translations without 'hell'? accurate translations?

[DavidFord]

The NT was originally in Aramaic, not Greek.  Translations by Younan, Etheridge, Magiera, Bauscher, and Holman of the NT from the Aramaic lack 'hell.'

For Mt 1 - Acts 16, the very best translation is Paul Younan's interlinear; I have a file of what Younan translated formatted as English sentences.  I posted an older version of what I have for Younan at and around: 
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/aus.religion.islam/bzdQCJTVhyk/67oc3xvCb-kJ
For the rest, when I quote an Aramaic translation, it's usually Murdock or Etheridge, with a slight edge to Murdock. 
Mageira's is good, and it retains the instances of "Master YHWH" (though they're disguised in her all-caps quotations of Old Testament passages).
I avoid Lamsa's as much as possible, because he apparently disliked the supernatural and to that end watered-down certain passages.
Andrew Gabriel Roth's AENT used someone else's inferior rendition of Younan, and even though it's in its 5th edition, all the missing words and typos still aren't fixed, plus I don't trust his editing of Murdock.  The footnotes and 2nd half of the book are, though, interesting.
Bauscher's is OK, though the wording is a little strange at times.  The hardcopy's (and I imagine PDF's) footnotes are marvelous in comparing Aramaic lettering with Greek lettering, and making the case for the Aramaic being the original.
Someone I know was impressed with the Spanish translation mentioned below.

Younan - use the Pesh itta Tool  http://dukhrana.com/
Etheridge (and Murdock) - use the Pesh itta Tool  http://dukhrana.com/
http://www.lulu.com  search for Ewan Macleod's Etheridge (and Murdock) translation of the Aramaic
Jan Magiera  http://aramaicdb.lightofword.org/index.php/en/english-word-search
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=janet+magiera&ref=nb_sb_noss_1
David Bauscher - Aramaic Bible in Plain English  https://biblehub.com/aramaic-plain-english/
https://www.lulu.com/shop/rev-david-bauscher/the-original-aramaic-new-testament-in-plain-english-with-psalms-proverbs-8th-edition-with-notes/hardcover/product-21273790.html

Messianic Aleph Tav Interlinear Scriptures - Bill Sanford
https://alephtavscriptures.com/product-category/matis/

William Norton, _A translation, in English daily used, of the Peshi to-Syriac text, and of the received Greek text, of Hebrews, James, 1 Peter, and 1 John : with an introduction on the Peshi to-Syriac text, and the revised Greek text of 1881_ (1889)
https://archive.org/details/translationineng00nort/page/n4
William Norton, _A Translation in English Daily Used of the Seventeen Letters_ (1890)
https://archive.org/details/ATranslationInEnglishDailyUsedOfT

Joseph Pashka, _The Aramaic Gospels and Acts_
https://www.amazon.com/Aramaic-Gospels-Acts-Joseph-Pashka/dp/1591606020/

Biblia Pesh itta (Nuevo Testamento)  https://www.bibliatodo.com/la-biblia/version/Pesh ita-nuevo-testamento

The Greek word ainon means 'age/world,' and is often mistranslated as 'eternal.'  Young's Literal Translation (YLT) of the Greek translation has renderings of 'age' and 'age-during':
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?qs_version=YLT&quicksearch=age&begin=47&end=73&limit=500
It also lacks 'hell,' and instead has 'hades' and 'gehenna' and 'Tartarus':
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=hades&qs_version=YLT
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=gehenna&qs_version=YLT
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=tartarus&qs_version=YLT
For the OT, it has 'sheol':
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=sheol&qs_version=YLT

[WhiteWings]

Hell is an accurate translation as it also mean 'hidden'.
It's meaning that's given to the word that's what wrong.

Hell, sheol, gehenna, hades, it doesn't matter if the reader thinks it's about eternal torture.
Changing a word doesn't change the demonic doctrine (re)defining that word.

The above is valid for many Biblical discussions.
Everyone agrees Scripture states Christ is the Savior of all. But the definition of all ranges between 5%-100%

[DavidFord]

Mistranslations in Your New Testament
Translated From Greek,
Which Was Translated From the Original Aramaic

The popular KJV has 'hell' over 50 times. 
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=hell&qs_version=KJV&limit=500
It should have rendered things as 'Sheol' (or 'Gehenna') in the vast majority of cases, and adhered to the way things are in the original Hebrew of the OT and the original Aramaic of the NT.

For the New Testament, the KJV and almost all other translations used Greek manuscripts, and have translation errors and corruptions present in basically all English language NTs translated from Greek.  The Assyrian Church of the East claims that they got the NT books (exception:  the 'Western Five') from those who originally wrote them in Aramaic, but anyone including a church can claim anything.  The best evidence of Aramaic being the original is mistranslations in the Greek translation.  Accurate translations of the original Aramaic remove several mistranslations and corruptions present in Greek mss.

*mistranslation at Mt 1:16*
Matthew 1:17 says there are 14, 14, 14 generations.
Greek manuscripts of Matthew's genealogy list 14, 14, 13 generations.
In Aramaic mss. of Matthew's genealogy, with Mt 1:16's "gbra" correctly translated as father/guardian, Matthew's genealogy lists 14, 14, 14 generations.
Mary had a father/guardian named Joseph (plus a husband also called Joseph).

*mistranslation at Mt 26:6 and Mk 14:3*
Do you think Jesus and his disciples visited the house of a leper?  The Greek translation from Aramaic has leper at Mt 26:6 and Mk 14:3, while the Aramaic allows for potter.  Lepers were unclean and weren't allowed to have guests over.  It's actually Simon the _potter_.  To continue to call someone a leper even after he'd been healed of leprosy would have constituted slander.

*mistranslation at Mt 7:6*
For Mt 7:6, it's actually 'hang earrings on dogs,' not 'give a holy thing to dogs.'

*mistranslation at Lk 14:26*
The Greek manuscripts have a mistranslation for Lk 14:26, which when translated well reads:
"He who comes to me [Jesus]
and does not *sena* [put aside; contextually improper here: hate, have an aversion to] his father and his mother
and his brothers and his sisters
and his wife and his children
and even himself,
is not able to be a talmida [student] to me."

*mistranslation for Acts 2:24*
When translated well it reads:
"But Allaha [God] loosed the *cords* of Sheol [the Grave/Death] and raised him [Yeshua/Jesus] because it was not possible that he be held in it, in Sheol."
Re:  cords, the Greek versions mistranslated this word as 'pain.'  Cf. Jn 2:15 & 2 Samuel 22:6. -- Paul Younan

*mistranslation for Acts 5:13*
The Greek manuscripts have a mistranslation for Acts 5:13:
And there was a great fear in all the eidta [congregation], and in all those who heard.
And many mighty deeds and signs occurred by the hands of the Shelikha [Apostles] among the people. And they were all assembled together in the Porch of Shlemon [Soloman].
13. And of other men, not one dared to *touch* them,
rather the people magnified them.
Re: touch, this word can mean "join/commune" but also "touch," the latter undoubtedly being the correct reading. The Greek versions mistranslated this word as "join."--PY

*mistranslation for Acts 8:23*
The Greek manuscripts have a mistranslation for Acts 8:23:
"But repent of this your evil and beseech Allaha [God]. Perhaps you [Simon the sorcerer] will be forgiven the guile of your heart.
23. For I [Shimon Keepa/ Simon Peter] see that you are in bitter *anger*
and in the bonds of iniquity."
Re: anger, the Aramaic word kabda can mean gall/liver/anger. The Greek versions mistranslate "bitter kabda" as "gall of bitterness" instead of the more contextually proper "bitter anger."--PY

*mistranslation for Acts 8:27*
The Greek manuscripts have a mistranslation for Acts 8:27, which when translated well reads:
"And he [Pileepos/ Philip] arose (and) went and met a certain *mahaymina* [believer] who had come from Cush, an official of Qandeq, the malkta [queen] of the Cushi tes, and he was an authority over all her treasures. And he had come to worship in Urishlim."
Re:  MHYMNA, it can mean either 'believer' or 'eunuch'-- or many similar things. The Greek versions mistranslate this as 'eunuch' instead of the more contextually correct 'believer.'-- PY. The Ethiopian _believer_ was intending to worship in Jerusalem, presumably in the temple there-- which eunuchs were prohibited from doing by Deut 23:2. Cf. Mt 19:12.

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*mistranslation at Mark 9:49*
Mark 9:49 (HCSB)
For everyone will be salted with fire.[a: Other mss add
_and every sacrifice will be salted with salt_]

The complete text was present as of A.D. 175:
Diatesseron 25:23
Every _one_ shall be salted with fire,
and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.

The original Aramaic has the complete text:
Mark 9:49 (Younan)
For with fire everything will be vaporized,
and with salt every sacrifice will be seasoned.

Incidentally, Greek manuscripts have a mistranslation for Mk 9:49, which when translated well reads:
"For with fire everything will be *vaporized*,
and with salt every sacrifice will be *seasoned*."

Re: vaporized and seasoned, the root MLKh can mean 'to salt, season' or 'to destroy, vaporize, scatter.' The intended meaning shifted between the first and second lines-Meshikha/ the Messiah plays on the dual meaning of MLKh. See Mk 9 PDF of Paul Younan at pesh itta.org, and at http://dukhrana.com

////////////////////////////////////////
*mistranslation at Rev 1:13*

The mistranslation says Jesus has female breasts:

Revelation 1:13 (The Passion Translation)
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=rev+1&version=TPT
And walking among the lampstands, I saw someone like a son of man, wearing a full-length robe with a golden sash over his chest.[aj]
The Greek word used here is mastos and is used exclusively for a woman's breasts.

Do you see anything in this Palmer and Barnstone you disagree with?:

David Robert Palmer, The Revelation of John, part of The Holy Bible, The Ancient Greek Text, alternating verse by verse with A new English translation from the Greek, with translator's footnotes and Greek textual variant footnotes (May 2017)
http://bibletranslation.ws/palmer-translation/
PDF:
http://www.bibletranslation.ws/trans/revwgrk.pdf
28 1:13f Literally, "breasts," μαστοῖς but that would be very unidiomatic for English, and it essentially means chest, as in 15:6, where the seven angels also have a golden sash around their chest, and there the Greek word used is στῆθος, "chest." But I didn't want to translate μαστοῖς as a singular word like chest, when the Greek is plural, so I used "pecs" which is short for pectorals.

The Restored New Testament: A New Translation with Commentary, Including the Gnostic Gospels Thomas, Mary, and Judas (2009) by Willis Barnstone, 1485pp., on 1236
https://www.amazon.com/Restored-New-Testament-Translation-Commentary/dp/039306493X/
14.  Although the Greek mastois means "breasts," it is commonly translated as "chest" or "waist" or sometimes the singular form "breast."

Are you comfortable with μαστοῖς being at Rev 1:13 in Greek mss.?  Do you think στῆθος (stéthos) should have instead been used?

3149. μαστός (mastos)
https://biblehub.com/greek/strongs_3149.htm
Strong's Greek: 3149. μαστός (mastos) — 3 Occurrences
Luke 11:27 N-NMP
GRK: σε καὶ μαστοὶ οὓς ἐθήλασας
NAS: that bore You and the breasts at which
KJV: and the paps which
INT: you and [the] breasts at which you nursed

Luke 23:29 N-NMP
GRK: ἐγέννησαν καὶ μαστοὶ οἳ οὐκ
NAS: bore, and the breasts that never
KJV: bare, and the paps which never
INT: did bear and breasts which never

Revelation 1:13 N-DMP
GRK: πρὸς τοῖς μαστοῖς ζώνην χρυσᾶν
NAS: across His chest with a golden
KJV: about the paps with a golden
INT: at the breasts a belt golden

4738. στῆθος (stéthos)
https://biblehub.com/greek/strongs_4738.htm
Strong's Greek: 4738. στῆθος (stéthos) — 5 Occurrences
Luke 18:13 N-ANS
GRK: ἔτυπτεν τὸ στῆθος αὐτοῦ λέγων
NAS: but was beating his breast, saying,
KJV: upon his breast, saying, God
INT: was striking the breast of himself saying

Luke 23:48 N-ANP
GRK: τύπτοντες τὰ στήθη ὑπέστρεφον
NAS: beating their breasts.
KJV: smote their breasts, and returned.
INT: beating the breasts returned [home]

John 13:25 N-ANS
GRK: ἐπὶ τὸ στῆθος τοῦ Ἰησοῦ
NAS: on Jesus' bosom, said
KJV: lying on Jesus' breast saith unto him,
INT: on the breast of Jesus

John 21:20 N-ANS
GRK: ἐπὶ τὸ στῆθος αὐτοῦ καὶ
NAS: had leaned back on His bosom at the supper
KJV: on his breast at supper,
INT: on the bosom of him and

Revelation 15:6 N-ANP
GRK: περὶ τὰ στήθη ζώνας χρυσᾶς
NAS: around their chests with golden
KJV: and having their breasts girded
INT: about the breasts sashes golden

Do you agree with this statement?: "the description τοῖς μαστοῖς in Rev. 1 about Jesus would be surprising to a Greek reader, and μαστός is not used of men in LXX or NT."

https://bulletin.equinoxpub.com/2014/12/jesus-man-breasts/
See: Jesse Rainbow, "Male μαστοί in Revelation 1.13." Journal for the Study of the New Testament 30.2 (2007): 249-253.
Aaron Christianson says:  .... Fact Check!
μαστός is used of the male chest as well. Tragedies of Aescylus, Choephoroe, line 545.
LSJ'd! (and not to worry, I TLG'd it too!) Rainbow needs to be careful before he publishes something that can be refuted by checking the most popular Greek Lexicon in existence? and you should Check too! It's online, after all; no excuse not to check.
That?s not to say Jesus doesn't have tits, but I don't think it's a clear teaching from this scripture. I guess we'll have to wait for his glorious appearing to find out.
....
Deane Galbraith says: ....
Hmmmmm? reading the article again, it seems that the author examines only LXX and NT usage of μαστός. Yet, he does make the more general statement that a reference to male breasts "is as striking in Greek as it is in the English", which implies a more general claim. Aeschylus is not contemporary Greek, but, you're right, I should've cross-checked against the usages.
....
Deane Galbraith says: ....
? ok, Aeschylus has καὶ μαστὸν ἀμφέχασκ᾽ ἐμὸν θρεπτήριον in Choephoroe, line 545: a nourishing breast for a baby! This is clearly a woman's breast; man-breasts do not ordinarily provide nourishment. Is this your example of a man-breast?
Yet LSJ doesn't actually cite Aeschylus as an example of the male application of μαστός, but cites Choephoroe, line 545 as a general instance of its use. For a man-breast, LSJ cites some other souces: "of men's breasts, "βάλε δουρὶ στέρνον ὑπὲρ μαζοῖο" [Il.]4.528; "βάλε στῆθος παρὰ μαζόν" 8.121, cf. Od.22.82 [μαζόν], X.An.1.4.17, 4.3.6 [both τῶν μαστῶν]." So, we have three from Homer, and two in Xenophon's Anabasis, and a total of 291 citations. From a quick survey, the mastoi seem to be overwhelmingly women's. Even the metaphorical usage refers to spherical or cup-like objects. I haven't looked at this in any detail, but Rainbow?s conclusion seems to be correct: the description τοῖς μαστοῖς in Rev. 1 about Jesus would be surprising to a Greek reader, and μαστός is not used of men in LXX or NT.

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*mistranslation at Rev 2:22*

The Greek mistranslation rendered a word as "bed" thereby having an adulterous woman being thrown into a bed.  (It should have used "bier.")  The KJV translators apparently failed to notice the irony:
Rev 2:21-22 (KJV)
21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.

The NASB added "of sickness" and were honest in that they put "of sickness" in italics, thereby indicating to the reader that they'd added it beyond what the Greek has:
Rev 2:21-22 (NASB)
21 I gave her time to repent, and she does not want to repent of her immorality. 22 Behold, I will throw her on a bed _of sickness_, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of her deeds.

Strong's Concordance 2825b. kliné
https://biblehub.com/greek/2825b.htm
kliné: a couch
Transliteration: kliné
Short Definition: bed

Do you agree with me that it'd make more sense if she'd been said to have been thrown onto a mortuary couch i.e. a bier?  (Doing such is possible translating from the Aramaic Revelation.)

http://cal.huc.edu/oneentry.php?lemma=%28rs+N%20&cits=all
1  bed.... (a) mortuary couch, bier.... when they saw that their bier preceded his bier [i.e. they died before him]. (b) litter.... (c).... a luxurious couch.... (d).... a folding bed made of leather....

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In the Aramaic, Mt's rendition of the Lord's Prayer has much rhyming.  The Aramaic Lk's version has less rhyming. The Greek versions lack rhyming.  Do you think that it's possible that someone translated a non-rhyming Greek Lord's Prayer into a rhyming Aramaic Lord's Prayer?

A transliteration of the Aramaic Mt 6:9-13:
Ah-woon ** our Father
d'wash-may-ya ** in heaven
============================
nith-qad-dash shmakh ** holy be Your name
teh'-theh' ** come
mal-koo-thakh ** Your kingdom
neh-weh ** be done
tsow-ya-nakh ** Your will
============================
ay-kan-na ** as
d'wash-may-ya ** in heaven
ap b'ar-aa ** so on earth.
11 ============================
haw lan ** give us
lakh-ma ** the bread
d'son-qa-nan ** of our need
yo-ma-na ** this day
12 ============================
ow'shwoq lan ** and forgive us
khow-beyn ** our offences
ay-kan-na d'ap kha-nan ** as also we
shwa-qan ** have forgiven
l'khay-ya-wen ** those who have offended us
13 ============================
ow'la ** and not
ta'-lan ** bring us
l'nis-you-na ** into trial
al-la pas-san ** but deliver us
min bee-sha ** from the evil one
============================
modt-dtil d'dee-lak ** for of yours
hee mal-koo-tha ** is the Kingdom
ow'khay-la ** and the power
ow'tish-bokh-tha ** and the glory
l'al-um ail-meen. ** age to age, or:  world to world

What do you think is more poetic:  the Lord's Prayer
a) in Greek, or
b) in the Mt 6 Aramaic?

Mt 6:10's "as" uses the letters "aikna," while Lk 11:2s "as" uses "aik."  Also, Mt 6:11 uses "yomna"-- this day, daily-- while Lk 11:3 instead uses "klium"-- every day, daily. Hence, in at least 2 places, the Luke version means the same, but has less-perfect rhyming compared with the Matthew version.  In my opinion, the prophet Jesus-- God incarnate-- gave a model prayer with superb rhyming recorded in the Aramaic Mt 6.  The Lk 11 rendition means the same, but has less rhyming and fewer of the prophet Jesus' original words, besides lacking "for of yours is the Kingdom, and the power, and the glory, l'ailm-ailmin."

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*Greek mss. embarrassingly have Jesus liable to the fire of Gehenna.*

Compare Mt 5:22 and Mt 23:17 in the Greek.
Mt 5:22
https://biblehub.com/interlinear/matthew/5.htm
3004 [e]
eipē
εἴπῃ  ,
shall say

3474 [e]
Mōre
Μωρέ  ,
Fool
Adj-VMS

1777 [e]
enochos
ἔνοχος
liable

1510 [e]
estai
ἔσται
will be

1519 [e]
eis
εἰς
to

3588 [e]
tēn
τὴν
the

1067 [e]
geennan
γέενναν
hell

3588 [e]
tou
τοῦ
-

4442 [e]
pyros
πυρός  .
of fire

Mt 23:17
https://biblehub.com/interlinear/matthew/23.htm
3474 [e]
17   mōroi
17   μωροὶ
17   Foolish
17   Adj-VMP

2532 [e]
kai
καὶ
and

5185 [e]
typhloi
τυφλοί  !
blind

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More handouts:  bottom of
https://disqus.com/home/discussion/podbayfm/listen_to_episodes_of_heal_the_sick_podcast_on_podbay/

[DavidFord]

Hell is an accurate translation as it also mean 'hidden'.
It's meaning that's given to the word that's what wrong.

So you think 'hell' is an accurate translation of Sheol and of Hades.  Do you think 'hell' is an accurate translation of:  Gehenna?  Tartarus?  Lake of Fire?

[DavidFord]

Another problem with the KJV is its 1John 5:7, which was added into some Greek 1John manuscripts over a thousand years after 1John was written.  Do you think this belongs in printed copies of the NT?:
1 John 5:7 (NKJV) For there are three that bear witness [a]in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.
Footnotes:
1 John 5:7 NU, M omit the words from in heaven (v. 7) through on earth (v. 8). Only 4 or 5 very late mss. contain these words in Greek.

Are you aware of any evidence or arguments to support 1John 5:7 as belonging in printed copies of the NT?

https://www.gotquestions.org/Comma-Johanneum.html
However, it is highly unlikely that the Comma Johanneum was originally a part of 1 John.  None of the oldest Greek manuscripts of 1 John contain the comma, and none of the very early church fathers include it when quoting or referencing 1 John 5:7-8.  The presence of the Comma Johanneum in Greek manuscripts is actually quite rare until the 15th century A.D.  It is primarily found in Latin manuscripts.  While some of the Latin manuscripts containing the Comma Johanneum are ancient, the Comma Johanneum did not appear in the original Latin Vulgate written by Jerome.

In the 16th century, when Desiderius Erasmus was compiling what became known as the Textus Receptus, he did not include the Comma Johanneum in the 1st or 2nd editions.  Due to intense pressure from the Catholic Church and others who wanted it included because of its support for trinitarianism, Erasmus included the Comma Johanneum in later editions of the Textus Receptus.  His decision resulted in the Comma Johanneum being included in the King James Version of the Bible and later in the New King James Version.

https://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/questions/2649/what-is-the-argument-against-the-authenticity-of-1-john-57-8-in-the-kjv
This is a case where the argument for inauthenticity is quite clear. The Comma Johanneum does not appear in any ancient Greek sources (1 John, like all the other books of the New Testament, was written originally in Greek). The earliest Greek version of 1 John with the Comma Johanneum is from 1516! The extra line was added to some Latin manuscripts sometime between the 3rd and 6th century and was originally written in Latin. It is also not found in any ancient Syriac or Coptic texts, or the traditional texts of the Ethiopian church.

The reason it is sometimes included in modern bibles is that it was in the Vulgate and as a result in many early translations like the King James version. Nonetheless, it is not found even in the oldest texts of the Vulgate!

Unlike some more controversial textual questions, there seems not to be any major disagreement among scholars (including conservative scholars) about the inauthenticity of the Comma Johanneum. You can find a few defenses of authenticity, but it's a decidedly fringe position mostly held by people who are committed to the KJV-only movement.

To refresh on the details, I got most of this information from this article by Daniel Wallace, and a little of it from Wikipedia. But both of these sources agree with what I'd read about this topic elsewhere in the past.

[DavidFord]

posted at https://youtu.be/K0WpHwOeRiQ
"point me to the 'Aramaic' manuscripts of the NT"
The Assyrian Church of the East has been faithfully transmitting the Aramaic NT since the earliest days of Christianity, when they received the books from those who wrote them (exception:  the 'Western Five'-- II Peter, II John, III John, Jude and Revelation; they closed their canon before receiving those).
I posted some arguments for Aramaic being the original within the thread
http://tentmaker.org/forum/judgement-and-punishment/gehenna-and-sheol-in-the-aramaic-nt/
Older versions of many of the posts appeared earlier here, which has additional things I didn't post on the Tentmaker forum:
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/aus.religion.islam/bzdQCJTVhyk/SdGP_f82uUoJ

The Khabouris Codex is a medieval manuscript of the Aramaic. It can be examined at http://dukhrana.com/khabouris/
and info about it is at https://therefinersfire.org/khabouris_codex.htm
Tatian, who died in A.D. 180, composed the Diatesseron (a consolidation of the 4 Gospels) using the Aramaic.  That was translated into Arabic, which we have today:
http://sepehr.mohamadi.name/?p=84
The Greek manuscripts have many variants.  In many instances, the Aramaic and the Diatesseron agree as to what the original renditions of various Gospel passages were:
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/aus.religion.islam/bzdQCJTVhyk/iI-uGFZ9CjwJ;

[DavidFord]

Biblical Archaeology: Factual Evidence to Support the Historicity of the Bible
https://www.equip.org/article/biblical-archaeology-factual-evidence-to-support-the-historicity-of-the-bible/

9 archaeology finds that confirm the New Testament
https://www.premierchristianity.com/Past-Issues/2017/March-2017/9-archaeology-finds-that-confirm-the-New-Testament

On http://csntm.org/Manuscripts.aspx
for the checkbox "Gospels", doing control-f/ "find" for "1st" yields 0 results.  Searching for "2nd" yields 3 results having merely "2nd," and  3 results having "2nd-3rd century."  The by-A.D. 175 Aramaic Diatesseron has 95% of the 4 Gospels-- compared with the website you mentioned having a tiny fraction of the Gospels:

Second century manuscript of the Gospels on papyrus; 1 fragment, single column, approximately 18 lines per column.
Second century manuscript of the Gospels on papyrus; 1 fragment, single column, approximately 31 lines per column.
Second century manuscript of the Gospels on papyrus; 1 fragment, single column, 23–24 lines per column.
Late second or early third century manuscript of the Gospels on papyrus; 1 leaf, single column, 10–11 lines per column.
Second or third century manuscript of the Gospels on papyrus; 1 fragment, single column, 13 lines per column.
Second or third century manuscript of the Gospels on papyrus; 1 fragment, single column, approximately 19–20 lines per column.

"Considering you can't give me even one in Aramaic is entirely the point" 
Have your fragments helped determine which of the numerous variants existed in Greek mss. early on?

I have quoted over 200 textual variants in the 4 Gospels, located at the places mentioned below-- see the link.

Aramaic Peshi tta New Testament, Often Bolstered by the Diatesseron, Adjudicating Between Conflicting Greek Manuscripts
The Greek manuscripts have many variants.  In many instances, the Aramaic and the by-A.D. 175 Diatesseron agree as to what the original renditions of various Gospel passages were:
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/aus.religion.islam/bzdQCJTVhyk/iI-uGFZ9CjwJ
*Book of Matthew*
Matthew 1:25, 2:18, 3:16, 4:10, 5:22, 5:25, 5:44, 5:47, 6:1, 6:4, 6:6, 6:13, 6:15, 6:18, 6:33, 8:18, 11:15, 11:23, 12:22, 12:47, 13:43, 13:51, 14:24, 14:30, 14:33, 15:8, 15:14, 15:27, 16:2-4, 16:13, 18:11, 18:15, 18:19, 18:29, 18:35, 19:17, 19:20, 20:6-7, 20:16, 21:12, 21:28-32, 21:44, 22:7, 22:13, 22:44, 23:3, 23:4-5, 23:8, 23:14, 23:19, 23:25, 23:26, 24:42-43, 24:48, 25:6, 25:13-14, 25:31, 26:3, 26:28, 26:42, 27:16-17, 27:24, 27:41-42, 27:64, 28:2, 28:9, 28:17, 28:20
*Book of Mark*
Mark 3:14-16, 3:29, 6:33, 6:36, 7:2, 7:4-5, 7:8-9, 7:19, 7:24, 8:26, 9:23, 9:49, 10:21, 10:24, 12:4, 12:29-30, 12:33, 13:33, 14:19, 14:68, 15:28, 16:9-20
*Book of Luke*
Luke 1:28, 1:29, 2:14, 2:33, 2:38, 2:40, 2:43, 3:19, 3:22, 4:44, 6:10, 8:45, 8:48, 9:23, 9:54-56, 10:1, 10:21-22, 10:38, 10:39-41, 10:42, 11:11, 11:53-54, 13:2, 14:5, 15:16, 16:9, 17:3, 17:9, 17:33, 17:36, 20:13, 20:30, 21:19, 21:36, 22:31, 22:43-44, 23:6, 23:23, 23:34, 23:42, 24:17, 24:42, 24:46, 24:49, 24:51, 24:53
*Book of John*
John 1:18, 1:27, 1:34, 1:42, 3:13, 3:15, 3:25, 3:34, 4:1, 4:9, 4:42, 1:18, 5:2, 5:3-4, 5:16, 5:44, 6:22, 6:36, 6:47, 6:58, 6:64, 6:69, 6:71, 7:8, 7:26, 7:37, 7:39, 7:46, 7:50, 7:53-8:11, 8:16, 8:38, 8:54, 8:57, 8:59, 9:4, 9:9, 9:11, 9:35, 10:8, 10:26, 10:29, 10:34, 10:38, 11:25, 11:41, 11:49-50, 12:1, 12:28, 12:47, 13:10, 13:18, 13:26, 13:32, 14:4, 14:7, 14:11, 14:14, 14:15, 14:28, 15:7, 16:3, 16:4, 16:16, 16:18, 16:27, 17:21, 18:20, 19:16, 19:28, 20:31, 21:3, 21:15-17

[DavidFord]

"Jesus disciple NEVER talked in Aramaic"   
Acts 1 The Passion Translation (TPT)
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts+1&version=TPT
18 He [Judas] earned the wages of his sin, for he fell headfirst, and his belly split open, spilling his intestines on the ground. 19 Everyone in Jerusalem knows what happened to him. That's why the field where he died is called in Aramaic^x 'Haqel Dama,' that is, 'The Bloody Field.'
x:  Acts 1:19  Or "in the language of the region."  The Greek text is clear that the Jews of Jesus' day spoke Aramaic, the language that Jesus and his apostles taught in.  The Greek text transliterates the name of the field into a Greek equivalent for a Greek audience.

Mark 5:41 (TPT)
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=mark+5%3A41&version=TPT
41 He tenderly clasped the child's hand in his and said to her in Aramaic, "Talitha koum,"^a which means, "Little girl,^b wake up from the sleep of death."
Footnotes:
Mark 5:41 One of the many references in the New Testament proving that the language of Jesus was Aramaic.
Mark 5:41 The Aramaic word talitha can also mean "little lamb."  ....

"Paul wrote roughly 1/3rd part of NT and he NEVER talked in Aramaic"
1 Corinthians 16:22 (TPT)
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Corinthians+16%3A22+&version=TPT
If anyone doesn't sincerely love the Lord, he deserves to be doomed as an outcast.^a  Our Lord has come!^b
Footnotes:
1 Corinthians 16:22 Or "accursed."
1 Corinthians 16:22 Or "Maranatha!"  This is an Aramaic word that can be translated in two ways, "Come, our Lord" or "Our Lord has come."

[guest6088]

The NT was originally in Aramaic, not Greek.  Translations by Etheridge, Magiera, Bauscher, and Holman of the NT from the Aramaic lack 'hell':
Etheridge - use the Peshi++a Tool  http://dukhrana.com/
http://www.lulu.com  search for Ewan Macleod's Etheridge translation of the Aramaic
Magiera  http://aramaicdb.lightofword.org/index.php/en/english-word-search
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=janet+magiera&ref=nb_sb_noss_1
Bauscher  - Aramaic Bible in Plain English  https://biblehub.com/aramaic-plain-english/
https://www.lulu.com/shop/rev-david-bauscher/the-original-aramaic-new-testament-in-plain-english-with-psalms-proverbs-8th-edition-with-notes/hardcover/product-21273790.html
Biblia Peshi++a (Nuevo Testamento)  https://www.bibliatodo.com/la-biblia/ --in the "Solo Nuevo Testamento" category, select "Biblia Peshi++a (Nuevo Testamento)"

The Greek word ainon means 'age/world,' and is often mistranslated as 'eternal.'  Young's Literal Translation (YLT) of the Greek translation has renderings of 'age' and 'age-during':
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?qs_version=YLT&quicksearch=age&begin=47&end=73&limit=500
It also lacks 'hell,' and instead has 'hades' and 'gehenna' and 'Tartarus':
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=hades&qs_version=YLT
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=gehenna&qs_version=YLT
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=tartarus&qs_version=YLT
For the OT, it has 'sheol':
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=sheol&qs_version=YLT

Hi David, can you inform me where you get the conviction that the entire New Testament was originally written in Aramaic as I believe to say that with certainty is flawed.

Thank you.

[marie glen]

I have to think letters written to gentile churches would have been in Greek.. for the definition of Hades (originally the word was not seen) I really on the earliest or original meaning of sheol, to me originally, a place where there was neither thought nor doing..

Many believe believers are conscious during death before resurrection, which I don't know :dontknow: and to me doesn't matter, but Hades for the unsaved; Hades as a place of the dead other than the grave, I can't easily believe as that implies natural, inherent immortality.

But very valuable, I think to trace the 'evolution' of sheol, from it's original biblical meaning to the Jewish myth sheol in the Talmud, which was like the world's view.
Just  :2c: :gsmile:

[sheila]

the 'dead' are conscious of nothing at all..remove the 'spirit'of life from our bodies..and it dissolves..does not move,recieve impulse etc.

=without life..There is 'nothing' but God.But,if the same spirit in you[life] be the same spirit that be in Christ,,it will 'quicken'your

mortal body..cause it to put on incorruption and immortality[change it into another form/spirit] then that spirit will return untoGod

and the 'former'corrupt/mortal dust body..return unto the dust.
""
He pours out His spirit on ALL flesh..on every man's last day.  When God said'Let us make man in our image and likeness....".

incorruption and immortality..eternallife..is that image and likeness..and when we see Him face to face..we shall be just like Him.


so..'hell'is the grave...the unseen by those who judge by the appearance of the eyes...[hid in Christ]

   Enoch was no more because God took him..but he did not see death............

             if you were here Lord,Lazarus would not have died......


   sometimes[parable of the ten virgins]..virgins fall asleep spiritually..though they may be alive[carnal] in the flesh....and lacking

sufficient 'oil/spiritual light" when they return and find the bridegroom and the virgins have already met...remain in darkness........about

those who have died in the flesh[put off earthly garments ]to dwell eternally with the Lord in spirit.......

each in his order...and those that remain..when their light[oil] comes..find He comes with all those who had preceded them in death.


in the last days..I will pour out My spirit[oil]on all flesh.... :2c:

continual sowing and reaping since Abel..although men have been in darkness about it.Jesus is the resurrection and

before the founding of the world..He was. Jesus as the High Priest offers daily sacrifices unto God..our spirits returned unto God

the Father...and raises us UP into an eternal spiritual temple[body] one with the Father and Lamb.

[DavidFord]

can you inform me where you get the conviction that the entire New Testament was originally written in Aramaic as I believe to say that with certainty is flawed

Mistranslations-- several of which are discussed above-- are strong evidence that the Greek NT mss. have a translation from Aramaic.  There are many Semitic figures of speech throughout the NT, e.g. discussion of faces, kidneys, bowels, and hearts, that are alien to the Greek mind.  The Aramaic has neat features not present in the Greek mss., e.g. Mt's Lord's Prayer has much rhyming in Aramaic, there's an instance of Janus parallelism, and the Aramaic equivalent of 'Master YHWH' is retained (whereas the Greek mss. render all 'lord's-- even 'sir's-- as 'kurios.')  Plus the Greek mss. for John prominently contain a particular Semitic linguistic construction, the Greek grammar for Revelation is atrociously bad, etc.  I discussed much of this in
http://tentmaker.org/forum/judgement-and-punishment/gehenna-and-sheol-in-the-aramaic-nt/
and earlier in
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/aus.religion.islam/bzdQCJTVhyk/SdGP_f82uUoJ

[marie glen]

can you inform me where you get the conviction that the entire New Testament was originally written in Aramaic as I believe to say that with certainty is flawed

Mistranslations-- several of which are discussed above-- are strong evidence that the Greek NT mss. have a translation from Aramaic.  There are many Semitic figures of speech throughout the NT, e.g. discussion of faces, kidneys, bowels, and hearts, that are alien to the Greek mind.  The Aramaic has neat features not present in the Greek mss., e.g. Mt's Lord's Prayer has much rhyming in Aramaic, there's an instance of Janus parallelism, and the Aramaic equivalent of 'Master YHWH' is retained (whereas the Greek mss. render all 'lord's-- even 'sir's-- as 'kurios.')  Plus the Greek mss. for John prominently contain a particular Semitic linguistic construction, the Greek grammar for Revelation is atrociously bad, etc.  I discussed much of this in
http://tentmaker.org/forum/judgement-and-punishment/gehenna-and-sheol-in-the-aramaic-nt/
and earlier in
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/aus.religion.islam/bzdQCJTVhyk/SdGP_f82uUoJ

It makes sense to me (1) Jesus would have spoken Aramaic to Israel. And (2) that letters written to predominantly Israeli churches would likely too have been written in the Aramaic. As Paul, when he was being arrested in Jerusalem (Acts 21) "spoke to the crowd in Aramaic" (vs 40). Which is pretty current with the writing of his letters.

But letters to predominantly gentile believers, I have to think were likely written in the Greek.. Likely made up of both gentile and Judean? With some seeming very much addressed to gentile believers.. And how Paul called himself the apostle to the gentiles..

And John was to send the letters to the churches with the book of revelation, to churches of Asia..

[guest6088]

can you inform me where you get the conviction that the entire New Testament was originally written in Aramaic as I believe to say that with certainty is flawed

Mistranslations-- several of which are discussed above-- are strong evidence that the Greek NT mss. have a translation from Aramaic.  There are many Semitic figures of speech throughout the NT, e.g. discussion of faces, kidneys, bowels, and hearts, that are alien to the Greek mind.  The Aramaic has neat features not present in the Greek mss., e.g. Mt's Lord's Prayer has much rhyming in Aramaic, there's an instance of Janus parallelism, and the Aramaic equivalent of 'Master YHWH' is retained (whereas the Greek mss. render all 'lord's-- even 'sir's-- as 'kurios.')  Plus the Greek mss. for John prominently contain a particular Semitic linguistic construction, the Greek grammar for Revelation is atrociously bad, etc.  I discussed much of this in
http://tentmaker.org/forum/judgement-and-punishment/gehenna-and-sheol-in-the-aramaic-nt/
and earlier in
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/aus.religion.islam/bzdQCJTVhyk/SdGP_f82uUoJ

It makes sense to me (1) Jesus would have spoken Aramaic to Israel. And (2) that letters written to predominantly Israeli churches would likely too have been written in the Aramaic. As Paul, when he was being arrested in Jerusalem (Acts 21) "spoke to the crowd in Aramaic" (vs 40). Which is pretty current with the writing of his letters.

But letters to predominantly gentile believers, I have to think were likely written in the Greek.. Likely made up of both gentile and Judean? With some seeming very much addressed to gentile believers.. And how Paul called himself the apostle to the gentiles..

And John was to send the letters to the churches with the book of revelation, to churches of Asia..

That's pretty much what I believe.  I don't think the entire NT was originally Aramaic...Could have been though, but to say with certainty I couldn't.

[DavidFord]

It makes sense to me (1) Jesus would have spoken Aramaic to Israel. And (2) that letters written to predominantly Israeli churches would likely too have been written in the Aramaic. As Paul, when he was being arrested in Jerusalem (Acts 21) "spoke to the crowd in Aramaic" (vs 40). Which is pretty current with the writing of his letters.

But letters to predominantly gentile believers, I have to think were likely written in the Greek.. Likely made up of both gentile and Judean? With some seeming very much addressed to gentile believers.. And how Paul called himself the apostle to the gentiles..

And John was to send the letters to the churches with the book of revelation, to churches of Asia..

"letters to predominantly gentile believers, I have to think were likely written in the Greek.. Likely made up of both gentile and Judean? With some seeming very much addressed to gentile believers"
What grounds are there for thinking that some of Paul's letters were written "to predominantly gentile believers"-- and which letters?
Revelation was originally written in Aramaic, and got translated-- badly-- into Greek.
Do you think Revelation was originally composed in:  Greek?  Aramaic?  Hebrew?

Christopher Lancaster aka "Raphael Lataster," _Was the New Testament Really Written in Greek? A Concise Compendium of the Many Internal and External Evidences of Aramaic Peshi tta Primacy_ (2011), 328pp., 138-139.   Lataster PDF:
http://www.preteristarchive.com/Books/pdf/2006_lataster_NT_writteningreek.pdf
In addition to the evidence for Semitic grammar embedded in the Greek New Testament, the fact that serious grammatical errors are found in the Greek New Testament books should also be revealed.  Speaking of the Greek of Revelation, Charles Cutler Torrey states that it "...swarms with major offenses against Greek grammar." He calls it "linguistic anarchy", and says, "The grammatical monstrosities of the book, in their number and variety and especially in their startling character, stand alone in the history of literature."  Torrey gives ten examples listed below:
1. Rev. 1:4 "Grace to you, and peace, from he who is and who was and who is to come." (all nom. case)
2. Rev. 1:15 "His legs were like burnished brass (neutral gender dative case), as in a furnace purified" (Fem. gender sing. no., gen. case)
3. Rev. 11:3 "My witness (nom.) shall prophesy for many days clothed (accus.) in sackcloth."
4. Rev. 14:14 "I saw on the cloud, one seated like unto a Son of Man (accus.) having
(nom.) upon his head a golden crown."
5. Rev. 14:19 "He harvested the vintage of the earth, and cast it into the winepress
(fem), the great (masc.) of the wrath of God."
6. Rev. 17:4 "A golden cup filled with abominations (gen.) and with unclean things" (accus.)
7. Rev. 19:20 "The lake of blazing (fem.) fire (neutral)."
8. Rev. 20:2 "And he seized the dragon (accus.), the old serpent (nom.), who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him."
9. Rev. 21:9 "Seven angels holding seven bowls (accus.), filled (gen.) with the seven last plagues."
10. Rev. 22:5 "They have no need of lamplight (gen.) nor of sunlight (accus.).

David Robert Palmer, The Revelation of John, part of The Holy Bible, The Ancient Greek Text, alternating verse by verse with A new English translation from the Greek, with translator's footnotes and Greek textual variant footnotes (May 2017)
http://bibletranslation.ws/palmer-translation/
PDF:
http://www.bibletranslation.ws/trans/revwgrk.pdf
170 10:1b The Greek word here, πους, is the word for feet, but in ancient Greek and many other
languages the words for foot or for hand (χειρ) can mean the whole extremity or whole limb.
That is especially true in Revelation, which displays much Aramaic influence. It is far more
appropriate here to speak of a leg being like a column or pillar than a foot being like a column
or pillar.
....
246 13:16b .... An Aramaism is an unusual and rare occurrence, and I think the burden of proof that it is occurring, is on the one saying it is. That said, I have come to believe that Revelation does
show an Aramaic mind in its author. For example, though even ancient Greek the words for
foot πούς and hand χείρ originally meant the whole limb, not just the foot and hand, this is
most definitely always true in Hebrew and Aramaic. The author of Revelation uses πούς,
"foot" to mean the whole limb, where he says the feet of the angel were like "columns" of fire
Legs are like columns, and feet are not. Therefore similarly, we must conclude that in
Revelation 13:16, with χείρ the author means anywhere on the entire upper right limb, not
just the hand.

Revelation 1:13 (The Passion Translation)
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=rev+1&version=TPT
And walking among the lampstands, I saw someone like a son of man, wearing a full-length robe with a golden sash over his chest.[aj]
The Greek word used here is mastos and is used exclusively for a woman's breasts.

3149. μαστός (mastos)
https://biblehub.com/greek/strongs_3149.htm
Strong's Greek: 3149. μαστός (mastos) — 3 Occurrences
Luke 11:27 N-NMP
GRK: σε καὶ μαστοὶ οὓς ἐθήλασας
NAS: that bore You and the breasts at which
KJV: and the paps which
INT: you and [the] breasts at which you nursed

Luke 23:29 N-NMP
GRK: ἐγέννησαν καὶ μαστοὶ οἳ οὐκ
NAS: bore, and the breasts that never
KJV: bare, and the paps which never
INT: did bear and breasts which never

Revelation 1:13 N-DMP
GRK: πρὸς τοῖς μαστοῖς ζώνην χρυσᾶν
NAS: across His chest with a golden
KJV: about the paps with a golden
INT: at the breasts a belt golden

4738. στῆθος (stéthos)
https://biblehub.com/greek/strongs_4738.htm
Strong's Greek: 4738. στῆθος (stéthos) — 5 Occurrences
Luke 18:13 N-ANS
GRK: ἔτυπτεν τὸ στῆθος αὐτοῦ λέγων
NAS: but was beating his breast, saying,
KJV: upon his breast, saying, God
INT: was striking the breast of himself saying

Luke 23:48 N-ANP
GRK: τύπτοντες τὰ στήθη ὑπέστρεφον
NAS: beating their breasts.
KJV: smote their breasts, and returned.
INT: beating the breasts returned [home]

John 13:25 N-ANS
GRK: ἐπὶ τὸ στῆθος τοῦ Ἰησοῦ
NAS: on Jesus' bosom, said
KJV: lying on Jesus' breast saith unto him,
INT: on the breast of Jesus

John 21:20 N-ANS
GRK: ἐπὶ τὸ στῆθος αὐτοῦ καὶ
NAS: had leaned back on His bosom at the supper
KJV: on his breast at supper,
INT: on the bosom of him and

Revelation 15:6 N-ANP
GRK: περὶ τὰ στήθη ζώνας χρυσᾶς
NAS: around their chests with golden
KJV: and having their breasts girded
INT: about the breasts sashes golden

David Robert Palmer, The Revelation of John, part of The Holy Bible, The Ancient Greek Text, alternating verse by verse with A new English translation from the Greek, with translator's footnotes and Greek textual variant footnotes (May 2017)
http://bibletranslation.ws/palmer-translation/
PDF:
http://www.bibletranslation.ws/trans/revwgrk.pdf
28 1:13f Literally, "breasts," μαστοῖς but that would be very unidiomatic for English, and it
essentially means chest, as in 15:6, where the seven angels also have a golden sash around
their chest, and there the Greek word used is στῆθος, "chest." But I didn't want to translate
μαστοῖς as a singular word like chest, when the Greek is plural, so I used "pecs" which is short
for pectorals.

_The Restored New Testament: A New Translation with Commentary, Including the Gnostic Gospels Thomas, Mary, and Judas_ (2009) by Willis Barnstone, 1485pp., on 1236
https://www.amazon.com/Restored-New-Testament-Translation-Commentary/dp/039306493X/
14.  Although the Greek _mastois_ means "breasts," it is commonly translated as "chest" or "waist" or sometimes the singular form "breast."

[DavidFord]

Especially-interesting instances of MrYa = Master YHWH in the Aramaic New Testament
Verses from https://aramaicdb.lightofword.org/index.php/en/scripture-reference-search

Mat 22:45 (APNT) Therefore, if David called him 'LORD,' how is he his son?"
Luk 2:11 For today the deliverer, who is the LORD the Messiah, is born to you in the city of David.
Act 2:36 Therefore, all the house of Israel should truly know that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, LORD and Christ."
Act 2:38 Simon said to them, "Repent and be baptized, each one of you, in the name of the LORD Jesus for the forgiveness of sins, so that you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Rom 14:9 Because of this, Christ also died and is alive and is risen that he would be the LORD for the dead and for the living.
Rom 14:14 For I know and am persuaded in the LORD Jesus that there is not anything that is defiled of itself. But to him who thinks that something is unclean, to him alone it is unclean.
1Co 8:6 but to us ourselves, [there] is one God, the Father, from whom [are] all [things] and by whom we are, and one LORD, Jesus Christ, by way of him [are] all [things] and we are also by way of him.
1Co 11:27 Therefore, whoever eats of the bread of the LORD and drinks from his cup and is not worthy, he is indebted to the blood of the LORD and to his body.
1Co 12:3 Because of this, I make known to you that there is no one who speaks by the Spirit of God and says that Jesus is cursed. And neither is anyone able to say that Jesus is LORD, except by the Holy Spirit.
Phi 2:11 and every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is the LORD, to the glory of God his Father.
Col 3:24 And know that from our Lord you will receive a reward in the inheritance, for you serve the LORD the Messiah.
Rev 1:8 "I am Aleph and Tau," says the LORD God, "He who is and was and comes, who is the Almighty."
Rev 22:20 He said, testifying these [things], "Yes, I am coming soon." Come, LORD Jesus.

hat tip:
https://torahinkingdom.com/yhwh-new-testament/

[sheila]

Hi David,1 Cor11;27that one can be tricky..since He chose the foolish and despised..and the prodigal son come home..proclaiming

I AM UNWORTHY....I don't  think we 'earn"love"..it just is..and freeley forgives 'debts/trespasses"I also find it'odd' those

proclaiming LORD,LORD...then lists the'works'and He denies knowing them..indebted to Him because they didn't give food/water

etc..to fellow members o f His body[maybe they thought these fellow body members were unworthy/despised/fools..etc?

I would love to hear others input regarding this...... :girlheart:

[sheila]

 :2c:remember some'christian' writers awhile back..saying blacks were cursed..surely that was a debt against His body...

and the elder sons poor attitude when the despised,unworthy brother returned[where was the natural Love for both his Father and

brother?]It is often tied up with physical affliction/sickness..this not discerning the body.... :girlheart:

[DavidFord]

when the despised, unworthy brother returned

The prodigal returned.  In the end, all of us will have returned.

Another:  "we have a choice and the Bible does not tell that all creation will choose Jesus"
1Co 12:3 Because of this, I make known to you that there is no one who speaks by the Spirit of God and says that Jesus is cursed. And neither is anyone able to say that Jesus is LORD, except by the Holy Spirit.
Phi 2:11 and every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is the LORD, to the glory of God his Father.

-Verses from https://aramaicdb.lightofword.org/index.php/en/scripture-reference-search
The NT was originally in Aramaic, and it has "MrYa" = "Master YHWH" in many places (e.g. the 2 verses above), which the Greek translation rendered as merely 'kurius'/lord, even as the Greek translation rendered 'sir' as 'lord.'
God is so brilliant that he can give free will to people and to angels, they rebel, and in the end, all the people (and the angels?) willingly return to God.  Jesus preached in hell once, and I'm sure he cleared the place out.  Perhaps Jesus-- who has the keys to hell-- will preach there once again.

[marie glen]

when the despised, unworthy brother returned

The prodigal returned.  In the end, all of us will have returned.

:thumbsup: :cloud9: Like Nebuchadnezzar? After 7 times, (6000 years plus the millennium) humanity comes to its senses (during collective 'day' of Judgment/discernment?)

[marie glen]

P.S. I'm interested in the Berean Study Bible.. But I have to read more of their verses first, controversial ones. It's one of the versions on biblehub.com

I just as soon have a bible that doesn't say hell.. not saying forever would be good too.. That's basically my only beef with the translations. But the more Hebrew and Aramaic - and I've no doubt the very first Christians, who were Judean, very much had an Aramaic bent - the better. Whether they wrote in Greek to gentile churches, like in Corinth, or those of Asia.. :dontknow: I'm sure God Almighty is able to communicate His Word in every language.. But the Aramaic leaning seems the most genuine to me, personally. But I read a lot of versions, including the most modern ones.

Aramaic leaning verse translations are very interesting, thanks for posting them! :Peace2:

[DavidFord]

An additional mistranslation.

Jn 15, based on Paul Younan's translation of the original Aramaic, http://dukhrana.com
21. But they will do all these things to you because of my name,
for they do not know He who sent me.
22. If I had not come (and) spoken to them,
they would have no sin,
but now they have no holocaust upon the face of their sin.
[Aramaic idiomatic construct meaning 'now their sin is left uncovered.' The Aramaic word Alatha (offering, sacrifice, holocaust, and oblation) has been confused in the Greek translations with the Aramaic word Altha (excuse, pretext).  Jesus meant 'their sin is left uncovered' and not, as the Western versions read, 'their sin is without excuse.'  There never is an excuse for sin. -- based on PY]

[DavidFord]

"talk about anything other than KJV is no good"  IMO, such talk is silliness.  "peoples POV on bible versions"  The version you read regularly is the best. 
The Masoretic has problems.  Amazingly, in several instances the LXX i.e. Septuagint (Hebrew into Greek into English) is superior to the much-younger Masoretic (Hebrew into English).  The New Testament was originally in Aramaic, not Greek, and correctly translating from Aramaic into English removes several mistranslations and corruptions present in the 'Aramaic into Greek into English' editions that so common these days.
3rd post down
Mistranslations in Your New Testament Translated From Greek, Which Was Translated From the Original Aramaic
https://tentmaker.org/forum/judgement-and-punishment/translations-without-'hell'-accurate-translations/

There are scattered discussions of instances of LXX and Samaritan Pentateuch and Peshi tta Tanakh and Dead Sea Scrolls vs. the Masoretic in the Aramaic Primacy Forum at
peshi tta.org
specifically in its thread "book of Hebrews: better from Greek, or Aramaic?"

[eaglesway]

Tried that link David. Didnt work for me. Is it possible a letter missing or something?

[DavidFord]

Tried that link David. Didnt work for me. Is it possible a letter missing or something?

The forum software's bowdlerizing feature interfered.  Try typing in peshi tta.org