Trinity Discussion, split from "Something I Just Read"

[sheila]

truly,I beleive christendom's doctrine of the trinity is a carnal/lower fleshly understanding.I also know that there is

a very High understanding to that earthly shadow of the mercy seat/shekinah light/atonement ark and two cherubs

in the HOLY OF HOLIES. There is lower understanding..that is even twisted by carnal minded..and there is a very

high spiritual understanding/mind of Christ.

  If God be in Christ and Christ be in God,and the Holy spirit be in the Holy of Holies..and they are all in you..what is in you..

  the pirit of God,the Holy spirit and the spirit of Christ?

   I pray Father,that they may be where I am..that they may be one.

   reconciliation is oneness in heart mind body with another. You enter that holy of Holy  place through them dwelling in you

    reconcile....to bring togather..........

[Molly]

Sheila,  :thumbsup:


Indwelt by the Father

(Ephesians 4:6 ) One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.



Indwelt by the Son

(Colossians 1:27 ) To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:



Indwelt by the Holy Spirit

(1 Corinthians 3:16) Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

[mplsfitter539]

The current mainstream teaching in Christianity is that God is a coequal, coeternal, one-substance trinity, and that Jesus Christ is God. This doctrine is considered by many as the cornerstone of Christianity, but where did this doctrine come from? The historical record is overwhelming that the church of the first three centuries did not worship God as a coequal, coeternal, con-substantial, one-substance three in one mysterious godhead. The early church worshiped one God and believed in a subordinate Son. The trinity originated with Babylon, and was passed on to most of the world's religions. This polytheistic (believing in more than one god) trinitarianism was intertwined with Greek religion and philosophy and slowly worked its way into Christian thought and creeds some 300 years after Christ. Here is the url for the rest of this article. http://www.christadelphia.org/trinityhistory.htm  ( I do not support this site, only that I agree with the findings of the pagan origins of the pagan trinity theory).

I have concluded that those of us not believing in man made doctrines/hypothesis do not have to show proof against the trinity theory. Since it is not mentioned by name or implied anywhere in the Word of God it is the responsibility of the trinity theory believers to prove what it is that they believe. I believe in the bible always and likewise always refuse the traditions of men and man made ways of explaining things that they don't understand.

I personally want to thank everyone here for participation in this debate and for keeping it civil.

DuWayne

[rosered]

 
  Yes been trying to say that   Shelia   in other words , yet ,  I know none whom if   the Lords Holy Spirit does not teach   them  spiritual things   not fully grown   we all lack understanding  , they    will never understand the patterns of the 3's in holy writ     nor the  ability  to process   those types and shadows of the good things to come , till the Light/Knowledge of Gods wisdom  increases , I for one am just now  being able to process this  after so long a time  :eek:
  truly  the carnal mind / babes   is an emnity against the Spirit [teacher ] and none have till the Lord God Almighty sees  fit to give it ,  that is just how it is set


  ◄  1 Corinthians 2:13  ►


New International Version (©2011)
This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words.
New Living Translation (©2007)
When we tell you these things, we do not use words that come from human wisdom. Instead, we speak words given to us by the Spirit, using the Spirit's words to explain spiritual truths.

English Standard Version (©2001)
And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who are spiritual.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
which things we also speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, combining spiritual thoughts with spiritual words.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Holman Christian Standard Bible (©2009)
We also speak these things, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual things to spiritual people.

International Standard Version (©2012)
We don't speak about these things with words taught us by human wisdom, but with words taught by the Spirit, as we explain spiritual things to spiritual people.

NET Bible (©2006)
And we speak about these things, not with words taught us by human wisdom, but with those taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual things to spiritual people.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
But those things we speak are not in the teaching of the words of the wisdom of men, but in the teaching of The Spirit, and we compare spiritual things to the spiritual.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
We don't speak about these things using teachings that are based on intellectual arguments like people do. Instead, we use the Spirit's teachings. We explain spiritual things to those who have the Spirit.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teaches, but which the Holy Spirit teaches; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

American King James Version
Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teaches, but which the Holy Ghost teaches; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

American Standard Version
Which things also we speak, not in words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Spirit teacheth; combining spiritual things with spiritual words .

Douay-Rheims Bible
Which things also we speak, not in the learned words of human wisdom; but in the doctrine of the Spirit, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Darby Bible Translation
which also we speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Spirit, communicating spiritual things by spiritual means.

English Revised Version
Which things also we speak, not in words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Spirit teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Webster's Bible Translation
Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Spirit teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Weymouth New Testament
Of these we speak--not in language which man's wisdom teaches us, but in that which the Spirit teaches--adapting, as we do, spiritual words to spiritual truths.

World English Bible
Which things also we speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches, but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual things.

Young's Literal Translation
which things also we speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Holy Spirit, with spiritual things spiritual things comparing,


I should have said  this first  lol ,   for as the old belief system of the trinity  ,  not exactly
  but   all things come from   One God  , yet there is the pattern of the 3  that cannot be denied  in scripture as distint purposes  , just what  my thoughts are about all this  , I never want to  argue over  our faith , its pointness !

[micah7:9]

The current mainstream teaching in Christianity is that God is a coequal, coeternal, one-substance trinity, and that Jesus Christ is God. This doctrine is considered by many as the cornerstone of Christianity, but where did this doctrine come from? The historical record is overwhelming that the church of the first three centuries did not worship God as a coequal, coeternal, con-substantial, one-substance three in one mysterious godhead. The early church worshiped one God and believed in a subordinate Son. The trinity originated with Babylon, and was passed on to most of the world's religions. This polytheistic (believing in more than one god) trinitarianism was intertwined with Greek religion and philosophy and slowly worked its way into Christian thought and creeds some 300 years after Christ. Here is the url for the rest of this article. http://www.christadelphia.org/trinityhistory.htm  ( I do not support this site, only that I agree with the findings of the pagan origins of the pagan trinity theory).

I have concluded that those of us not believing in man made doctrines/hypothesis do not have to show proof against the trinity theory. Since it is not mentioned by name or implied anywhere in the Word of God it is the responsibility of the trinity theory believers to prove what it is that they believe. I believe in the bible always and likewise always refuse the traditions of men and man made ways of explaining things that they don't understand.

I personally want to thank everyone here for participation in this debate and for keeping it civil.

DuWayne

:dsunny:
Deu_17:6  At the mouth of two witnesses, or three witnesses, shall he that is worthy of death be put to death; but at the mouth of one witness he shall not be put to death.
Below are 3 witnesses 

Deu 6:4  Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: 
Joh 10:30  I and my Father are one.
Joh 17:22  And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

[Molly]

This thread has brought up some old memories for me.  I remember when I was very young, my mother told me I had my own guardian angel whose job it was to protect me.  This made me feel great because I was often fending for myself among the wolves, but shortly after that, I was walking home from school on top of a huge snowbank and tripped and started sliding head first into the street at a busy corner.  This all happened very fast.   I stopped sliding so close to a passing car that I could almost feel the tire singe my eyelashes.  I was staring at the writing on a tire wall as it brushed past my face.   Maybe two inches further and my head would have been under the tire.  In a world of no friction, something caught me by the feet and stopped my slide head first into the street   After that, I believed her.  Of course, grown up now, I can find scripture to support it.

10 Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven.  Mat 18

Nevertheless, things progressed and problems got bigger and even more complicated.  Even so, I was always protected, but the protection itself became more and more complicated, and later, looking back, I realized that maybe this or that episode in my life  required some type of super angel to intervene.  For this reason, I was struck when I first learned about the Parakletos, the Helper. 

I will not leave you an orphan...

I will pray the Father and He shall give you another Helper [Parakletos].


"The New Testament includes over 90 references to the Holy Spirit.[4] The sacredness of the Holy Spirit is affirmed in all three Synoptic Gospels which proclaim blasphemy against the Holy Spirit as the unforgivable sin.[5] The Holy Spirit plays a key role in the Pauline epistles.[6] In the Johannine writings, three separate terms, "Holy Spirit", "Spirit of Truth" and "Paraclete" are used.[7]

The New Testament details a close relationship between the Holy Spirit and Jesus during his earthly life and ministry.[8] The Gospels of Luke and Matthew and the Nicene Creed state that Jesus was "conceived by the Holy Spirit, born of the Virgin Mary."[9] The Holy Spirit descended on Jesus as a dove during his Baptism, and in his Farewell Discourse after the Last Supper Jesus promised to send the Holy Spirit to his disciples after his departure.[10][11]C

The theology of the Holy Spirit is called pneumatology. The Holy Spirit is referred to as the Lord and Giver of Life in the Nicene Creed. The participation of the Holy Spirit in the tripartite nature of conversion is apparent in Jesus' final post-Resurrection instruction to his disciples at the end of the Gospel of Matthew (28:19): "make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them into the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit".[12] Since the first century, Christians have also called upon God with the name "Father, Son and Holy Spirit" in prayer, absolution and benediction.[13][14]"

The sacredness of the Holy Spirit is affirmed in all three Synoptic Gospels (Matthew 12:30-32, Mark 3:28-30 and Luke 12:8-10) which proclaim that blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is the unforgivable sin.[5]

--Wikipedia



Clearly this is a serious and deep topic.  But, for me, the Holy Spirit has always been my companion in the trenches of life, fighting side by side with me in all endeavors, watching my back, and walking before me,  making my path smooth through the most treacherous of waters.   It's not a matter of theology for me, but  a matter of how I live my life.  He was doing this before I ever noticed it, but once I began to notice it, His presence seemed to increase.

Yes, He can imbue us with the power of God, teach us, show us all things, sanctify us, and prepare His temple for the presence of the Father and the Son, but to a woman [sheep] walking alone in the world, He is, quite simply, the Strong Man at her side.  And, for this, I am eternally grateful.



Where shall I go from your Spirit? or where shall I flee from your presence? 8If I ascend up into heaven, you are there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, you are there. 9If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; 10Even there shall your hand lead me, and your right hand shall hold me.

---Psalm 139


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Vienna_Karlskirche_frescos4b.jpg

[Lazarus Short]

The current mainstream teaching in Christianity is that God is a coequal, coeternal, one-substance trinity, and that Jesus Christ is God. This doctrine is considered by many as the cornerstone of Christianity, but where did this doctrine come from? The historical record is overwhelming that the church of the first three centuries did not worship God as a coequal, coeternal, con-substantial, one-substance three in one mysterious godhead. The early church worshiped one God and believed in a subordinate Son. The trinity originated with Babylon, and was passed on to most of the world's religions. This polytheistic (believing in more than one god) trinitarianism was intertwined with Greek religion and philosophy and slowly worked its way into Christian thought and creeds some 300 years after Christ. Here is the url for the rest of this article. http://www.christadelphia.org/trinityhistory.htm  ( I do not support this site, only that I agree with the findings of the pagan origins of the pagan trinity theory).

I have concluded that those of us not believing in man made doctrines/hypothesis do not have to show proof against the trinity theory. Since it is not mentioned by name or implied anywhere in the Word of God it is the responsibility of the trinity theory believers to prove what it is that they believe. I believe in the bible always and likewise always refuse the traditions of men and man made ways of explaining things that they don't understand.

I personally want to thank everyone here for participation in this debate and for keeping it civil.

DuWayne

I read the linked article from beginning to end, and I think the light is coming on for me:

God is God

Jesus is the Son of God, not God the Son - subordinate, not co-equal.

The Holy Spirit is God's Breath/Spirit/Life Force, not God.  There are Seven Spirits - they do their work and return to God.

[micah7:9]

I have said before, I have not and do not deny the existence or the moving and works of the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit is the wisdom and power of the Lord God. The Holy Spirit is real. The Lord God is ONE, not a trinity.
The son came out from the God/Father, Joh 16:27  For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.
Joh 17:8  For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

I believe the power or energy, that caused the "coming out" is the Holy Spirit. :dsunny:

P.S. Spurious Passages in the Bible
Matthew 28:19-- the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit *

[Molly]

The current mainstream teaching in Christianity is that God is a coequal, coeternal, one-substance trinity, and that Jesus Christ is God. This doctrine is considered by many as the cornerstone of Christianity, but where did this doctrine come from? The historical record is overwhelming that the church of the first three centuries did not worship God as a coequal, coeternal, con-substantial, one-substance three in one mysterious godhead. The early church worshiped one God and believed in a subordinate Son. The trinity originated with Babylon, and was passed on to most of the world's religions. This polytheistic (believing in more than one god) trinitarianism was intertwined with Greek religion and philosophy and slowly worked its way into Christian thought and creeds some 300 years after Christ. Here is the url for the rest of this article. http://www.christadelphia.org/trinityhistory.htm  ( I do not support this site, only that I agree with the findings of the pagan origins of the pagan trinity theory).

I have concluded that those of us not believing in man made doctrines/hypothesis do not have to show proof against the trinity theory. Since it is not mentioned by name or implied anywhere in the Word of God it is the responsibility of the trinity theory believers to prove what it is that they believe. I believe in the bible always and likewise always refuse the traditions of men and man made ways of explaining things that they don't understand.

I personally want to thank everyone here for participation in this debate and for keeping it civil.

DuWayne

:dsunny:
Deu_17:6  At the mouth of two witnesses, or three witnesses, shall he that is worthy of death be put to death; but at the mouth of one witness he shall not be put to death.
Below are 3 witnesses 

Deu 6:4  Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: 
Joh 10:30  I and my Father are one.
Joh 17:22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:[/u]

Are you saying we are the third witness as we are brought into oneness with the Father and the Son?   

Because if you are, I couldn't agree more.   It is the Holy Spirit, under the command of Jesus and the Father,  who ushers us into the family of God, allowing us to share his third place in the 'trinity' of the Godhead.


"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty."

--Rev 1:8


Through the Holy Spirit we are the "is to come" part of God.


PS There is nothing 'spurious' in the word of God.

[sheila]

DuWayne,I had been aware since the 80's of the tri-unal gods worshipped..and even the sign of the cross,long before

Christ,as a pagan symbol.  But we must remember..flesh gives birth to flesh and spirit gives birth to spirit,and I have

found that the 'one' talent that the servant took and 'hid' in the earth,is removed from him that hid it..and given to him

that received the five..and increased the five to ten.Upon receiving the additional one..that same servant will increase

again the one to two...and end up with 12.....symbolic sign of the Government and Kingdom of God. which = to me

myriads and myriads of angelic holy angels indwelt with His spirit..to do His bidding and carry out His dominion

and great multitudes of the spirits of just men made perfect indwelt by His Holy spirit that also always do what

pleases Him....and He as sovereign over all rules and carrys out the dominion of His whole creation..as one body,one spirit

one mind with and through the many members.

   Luke 7;8  the centurion...recognizing Jesus under the authority of Father,with those under his authority in the Kingdom

     'For I myself am a man under authority,with soldiers under me.  I tell this one 'go' and he goes; and that one 'come' and

he 'comes'. I say to my servant 'do this' and he does it.

   this Kingdom and Government of God will become all in all..God in all.  the stone not cut out by human hands will

fill the entire earth....  for this reason..Jesus said..if ye have done it to the least of these..you have done it unto me.

   and for this reason also,Jesus said...of man born of woman,none is greater then John the baptist..but he who is least

in the kingdom of heaven is greater then he.

   

[Molly]

The current mainstream teaching in Christianity is that God is a coequal, coeternal, one-substance trinity, and that Jesus Christ is God. This doctrine is considered by many as the cornerstone of Christianity, but where did this doctrine come from? The historical record is overwhelming that the church of the first three centuries did not worship God as a coequal, coeternal, con-substantial, one-substance three in one mysterious godhead. The early church worshiped one God and believed in a subordinate Son. The trinity originated with Babylon, and was passed on to most of the world's religions. This polytheistic (believing in more than one god) trinitarianism was intertwined with Greek religion and philosophy and slowly worked its way into Christian thought and creeds some 300 years after Christ. Here is the url for the rest of this article. http://www.christadelphia.org/trinityhistory.htm  ( I do not support this site, only that I agree with the findings of the pagan origins of the pagan trinity theory).

I have concluded that those of us not believing in man made doctrines/hypothesis do not have to show proof against the trinity theory. Since it is not mentioned by name or implied anywhere in the Word of God it is the responsibility of the trinity theory believers to prove what it is that they believe. I believe in the bible always and likewise always refuse the traditions of men and man made ways of explaining things that they don't understand.

I personally want to thank everyone here for participation in this debate and for keeping it civil.

DuWayne

I read the linked article from beginning to end, and I think the light is coming on for me:

God is God

Jesus is the Son of God, not God the Son - subordinate, not co-equal.

The Holy Spirit is God's Breath/Spirit/Life Force, not God.  There are Seven Spirits - they do their work and return to God.

5Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: 6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: 7 But made himself of no reputation, and took on him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: ...Phil 2:6


John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.



10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.



14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.



15 John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.

16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

----John 1

[micah7:9]

The current mainstream teaching in Christianity is that God is a coequal, coeternal, one-substance trinity, and that Jesus Christ is God. This doctrine is considered by many as the cornerstone of Christianity, but where did this doctrine come from? The historical record is overwhelming that the church of the first three centuries did not worship God as a coequal, coeternal, con-substantial, one-substance three in one mysterious godhead. The early church worshiped one God and believed in a subordinate Son. The trinity originated with Babylon, and was passed on to most of the world's religions. This polytheistic (believing in more than one god) trinitarianism was intertwined with Greek religion and philosophy and slowly worked its way into Christian thought and creeds some 300 years after Christ. Here is the url for the rest of this article. http://www.christadelphia.org/trinityhistory.htm  ( I do not support this site, only that I agree with the findings of the pagan origins of the pagan trinity theory).

I have concluded that those of us not believing in man made doctrines/hypothesis do not have to show proof against the trinity theory. Since it is not mentioned by name or implied anywhere in the Word of God it is the responsibility of the trinity theory believers to prove what it is that they believe. I believe in the bible always and likewise always refuse the traditions of men and man made ways of explaining things that they don't understand.

I personally want to thank everyone here for participation in this debate and for keeping it civil.

DuWayne

:dsunny:
Deu_17:6  At the mouth of two witnesses, or three witnesses, shall he that is worthy of death be put to death; but at the mouth of one witness he shall not be put to death.
Below are 3 witnesses 

Deu 6:4  Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: 
Joh 10:30  I and my Father are one.
Joh 17:22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:[/u]

Are you saying we are the third witness as we are brought into oneness with the Father and the Son?   

Because if you are, I couldn't agree more.   It is the Holy Spirit, under the command of Jesus and the Father,  who ushers us into the family of God, allowing us to share his third place in the 'trinity' of the Godhead.


"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty."

--Rev 1:8


Through the Holy Spirit we are the "is to come" part of God.


PS There is nothing 'spurious' in the word of God.

All I showed were 3 witnesses that God is one.
"Are you saying we are the third witness as we are brought into oneness with the Father and the Son?"
Don't know how you got that.
I do believe that all will be in the family of God, He is a family.

"PS There is nothing 'spurious' in the word of God."   But there is in the Bible.

   

[Lazarus Short]

Molly, I see that I am going to have more study before me...

[sheila]

ah yes, the great cloud of wittness that surround us...coming on the clouds.

[CHB]

I have these questions as well.
If the trinity is true, how is it that Jesus Christ was CONCEIVED BY THE HOLY SPIRIT, but is the SON OF GOD THE FATHER???
If Jesus Christ is the one and only Supreme Deity and Almighty God of the universe, when He died on the cross, WHO resurrected Him back to life?

Also consider, if the Father, the Holy Spirit of God, and Jesus Christ are One inseparable God, then if either of the three were to die, ALL WOULD DIE.

So if God is a trinity and "The TRINITY" itself DIED, then there would be no power to resurrect anyone and we would be without any God today, in fact, we would be without ourselves or anything else in the universe. There would be one big black void!

If "God" (your trinity), DIED, then "God" died--ALL OF GOD DIED, for you say "God" is a "trinity."  Maybe you would care to explain that to me?  Remember now, the trinity can NOT be divided up into three separate parts, for according to you it IS the three parts that make the whole God. Did only one-third of God die for the sin of the world?

Amen micah. I am a little late reading these post but if the Holy Spirit is a third party of the Godhead why doesn't the apostles recognize it in their epistles?  (Rom 1:7) Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.  No mention of the Holy Spirit.

No acknowlegdement of the Holy Spirit as being p[art of the Godhead here.
(1Cor. 1:3) Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(1Cor. 1:2) Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(Gal. 1:3) Grace be to you, and peace, from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(Eph. 1:2) Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(Phil.1:2) Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(Col. 1:2) Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

This is true in every epistle. If the Holy Spirit was a part of the Godhead why didn't the apostles acknowledge it as such? You would think it would say " Grace be to you, and peace, from God the Father, THE HOLY SPIRIT and from the Lord Jesus Christ." but that isn't what it says.

CHB

[Molly]

ah yes, the great cloud of wittness that surround us...coming on the clouds.

:thumbsup:

[Molly]

I have these questions as well.
If the trinity is true, how is it that Jesus Christ was CONCEIVED BY THE HOLY SPIRIT, but is the SON OF GOD THE FATHER???
If Jesus Christ is the one and only Supreme Deity and Almighty God of the universe, when He died on the cross, WHO resurrected Him back to life?

Also consider, if the Father, the Holy Spirit of God, and Jesus Christ are One inseparable God, then if either of the three were to die, ALL WOULD DIE.

So if God is a trinity and "The TRINITY" itself DIED, then there would be no power to resurrect anyone and we would be without any God today, in fact, we would be without ourselves or anything else in the universe. There would be one big black void!

If "God" (your trinity), DIED, then "God" died--ALL OF GOD DIED, for you say "God" is a "trinity."  Maybe you would care to explain that to me?  Remember now, the trinity can NOT be divided up into three separate parts, for according to you it IS the three parts that make the whole God. Did only one-third of God die for the sin of the world?

Amen micah. I am a little late reading these post but if the Holy Spirit is a third party of the Godhead why doesn't the apostles recognize it in their epistles?  (Rom 1:7) Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.  No mention of the Holy Spirit.

No acknowlegdement of the Holy Spirit as being p[art of the Godhead here.
(1Cor. 1:3) Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(1Cor. 1:2) Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(Gal. 1:3) Grace be to you, and peace, from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(Eph. 1:2) Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(Phil.1:2) Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

(Col. 1:2) Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.

This is true in every epistle. If the Holy Spirit was a part of the Godhead why didn't the apostles acknowledge it as such? You would think it would say " Grace be to you, and peace, from God the Father, THE HOLY SPIRIT and from the Lord Jesus Christ." but that isn't what it says.

CHB

Because they are speaking those words through the Holy Spirit.

[sheila]

right,he will not speak of his own..but what is mine[Christs] and declare it to you

[sheila]

also,because our hearts are epistle's written of the finger of God...man with the inkhorn..of which God writes in our hearts

and minds.   

[sheila]

alo this  with the writing kit..man with inkhorn...is the Holy spirit of which we are born of the spirit and our names written

in heaven..as born of the Jerusalem above.  what's born of spirit is spirit.

[micah7:9]

Again no one is denying the existence of the Holy Spirit and the works through those who believe. Since I find no evidence in the Bible that there is a trinity of three persons in one, I consider it theological doctrine imagined by men. The evidence in the Bible is, ONE Lord God.  Is there any place that states God the Holy Spirit?
Joh 6:27  Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed
Luk 22:70  Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am.
Eph 4:30  And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

[rosered]

Again no one is denying the existence of the Holy Spirit and the works through those who believe. Since I find no evidence in the Bible that there is a trinity of three persons in one, I consider it theological doctrine imagined by men. The evidence in the Bible is, ONE Lord God.  Is there any place that states God the Holy Spirit?
Joh 6:27  Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed
Luk 22:70  Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am.
Eph 4:30  And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

1Cr 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and [that] no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost. .
Gods Word  3 So I want you to know that no one speaking by God's Spirit says, "Jesus is cursed." No one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit.

Yes it the witness in you Gods seal  that speaks  and teaches and reminds our  conscience    obedience to Gods will   being done
 

[Molly]

alo this  with the writing kit..man with inkhorn...is the Holy spirit of which we are born of the spirit and our names written

in heaven..as born of the Jerusalem above.  what's born of spirit is spirit.

Right.  Born the same way as Jesus, conceived by the Holy Spirit--born again--born from above--born in the heavenly Jerusalem--



3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

--John 3





His foundation is in the holy mountains.

2 The Lord loveth the gates of Zion more than all the dwellings of Jacob.

3 Glorious things are spoken of thee, O city of God. Selah.

4 I will make mention of Rahab and Babylon to them that know me: behold Philistia, and Tyre, with Ethiopia; this man was born there.

5 And of Zion it shall be said, This and that man was born in her: and the highest himself shall establish her.

6 The Lord shall count, when he writeth up the people, that this man was born there. Selah.

7 As well the singers as the players on instruments shall be there: all my springs are in thee.

--Psalm 87

[jabcat]

"PS There is nothing 'spurious' in the word of God."   But there is in the Bible.

A few things suspected (by honest, truly "of the faith" scholars), a very few things "proven".  Which have to do with translations.  The more literal translations tend to correct this.  And of course they don't exist in the VERY oldest (closest to the Originals) manuscripts.  The differences there are things like spelling, a minor word left out/difference here and there - transcribing errors - that don't affect the meaning AT ALL.  Hopefully better translations will keep getting based on those few oldest available manuscripts.   :thumbsup:

Blessings.

[Molly]

Again no one is denying the existence of the Holy Spirit and the works through those who believe. Since I find no evidence in the Bible that there is a trinity of three persons in one, I consider it theological doctrine imagined by men. The evidence in the Bible is, ONE Lord God.  Is there any place that states God the Holy Spirit?
Joh 6:27  Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed
Luk 22:70  Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am.
Eph 4:30  And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

1Cr 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and [that] no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost. .
Gods Word  3 So I want you to know that no one speaking by God's Spirit says, "Jesus is cursed." No one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit.

Yes it the witness in you Gods seal  that speaks  and teaches and reminds our  conscience    obedience to Gods will   being done

rosered  :thumbsup:


12  I have yet many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13However, when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come. 14He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall show it to you. ...