God's Will, Man's Will, free will/sov discussions

[marie glen]

Amen! He sure will.. I often think, what is the best teacher? (besides God's HS that is!) This life of missing the mark - individually and collectively, which can only crash n burn as the saying goes.. unveiling to our heart, mind and psyche, truth from error / untrue.. life from death.. i.e. good from evil/not good.. what works - building on The Rock / Truth and what can never, no never, ever ever work, i.e. building on sands..

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[Dandelion]

The Beginning (John 1)
(Genesis 1:1-2)
1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning. 3Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made. 4In Him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.

D.

[ChristianBrother]

In my whole spiritual life i have learn..
We all need to come to His will
No way.. His will need to be done..
let us surrender him with new faith and hopes

[marie glen]

The Beginning (John 1)
(Genesis 1:1-2)
1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning. 3Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made. 4In Him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.

D.

Amen! Praise the Lord! We can totally rest in that truth.

While I read that it came to mind.. about the adversary, and the often question - was the adversary created in the beginning as evil?

I think no, but the option of straying was switched on, so to speak, with him.. It's not as some seem to think, that somehow the adversary's revolt was a surprise to God! :LH:

Yet, I thoroughly hate it, and can't accept it, when it is put forth that God created the adversary, and created evil, instead of engineered things so the wandering would occur at the beginning of things (what He is creating).. Seems to me all need to fully understand good from evil.. It may seem like not much difference -  and in a sense, there isn't! Whether He created evil as evil, or engineered it so the wandering into it could occur.. Not 'free-will' but able to, and guided down that path of wandering.. "all we like sheep have gone astray".. Engineered just so, for God's purposes.

Yet I think the fruits of both differ views greatly.. One way of seeing it - God created evil as evil, the adversary was created evil (why would he have to repent then?)

If God created evil as evil and the adversary as evil, then it seems to also be the thought that Hitler, etc, all such, was God acting through them. I cannot accept that. That is almost, but not quite, as bad as the ET idea. (why would anyone be required to repent if our evil deeds are God doing them through us? Yes, I come across that idea all the time!)

Look at how that wily serpent approached Eve? -- In mankind's infancy -- Didn't God know that was going to happen? Indeed, Adam and Eve were the seed, through which all of us came about; the corruption of them and thus the seed of us all, corrupted so early on - so that it spread to all. God is a genius! And of course that is an understatement.. greatly. :gsmile:

5The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it...

.... :cloud9:

[guest6024]

John 7:17 NIV
17 Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own.

[guest6024]

If we have NO free will then why a need for a 'savior'?   :dontknow:  If we have no free will we cannot CHOOSE to sin and so we are NOT sinners so who is the 'savior' saving?  :punish: ...God?   :eek:


QUESTION:-   :LH:
To those that DON'T believe in human free willl...
...If someone slapped you over the back of the head for no reason :punish: who would you blame? - Them or God? 
In other words would you blame the puppet or the puppeteer?   :dontknow:
Who is REALLY to blame?  :Chinscratch:

If you would blame the person you are a hypocrite no?   :LH:

I believe we have a free will.  (As far as choosing 'flesh or spirit' goes).   :banana:
I also believe that when we 'know as we are fully known' we will willingly subject ourselves to God.  -  A mutual relationship.   :gimmefive:

[GodIsLove]

I think the extend of free will is a mystery.
But I do think our will is restrained by lots of factors:

We didn't choose where to be born, what family to be born into, our culture, our genetics, our socioeconomics, gender, race, the time period we were born, our physical health, our mental health.

We didn't choose to be born at all!

Then other environmental factors can happen without our permission or choice that can affect us and how we make choices: abuse, accidents, bullying, natural disasters. The list is too long to write.

Our wills are also slaves to selfish or otherwise sinful desires. Slave inherently implies a lack of freedom of choice.

THEN the Bible tells us God's will is stronger than ours (who can resist His will etc) so if and when he does come to us we cannot resist, at least in that moment. Not because he is controlling, but because we belong to him and are His, made from him and for him.

So any free will we have I believe is constrained and influenced by the factors I referred to above AND is only allowed because God is allowing us to exercise our own wills within all these parameters and confines.  He can and does step in and other times it seems like He lets us go it alone but for a purpose IMO, for learning or some other purpose.

So if I was feeling the Holy Spirit working in me and someone slapped me for no reason, I'd probably feel thoughts like "Father forgive him, he knows not what he is doing" or "he hit me because... (he was hit as a child and doesn't know a better way...or he hit me because he just lost his job and can't deal with his negative emotions appropriately and I just happen to be here to feel his wrath...or he hit me because he is mentally ill...etc).

If I was feeling carnally minded of course I'd be mad, and I'd probably lash out and hit back.

Just my  :2c:

I think also, to answer the question of if we don't have free will why need a savior:

What about this scenario:

A small child wanders into a pool and is drowning. They freely chose to drown themselves, aka suicide? No, it was done out of ignorance and was basically an accident, the kid didn't know better. The factors at play (the pool wasn't locked, the kid wasn't supervised, the kid was born into a family with a pool, the kid didn't know how to swim) and the child's ignorance caused the need for a savior.

Or you can take the example a step further and say someone threw the kid in the pool. They then didn't even choose to ignorantly wander in, but they still need to be saved.

Full disclosure:

I said all this and do believe this is somewhat how it plays out but I admit ignorance to the details as I think we ALL are currently a little fuzzy on how it works.

However in my every day life I do have both thoughts:

I can see where a behavior of mine or someone else's comes from (past events, trauma, mental illness, ignorance etc) but I still do get upset when I perceive someone is wronging me or I feel guilt and remorse when I do something I believe was the wrong choice. So I think we can recognize our wills are pulled and influenced and constrained and still try, within the limited confines, to make the best choices we can given our abilities at the time, and pray to God to help us make choices that align with his will and that will be the most loving choices possible.

[guest6024]

I think the extend of free will is a mystery.
But I do think our will is restrained by lots of factors:

We didn't choose where to be born, what family to be born into, our culture, our genetics, our socioeconomics, gender, race, the time period we were born, our physical health, our mental health.

We didn't choose to be born at all!

Then other environmental factors can happen without our permission or choice that can affect us and how we make choices: abuse, accidents, bullying, natural disasters. The list is too long to write.

Our wills are also slaves to selfish or otherwise sinful desires. Slave inherently implies a lack of freedom of choice.

THEN the Bible tells us God's will is stronger than ours (who can resist His will etc) so if and when he does come to us we cannot resist, at least in that moment. Not because he is controlling, but because we belong to him and are His, made from him and for him.

So any free will we have I believe is constrained and influenced by the factors I referred to above AND is only allowed because God is allowing us to exercise our own wills within all these parameters and confines.  He can and does step in and other times it seems like He lets us go it alone but for a purpose IMO, for learning or some other purpose.

So if I was feeling the Holy Spirit working in me and someone slapped me for no reason, I'd probably feel thoughts like "Father forgive him, he knows not what he is doing" or "he hit me because... (he was hit as a child and doesn't know a better way...or he hit me because he just lost his job and can't deal with his negative emotions appropriately and I just happen to be here to feel his wrath...or he hit me because he is mentally ill...etc).

If I was feeling carnally minded of course I'd be mad, and I'd probably lash out and hit back.

Just my  :2c:

I think also, to answer the question of if we don't have free will why need a savior:

What about this scenario:

A small child wanders into a pool and is drowning. They freely chose to drown themselves, aka suicide? No, it was done out of ignorance and was basically an accident, the kid didn't know better. The factors at play (the pool wasn't locked, the kid wasn't supervised, the kid was born into a family with a pool, the kid didn't know how to swim) and the child's ignorance caused the need for a savior.

Or you can take the example a step further and say someone threw the kid in the pool. They then didn't even choose to ignorantly wander in, but they still need to be saved.

Full disclosure:

I said all this and do believe this is somewhat how it plays out but I admit ignorance to the details as I think we ALL are currently a little fuzzy on how it works.

However in my every day life I do have both thoughts:

I can see where a behavior of mine or someone else's comes from (past events, trauma, mental illness, ignorance etc) but I still do get upset when I perceive someone is wronging me or I feel guilt and remorse when I do something I believe was the wrong choice. So I think we can recognize our wills are pulled and influenced and constrained and still try, within the limited confines, to make the best choices we can given our abilities at the time, and pray to God to help us make choices that align with his will and that will be the most loving choices possible.

Hi thank you for the response!

...If the child wandered into a pool (to see what it was like or to deliberately kill themself) and they have NO free will then the child didn't wander into the pool (how can they with NO free will? (they are a robot essentially)) ...So It was God that did it.
IF that child needs a 'savior' then who is the savior saving?  That child (an entity with zero free will) or Himself for wandering into the pool in the first place?

It's just the same if someone throws the child in the pool...The child has no say in it and the person throwing the child in has no say either.  So the need for a savior begs the question 'who is being saved' since none of these people are making choices?


This is what I believe the TRUTH is though...
If I made a robot with 'free will' (50/50 it could go 'left or right', 'up or down', say 'yes' or 'no' etc etc) and it eventually falls into a pool and I save the robot. - Who have I saved?
Well...I've saved the robot.  It had free will (the robot acted INDEPENDENTLY of ME)...(I didn't force it or tell it to do anything).  But I saved it from drowning (or rusting in this case!). 
This proves there was 'something' to be 'saved'.
If there was NO free will there would be NOTHING to save (because the puppet and the puppeteer would be the same person).

With regards to the head slapping thing. - Why be mad at the person (with no free will) who did (didn't do it cos hes no free will) it? - That's a bit like getting angry at the puppet instead of the puppeteer?

[sheila]

computer files and programs can be'corrupted"..and act without trhyme or reason when they do.positive/negative,good/evil...choice

is mute when corrupted.Enter  MALWARE/ENMITY....... :2c:

[guest6024]

computer files and programs can be'corrupted"..and act without trhyme or reason when they do.positive/negative,good/evil...choice

is mute when corrupted.Enter  MALWARE/ENMITY....... :2c:

Can you elaborate a little, I don't understand what you mean.

The robot could only become 'corrupted' if the creator of the robot (and also creator of the whole universe) subjected it to corruption as the robot has no free will nor creative power (to than extent)...

Here's a funny analogy!

Hitler is told to go in to be judged by God by an angel...
"Good luck in there dude" says the angel and he closes the door...
Hitler sees God sitting opposite, eating some raisins, looking really happy.
God notices him.
"Hitler!  Come over!  You're looking super today...Love the 'tash" says God.
Hitler is a bit dumbstruck.
..."Ohhh...That's nice of you God...So um... Aren't you going to punish me?"
"What for?"
"Well...Quite a few things"...
"You didn't have a free will...Hardly your fault is it!  Now enter into paradise!"

[sheila]

 :2c:Romans8;20

[guest6024]

:2c:Romans8;20

"For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by its own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in hope".

The way I see that is me creating the robot and its surroundings.  The robot still has a 'free will' (within the limits of its 'brain' which I gave it (100Gb in this case!) and within the confines of it's 'habitat') etc.
Why would I let the robot have complete control over everything with it's limited knowledge? I wouldn't.

I believe we have a free will in much the same way as this.  IE ... God sets the 'barriers' and leaves us to it.

Why?  I've no idea.

If I was God and ruled the universe and had 'need of nothing' (self sustaining blah blah) would I create a robot/human/other life?...  Answer...No idea. 
Its possible I would start 'creating stuff' though...Fluffy cute things mostly I reckon.   Maybe I would make a place like earth to see how my 'robots' coped with a bit of stress... I mean...Look at superman without his superpowers...what a drip!  Yeah...a bit of 'character building' never hurt nobody.  Noone likes a spoiled person and to allow them to appreciate the 'light' i'd have to give them a little 'darkness'.  I know they wouldn't enjoy it (at the time) but they would realize one day I had their best interests at heart...

Yeah...Imagine creating 'someone' and everything in their life is perfect...You watch them from the 'heavens' and they are just in a perfect world with perfect weather and everythings perfet...They live on chocolate and don't get fat or ever get a sore stomach...  They never suffer in the least and you watch them and they don't even know they are in paradise so can't even appreciate it...They just 'go through the motions' like a dummy.

Nah...We need duality...I know it's not pleasant but there you go...It's either that or be a robot.  Yep we have free will I reckon.

...And Marc became lost in thought and talked aimlessly for many hours...  :dsunny:

[MusicLover123]

All I see mostly here is human reasoning, and not Scriptures to witness to God's truth. That's all I'll say for now.

Isaiah 55

8For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.
9For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

Colossians 2
8See that no one shall be carrying you away as spoil through the philosophy and vain deceit, according to the deliverance of men, according to the rudiments of the world, and not according to Christ

[guest6024]

All I see mostly here is human reasoning, and not Scriptures to witness to God's truth. That's all I'll say for now.

Isaiah 55

8For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.
9For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

Colossians 2
8See that no one shall be carrying you away as spoil through the philosophy and vain deceit, according to the deliverance of men, according to the rudiments of the world, and not according to Christ

Very interesting.  :LH:

And you use this seeming 'God's truth' from certain books which were evidently written by humans and humans also decided which books went into the bible..   

Nah...his thoughts are CERTAINLY not MY thoughts!...Far from it!   

If you think those bible writers were 'inspired by God' (love) to say such things about the creator of all then thats up to you.    :declare:
...But I don't.   

[etc....mod edit]

marc, as far as the purpose, intent, and posting expectations at TM your post does not meet expectations.  If you have serious questions or uncertainties, that's an area for discussion.  However,   please review the posting guidelines, particularly 'expectations regarding scriptures', as well as "not a debate site", and feel free to give it one more shot.  Please keep in mind the expectations though.  Thanks.

[GodIsLove]

Ok. It's not my site and I won't get into it.

BUT, ML, I'm a little disheartened by all of your subtle jabs at others' posts. I've seen it a few times. It comes across as rather condescending.

Many veterans on this site engage in discussions because like it or not the Bible is somewhat unclear about some things and God gave us human reason so it's ok to use it and engage in discussions with one another. I did use scripture (who can resist his will), Sheila did as well.

I like "new blood" on here and it seems people get shut down rather quickly. It makes for quite the circular topics, with the same old posts.

[MusicLover123]

OK, Sorry about that then.

I was actually just referring to Marc, but even then I shouldn't have worded it that way.

I'm learning, so please forgive me

[jabcat]

People get "shut down" when they either persistently or blatantly ignore the clearly stated posting guidelines.  In reviewing things though, marc could have 1 warning.  So his ban will be lifted for now, with a request to review posting guidelines in question, and we'll go from there.

[GodIsLove]

OK, Sorry about that then.

I was actually just referring to Marc, but even then I shouldn't have worded it that way.

I'm learning, so please forgive me

Totally forgiven. And I apologize if I came across as harsh, I had a bad day, actually bad couple of weeks. Hint hint free will constrained by a carnal mind wallowing in the cares of the world. Ha

And yeah I do see where Marc didn't site anything other than his own ideas. I was hoping for a good discussion but I see he got rather controversial pretty quickly. Not sure the extend of what he said and not sure why he got so heated so quickly.

Anyway u are a welcome edition as the "new blood" I was referring to and am glad u are sticking around here.

[trettep]

Very interesting.  :LH:

And you use this seeming 'God's truth' from certain books which were evidently written by humans and humans also decided which books went into the bible..     [mod edit]

Nah...his thoughts are CERTAINLY not MY thoughts!...Far from it!   
Why...It almost sounds like this 'god' was created by 'men'!  ... The worst kind of men...     [mod edit]   Like if a group of people I don't know told me they just saw someone walking on water I'd have to see it for myself...especially if it was over 2000 yrs ago... Call me a 'doubting thomas' lol!  :dontknow:

[mod edit]

'Human reasoning' lol!  That's pretty much ALL we've got...
If you think those bible writers were 'inspired by God' (love) to say such things about the creator of all then thats up to you.    :declare:
...But I don't.   
I give the real creator a bit more credit than that.


I'd like to have a SANE discussion at some point based on love and proper morals?

[mod edit]

I'm just here looking for truth. 
...Ain't finding much.   :doh:

Let me tell you something interesting though if you have time...

[[mod edit]

What I'm getting at is that...  Nobody HAS to believe everything they read just because someone wrote it and someone else put it there and said 'this is what God said'.


Admit it... [mod edit] You can't lie to yourself...Are you REALLY happy that all that stuff is in the bible?

Well...Hate me if you like... But I'm honest.  And I DETEST that kind of thing. - IT'S DISGUSTING and there is NO defence for it - not from me anyway.

[mod edit]

Sometimes it's better to use the brain the REAL CREATOR gave us than blindly follow a book I reckon. - Real love doesn't hit people off rocks or stone anyone and that's that.  I don't care what a book says!

To find truth one must be honest and that's what I'm about....  I've had enough lies to last me a lifetime

I look forward to debates in future!

Hi Marc,

I'm glad to see that your looking for the Truth.  You will eventually come to know it. 

Are you into statistics?

The Jews (remember that didn't give Jesus any credit towards being the Messiah - on the contrary), they had a Temple ritual in which they would choose between two stones by grabbing one at random.  Therefore, it should be easy to see that the odds are very similar to flipping a two sided coin.  Now for 40 years straight that chose the same BLACK stone.  The odds of that are 2 raised to the 40th power or 1099511627776 to 1.

The destruction of that Temple began the day that Jesus was Crucified and ended when the Romans destroyed the Temple in 70 AD just as Jesus foretold in Matthew 24.

You see there are patterns in the Bible that we see that can't be explained but by divine operations. 

There many other events recorded by Jewish sages that happened in regards to the Temple.  Now understand the Jews would in no manner devise these things to prop up Jesus since they are the ones that were responsible for His Crucifixion.   

Now these things were recorded and we have the evidence of those events.  So if you believe you have logic and reason then you need to investigate such amazing events and see what you conclude.

[MusicLover123]

OK, Sorry about that then.

I was actually just referring to Marc, but even then I shouldn't have worded it that way.

I'm learning, so please forgive me

Totally forgiven. And I apologize if I came across as harsh, I had a bad day, actually bad couple of weeks. Hint hint free will constrained by a carnal mind wallowing in the cares of the world. Ha

And yeah I do see where Marc didn't site anything other than his own ideas. I was hoping for a good discussion but I see he got rather controversial pretty quickly. Not sure the extend of what he said and not sure why he got so heated so quickly.

Anyway u are a welcome edition as the "new blood" I was referring to and am glad u are sticking around here.

:friendstu:

In regards to your worries, cast it all on Him. He dwells with us and in us, and swept among us in the flesh. God knows what to do.

Philippians 4
4Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, rejoice;
5let your forbearance be known to all men; the Lord [is] near;
6for nothing be anxious, but in everything by prayer, and by supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known unto God;
7and the peace of God, that is surpassing all understanding, shall guard your hearts and your thoughts in Christ Jesus.
8As to the rest, brethren, as many things as are true, as many as [are] grave, as many as [are] righteous, as many as [are] pure, as many as [are] lovely, as many as [are] of good report, if any worthiness, and if any praise, these things think upon

[MusicLover123]

On a lighter note, more of a double edged sword, but...

Maybe it was good I said that? In a weird sort of way? If I would have not been lead to post, who knows how much more trouble could have come out.

[guest6024]

Ok.

Yeah I can't concile the OT with the NT 'god' and have never heard any decent reasoning that the two can be the same one.  One says 'stone them' the other says 'forgive them'. - Complete opposites!

I'll look for answers elsewhere.

Thanks.

[guest6024]

Very interesting.  :LH:

And you use this seeming 'God's truth' from certain books which were evidently written by humans and humans also decided which books went into the bible..     [mod edit]

Nah...his thoughts are CERTAINLY not MY thoughts!...Far from it!   
Why...It almost sounds like this 'god' was created by 'men'!  ... The worst kind of men...     [mod edit]   Like if a group of people I don't know told me they just saw someone walking on water I'd have to see it for myself...especially if it was over 2000 yrs ago... Call me a 'doubting thomas' lol!  :dontknow:

[mod edit]

'Human reasoning' lol!  That's pretty much ALL we've got...
If you think those bible writers were 'inspired by God' (love) to say such things about the creator of all then thats up to you.    :declare:
...But I don't.   
I give the real creator a bit more credit than that.


I'd like to have a SANE discussion at some point based on love and proper morals?

[mod edit]

I'm just here looking for truth. 
...Ain't finding much.   :doh:

Let me tell you something interesting though if you have time...

[[mod edit]

What I'm getting at is that...  Nobody HAS to believe everything they read just because someone wrote it and someone else put it there and said 'this is what God said'.


Admit it... [mod edit] You can't lie to yourself...Are you REALLY happy that all that stuff is in the bible?

Well...Hate me if you like... But I'm honest.  And I DETEST that kind of thing. - IT'S DISGUSTING and there is NO defence for it - not from me anyway.

[mod edit]

Sometimes it's better to use the brain the REAL CREATOR gave us than blindly follow a book I reckon. - Real love doesn't hit people off rocks or stone anyone and that's that.  I don't care what a book says!

To find truth one must be honest and that's what I'm about....  I've had enough lies to last me a lifetime

I look forward to debates in future!

Hi Marc,

I'm glad to see that your looking for the Truth.  You will eventually come to know it. 

Are you into statistics?

The Jews (remember that didn't give Jesus any credit towards being the Messiah - on the contrary), they had a Temple ritual in which they would choose between two stones by grabbing one at random.  Therefore, it should be easy to see that the odds are very similar to flipping a two sided coin.  Now for 40 years straight that chose the same BLACK stone.  The odds of that are 2 raised to the 40th power or 1099511627776 to 1.

The destruction of that Temple began the day that Jesus was Crucified and ended when the Romans destroyed the Temple in 70 AD just as Jesus foretold in Matthew 24.

You see there are patterns in the Bible that we see that can't be explained but by divine operations. 

There many other events recorded by Jewish sages that happened in regards to the Temple.  Now understand the Jews would in no manner devise these things to prop up Jesus since they are the ones that were responsible for His Crucifixion.   

Now these things were recorded and we have the evidence of those events.  So if you believe you have logic and reason then you need to investigate such amazing events and see what you conclude.

Hi thank you.
I have no way of knowing if that really happened or not as I wasn't there etc but I've had similar things happen to me in prayers so I'm certainly open to believing it and it is actually because of experiences (similar to this) why I'm 'searching' at the moment in the first place.

Someone...or 'something' has answered many of my prayers in my life. 
I don't even know why I came here? - I mean 'God' seems to answer me anyway...What do I care what a book says?

I'm quite ill at the moment.  I might not have a great deal of time.  I feel as though I'm looking for the one who answered my prayers so I can thank Him in some way...I don't know...

I don't even know anymore. 

I don't even really care anymore lol.

[GodIsLove]

On a lighter note, more of a double edged sword, but...

Maybe it was good I said that? In a weird sort of way? If I would have not been lead to post, who knows how much more trouble could have come out.

Totally. It's often like that, God knows the outcome and can see the end result.

[GodIsLove]

OK, Sorry about that then.

I was actually just referring to Marc, but even then I shouldn't have worded it that way.

I'm learning, so please forgive me

Totally forgiven. And I apologize if I came across as harsh, I had a bad day, actually bad couple of weeks. Hint hint free will constrained by a carnal mind wallowing in the cares of the world. Ha

And yeah I do see where Marc didn't site anything other than his own ideas. I was hoping for a good discussion but I see he got rather controversial pretty quickly. Not sure the extend of what he said and not sure why he got so heated so quickly.

Anyway u are a welcome edition as the "new blood" I was referring to and am glad u are sticking around here.

:friendstu:

In regards to your worries, cast it all on Him. He dwells with us and in us, and swept among us in the flesh. God knows what to do.

Philippians 4
4Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, rejoice;
5let your forbearance be known to all men; the Lord [is] near;
6for nothing be anxious, but in everything by prayer, and by supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known unto God;
7and the peace of God, that is surpassing all understanding, shall guard your hearts and your thoughts in Christ Jesus.
8As to the rest, brethren, as many things as are true, as many as [are] grave, as many as [are] righteous, as many as [are] pure, as many as [are] lovely, as many as [are] of good report, if any worthiness, and if any praise, these things think upon

Awesome passage. I call out to him daily saying I know I don't have the answers and asking him to guide me and deliver me from anxiety. He does, eventually, but in his time and not immediately like I'd like, so there must be some sort of learning process going on for me that he is teaching me about. I tend to not know if something is from me, from others or from God when I am asking for guidance on grey area choices I have to make. Mostly parenting choices or interpersonal choices. I know Love is the highest thing and to do things out of love but sometimes given several options I can't see which one is that path. Life is complicated!

To bring it all back to free will, I'd sometimes rather not have it! I struggle making decisions, and know I don't know what the heck to do, so it seems like a curse and not a blessing sometime to have "thinking ability" like Marie Glen likes to call it.