Is there a need for the Church still?

[Tracy]

I am a Preterist and learned everything I know from the Bible and help of the Holy Spirit.  I thought I should go to Church and find I had better nonbeliever friends than what I saw at the Church... So my question.. now that it is over and God is our God and teaches all things.  Do we need to go to Church?  Is it not manmade? 

[jabcat]

Hi Tracy.  I'd like to go point-by-point if I may.  As a preterist and believing "it is over", I can see how that might affect how you see the body as needing to function, as Paul described in his books - including to not forsake assembling together.  "and much more as we see the day approaching".  This was of course post-cross, this age.  (notwithstanding, much discussion about what assembling together means exactly, as well as much disenchantment with some of the traditions and teachings of most of today's church).

Of course great to be taught from the scriptures and Holy Spirit.

As a believer, what do you find you have in common with the world, i.e., non-believers?  (As a "non-traditional" believer, I find I still have in common with other believers who remain within tradition, the core teachings and Person of Jesus Christ and worshiping God together, etc.)

Man-made - I believe much of the teachings and traditions are, and I filter what I absorb and what I pass on - but not the general concept of meeting together with other believers and sharing whatever common ground we can find.   :2c:

[marie glen]

Personally I believe there is use for the organized church.. even if it is a different organization than the early first churches were - I would be happier if it was still home run, instead of having the upkeep of buildings with utilities, etc.  And there was more sharing and teaching instead of it being all on one person's shoulders..

But I assume many churches are trying to do it as well as they can.  And others of course are off in left field somewhere as the old saying goes..

I think how one gathers depends on the individual. Many, unfortunately, have had bad experiences with the organized church.. Some's conscience perhaps cannot stand up in their self concerning the 'hell' notion.. Or perhaps legalism or what not.. Some churches too are teacching Genesis is myth..  But, a good church can be a strength and a blessing..

As for myself I have hermit monastic tendencies and very much involvement, so far, tends to throw me off orbit.. out of kilter.

I used to mostly keep that under my hat.. But hey, perhaps " wisdom is justified of her different children" (very badly paraphrased from faulty memory)

God bless! :Peace2: :smile:

Imagine this being asked elsewhere, in some places, perhaps a furor would result? It's good the question(s) have places they can be asked, imo..

[Seth]

I don't attend church myself, because I just find I cannot abide the teaching and don't want my daughter influenced either. But, as for not forsaking the meeting together, I think God provided a way for the growing UR believers to meet on forums like this. I don't believe you need to go to a church. When Paul said that, he was talking to people that at least believed in the final destiny of all, and that God is not a torturer of humanity forever. I believe there is kinship with those in the church but I keep in mind the parable of the prodigal son. Some kinfolk are over there, and some kinfolk are over here.

Not to say that I am not prodigal myself in some of my ways, and certainly in my flesh, but I just mean that we can still regard ETers as kin in Christ without having daily fellowship with them.

[Lazarus Short]

Laz can do no better than to quote the science-fiction writer James P. Hogan, from his novel Giant's Star:

"It seems a law of history for successful movements and empires to resist further change after the needs that had motivated them into promoting change had been satisfied."

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: I've been with the Lord for 30 years now. He took me out of the churches about 3 years into my walk, and unless He led to me to visit for one reason or another, I never went back, because He called me up on the mountaintop.

The last 2 years, when possible and when led I've attended a Messianic Jewish church. I think that a lot of people end up believing what is taught wherever they were forced to go as a child, and never deviate from that.

Since I was on the outside looking in, fellowshipping with Him and a few in the body over time, the reverse happened to me. I found that what I now believe after all these years put me in step with a particular kind of fellowship I had never attended before. I still don't feel it's a necessity to go if  you're seeking after Him, but the times of refreshing with like minded believers is also really good. My  :2c: Blessings...

[guest5685]

Cardinal...The Lord tried to get me out about 2 1/2 to 3 years into my walk but I was either too hard headed or just a glutton for punishment and kept dipping my toe in just to repeatedly get spiritually beat up. Kind of like that old battered wife without enough sense to leave.

The Lord gave me a dream showing me a bunch of hookers on my front lawn and as the cops took one away she was looking back at me. She said to the cop what's he want I think he want's a 52.  :dontknow:

At the time I had been trying out or looking for a place to go weekly again just wanting a place to fellowship that wasn't too bad.
That did it! I finally believed it was good to give up on the idea of a 52 (weekly church). :punish:

I'm actually sharing this in case someone as hard headed reads this and can learn from my mistake. :HeartThrob:

Cardinal my friend ...YOU DID WELL...Congrats! :banana: :thumbsup:

[Ross]

Moses carried out a little act which then made him head to the wilderness for 40 years. He wasn't attending a church.
He received direct contact which converted him.
He then wet into ministry.
Paul thought he was doing the right thing. Even went to the enforcement of his religion to the point o death.
He received direct correction, then went into ministry.
Paul says he had this happen to him as an example of how God works.
Whilst we fellowship and encourage each other, which is necessary, God is the one developing us.
Church is not mandate. The history of how that church has become a ruling power instead of a place of mutual encouragement shows major disagreement about the simplicity of the Gospel.
Christ said not to copy the pharisees or scribes.
The truth is supposed to set us free, not bring us to bondage.

[Cardinal]

Cardinal...The Lord tried to get me out about 2 1/2 to 3 years into my walk but I was either too hard headed or just a glutton for punishment and kept dipping my toe in just to repeatedly get spiritually beat up. Kind of like that old battered wife without enough sense to leave.

The Lord gave me a dream showing me a bunch of hookers on my front lawn and as the cops took one away she was looking back at me. She said to the cop what's he want I think he want's a 52.  :dontknow:

At the time I had been trying out or looking for a place to go weekly again just wanting a place to fellowship that wasn't too bad.
That did it! I finally believed it was good to give up on the idea of a 52 (weekly church). :punish:

I'm actually sharing this in case someone as hard headed reads this and can learn from my mistake. :HeartThrob:

Cardinal my friend ...YOU DID WELL...Congrats! :banana: :thumbsup:

As I read your dream, I heard it differently. Fifty is the number of Pentecost. You wanted a 50, TOO? Pentecost is where He starts to remove the flesh (harlot).

Anyway, what made my leaving even harder was that He used me to help start the church I was leaving. It started as a bible study, and He raised up a 5 fold ministry from it. Problems arose when one of them decided to make it according to the pattern of the worldly churches, and not according to the pattern of God. He gave me several words and dreams for them, and then made me walk out, never to return. It collapsed in two months time; the only people there the last night were the 2 that rebelled.

But it was a learning experience and I got to see firsthand what He intended Pentecost to do, and witnessed the same destruction of it. Nothing new under the sun. Blessings....

[guest5685]

Wow! Now that's an interesting story you have. A real eye-opener for sure! :eek: