My mother said this today (she is Calvinist) I CANNOT BELIEVE WHAT I HEARD

[Josh Crowell]

"I'll be so glad when God comes back and judges these immoral people! I can't wait!"
She said that upon hearing Justin Trudeau talking on TV about potentially legalizing prostitution.
She doesn't care about the fate of people's souls, she doesn't love them. How can she, talking like that.
So horrible. I always thought she was a kind and loving person, who believed in hell because she felt she had to. I thought she didn't want anybody to go there, but now, I can't be so sure. She tells me about my late father, who would sit down and read the bible to people, telling them what Jesus did for them. He was the most loving person you could ever meet. I think he probably believed in eternal hell, as he was Pentecostal, and they generally do believe that. But he never wished it on ANYBODY.

You become what you worship, and it's so sad that my mother has become like the Calvinist God. I wonder if she actually thinks about it, that if God created some people to be his elect, he must have created others to burn. Either that, or it's up to man to save himself, and god really doesn't care whether anyone burns or not. How can she accept a God like that, how is that righteous? Her god is selfish, and cares only about his own glory and self-gratification. That god is a HYPOCRITE!

I know how, her heart has been hardened, just like the religious people of Jesus' time. They were cold and unloving, they eagerly awaited their "Messiah" who would crush everyone else and give them all the glory.

This really took a blow on me, hearing her say something like that. My father would be beside himself to hear his wife actually WISH for God to ETERNALLY TORTURE these people. I can't believe she has become this way, just like Luther and Calvin were. I have nobody to turn to, I can't even trust my own mother anymore. That's why I am here.

[JamesH]

Sorry about your dilemma. That kinda sucks that your mom feels that way but that's atypical of a Calvinist mindset. They believe that those who aren't the elect will burn in hellfire for all time and some will go as far as looking forward to getting their jollies in seeing the damned burn while in heaven(Jonathan Edwards and John Owens both Calvinists believed in that).

The only thing I can tell you is learn the original languages(via interpretation,word study and exegesis)like I'm doing so you can present the truth of Universalism through the lens of the Biblical Languages to your mother. Also study the history of Universalism. You'll find out that it was the prevailing doctrine for the first 500+ years of the early church(from the NT times to the ECF's)and you cal also present that historical content to your mother as well.

[sheila]

Josh...because of the increasing of lawlessness...the love of many will wax cold. And,yet,the harlots and tax-collectors enter into the kingdom of heaven before you.

Jesus spoke to the religious leaders of his day with the offspring of viper spirits..and said'you traverse land and sea to make one proselyte..and when you have finished

you make them them two-fold the child of hell." All these words do notreturn unto the Lord void. For He has bound up all men in disobedience in order to show mercy unto all.

that no flesh may boast..and God alone will be exalted on that day.

when the Lord judges His people[allmen] the people will learn righteousness[is a free gift..and is a gift given of God in mercy through His son..to raise up all men in

incorruption in the immortal spirit...for as all have bore the image of the corrupt,so,too,shall all bear the image of the incorrupt.

Please realize that your mother is bearing the image of the corrupt in her flesh...and God has allowed this for His own purpose's. Every hidden thing[to those blinded]

will be revealed..and the word that goes forth from His mouth will divide.Hebrews 4;12...Mercy unto ALL prostitutes and calvinists!!!Please extend the same grace

mercy and love unto your mother that you have unto the prostitutes...God has.No respector of persons in this matter[all bound up in disobedience..in order to..]

do not allow a bitter root of disappointment in her fleshly weakness to colour your outlook.Continue loving her..what do you know..?God may show her a more excellant

way of  His Love...through you...and she may change her mind.


Revof Christ ch 17...good read on prostitutes..fleshly and spiritual type. Israel rejected her own bridegroom/husband...and put him to death..proclaiming "we have no king

but Caesar!"as she sit atop the roman/christian beast/empire.Mother of harlots.But she is 'hated'and devasted in the end...Come out of her My people!

all the churches[virgins]slept during that hour[could you not watch with me one hour?]Mt 26;40get up and pray that you not fall into temptation.


Jeremiah11;15-17what ismy beloved doing in her temple as she works out her evil schemes with many? Can consecrated meat

avert your punishment?....because the house of Israel and the house of Judah have provoked me to anger by burning incense[prayer] unto Baal[burn His children in

the fire]Rev 2;14,20. Rev 3;10....I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world..to 'test' those who live on the earth.



what will be the final outcome of His doings in these things? a people of a meek and humble spirit. with no flesh boasting. He makes all work unto the good of those

who love Him..and those whom He loved first.

1Peter 4;10 Each one should use whatever gift he has recieved to serve others,faithfully administering God's grace in it's various forms.



1 Peter 4;6.......FOR THIS IS THE REASON THE GOSPEL WAS PREACHED EVEN TO THOSE WHO ARE NOW DEAD,SO THAT THEY MIGHT BE JUDGED ACCORDING TO MEN

IN THE BODY[sin in flesh condemned in all]BUT LIVE ACCORDING TO GOD IN THE SPIRIT .


Jeremiah32;27 I AM THE LORD...THE GOD OF ALL MANKIND...IS ANYTHING TO HARD FOR ME? v 37I will surely gather them from all the lands where I banish them

in my furious anger and great wrath[Adam out of garden].. I will bring them back to this place and let them live in safety..as I have brought all this great calamity on this

people,so Iwill give them all the prosperity I have promised them. :2c:

[GodIsLove]

Nice post Sheila!

For some reason the second half has a strike through it  :LH:

[sheila]

smh...I have no idea why? :dontknow:and I have no idea how to remove the line...smh  sorry,guys...

[MusicLover123]

Josh...because of the increasing of lawlessness...the love of many will wax cold. And,yet,the harlots and tax-collectors enter into the kingdom of heaven before you.

Jesus spoke to the religious leaders of his day with the offspring of viper spirits..and said'you traverse land and sea to make one proselyte..and when you have finished

you make them them two-fold the child of hell." All these words do notreturn unto the Lord void. For He has bound up all men in disobedience in order to show mercy unto all.

that no flesh may boast..and God alone will be exalted on that day.

when the Lord judges His people[allmen] the people will learn righteousness[is a free gift..and is a gift given of God in mercy through His son..to raise up all men in

incorruption in the immortal spirit...for as all have bore the image of the corrupt,so,too,shall all bear the image of the incorrupt.

Please realize that your mother is bearing the image of the corrupt in her flesh...and God has allowed this for His own purpose's. Every hidden thing[to those blinded]

will be revealed..and the word that goes forth from His mouth will divide.Hebrews 4;12...Mercy unto ALL prostitutes and calvinists!!!Please extend the same grace

mercy and love unto your mother that you have unto the prostitutes...God has.No respector of persons in this matter[all bound up in disobedience..in order to..]

do not allow a bitter root of disappointment in her fleshly weakness to colour your outlook.Continue loving her..what do you know..?God may show her a more excellant

way of  His Love...through you...and she may change her mind.


Revof Christ ch 17...good read on prostitutes..fleshly and spiritual type. Israel rejected her own bridegroom/husband...and put him to death..proclaiming "we have no king

but Caesar!"as she sit atop the roman/christian beast/empire.Mother of harlots.But she is 'hated'and devasted in the end...Come out of her My people!

all the churches[virgins]slept during that hour[could you not watch with me one hour?]Mt 26;40get up and pray that you not fall into temptation.


Jeremiah11;15-17what ismy beloved doing in her temple as she works out her evil schemes with many? Can consecrated meat

avert your punishment?....because the house of Israel and the house of Judah have provoked me to anger by burning incense[prayer] unto Baal[burn His children in

the fire]Rev 2;14,20. Rev 3;10....I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world..to 'test' those who live on the earth.



what will be the final outcome of His doings in these things? a people of a meek and humble spirit. with no flesh boasting. He makes all work unto the good of those

who love Him..and those whom He loved first.

1Peter 4;10 Each one should use whatever gift he has recieved to serve others,faithfully administering God's grace in it's various forms.



1 Peter 4;6.......FOR THIS IS THE REASON THE GOSPEL WAS PREACHED EVEN TO THOSE WHO ARE NOW DEAD,SO THAT THEY MIGHT BE JUDGED ACCORDING TO MEN

IN THE BODY[sin in flesh condemned in all]BUT LIVE ACCORDING TO GOD IN THE SPIRIT .


Jeremiah32;27 I AM THE LORD...THE GOD OF ALL MANKIND...IS ANYTHING TO HARD FOR ME? v 37I will surely gather them from all the lands where I banish them

in my furious anger and great wrath[Adam out of garden].. I will bring them back to this place and let them live in safety..as I have brought all this great calamity on this

people,so Iwill give them all the prosperity I have promised them. :2c:

Does that help? You had "s" with [] in front of "word"

[sheila]

Thank You so Much! ML :girlheart:

[MusicLover123]

Thank You so Much! ML :girlheart:

No probs Sheila! :myahoo:

[darryl]

she's still your Mum...u only have 1 mother...just love her while she's here....she'll be gone 1 day...give her heaps of hugs n she'll see the love of Jesus in you n prayerfully, hopefully, come to know the wonderous truth of Ultimate Reconciliation for all . :dsunny:

[sheila]

 :2c:just wanted to add these scriptural thoughts. Because God/Christ have saved ALL men......even when people drink poisonous doctrines[leviathan meat] they are

not'hurt'or 'harmed"of the LOF..or  their name blotted out in the book of Life. the Lamb that spake as a dragon=gospels teaching doctrines

of demons/accusations/condemnation of most of mankind/et/ed.Or ministries who are overcome 'cursing men into Lof/et/ed for money like Balaam.

Jesus seperates sheep[all men]from their scapegoats[demons that hold them in captivity to slavery to sin]Through one man sin entered..and through one man[Jesus Christ]

allshall be set free/justified..deemed righteous in the Heavenly Court..and inherit the Kingdom of Heaven prepared for them.WE shall be changed.

People held in these blind sheepfolds will hear their Lords voice and come forth at their appointed time. the blind will see,the deaf will hear..the lame walk,the dead rise

the prison bars open..the hungry and thirsty receive the waters of Life and eat a banquet of well oiled dishes.

Though there be many anti-christs[Lamb that speak as dragon..deny Christ takes away all their sin/and curse men that are remade in the image of Christ..because

of any failure they exhibited when they bore the corrupt/weak image while on earth...even slandering the new creature celestial being.They forget that God was

reconciling the WORLD to HIMSELF in CHRIST..AND NOT COUNTING MEN"S SINS AGAINST THEM.2 Cor5;19Love keeps no record of wrongs.Jesus come not to

condemn the world but save it.. James 3;19  WITH THE TOUGN WE PRAISE OUR LORD AND FATHER,ANDWITH ITWE CURSE MEN WHO HAVE BEEN MADE IN GOD'S

LIKENESS . A salt spring can not produce fresh water..and many least ones that have been thirsty have recieved such a cup of water as this in the churches.

There has been a drought of this true living water,world-wide...and a famine also world-wide for the true sayings of God. Such doctrines havecausedmany spots and

wrinkles in the churches..as they feed themselves at the LOVE_FEAST.!It is a Love feast of the Father to all prodigal Adam[yes,only Jesus was not aprodigal/hadnosin.]

Father causes His sun[sonshine] to shine and rain/reign to fall on both the good and bad men.His face shines with LOVE FOR ALL HIS SONS AND DAUGHTERS...


Isaaih 52;5 AND NOW,WHAT DO I HAVE HERE,declares the Lord.  FOR MY PEOPLE HAVE BEEN TAKEN AWAY FOR NOTHING,AND THOSE WHO RULE THEM MOCK.

AND ALL DAY LONG MY NAME IS CONSTANTLY BLASPHEMED. THEREFORE MY PEOPLE WILL KNOW MY NAME.

v

[darryl]

:2c:just wanted to add these scriptural thoughts. Because God/Christ have saved ALL men......even when people drink poisonous doctrines[leviathan meat] they are

not'hurt'or 'harmed"of the LOF..or  their name blotted out in the book of Life. the Lamb that spake as a dragon=gospels teaching doctrines

of demons/accusations/condemnation of most of mankind/et/ed.Or ministries who are overcome 'cursing men into Lof/et/ed for money like Balaam.

Jesus seperates sheep[all men]from their scapegoats[demons that hold them in captivity to slavery to sin]Through one man sin entered..and through one man[Jesus Christ]

allshall be set free/justified..deemed righteous in the Heavenly Court..and inherit the Kingdom of Heaven prepared for them.WE shall be changed.

People held in these blind sheepfolds will hear their Lords voice and come forth at their appointed time. the blind will see,the deaf will hear..the lame walk,the dead rise

the prison bars open..the hungry and thirsty receive the waters of Life and eat a banquet of well oiled dishes.

Though there be many anti-christs[Lamb that speak as dragon..deny Christ takes away all their sin/and curse men that are remade in the image of Christ..because

of any failure they exhibited when they bore the corrupt/weak image while on earth...even slandering the new creature celestial being.They forget that God was

reconciling the WORLD to HIMSELF in CHRIST..AND NOT COUNTING MEN"S SINS AGAINST THEM.2 Cor5;19Love keeps no record of wrongs.Jesus come not to

condemn the world but save it.. James 3;19  WITH THE TOUGN WE PRAISE OUR LORD AND FATHER,ANDWITH ITWE CURSE MEN WHO HAVE BEEN MADE IN GOD'S

LIKENESS . A salt spring can not produce fresh water..and many least ones that have been thirsty have recieved such a cup of water as this in the churches.

There has been a drought of this true living water,world-wide...and a famine also world-wide for the true sayings of God. Such doctrines havecausedmany spots and

wrinkles in the churches..as they feed themselves at the LOVE_FEAST.!It is a Love feast of the Father to all prodigal Adam[yes,only Jesus was not aprodigal/hadnosin.]

Father causes His sun[sonshine] to shine and rain/reign to fall on both the good and bad men.His face shines with LOVE FOR ALL HIS SONS AND DAUGHTERS...


Isaaih 52;5 AND NOW,WHAT DO I HAVE HERE,declares the Lord.  FOR MY PEOPLE HAVE BEEN TAKEN AWAY FOR NOTHING,AND THOSE WHO RULE THEM MOCK.

AND ALL DAY LONG MY NAME IS CONSTANTLY BLASPHEMED. THEREFORE MY PEOPLE WILL KNOW MY NAME.

v

yes... :dsunny: :banana:

[Dandelion]

My family were not Calvinists, but had that same spirit.

They would get very happy and excited, thinking of all the people they hated, that were going to Hell.

Forgive them, Lord, they know not what they do.......and, many times, neither do we all.

Thank goodness we have a God who loves us and forgives us!

Romans 5:8

But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

AMEN!              :girlheart:

D.

[marie glen]

They were cold and unloving, they eagerly awaited their "Messiah" who would crush everyone else and give them all the glory.

I never thought of it quite like that before! You're totally right.. (so carnal in character!)

This really took a blow on me, hearing her say something like that. My father would be beside himself to hear his wife actually WISH for God to ETERNALLY TORTURE these people. I can't believe she has become this way, just like Luther and Calvin were. I have nobody to turn to, I can't even trust my own mother anymore. That's why I am here.

Welcome!! I'm very glad you are here!! It really does help to mix with others who know the full "Glad Tidings to all"!

But.. Your mum may have been (partly) speaking figuratively.. I don't think anybody fully comprehends what a horror the whole hell and Et thing is! In part was a looking forward happily to all truth being proven. (Something we all can relate to!) And partly, I suppose, as you say, a reflection on that image of God which is so.. dangerous! "We are a letter" as Paul wrote, "to unbelievers" :faint: But I think there's purpose to its being allowed.. And praise God, one day ALL will fully know and appreciate the great truth of who God really is.. And though in some respects, the Et gospel is our 'enemy', we still can love those brethren trapped therein (I mean, how sad!) ..we can love and continue to pray for them. God still has much Life still up His sleeves.. Thank Goodness! (And can still surprise us.)
    :Peace2: :girlheart: God bless!