if there were genuine eternal hellfire punishments, the cross would be in vain

[anti_nietzsche]

If God wouldn't want and manage to save the entire world with the whole of mankind, then he wouldn't have had to send Jesus to the cross. He would have his little Israel still and that was it. We would be required to believe in God, obey justice and humility, and those who fail that ... hellfire. But Jesus came to change that system, and now we are not under the letter that kills anymore but instead under the spirit that gives life. And the cross of Christ is of infinite value, because an infinite loving God died there and made the cross into the most fix point in the universe. Those who do not believe in God cannot do something else because faith is a gift and if they don't get this gift from God - what can they do? That is why I don't hinge salvation on  man's doing but on God's doing, and most of that has already been accomplished in that awesome sacrifice of Jesus Christ. This sacrifice is of ultimate value and weighs out the sins of the entire world and of anyone who lives in it. And so now the world is reconciled to God and Jesus Christ is the Lord of Lords, and He is drawing all men to Him. Some of these men will answer in this lifetime, others after death. But Christ is all in all, according to the times in God's direction. And His Father can still insist that He is friendly and that His goodness endures forever.

[Lazarus Short]

The Law God gave to Moses demanded death at times.  It was justice, but God's ultimate Justice was to send His Own Son to suffer the death penalty on our behalf.  It is an unexpected Justice, still unappreciated by the damnationists, but God's ways are unfathomable beyond our own.

[marie glen]

I never thought of it quite like that.. But it makes a lot of sense! :thumbsup:

"Remember and return to Jehovah, do all ends of the earth, and before Thee bow themselves, do all families of the nations." - Ps 22:27, Young's Literal Translation

[Shev]

Amen! We are the first fruits of His creation, not the last fruits!

[darryl]

if never ending torture in eternal hellfire were true, Jesus would've had to be tortured forever in order to take our penalty apon Himself...the hellists miss this point.

[eaglesway]

if never ending torture in eternal hellfire were true, Jesus would've had to be tortured forever in order to take our penalty apon Himself...the hellists miss this point.

Good point! Altho I suppose, as a hellist, I would say, "Jesus didnt die to deal with hell He died to deal with sin"

Thank God we know differently!

Jesus said, of us, "The gates of hell(sheol) shall not prevail against you." I think we work towards that now, and will work towards it in the ages to come, until all of sheol is empty and all are in "the life" of Christ and the Father.

If there was a hell of eternal punishment, then the gates of hell would have prevailed against us, Christ and the Father. Gates stronger than the love of God in Christ on the cross?

I don't think so.

"If I am lifted up from the earth I will draw all men unto me."

"For so it pleased the Father to make all the fulness dwell in Him, and though Him to reconcile all things to Himself, wthere things in heaven or things on earth." Col 1:20

[anti_nietzsche]

I'm not sure the Law was really given by God. It seems more like all the other laws the nations gave to themselves at some point. Jesus accepted some of it but insisted on love being the fulfillment of the law, something that the jews who followed the law did not accept. So he went to the cross and abolished the law on it. Now the only remaining function of the law is to be used as christological prophecy.