24 Reasons Hell Is Real

[micah7:9]

Well I will say with humility our posts deflated Bro. Shibley's paper if nothing else he would have to write another paper to show how the scriptures that were posted do not show a gospel of truth. I reread several responses for 12, 14, 20 and I just became happy. And one verse that was brought up several times for me is an absolute, and to deny it's authority is to say the Savior lied(never)........
Joh 12:32  And I-- if I am lifted up from the earth--will draw all men to me."

[marie glen]

Well I will say with humility our posts deflated Bro. Shibley's paper if nothing else he would have to write another paper to show how the scriptures that were posted do not show a gospel of truth. I reread several responses for 12, 14, 20 and I just became happy. And one verse that was brought up several times for me is an absolute, and to deny it's authority is to say the Savior lied(never)........
Joh 12:32  And I-- if I am lifted up from the earth--will draw all men to me."  

Yep! :banana: And any number of verses, which even standing alone, very much support God's perfection and all powerfulness..

And especially  :iagree: Joh 12:32  And I-- if I am lifted up from the earth--will draw all men to me." :iagree: :iagree:

I had something I wanted to add to this thread, was thinking of earlier.. hmmm.. oh yes! Luke 6:36 "Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful." Do we realize just how many millions of ppl have never heard of Jesus? Of which they cannot be saved, reconciled, rehabilitated/born again, without believing in Him!! Like our loving, merciful, all wise, all knowing, all loving, heavenly Father would simply condemn them out of hand. Really???

The whoLe thing is so illogical, it simply blows the mind..!

[micah7:9]

Yes and to add....2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not tardy as to the promise, as some are deeming tardiness, but is patient because of you, not intending any to perish, but all to make room for repentance."

Yeah as they use to say in the pentecoste  of the 80's AIN'T GOD GOOD! :dsunny:

[eaglesway]

 :banana:

[sheila]

  Isaaih 28;14-   Therefore,hear the word of the Lord ye scoffers...which rule these people in Jerusalem.  Ye boast..'we have entered into a

  covenant with death[ministry of death] with HELL have we made an agreement. When an overwhelming scourge sweeps by

  it can not touch us, for we have made a lie our refuge..and falsehood our hiding place..

   SEE I LAY A STONE IN ZION A TESTED STONE  A PRECIOUS CORNERSTONE FOR A SURE FOUNDATION..THE ONE WHO TRUSTS

   WILL NEVER BE DISMAYED  I WILL MAKE JUSTICE THE MEASURING LINE AND RIGHTEOUSNESS THE PLUMB LINE;

   HAIL WILL SWEEP AWAY YOUR REFUGE OF A LIE...AND WATER WILL OVERFLOW YOUR HIDING PLACE

     YOUR COVENANT WITH DEATH WILL BE ANULLED..AND YOUR AGREEMENT WITH HELL WILL NOT STAND

   WHEN THE OVERWHELMING SCOURGE[JESUS MADE A SCOURGE AND OVERTURNED THE TABLES IN THE TEMPLE/GOD

SCOURGES EVERY SON HE RECEIVES TO HIMSELF] SWEEPS BY YOU WILL BE BEATEN DOWN BY IT......


   THE UNDERSTANDING OF THIS MESSAGE WILL BRING SHEER TERROR

[joeteekay]

Love this thread. So many good responses from all you faithful in tentmaker.
I have copied and pasted the response of CHB and Marie into the original document.
I will add more of your very good comments as well as those of EW and mine when when I finish this.
Please see attached. Excuse any errors. The response could be an important STATEMENT about UR.
May be too late but does it matter?

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Tom]

It's a shame this guy "provides training and resources for thousands of pastors" because he's robbing people of the joy of knowing the overwhelming power of God's love and replacing it with irrational fear of a lie that comes straight from Satan through the Roman Catholic Church into his King James Protestant Church and makes people crazy and confused about a god who wants to torture people in fire forever who never even heard of Jesus Christ or who were incapable of understanding the evangel especially in the distorted form he portrays it. He's neglecting to tell you that his "hell" is based on forgery perpetrated in his beloved King James by intentionally mistranslating "Gehenna" as "hell" thereby causing the deception that "hades," the unseen state of dead souls, is a torture chamber that will last forever somehow causing people to burn continuously without being consumed. He is also confusing "the lake of fire" with "hell" which his own King James says is cast into "the lake of fire" which is actually "the second death" which will be abolished at the consummation of the eons. Because he is relying on the inaccurate translation of the King James for the Greek "aion," literally "eon," he is completely confusing people with his interpretation of scripture by making people think periods of time are "eternal." He is ignoring scripture about faith being a gracious gift of God that we don't earn by anything we do. He is ignoring scripture about death being the result of sin, not torture in fire forever. He is ignoring scripture about all mankind dying because of Adam and all mankind being made alive because of Christ. All he's doing is pushing the old Roman case for heresy against what the inspired written word of God says is what brings about the ultimate plan of God which is all on earth and in the heavens being reconciled to God through Christ's blood on the cross so that God may be all in all. His preaching is nothing but the systematized deception of orthodox theology established for the political expediency of the Roman Empire. He and his Protestant buddies should be ashamed for not purging the nonsense during The Reformation instead of self-righteously condemning the majority of mankind to a fate that God does not have planned even for the worst of human sinners or even Satan himself who is the author of this evil lie called "hell." We have to have compassion for him even though he's making people crazy by spewing forth this nonsense out of ignorance. The first thing he needs to do is retire his King James, and get an accurate translation. Then he needs to stop talking, and start listening to what the word of God accurately translated has to say. Maybe that will help the scales fall from his eyes, but I doubt it will happen because most guys like him are locked into their programming. They're afraid to open their minds and see the truth. It's especially distressing that our worse persecution seems to come from fellow believers like this rather than even the atheists. They don't believe in "hell." So they don't condemn us. They just think we're fools, but we have to have compassion for them too because God has blinded them temporarily. Only some have been chosen to have faith from before the disruption of the world, but all will eventually be saved. That's what scripture actually says, and this guy should be able to see that if he was reading an accurate translation of the ancient manuscripts. But I think he clings to his King James like he clings to his self-righteous theology of saving himself by his own so called free will while he's all right with his god torturing most of mankind in fire forever. His god is not my God. His god is a fiend worse than Hitler, Stalin, Mao, or Pol Pot. His god is an impotent weakling who can't even overcome the free will of his own creatures. His so called gospel is no good news at all for billions of people who need to know God's love and are being deprived of it because of his distorted evangel. God will have mercy on him and his followers though because it's all according to God's will that Satan's counterfeit church be seen for exactly what it is. Just don't let preachers like this discourage you. Pity them, and speak the truth of the word of God to counter the lie of Satan that they are preaching ignorantly. It's our responsibility to study an accurate translation of the inspired written word of God so we can share the truth with all the people who are deceived by this popular lie of Satan called "hell" that dishonors the true living God who loves all his creatures and will reconcile all his creatures through Christ's blood on the cross. Let the church call it heresy. Who cares? Let them tell us we're going to "hell" for believing God. Let them continue to spew forth their wretched disgusting lie of "hell," and see their churches continue to empty while people are coming to know the truth that God is the savior of all mankind especially believers. It's only a matter of time before all will know the truth, and all will be filled with love, not fear, because God will be all in all.   

[joeteekay]

Wow Tom,
You sure said a lot and a good encapsulation of what is going on here on earth.  :thumbsup:

[Tom]

I had to edit it Joe because I forgot something important.

[Lazarus Short]

Something I learned years ago from reading Charles Fort's four books (no, he's NOT a Christian author) is that a theory must account for ALL the data, not just most or some. 

Now in the case of Hell, it seems to me that the Reconciliation theory explains the data [Biblical text] better than the Damnation theory.  Or, in other words, no Hell beats and trumps Hell.

[rosered]

  I believe we need to consider the  worldly wisdom  preaching  is foolishness to God  , and does not really know God  or His eternal will /desire ,

but  allows this to continue in His wisdom .


1Corth 1       for the benefit   of some  and to the fall of others   .
  Some do save by    fear    , its in  the letter of  Jude.

I t is impossible to understand  exactly why we see   some  saved though fear and others by compassion.

  God  in His Wisdom and plan  works everything according to His own will and desires.
Knowing God and His power is  the Light and those in darkness and  preach in darkness are as blind men leading the blind

Being in the ditch  is an experience  many  are  not willing to go though again , as I am one of them .Looking to Jesus only, now .

  But God in His wisdom is able to many anyone ''stand '' if He so desires it .


:2c:

[marie glen]

Philippians 3:21 (Concordant Version) - "Who will transfigure the body of our humiliation, to conform it to the body of His glory, in accord with the operation which enables Him even to subject all to Himself."

...no mention there of another's ('free') will able to contradict that..

"denying the Lord" closer translation is "contradicting the Lord".. Jude 4, 2 Peter 2:1

and 2 Timothy 3:5 - "holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power" - I think the gospel as preached (by ET or EA) very much contradicts/denies the POWER of GOD! :faint:

[sheila]

robbing the people IS ROBBING GOD OF HIS GLORY.  IT IS GOD BEING ROBBED!!

[eaglesway]

Something I learned years ago from reading Charles Fort's four books (no, he's NOT a Christian author) is that a theory must account for ALL the data, not just most or some. 

Now in the case of Hell, it seems to me that the Reconciliation theory explains the data [Biblical text] better than the Damnation theory.  Or, in other words, no Hell beats and trumps Hell.

:thumbsup:

[Abigail]

Dear ones,

I think most of the points are elaborately refuted on the Tentmaker's, these mostly have to do with a misunderstanding of words like eternal, hell, judgment etc. Yet I think some points have to do with certain movements called Universalism, which are different from what we understand as being the Victorious Gospel.

Pt 12 The idea that universalism teaches that all ways lead to God, probably comes from teachers like Bishop Carlton Pearson. From his website I get the idea he believes there is no judgment at all, and as I see symbols of all major religions, I think he believes all religions lead to God (?) Probably people think that this is what Universalism teaches.

Pt 22 This point might have to do with Unitarian Universalism, which is very liberal. I think most christians do not know very much about Universalism, so they think all Universalists are Unitarians. When God by His Spirit graciously convinced my heart of His victorious plan to save all mankind, my mind was doubting it. As I was searching the internet to find the convictions of my heart confirmed by the Scriptures, I initially found universalist websites that made me doubt even more. This was because of their very liberal teachings, among others portraying God as (as brother Eby states it) a 'syrupy sweet' Love: no judgment, no dealing with sin - on the contrary, being very easy on sin. (I believe God is strongly AGAINST sin, but not against sinners! That's the reason He saves us from it)
I can understand very well that sincere christians who are open to universalism, are repelled from it by finding these kind of teachings. (I am extremely thankful I found Tentmaker!)

Pt 23 I think one very common misconception is, what is salvation all about. For most christians, salvation means being saved from hell, so it's related to the future/afterlife. In the Bible, as far as I know, salvation is never linked to hell (or Sheol, Hades, Gehenna, eternal punishment, eternal death...)
Salvation is from sin. So the whole point is, preaching the gospel is not to prevent people from going to hell. It's about getting them freed of the horrible power of sin (which, btw, is God's work, but we might be honored to be His messagers)
I found the articles 'The Judgment of the World by the Cross' on Seth's website mercifultruth.com very helpfull on this point.

:2c:

[joeteekay]

Here is my late response to David Shibley 24 points against UR:

1. Jesus made both repentance and faith prerequisites for forgiveness. "Unless you repent you will all likewise perish" (Luke 13:3, NKJV). "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel" (Mark 1:15).


God commands ALL men to repent and all will repent on God's schedule some now, all others later. EVERY knee shall bow.  Act_17:30  And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:.  Those who do not repent in this age, will perish.   Can a person perish and still be saved?  The word "perish" is the Greek word "apollumi" which is translated as either DESTROYED, PERISHED, AND LOST depending on what the translators thought fit.  They were inconsistent in their translation.  So whether one is destroyed, perished, or lost, it matters not to Jesus—HE SAVES THEM ALL.  (Mat 18:11)  For the Son of man is come to SAVE that which was LOST (apollumi).  Many other scriptures tell us this same thing.


2. The "water of life" is offered to all, but not all receive it or even desire it. "Whoever desires, let him take the water of life freely" (Rev. 22:17).


For anyone to say that the water if life will be offered to all, but that some will reject it and not desire it, is belief in Arminianism theology.  It implies that mans will is stronger than God's will.  That is false. (1Ti 2:4)  Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.


3. Scripture teaches that there will be a judgment after death. "And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment" (Heb. 9:27).


That is true about judgement.  Problem is that some interpret judgement as condemnation or being found guilty.  Most Christians have a one-sided and often evil concept of judgment. They think of it primarily as a negative and horrible thing that wicked people must go through before being sentenced to hell fire.  Judgment is not reserved exclusively for the wicked, nor is it a one-sided sentence of doom.  Judgment has both a positive and a negative side.  But God's judgement is righteous and ultimately leads to salvation.  God "judges" us by "chastening" us! (I Cor. 11:32).  It means to - chasten, instruct, teach, Strong's" Greek: 'paideuo' #3811.  The book of Isaiah speaks of judgments on Israel and on the nations. But the end of all these judgments is SALVATION TO ALL.


4. Those who have not had a true conversion will experience a judgment for sin that the Bible describes as "the second death." "But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death" (Rev. 21:8).


Whether converted or not, all experience  judgment for sinning.  All have sinned.  You reap what sow you.  Judgment and the second death are two separate events.  There is a White Throne Judgment at the consummation for those who were not converted.  That judgment results in cleansing all rest of mankind from their sins and giving them immortality.  Then death and hell are cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death Rev. 20:14).


5. Contrary to Universalist beliefs, Jesus' teaching indicates that most of humanity is on a broad path that leads to destruction. "'Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able. When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, "Lord, Lord, open for us," and He will answer and say to you, "I do not know you, where you are from. ... Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity"'" (Luke 13:24-27).


Absolutely wrong.  Christian Universalists DO believe there is a broad path that leads to destruction (Greek word "apollumi" which is translated as either DESTROYED, PERISHED, AND LOST as described in response #1).  This most certainly does not mean being cast into an ever burning hell fire.  Their salvation comes later in the White Throne judgment period.  And yes, there are those who work iniquity, but their judgment, chastisement and salvation will also occur in a later age.


6. Jesus spoke often of a terrible place of judgment for those outside His kingdom rule. "'The Son of Man will send out His angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice lawlessness, and will cast them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth'" (Matt. 13:41-42).


Sure there has been and will be a time of wailing and gnashing of teeth for those who are not among the called and chosen in this age.  When one comes to understand that we are living in a day of salvation now and that there is a later day of salvation for all the rest of mankind, one will begin to see the beautiful truth of the salvation of all.


7. The Bible teaches both the love of God and His sure judgment of sin. Trusting in Christ's payment for our sins saves us from this coming judgment. "But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him" (Rom. 5:8-9).


Absolutely and how wonderful is the victorious gospel.


8. In one of the most loving verses in the Bible, Jesus issues eternal options. "'For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life'" (John 3:16).


Yes John 3:16 is a most loving verse.  Whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life'. The scriptural truth is that non will perish eternally, but all will believe and be saved.  Joh_12:32  And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.   ALL  humans will be drawn in loving submission to Christ.  Rom_14:11  For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.  All will profess and worship God in loving adoration.  There is just no denying the truth of these verses.


9. Scripture teaches that there is unending, eternal judgment for those who do not know God and who do not respond in faith to the gospel. "The Lord Jesus [will be] revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power" (2 Thess. 1:7-9).


This might seem like a real clincher for David Shibley, the writer of this piece.  But it is in error.
1.   there is no unending eternal judgment as has already been proven in earlier responses.
2   There is not one who will not respond to the victorious gospel of Jesus, in God's appointed time.  Jesus is the saviour of the world, not just some of the world.
3   Yes God does take vengeance on those who do not in their life time know God.  But that vengeance is a temporary condition.  Its all Gods working all things after the council of His own will.

Everlasting destruction is not an accurate rendering.  No such word as everlasting in the Greek, it should be eonian. age-abiding or age-lasting.  It is a temporary situation.


10. Jesus emphatically taught that a spiritual birth is essential to entering the kingdom of heaven. "'Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God'" (John 3:3).


Yes, and everyone will be born again, in their own order.


11. In answer to a very clear question about what is necessary for salvation, Paul gave a very clear answer: "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved" (Acts. 16:31).


Yes, it is necessary to believe in the Lord to be saved.  Some believe and will be saved in this age, all others will believe later.  There is no other name under heaven whereby we must be saved.  Every knee shall bow to the Lord, and every tongue shall confess to God. Every man in his own order.  Christ the firstfruits, then they that are Christ's at his coming, and finally all others at the consummation..


12. Jesus gave no indication that many roads lead to God. He forcefully stated that He was the only way. "'I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me'" (John 14:6).


Absolutely true..  There is no other name under heaven whereby we must be saved.


13. The early preachers of the church clearly preached that Jesus is the only way to salvation. "Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved" (Acts 4:12; see also 1 Tim. 2:5; Heb. 2:3-4; 1 Pet. 1:3-5).


Absolutely true..  There is no other name under heaven whereby we must be saved.


14. According to Scripture, only those who receive Jesus Christ and believe in Him are children of God. "But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name" (John 1:12).


Absolutely true but God isn't calling everyone today.


15. The gospel is the power of God for salvation for everyone who believes. "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes" (Rom. 1:16; see also 10:9).


Once again, not everyone will believe at this time nor is God calling everyone at this time.  Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess.


16. Rather than teaching that those without faith in Christ are already saved, the Bible teaches that they are already under judgment. Faith in Christ brings us out of condemnation and into right relationship with God. "'He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God'" (John 3:18).


Those who believe in UR do not teach that those without faith in Christ are already saved?  To make that claim is false.  Even those with faith in Christ are not already saved, but are in the process of being saved.  Even Paul admitted that he could be rejected (1 Cor. 9:27).  And there is nothing in John 3:18  which says, there is no chance for rehabilitation/repentance beyond this age in which we live. To assume that someone in this age of grace is condemned forever because of unbelief is a gross misunderstanding.  Being "condemned" is not a sentence to the "fires of hell".  An unbeliever's condemnation is a temporary condition.  After all you can read that our own Lord was "condemned?" (Matt. 20:18).


17. Only those "And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire" (Rev. 20:15; see also 21:27).


The assumption made is that ONLY those whose names are in the Lamb's Book of Life are granted access into the eternal city of God.  It is true that those who are in Christ at His coming are written in the book of life, but does that exclude those who have not yet been written in the book or saved, remembering that Jesus is the Saviour of the whole world.   Can even Moses be saved? Moses asked God to forgive others.  His humble attitude enabled him to say blot me out of your book (of life) Ex. 32:32.  .But Moses will be in the Kingdom, I doubt any one can deny that.  Only those who need purification by fire and chastisement will go through the Lake of Fire (God is a consuming fire - Heb 12:29)  to bring them to God and salvation.  Rev. 21:27 tells us that at the end all will be written in the Book of Life.  The salvation of all.


18. People are not automatically righteous. Only when we declare faith in Jesus Christ does God declare us righteous in His sight. "But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness" (Rom. 4:5).


That's true. People are not automatically righteous. You become righteous by faith and that only comes when God draws (drags) you to Him (John 6:44). You do not come to Him of your own free will or desire.  (Rom. 4:16) Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed. 


19. Eternal life comes only through a relationship with God. We cannot know the Father unless we know the Son. "'And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent'" (John 17:3).


Very true. John chapters 13 to 17 record for us the words Jesus spoke to His disciples at the "last supper".  He revealed to them the relationship the Elect (His disciples) have with Him.  In verse 3 of Chapter 17 He tells them that eonian (eternal) life comes by knowing the Father, who sent Him (Christ).  Christ being the first of the firstfruits, and others following being firstfruits  - the Elect (Pentecost).


20. The cross of Christ is where payment for our sins was made. Only when we believe this are we saved. "'And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up [on a cross], that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life'" (John 3:14-15).


Christ died for our sins and not only ours. He died for the sin of the world (John 1:29), including all of mankind.  By His death we were reconciled to God.  But we shall be saved, not by His death, but by His LIFE ( Rom. 5:10).


21. Only those who have the Son of God have eternal life. "And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life" (1 John 5:11-12).
In addition to these verses, the story of Cornelius in Acts 10 and 11 provides hard evidence against Universalism. Cornelius was devout, prayed often, gave generously to the poor and even received an angelic visitation. Yet God went to great lengths to get the gospel to him so he could come to know Jesus and be saved.


It is a sad commentary that so many orthodox Christians believe that universalism is to be discredited, some even calling it heresy.  Either Jesus Christ is the saviour of the whole world or He is not.  No, universalism is not the gospel.   A knowledge of the "salvation of all" is not the only  truth leading to salvation.   Belief in, adherence to, and a love for, universalism will not save anyone.  But God will.


22. Added to the avalanche of scriptural evidence, there are also practical reasons for rejecting Universalism. History teaches that acceding to Universalism sets the church on a slippery slide toward theological liberalism. Soon all confidence in Scripture is lost and the uniqueness of the Christian gospel evaporates.


In no way does belief in the salvation of all set the church on a slippery slide toward theological liberalism.  No one has documented that as fact.  The truth is that there are 3 opinions on how God is working out His plan of salvation when you read the Bible..  Some people believe in eternal torment!  It seems to be clearly taught in the Bible many believe.  And, also, the doctrine of extermination is seemingly also "in the Bible,".  People have read it there too. Also, while apparently not quite so clearly, the Bible also teaches the ultimate salvation of all men. Only one of these is correct.  Indeed those who believe in the doctrine of Eternal Torment have a strong case when reading our popular Bible versions. But their false beliefs can be recognized by studying the Greek words in respected lexicons like Strong/Thayer. Otherwise it just becomes a yes/no fight. Without proof everybody is right


23. If we embrace Universalism, there is no urgency to evangelize or imperative to do missions. In fact, evangelism and missions would have to be redefined. We need look no further than most of the mainline denominations to see what happens to evangelism when Universalism is prevalent.


Where do we find specific examples of what happens to evangelism when the "salvation of all"  is preached?  How can one say  that a Universalist sees no urgency to proclaim the victorious gospel of Jesus Christ?  They are just as fervent and zealous as any energized Christian.


24. If Universalism is finally proved right, nothing will have been lost by our continued urgency in winning people to faith in Christ. But if it is false and we embrace it, then everything will be forever lost--including people who do not know Christ.


It is a good thing for all of us of all Christian denominations to preach that Christ died for our sins and it is only through Him we will be saved.  Even Paul rejoiced when he heard others preaching Christ, albeit for ulterior motives. (Philippians 1:18).  So lets rejoice. I truly think no one can believe in the "salvation of all" until God opens their eyes. You can explain all the mistranslations, misunderstandings and misinterpretations and clear verses that teach this truth until you are blue in the face, but none of that will matter if they aren't able to see it.  And the only One that can make them see is God.

[micah7:9]

CHB and joeteekay!  :banana: :dsunny: :HeartThrob: :trampoline: The Lord IS Good!

[rosered]

 :IloveU:  all

  Because I love the Lord   GOD and see his  beauty    and love  working in all   :HeartThrob:

  :goodpost:  everyone !!!  love  wins  Joe !!!     

[sheila]

 also recall that the disciples were upset over someone casting out demons in Jesus name and were not following with them. and we have

  Jesus reply unto His disciples.

   Isaachar is a large boned ass lying between two burdens..the ass has to be redeemed with a lamb...and the Lord has use of them.

[JonesHenry]

I dont thik the doctorine of NEVER ENDING CONSCIOUS HELL stops tyrants from being tyrants

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=6ae_1431380709


It mostly pushes people away from GOD as they view him as either unfair of purely imaginary. They simply reject god on there OWN moral grounds. This doctorine does not help to spread the Gospel of Jesus christ. It just creates fear and confusion

http://atheistimpact.podbean.com

[Tom]

I think the common misconception of "hell" distorts the worldview of all who believe it because it is based on fear not love. So that affects how they live their lives and how they interact with all their fellow human beings not to mention how they perceive God. God exercises judgment, but judgment doesn't always involve condemnation. And the result of condemnation is only temporary because God is love, God has the power to make the dead alive as evidenced by the resurrection of Jesus Christ, and God is the savior of all mankind.

[marie glen]

I dont thik the doctorine of NEVER ENDING CONSCIOUS HELL stops tyrants from being tyrants

    :laughing7: haha! i have to agree with that!

It mostly pushes people away from GOD as they view him as either unfair of purely imaginary. They simply reject god on there OWN moral grounds. This doctorine does not help to spread the Gospel of Jesus christ. It just creates fear and confusion

   :iagree: :iagree: totally! It makes the gospel unbelievable ("imaginery") and yes, now ppl judge God because of it.. and reject Him.. And some come to hate Him (the sin which when having, is unable to be forgiven) And certainly does not help to spread the gospel!

[eaglesway]

The doctrine of eternal torment makes God a tyrant, why should it discourage tyrants?  :laugh:

[Dandelion]

There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.

1 John 4:18

[joeteekay]

There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.

1 John 4:18

I view fear as torment ( not physical but mental, of the heart) a process of growing into deeper understanding of Him. I see punishment as loving chastisement from God for our good.