God is Life...?

[marie glen]

For a very long time now it's been my belief that God is life itself.. the life force.. "In the beginning, God.."

It's also my belief the lesson this life is teaching "all in heaven and in earth" - to wander from God is to wander from Life.

And to wander from His Perfect Will in anything, is to also wander from Life (being as God, surely, is Perfect/Perfection)

..and I believe that what all are learning by first hand experience, and by all of history, is that to wander from God (without His interference/salvation/rescue/redemption/reconciliation) would simply result in a self destructive puff of smoke, dust and ashes.. In other words it really cannot be done.. will not work..

Man cannot build on sand.. "Fallen! Fallen!" (man's) Babble on and on and on.. "is Fallen! Fallen!" (the ciTy/"harlot" which becomes one/ seduced all nations/7 continents with her "pornos" (greek word translated harlot, which means "to sell"). She falls/crashes "in one hour".. and falls (the towers,Isaiah?Ezekiel?) "in one day")
                                  - Because it cannot stand. Ever.

{{{ Is this not an important lesson? this knowing, and fully understanding good from evil? what can stand from what cannot, which imo, is also Life from nonlife, such a simple lesson, really..

but is surely(?) THE bedrock foundation of all things throughout the universe, which is going to be made new; and is the same story and lesson proven by every single person's life, in the story of every nation, and also is proven in the total story/lesson which is mankind's history as a whole}

It's my opinion this is why the Book Of Rev ends upon a note of "do not take away from the message of this book" (of Revelation) and opens with "blessed are those who read, hear, listen, heed.."
  :smile: :hiya:

[Tom]

I'm not the Rev fan that you are, sis, but I agree that God is spirit, "the life force," the source of all, the power operating all, and the goal of all.

[Seth]

Marie Glen, yes! I believe so. Also, I think, regarding Revelation, that is the reason that the "tree of life" is in the center of the "city" with rivers of "water." The further you go away from the city centre, the further you go into death outside that city.

[marie glen]

I'm not the Rev fan that you are, sis, but I agree that God is spirit, "the life force," the source of all, the power operating all, and the goal of all.

:thumbsup: thanks Tom! :icon_flower: and absolutely!

Marie Glen, yes! I believe so. Also, I think, regarding Revelation, that is the reason that the "tree of life" is in the center of the "city" with rivers of "water." The further you go away from the city centre, the further you go into death outside that city.

...and death begets more death/darkness, as ever further from the river of Life!  :icon_flower: :thumbsup:

[Seth]

Marie Glen, yes! I believe so. Also, I think, regarding Revelation, that is the reason that the "tree of life" is in the center of the "city" with rivers of "water." The further you go away from the city centre, the further you go into death outside that city.

...and death begets more death/darkness, as ever further from the river of Life!  :icon_flower: :thumbsup:

:thumbsup: :dsunny:

[rosered]

 :thumbsup:    Wonderful !!

[Lazarus Short]

The whole world outside the City (New Jerusalem) is the Outer Darkness spoken of in the Scripture.

[Seth]

 

The whole world outside the City (New Jerusalem) is the Outer Darkness spoken of in the Scripture.

:iagree:

[Seth]

So, when Jesus was crucified outside the city, that is an indicator of where the flesh dies. That is why the Apostles are told to cut out their eyes and throw them in to gehenna outside the city. Repentance also occurs outside the city. That is where the Prodigal Son found out his works were all for nothing and brought him nothing but pain, death, destruction, outer darkness, weeping and gnashing of teeth, and a fiery furnace of his own wickedness which brought him to his knees. The flesh dies outside the city.

[Warhawk17]

So, when Jesus was crucified outside the city, that is an indicator of where the flesh dies. That is why the Apostles are told to cut out their eyes and throw them in to gehenna outside the city. Repentance also occurs outside the city. That is where the Prodigal Son found out his works were all for nothing and brought him nothing but pain, death, destruction, outer darkness, weeping and gnashing of teeth, and a fiery furnace of his own wickedness which brought him to his knees. The flesh dies outside the city.

Really great stuff! It's always a good day when I learn something new spiritually or see something in a way I had never seen it before. Great discussion!

[WhiteWings]

The whole world outside the City (New Jerusalem) is the Outer Darkness spoken of in the Scripture.

But only during the party  :winkgrin:

[WhiteWings]

http://www.lampbroadcast.org/OUTRDARK.HTM

[Seth]

So, when Jesus was crucified outside the city, that is an indicator of where the flesh dies. That is why the Apostles are told to cut out their eyes and throw them in to gehenna outside the city. Repentance also occurs outside the city. That is where the Prodigal Son found out his works were all for nothing and brought him nothing but pain, death, destruction, outer darkness, weeping and gnashing of teeth, and a fiery furnace of his own wickedness which brought him to his knees. The flesh dies outside the city.

Really great stuff! It's always a good day when I learn something new spiritually or see something in a way I had never seen it before. Great discussion!

Warhawk17, I have a larger paper on it if you are interested, with alot more scripture on this: The Judgment of the world by the Cross

[Seth]

So, when Jesus was crucified outside the city, that is an indicator of where the flesh dies. That is why the Apostles are told to cut out their eyes and throw them in to gehenna outside the city. Repentance also occurs outside the city. That is where the Prodigal Son found out his works were all for nothing and brought him nothing but pain, death, destruction, outer darkness, weeping and gnashing of teeth, and a fiery furnace of his own wickedness which brought him to his knees. The flesh dies outside the city.

Really great stuff! It's always a good day when I learn something new spiritually or see something in a way I had never seen it before. Great discussion!

Warhawk, another thing I never understood before, is that people LOVE the "outer darkness" in which they are consigned.

John 3:18-21
He who believes in Him (Jesus) is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. This...is...the...judgment (Greek - krisis): that the Light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the Light, for their deeds were evil.

For everyone who does evil hates the Light, and does not come to the Light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought (worked) in God.

That's the judgment. It's nothing other than that. And people LOVE the darkness. But not forever. Their sin will someday betray them. What they found to be strength, they will discover to be weakness.

Lamentations 1:13-15
"From on high, he (God) sent FIRE, sent it down into my bones. He spread a net for my feet and turned me back. He made me desolate, faint all the day long. "MY SINS have been bound into a yoke; by his hands they were woven together. They (the sins) have been hung on my neck, and the Lord has sapped my strength.

He has given me into the hands of those I cannot withstand. "The Lord has rejected all the warriors in my midst; he has summoned an army against me to crush my young men. In his winepress the Lord has trampled Virgin Daughter Judah.

[marie glen]

That's the judgment. It's nothing other than that. And people LOVE the darkness. But not forever. Their sin will someday betray them. What they found to be strength, they will discover to be weakness.

I very much believe that! That sin bears witness of itself.. In straying from God is destruction.. it's really all the "wrath" needed.. that the 'wrath' of God is simply a (very) dramatic way to describe it - so all levels of intellect can grasp it - much like a child, you might smack their butt if they run out into traffic, because your heart is pounding and they almost got run over! but when they mature a simple "don't run out into traffic" will suffice!

I think God iS Life.. i think we're learning good from evil, which is also life from death,nonlife..

walk away from God? choose differently in any teeny tiny way from what He chooses? Ultimately, can't be done. It's the "iron rod" - God's law - like gravity, jump off the building if you must, but without God's salvation/intervention, we would aLL come to a bad end.. simple lesson really i can't help but think..

There is no malice in God.. But surely all in heaven and earth must learn that to walk away from Him or from his perfect will in any thing, can only ever bring one to harm.. namely resulting in a self destructive puff of smoke.. and dust scattered in the wind..

But He did intervene! :Peace2: :dsunny: :cloud9: (And will deeply engrave this unavoidable lesson upon every heart and mind?)

[Seth]

Marie Glen, yes....God is LOVE.....gasp! Dare we say it?  :laughing7:

[marie glen]

Amen, Seth.. it's a wonderful message.. the gospel


....good news, after all :banana:

[WhiteWings]

I still haven't worked this out for myself.

We often read God hates sin. He punishes the sinner.
OTOH it was He who designed us as lovers of darkness. Or at least a large part of humanity falls for the tricks of darkness.

Yes, I've read that all will be fine in the end and everything happens as it happens for the greater good of mankind. But then why is God so unhappy if all happens as designed? Everything He does is perfect. So His designs are perfect. Why isn't He perfectly happy if all perfect designs function exactly as intended?

Why Jesus had to die? Yes, I know the answer. Laws etc. But it was God Himself who designed those laws. He just as well could have required 50 push-ups instead of death.

:2c:

[Seth]

We often read God hates sin. He punishes the sinner.
OTOH it was He who designed us as lovers of darkness. Or at least a large part of humanity falls for the tricks of darkness.

Yes, I've read that all will be fine in the end and everything happens as it happens for the greater good of mankind. But then why is God so unhappy if all happens as designed?

My take on that is that God really isn't unhappy, not the way humans reckon unhappiness. We are flesh, so our emotions are filtered through physical means that God simply does not have. I am not saying that God does not feel, but that I don't think we should understand his feelings exactly the same way as our own.

There is much indication that the "feel" words in the ancient world are centered more around action than feeling. Here is an example:

John 3:16
For God so (Gk - houto) loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son...

It appears that the scripture is saying "God so much loved the world" But the word "houto" means "in this way." So the scripture is really saying: For God, in this way, loved the world: that he gave his only begotten son.

And yet:

Psalm 5:5,
The boastful shall not stand before Thine eyes; Thou dost hate all who do iniquity.

He hates them? He loves them? What? He hated Esau before Esau did good or evil. That just means he chose Jacob over Esau. For a man who God "hated" it certainly worked out well for him in the end...he and Jacob were reunited!

Again, it's more a matter of what God does, than how he "feels." Does Jesus really mean for us to emotionally HATE our own parents? I don't think so. He wants us to put himself above them, and in THAT way "hate" them, and in that way we can better love them:

2 John 1:5-7
I am not writing you a new command but one we have had from the beginning. I ask that we love one another. And this is love: that we walk in obedience to his commands. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you walk in love.

But he does not show favor to the wicked:

Isaiah 26:9-10
With my soul have I desired thee in the night; yea, with my spirit within me will I seek thee early: for when thy judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world will learn righteousness. Let favour be shewed to the wicked, yet will he not learn righteousness: in the land of uprightness will he deal unjustly, and will not behold the majesty of the LORD.

So by "hating" the wicked, he is "loving" them, because both those words that we Westerners associate with feelings, to God have more to do with our actions in SPITE of our emotions. We can love people, even if our emotions cause us to feel otherwise.

All this really to say, I don't think God is unhappy in our way. I think it's all a matter of what he is DOING rather than feeling.

[Ross]

We learn from experience. I can see stuff happening around us and try to convince myself it would never happen to me. Then something happens directly which changes my environment and makes me think and learn right from wrong with many different possibilities.
Adam and Eve ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Many religions then teach that we have to do something to earn our right standing with God.
Paul says to the Ephesians that "Before" the world began I KNEW YOU."
That was before the tree of knowledge had been touched.
Doesn't this highlight that the plan of creation is precise. God knew they would eat from the tree.
Christ knew they would eat from the tree and that He would then come to correct our mistakes and make us equal in value by His sacrifice. He did this as a living demonstration of the position we have which controls the universe does not make us arrogant and self-indulgent, but rather humble and loving ,caring beings.
What a magnificent plan.
Jacob and Esau were pointed out to highlight that their position was not self-effort.
Ishmael and Isaac were a demonstration of man's effort versus God's provision.
The flesh was made with selfish desires and is opposite to the spirit.
God knew that because He made that.
What better way to learn than from experience. The very thing said in Hebrews where it says that He disciplines those He loves, which is not pleasant at the time but provides a deeper understanding.
So Yes. God is life, love, teaching us right from wrong with a promise of a glorious future which goes beyond our current ability to grasp.