Jesus spoke to a jewish audience

[anti_nietzsche]

Hello,

I wanted to ask today, what do you think about the audience to whom Jesus speaks in the Gospels, and whether the Gospel statements are all still true and binding today?

I was wondering, Jesus' sacrifice and the resurrection mean a change. It's like the Gospels lead to that change in stages. First Jesus simply preaches a righteous conduct in life as the other jews understood it. Then he includes forgiveness and healing in a liberal way ... so now we have righteousness mixed with mercy. Then comes the crucifixion that looks like a defeat, but properly understood by the light of the resurrection, it is a victory. Because the cross weighs so much, we now have righteousness mixed with the UTMOST mercy.

Basically, the cross is an incredibly loaded thing. It is a part of God's grace. Jesus the Son of God is worth incredibly much. He is of infinite worth. And on the cross He loved all of us humans. So we now have a weight against sin. Even a Hitler could come and his sins would scream to Heaven. But Jesus' Cross of grace still weighs much much more. So God can forgive even a Hitler.

That is how we can have Universal Salvation, I think. It is fastened to the Cross, and to God's will of being a gracious Father. If we read the Gospels with this grace will of God in mind, then they appear different than if we simply look for a righteousness ground of meeting God. Instead we must look for a grace ground. And in this grace ground we meet a massive Love from God.

So when we preach Christ, let us preach the crucified Christ because it was then when God showed us the greatest love. And let us think thusly of this love that it is effective and causes salvation, not being just a still model of something.

God bless you!

Daniel

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Amen, good word.... :thumbsup:

[HungerForTruth]

Very interesting that you should mention this - I was just studying about the Jewish Roman wars and particular the one that ended in AD70 with 1.1 million jews (the inhabitants of Jerusalem) being slaughtered and thrown into Gehenna and burned by Roman soldiers.

As Jesus was preaching to a Jewish audience a strong case can be made that Jesus's hell references could be prophetic in nature - ie Jesus warning the Jews of their path of destruction if they insist on their Messiah being a military deliverer instead of accepting the spiritual deliverance found in Jesus.

[rosered]

 
Hi Daniel  ,
  I believe you  have a good  point  there 
I have considered    those being taught of Jesus  speaking the gospels was those still under law

  the broad term for me is   all are under   the Law [all humanity  in Adam  , the Jews were given the oracles of God ]     

  that is the  only difference between the Jew and any other   human being      and it was only for a ''time ''    that has since past

We have the oracles of God   to this day because of that ...

For me it is the HOLY SPIRIT    Being given   , from the act of Jesus Christ   laying His life down  and taking it back again , [The Cross]   that does  regenerate 

a new creation   of spiritual beings  [incorruptible ones ]       from the carnal beings [corruptible ones ]    up out of the dust does the    Christ rise [   anointed ones ]   Jesus Christ being the    beginning of all things new  and eternal   

[rosered]

  wow , fast replies  :thumbsup:

  Yes it is a matter of perspective     and how   we see things 

Humanity has suffered since the beginning of time  when Adam ''all humanity ''ate of the tree of knowledge of good and evil and began the  process of dying

  corruption and decay  , loss    dust  is its reward   in temporary   realm and all thoughts in it   and of it   and for it


  for me the TREE OF LIFE promised is Jesus Christ and He is    where ALL LIFE  IN GENERATED FROM [ HIS BODY ]

  eating his body and drinking His blood   that gives LIFE  back from the dead/ adam  ....       this incorruptible seed  is planted in the very hearts of men    to grow in truth and grace  as God  the Father gives the increase       , the seed is the tree of Life / Jesus  Christ     , one of a kind   , made of God back in Gen 1   

   when everything as  good and  perfect and no evil was   found  in it    and it was the 3rd DAY     tree seed itself The Third Day: Dry Ground
...10God called the dry land earth, and the gathering of the waters He called seas; and God saw that it was good. 11Then God said, "Let the earth sprout vegetation: plants yielding seed, and fruit trees on the earth bearing fruit after their kind with seed in them"; and it was so. 12The earth brought forth vegetation, plants yielding seed after their kind, and trees bearing fruit with seed in them, after their kind; and God saw that it was good....

We  are what we eat   ,, when the meek inherit the earth and good ground to me this is the Body of Christ   , in Matt 5    we can tell Jesus is speaking figurative  , or more so a spiritual   language   about the good soil being His body   where ALL LIFE DWELLS IN    ...  and the leaves heal nations and the fruit    is Holy    making the lump  holy  and the   ground  holy  able to bear   30 , 60 or 100 fold    where the presence of God is found in ... all in Jesus Christ      our salvation   our Hope our very lives     depend  :HeartThrob:

  perspective
[ pərˈspektiv ]
NOUN
a view or prospect.
synonyms: view · vista · panorama · prospect · bird's-eye view · outlook · More
a particular attitude toward or way of regarding something; a point of view:
synonyms: outlook · view · viewpoint · point of view · POV · standpoint

[Dandelion]

1 Corinthians 15:

12 But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? 13 If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised. 14 And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith. 15 More than that, we are then found to be false witnesses about God, for we have testified about God that he raised Christ from the dead. But he did not raise him if in fact the dead are not raised. 16 For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been raised either. 17 And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins. 18 Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost. 19 If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are of all people most to be pitied.

20 But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For he "has put everything under his feet."[c] Now when it says that "everything" has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28 When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

Thus, the Victorious Gospel!

D.

:dsunny:

[ed]

Until heaven and earth pass away.

I believe the book of Matthew in particular is a book of judgement of the Jewish leaders(heaven) and the nataion as a whole(earth).

Now there will be a new Israel - a new heavens and earth; but more about that later.
In Bible figurative language, "heavens" refers to governments and rulers, and "earth" refers to the nation or people.

http://www.tentmaker.org/books/heavenandearth.htm

The prophesy of John the Baptist happened.

Matthew 3
10 And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.


And the new heaven and earth are in Jesus Christ.

The Risen Lord Jesus declared the new heaven and the new earth.
Jesus is seated in the heavens, and we are the earth, where he is seated as well.


Matthew 28
18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: My  :2c:.....new heaven = mind of Christ. New earth = glorified body. He told them in the OT that if they would obey His commandments and His statutes that He would put none of the curses of the Egyptians on them (which includes the death of the firstborn). Firstborn = first born of the flesh, then the Spirit.

To me this promise contains the promise for a glorified body, which Jesus obtained by obeying His commandments and His statutes. He said I always do that which pleases my Father. Blessings....

[Seth]

My own  :2c:

Is that when we look at the things Jesus said to Israel they are also pretty consistently applied to Gentiles by Paul in his epistles, the necessity to have faith and the necessity to add love to your faith is pretty consistently applied across all Paul's epistles.

[micah7:9]

My own  :2c:

Is that when we look at the things Jesus said to Israel they are also pretty consistently applied to Gentiles by Paul in his epistles, the necessity to have faith and the necessity to add love to your faith is pretty consistently applied across all Paul's epistles.

:2c: :thumbsup:

[anti_nietzsche]

Hi Seth, it's true that jews and gentiles have the same God now and are called to be one flock.

but I was speaking about Jesus speaking to the Jews 2000 years ago. At that time religion was in peril because of the pharisees. Jesus often made ironic remarks about them, for example he speaks about gauging out eyes and cutting off hands if they cause you to sin. this is not a literal commandment to us but instead it is an ironic taking on of the then jewish fascination with sin and law and punishment. we are NOT supposed to gauge out our eyes or cut off our hands. Jesus is simply telling us where fanatic law belief leads to in the end. we can also look after women, that's just normal for adult men. but it should stop when we have a lover already, someone fit for marriage.

paul said everything is lawful to him. a phariseic jew cannot say this. we are supposed to use our own mind and follow Jesus' law of love. because only love does no harm to the neighbor.

god bless you!

daniel

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Paul said everything was lawful for him (under grace) but not everything is expedient (profitable). We are in a race (to save our soul, ie. work out your own salvation with fear and trembling) to the finish. Blessings....

[anti_nietzsche]

Do you fear and tremble literally?

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: I see fear there as a healthy respect and reverence, stemming from a desire to please my Father. I see trembling as the "earthquake" that comes when He reveals something that I need to change or put to "death" in myself.

The potter is either going to smooth out the edges if we're willing to go along with the process, or break it and start over. Having been broken before, I've found it's much easier and less traumatizing to get with the program.  :winkgrin:  Blessings....

[anti_nietzsche]

I ask because sometimes I am stricken deep with fear of God. I don't know what to do about it, I know love drives out fear but I don't experience this love. I've tried to help myself with tongue speaking but lately it's often wrong. I don't get the right voice anymore. I pray to God but sometimes I get no answer or I am too still to feel any responding thought in me. It's like I've become mute. I write a lot to relief myself but it feels meaningless to me. I still hope that all get saved but I don't understand it well. I miss my dad, he was an atheist until his death so conservative christianity can't console me for his afterlife. And sometimes I have those crushing doubts about God's existence. It's like I have to start over spiritually but I don't know how to do that. I used to feel comfort in God but fear and trembling startle me and make me afraid of being demanded to fear God so much ... which I dread because I do not like to live in fear. I have psychosis because of these things, it's been difficult for me for years, was afraid of the devil, of demons, it's not been easy.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: That kind of fear is not of God. That's the kind of fear that hath torment; God does not torment us with fear. Do you have one of those little books that just list His promises by category? That would be good for you to turn to (and speak out loud) when you feel down for any reason.

My dad was an agnostic, about the same thing. One thing I know is that God saves all. Even some of the NDE's speak of Jesus appearing to them in their "purgatory". David said though I make my bed in Sheol, You are there. Nothing can separate us from His love. If He appeared in there and they came back to life, then it stands to reason He would also appear to others in there,  even if it wasn't in their plan for them to come back to life, doesn't it? Else He would be a respecter of persons. blessings....

[gregoryfl]

Shalom ante-nietzsche,

If you have ever hiked up a mountain, and came out onto an overlook, then you have experienced the closest thing naturally to the fear of God. Please picture all that is involved in this, including feelings.

Ronen

[dajomaco]

Jesus did a work on the Cross.
That work had a payment.
God promised Jesus the salvation of all .
Did Jesus complete the work.(YES)
Will God keep his promise (YES)

[eaglesway]

Jesus did a work on the Cross.
That work had a payment.
God promised Jesus the salvation of all .
Did Jesus complete the work.(YES)
Will God keep his promise (YES)

:thumbsup: