Any Fans of Keith Green here?

[trying]

I've been watching the recently released CD/DVD combo - live footage of him on the DVD - he was sure an intense dude...

[firstborn888]

Yes, a fan here. I was also impressed that he eventually apologized to the Catholics for bashing them so bad. Got to admire his zeal ...

blessings,
- Byron

[trying]

I often wonder what the world would be like if all Christians lived w/ the same zeal he lived with?

[willieH]

willieH: Hi Trying... :hithere:

Saw him IN PERSON, performing as a soloist... it was just AWESOME.  I even still have a copy of His and wife Melody's ..."Last Days Newsletter"... an awesome FREE publication they sent out (at their expense) to those interested in his ministry...

I am a pro musician... and in my estimation, KG was of the BEST EVER, in terms of a person solely dedicated to the Gospel, and as a songwriter and musician, which GOD has utlilized in the human race...

He was NEVER about money... it was about GOD... and the message... Check out 4Him sometime...for  another such dedicated musical entity...

When the "musical role" is called in Eternity, And such musical men of GOD, as King David steps forth, ...Keith Green won't be all that far behind...  :bgdance:

pEace...
...willieH  :cloud9:

[trying]

willieH: Hi Trying... :hithere:

Saw him IN PERSON, performing as a soloist... it was just AWESOME.  I even still have a copy of His and wife Melody's ..."Last Days Newsletter"... an awesome FREE publication they sent out (at their expense) to those interested in his ministry...

I am a pro musician... and in my estimation, KG was of the BEST EVER, in terms of a person solely dedicated to the Gospel, and as a songwriter and musician, which GOD has utlilized in the human race...

He was NEVER about money... it was about GOD... and the message... Check out 4Him sometime...for  another such dedicated musical entity...

When the "musical role" is called in Eternity, And such musical men of GOD, as King David steps forth, ...Keith Green won't be all that far behind...  :bgdance:

pEace...
...willieH  :cloud9:

Yeah.. I tend to agree - he'll prolly forever stand w/o equal....

[Craig]

If ever I like Christian Music, it is Keith Green.

[firstborn888]

He was NEVER about money... it was about GOD... and the message... Check out

Look at the back of any (original) Kieth Green vinyl album. It says "if you cannot afford the purchase price of this record, please write to the following address and you will be sent one for free" or something to that effect. He would NOT sign a record contract unless it was agreed to place that offer on the back cover. Wow.

blessings,
- Byron

[hopeful]

Yes, a fan here. I was also impressed that he eventually apologized to the Catholics for bashing them so bad. Got to admire his zeal ...

blessings,
- Byron

I never knew that, Byron!  Thanks for that tid bit.

I love Keith and I read his biography that his wife wrote, every couple of years.  He went through so many changes durring his walk here with the Lord.  And so have I!

[willieH]

willieH: How-dee...  :cloud9:

"So you wanna go back to Egypt" is my personal favorite!  :laughing7:

pEace...
...willieH  :cloud9:

[reFORMer]

At a certain point in Keith Green's life, as soon as he could resolve his initial contractual agreements in the recording industry he offered his music on an free will offering basis, trying as much as possible to re-acquire ownership of the music he had done under contract.  He also was seeking to function with other believers, living together on the basis of Acts 2:44:  "And all that believed were together, and had all things common . . ."  All this and his preaching about it was so BIG of a deal in the extremely lucrative world of "Christian" music that it is my opinion he was murdered.  Of course it was just a plane crash . . .like Thomas Merton committed suicide with an electric fan cord around his neck!?  There are others.

When I was a child there was very little independent  contemporary "Christian" music industry, that is, apart from the traveling artists themselves.  When performers were to come hold meetings the question was if they were sent by the Holy Ghost.   If so, they had a testimony of God leading them and God providing for them.  When God sends someone He sees to it their needs are met.  Those that had minimum set fees to be agreed on ahead of time in addition to their "love offerings" were considered carnal and sold out to the world.  They were disqualified for being used of God and unacceptable for purposes of true ministry.  I remember in the late 50's when there was a big argument among the leaders of our local church over just this issue.  A group that had truckloads of theatrical equipment that also conscripted from the congregation actors to make up the lavish productions that constituted their ministry wanted a pre-arranged minimum plus.  With misgivings the church decided to invite them.  The meetings were so successful measured by attendance that they were held over another unplanned week and the church, which was built with classrooms that opened up on both sides of the main auditorium, had perhaps the largest crowds in it's history.

What I want to go on to say is that I don't believe it is of God's Spirit to offer to prophecy over someone for  say, $350 or to minister healing on a fee schedule basis.  Neither is it possible that these for hire musicians and their entrance fee events rise above a certain minimum blessing of God.  It just isn't in agreement with God's Spirit.  Actual anointed ministry or a ticket to some concert or event labeled "Christian:" which is it?  You cannot have both!

The following is only a piece of the rest of the story; but, what the apostle says is very strong.  I would expect if I developed and published a statement about the contemporary Christian music scene based on Acts 8:20-23 I would be considered at least an eccentric crank, certainly against what God is doing, how He's using these musicians, or something worse.

Acts 8:18-24:
18 And when Simon saw that through laying on of the apostles' hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money,
19 Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.
20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.
21 Thou hast neither part nor lot in this matter: for thy heart is not right in the sight of God.
22 Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee.
23 For I perceive that thou art in the gall of bitterness, and in the bond of iniquity.
24 Then answered Simon, and said, Pray ye to the Lord for me, that none of these things which ye have spoken come upon me.


---JamesMRohde

[willieH]

willieH: Hi reFormer... :hithere:

First, might I say that this statement so much as says that "charging MONEY" for a musical event which presents the GOSPEL, removes ANOINTING... I do not believe this even remotely true...

I have been to MANY GOSPEL concerts which I had to purchase tickets... and have been thoroughly blessed by them... finding the ANOINTING of the presence of GOD's HOLY SPIRIT... Many times I have been INSPIRED as a result of my attendance to those events... spiritually glowing from the Lord's presence there long afterwards...

Actual anointed ministry or a ticket to some concert or event labeled "Christian:" which is it?  You cannot have both!

I appreciate your comments... and I do not mean any negativity toward you nor your observance of Christian musical efforts... but I definitely believe differently, especially concerning ANOINTING...

Part of what made Keith Green successful was his involvement in the recording industry... After establishing himself, he (as you have noted), made efforts to regain rights to his music, in order to offer it to others on a freewill offering basis... this would NOT have been possible if he had first not gained the NAME and notoriety which his involvement in the record industry afforded him...

Therefore, his ministry would have been relegated to be just as do many other unknowns, ...producing music, and giving it away or receiving offerings for it... (such as my wife and I)

I am a pro musician (over 40yrs)... and have written and recorded and performed Christian music for many of those years (32)...  To date, I have not charged anyone for my GOSPEL music, but often times have even sent it as far as Australia at my own expense... donating MY materials and time to do so... (btw... I'll send you some if you like!)

Do I want a pat on the back for this?  NO WAY!  I want GOD's message to flourish in any way possible, and DO humbly cherish the degree in which I am allowed to be a part of it...  :bgdance:

Would I sign a recording contract which would (aside from forwarding the message)  net me monetary success for my music?  In a heartbeat!   :happygrin: 

Why?  Because it shall only gain what GOD intends it shall gain, be it (preferably) ANOINTING, and BLESSING to the hearers, ...or be it MONETARY blessing to the artist...  (a WORKMAN is worthy of HIS HIRE)...  :dontknow:

As far as MONEY being gained at the expense of TRUTH... I want no part. 

But if I work diligently and tirelessly in rehearsal and in studio work to bring the message of GOD, to SOME, and SOME just take the blessing without giving back... then these ONES have broken the FLOW of the RIVER of Living Water, not I... 

Let it be said that if SOME have nothing to give back... then the "water" has not been impeded... and it is a good thing to offer to those who are unable to afford, which is supported by those who are...

Does that make one who does not charge, better than another that charges for their work?  No way!

It means that I do not believe that another which sells music, is doing something  wrong, nor is eliminating (by charging others for that work), ANOINTING from their effort.

As far as performing GOSPEL music... the offerings of the hearts of the hearers is the best way to go... but concerning RECORDINGS... this (as far as I am concerned) is an entirely separate issue...

A "Christian" contractor builds a church... does his acceptance of money for his work take GOD out of his effort?  I think not... :mnah:

The messengers of the Gospel should be supported by those who are benefiting by their presentation, ...which "feet" are busy with making that presentation possible... the "shoes" will wear out... those "feet" will be in need new shoes...  :laughing7:

I thoroughly dig Keith Green's approach to GOD and to his music... (and I am and will be a fan and supporter of that approach)

Though some think they have the right, ...I do not find it to be a righteous act of an observer to judge someone which requires a fee for his recorded music...

It costs (sometimes a lot of) MONEY to record the music... It costs MONEY to produce it... it costs MONEY to master it, ...it costs MONEY to press it into listening formats... etc.  ...Not to mention the TIME consumed in these efforts!

I believe that MONEY does not in any way, diffuse or erect anointing... ANOINTING is done in the moment BY GOD, for us as individuals...

MONEY has no part in making that HOLINESS possible nor does it have part in defeating its manifestation either...

Paul said:

(Phil 1:15-18)

15  Some indeed preach CHRIST of envy and strife, and some also of good will
16  The one preach CHRIST of contention, not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my bonds
17  but the other of LOVE, knowing that I am set for the defence of the Gospel
18  What then?  Notwithstanding, EVERY WAY, whether IN PRETENCE or IN TRUTH, CHRIST is PREACHED; and I thereby do REJOICE, and WILL REJOICE.

In the end brother... as I said, I mean no disrespect of your observances, just wished to add my  :2c:

May we ALL rejoice at the name of CHRIST being exalted, and leave up to GOD, the corrections necessary in the individual methods of doing so...   :cloud9:

peAce...
willieH  :icon_jokercolor:

[reFORMer]

willieH,

I generally agree with what you are saying and ever so slightly hinted at it in agreeing there's an anointing to a certain degree on those for hire with the words about not:  "rise[ing] above a certain minimum blessing of God."  The quote you made from what I wrote was in the following paragraph in which I'm emphasizing this other statement a couple sentences earlier:

"What I want to go on to say is that I don't believe it is of God's Spirit to offer to prophecy over someone for  say, $350 or to minister healing on a fee schedule basis.  Neither is it possible that these for hire musicians and their entrance fee events rise above a certain minimum blessing of God.  It just isn't in agreement with God's Spirit.  Actual anointed ministry or a ticket to some concert or event labeled "Christian:" which is it?  You cannot have both!"

One of the hardest things to communicate in any successful way that doesn't seem to bring strife is the difference between anointing and ANOINTING!!!  One illustration is people who have experienced The New Birth, being Born Again, or regenerated by the Holy Spirit, there are various ways to refer to it, like a conversion experience --- as I say, people who have experienced this that had been involved with a more ritual based church are often ostracized by their former friends as they try to share this wonderful blessing of theirs.  Then, those in some fundamentalist congregation that experience the baptism in the Holy Spirit with speaking in tongues try to explain to their fundamentalist brethren how good it is . . . and you know the story in some more practical ways involving the revealed character of the LORD concerning His real love for all, His actually being The Savior of All.  One I work on a lot is those who've experienced both Passover (being Born Again, 30 fold) and Pentecost (the baptism in the Holy Spirit and His gifts, 60 fold,) getting them to recognize another and different feast that makes up the rest of our salvation, Tabernacles, the 100 fold salvation of our physical body being placed into born of God status.

I know there's a blessing in many of these Christian Music Events that are ticketed.  Most of them are instructed to let you in for free if you can't come up with the price of admission once the show starts.

It reminds me of what I've been thinking about today:

Revelation 18:9-11:
9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,
10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.
11 And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more:

There's a FIRE coming!  When the real thing shows up nobody will want the fake anymore.  All our cut glass is real purty . . . 'til the real gems show up.  Then the wares of the dealers in cheap go up in smoke.  God is going to reveal Himself in a people . . . because HE IS WORTHY to obtain a kingdom . . . Oh, I gotta stop . . . I suppose I'm not saying anything new . . . but am I getting blessed!!!

Love 'ya . . .

[joian]

There's a FIRE coming!  When the real thing shows up nobody will want the fake anymore.  All our cut glass is real purty . . . 'til the real gems show up.  Then the wares of the dealers in cheap go up in smoke.  God is going to reveal Himself in a people . . . because HE IS WORTHY to obtain a kingdom . . . Oh, I gotta stop . . . I suppose I'm not saying anything new . . . but am I getting blessed!!!

Whew!  that was a mouthful and blessed my socks off......yes, and may it burn the sockets out of our eye holes and burn out the dross in our mouths and the flesh from our bones.........may we never speak or sing until all flesh is burnt out..............

I was on YouTube watching the nightline interview of Todd Bentley........how it made me long for the real..........the pure...........the true.........can't stand church as usual.........it is such a sickening game to watch..........

Love you guys,

Joian

[rhellis]

My favoriet Keith Green song, written by someone else, is pure UR. It uses Origen's theory of "satan as the baited fish" as its basis for understanding the death and resurrection of Christ.

His plan of battle, you know,
it fooled them all.
They led him off to prison to die.
But as he entered Hades hall,
he broke those hellish chains with a cry.

Just look the gates of hell, they're fallen,
Crumbling from the inside out.
He's bursting through the walls with laughter,
listen to the angels shout.

It also speaks of him redeeming the prisoners of hell and so forth. That song ministered so much grace to me, even before I knew about UR. I wonder if Keith even knew what he was singing?

[hopeful]

Hello there, rhellis!   :dsunny:

Ah...  I remember that one!   Didn't know that Keith didn't write it, though.

It's amazing how much theology we can "catch" through the music we listen too, eh?