Aionios= duration or character?

[FineLinen]

I would appreciate any comments regarding this article by Dr. O.B.Jenkins.

http://orvillejenkins.com/theology/aionios.html 5

Two readers wrote with similar questions about the Greek word aionios as it appears in the Bible. They questioned the translation or definition of the Greek word with the English word “eternal” or “everlasting.”

I understand the meaning of the word aionios (often appearing in genitive plural aionion ) in Greek to carry the connotation of ‘pertaining to the age’ or ‘age enduring.’ The word is a form of the word we have borrowed into English from the Latin transliteration of the Greek as aeon or eon . The problems in interpreting it as the English “eternal” or “everlasting” are several.

Let’s get in focus some working principles of languages, meaning and translation. First of all, a word in one language and the culture it represents does not “mean” a word or the cultural concept it carries in another language.

Usage
Keep in mind that a “definition” is only a summary of how a word has been used. Meanings are all determined by usage. This what makes human speech so creative, dynamic, expressive and flexible. Inadequate assumptions about words, language and meaning can mislead us from the beginning.

So we first need to take a step back to look at the cultural or worldview concept. What we do is look at how we find a word being used. We honor the language and its cultural integrity. We do not assume in language that there is some objective authoritative “meaning” or “definition” that prescribes what a word can or must mean. That is not how language works.

We consider what underlying ideas are carried in words in a particular language. No language is independent of a historical, cultural context and the worldview of the culture using that language.

Thus in the strictest term, a word in Greek does not “mean” in English. Greek words “mean” what the Greek speaker was thinking in the Greek-speaking environment of that era and location. Similarly, today a Greek speaker is not referencing anything in English when he thinks and speaks fluently in his native tongue, or reads his Bible in his native tongue! Greek “means” in “Greek.”

The English speaker/reader must get into that world to determine meaning, then search for the most adequate word or phrase to express that in the English language and cultural-social context.

[FineLinen]

Dr. O.B. Jenkins

Language-Culture

We must determine what it means in the original language-culture, then search for a similar way to represent or approximate that in the target culture-language.  This is what A T Robertson succeeds in doing in his amazing classic, A Grammar of the Greek New Testament in the Light of Historical Research (1934, various reprints since).

Robertson does not "define" words, in some authoritative abstract manner, like the modern rationalist mind would prefer.  Robertson does not try to find a clear, definite box in which to file away a word in Greek.  He looks into the usage of a word or grammar form and surveys the breadth and variety of usage through history and across contexts.

On this particular word, Robertson points out that this word aionios is not a common adjective in the classical sources [p 159].  The context of usages in the New Testament ought to be the guide for a possible meaning in those passages.  But most fall back into their comfortable English vocabulary and modern western worldview.  The scriptures deserve better than this!

Working from a broad comparative linguistic background, A T Robertson was one of the few amazing scholars in the biblical exegesis field who was able to do this.  His explanations of usages make the ancient world come alive, and the people and their concerns and interchanges are the core of the "meaning" of Greek phrases he considers.

This dynamic approach attempts to honor the integrity of texts of any age or language and the language in which they are framed.  This is what the linguist, missionary or any cross-cultural communicator must do.

Original Meaning

-Continued below-

http://orvillejenkins.com/theology/aionios.html

[sheila]

TY Fine Linen..but that about strained my brain. Never-the-less ALL men need to know...that God's Love surpasses our ability

to comprehend. The gist of it...timelessness=immortality in a perfect state of harmony with God and all His creation.

  when a man parts the matrix and is born into this realm.....the deterioration begins and has an end. when man parts the matrix

of Jerusalem above the regeneration begins and has no end but perfection/immortality.


    eternal/timelessness...temporal/age abiding...=generations-each in his successive order .......as each man sown in his generation

   matriculates into immortality/timelessness.... :2c:

[FineLinen]

Dear Sheila: Do not strain your brain yet. There is more to come.

http://jonathanmitchellnewtestament.com/jonathan-s-writings/eternal-eonian-life/

[sheila]

 :laugh:    :girlheart:

[sheila]

 :2c:   Simplicity is a virtue I especially love. Manna[bread from heaven] more than two days old can breed 'worms'.

     The Good News should be so simple a child can understand it.Unless you change and become like little children........


I don't see how 'lawyering'of words[legalese] benefits the cause of the salvation of all men. I am sure our Father is the highest

intelligence there is..but He speaks plainly that we may understand...using every day simple things in His parables/teachings to the

people that they may understand.


I realize there are scholarly men that have a passion for the languages..and they have contributed greatly in seeing to the

translations of the scriptures in many languages for many people..and am thankful for them.


   That being said...context is context....whether in our present day or the greek world 2000 years ago. 1 Cor 14;26-28

we just may need an interpreter for this interpreter of this language/tongue.  :girlheart:

[FineLinen]

Dear Sheila: I hear you dear lady. The "simple" meaning of eternal life is what St. John declares>>>

"This is life eternal that we may know You the eternal God and Jesus Christ whom You did send."

This link will not be simple, and is strictly presented for those who desire a wee bit more layers.

"How can these things be?"

[FineLinen]

The Eons

A Pattern of Sound Words

Concerning  Aiõn  and  Aiõnios


THE MOST commonly used Greek-English lexicons used today by Christians are those by Thayer (1886) and by Arndt and Gingrich (1957). The definitions given for the noun, aiõn, and the adjective, aiõnios, are widely accepted as authoritative and determinative for the teaching of everlasting punishment. This becomes for many believers a strong bulwark against taking scriptural passages such as John 12:32; Romans 5:18,19; 11:32-36; 1 Corinthians 15:22-28; 2 Corinthians 5:14; Ephesians 1:10,11; Philippians 2:9-11; Colossians 1:20; 1 Timothy 2:4; 4:9,10; and 1 John 2:2, at face value. What is claimed for Matthew 25:46 or 2 Thessalonians 1:9, for example, is seen as limiting the meaning of the former passages.

-Continued below-

https://www.concordant.org/expositions/the-eons/greek-words-aion-aionios/

[FineLinen]

Aionios: A Scriptural Study

http://www.mercifultruth.com/eternity-detailedstudy.html

How eternity slipped in?

https://thetencommandmentsministry.us/ministry/free_bible/whence_eternity

ClementofA

http://www.city-data.com/forum/christianity/2931562-does-aionios-always-mean-eternal-ancient.html

Dr. Marvin Vincent

http://www.mercyuponall.org/2016/11/22/marvin-r-vincent-note-on-eternal-destruction-olethron-aionion/

Jonathan Mitchell (Eonian}

http://jonathanmitchellnewtestament.com/jonathan-s-writings/eternal-eonian-life/

'Aion, transliterated aeon, is a period of longer or shorter duration, having a beginning and an end, and complete in itself. Aristotle (peri ouravou, i. 9,15) says: "The period which includes the whole time of one's life is called the aeon of each one."

[FineLinen]

F.W. Farrar & G. Campbell Morgan

http://www.saviourofall.org/Writings/faithfathers.html

[darryl]

I would appreciate any comments regarding this article by Dr. O.B.Jenkins.

http://orvillejenkins.com/theology/aionios.html 5

Two readers wrote with similar questions about the Greek word aionios as it appears in the Bible. They questioned the translation or definition of the Greek word with the English word "eternal" or "everlasting."

I understand the meaning of the word aionios (often appearing in genitive plural aionion ) in Greek to carry the connotation of 'pertaining to the age' or 'age enduring.' The word is a form of the word we have borrowed into English from the Latin transliteration of the Greek as aeon or eon . The problems in interpreting it as the English "eternal" or "everlasting" are several.

Let's get in focus some working principles of languages, meaning and translation. First of all, a word in one language and the culture it represents does not "mean" a word or the cultural concept it carries in another language.

Usage
Keep in mind that a "definition" is only a summary of how a word has been used. Meanings are all determined by usage. This what makes human speech so creative, dynamic, expressive and flexible. Inadequate assumptions about words, language and meaning can mislead us from the beginning.

So we first need to take a step back to look at the cultural or worldview concept. What we do is look at how we find a word being used. We honor the language and its cultural integrity. We do not assume in language that there is some objective authoritative "meaning" or "definition" that prescribes what a word can or must mean. That is not how language works.

We consider what underlying ideas are carried in words in a particular language. No language is independent of a historical, cultural context and the worldview of the culture using that language.

Thus in the strictest term, a word in Greek does not "mean" in English. Greek words "mean" what the Greek speaker was thinking in the Greek-speaking environment of that era and location. Similarly, today a Greek speaker is not referencing anything in English when he thinks and speaks fluently in his native tongue, or reads his Bible in his native tongue! Greek "means" in "Greek."

The English speaker/reader must get into that world to determine meaning, then search for the most adequate word or phrase to express that in the English language and cultural-social context.

to gain an understanding of Biblical use of aionios, one must see how its used in the Septuagint, the Greek speaking Jews translation of the OT into Greek....aionios is always used to translate the Hebrew word  'Olam' which occurs hundreds of times in the OT...so, aionios connects to olam...and olam doesnt mean eternity....in the Hebrew its a subtle meaning....maybe something like something lasts as long as it lasts till something else happens...u cant understand 'aionios' without connecting it to 'olam'

[marie glen]

F.W. Farrar & G. Campbell Morgan

http://www.saviourofall.org/Writings/faithfathers.html

..that's a very good article. :thumbsup:

[marie glen]

to gain an understanding of Biblical use of aionios, one must see how its used in the Septuagint, the Greek speaking Jews translation of the OT into Greek....aionios is always used to translate the Hebrew word  'Olam' which occurs hundreds of times in the OT...so, aionios connects to olam...and olam doesnt mean eternity....in the Hebrew its a subtle meaning....maybe something like something lasts as long as it lasts till something else happens...u cant understand 'aionios' without connecting it to 'olam'

   :thumbsup: