What did Jesus mean?

[fullarmor2]

    Jesus said "do not fear people who can only destroy your body,  but fear God because he can destroy not only your body but your soul also in hell fire". 
   Is it possible that annihilationism is taught here?    Or,  firery torment?

[Gabe Grinstead]

It potentially could be pointing towards annihilation, but personally, I think the entire verse is hypothetical in the first place.  It is true that God is able to do those things, but it doesn't mean he will do those things. I think the first part of the verse means more than the second part, which is, don't fear what other people can do to you, because it can only affect your body, not your soul.  I think Jesus may have wanted to demonstrate that only God has the power to do the things that powerful, but it doesn't really say he 'will' do it.

[fullarmor2]

    Somewhere on here I read an excellent article which answered my question.  It talked about the original Greek and Hebrew words translated hell.  And how that those did not, do not, and never will have anything to do with the concept of ET.  And that the word hell shouldn't even mean hell as its understood by the mainstream. Its derived from "hel" an old english word that means to cover or to conceal.  And the concept of eternal torment was erroneously applied to the word hell.
 And regarding the verse I referred to in my post,  the article stated that Jesus is talking about the coming judgment of Israel at the hands of the Romans. How that many would perish and their dead bodies would be cast into the Valley of Hinnom (hell)  to be disposed of.
    One thing that confuses people I think regarding the verses I referred to is ,   first Jesus says "do not fear man who can only destroy the body"  then Jesus says "fear God who can destroy both body and soul in hell" .  People will say,  why did Jesus add the word soul in the second half of the verse?   I think Jesus must simply be referring to God's righteous punishment or correction,  how that its not limited to just the physical body.  

[fullarmor2]

It potentially could be pointing towards annihilation, but personally, I think the entire verse is hypothetical in the first place.  It is true that God is able to do those things, but it doesn't mean he will do those things. I think the first part of the verse means more than the second part, which is, don't fear what other people can do to you, because it can only affect your body, not your soul.  I think Jesus may have wanted to demonstrate that only God has the power to do the things that powerful, but it doesn't really say he 'will' do it.

   Very good point.   That makes a lot a sense.

[FineLinen]

   I think Jesus must simply be referring to God's righteous punishment or correction,  how that its not limited to just the physical body.  

I assure you, my friend, the entire purpose of the judgement of our Father leads to change and transformation. We read in the K.J.V. regarding aionios punishment. The primary meaning of kolasis is correction, followed by penalty and punishment. It is not mindless discipline, but punishment that is corrective in nature. Our Father is the Father of all fathers and His chastisement yields the peaceable fruits of righteousness.

[Taffy]

I assure you, my friend, the entire purpose of the judgement of our Father leads to change and transformation. We read in the K.J.V. regarding aionios punishment. The primary meaning of kolasis is correction, followed by penalty and punishment. It is not mindless discipline, but punishment that is corrective in nature. Our Father is the Father of all fathers and His chastisement yields the peaceable fruits of righteousness.

Amen FL... :icon_flower:

[Pierac]

Here's a little something fun for you to do! Go to your e-sword to check it out.

Did you know the word punishment only occurs once in the N.T.  Yep, they take the word judgement and change it to punishment, damnation, etc...  How does it make you feel knowing the translators felt the need to change judgement into punishment. 

Isa 26:9  At night my soul longs for You, Indeed, my spirit within me seeks You diligently; For when the earth experiences Your judgments The inhabitants of the world learn righteousness.

Isaiah make more sense now.  :thumbsup:

Peace,
Paul

[FineLinen]

Punishment= kovlasiß =

Correction, punishment, penalty.

kovlasiß rooted in kolavzw

kolavzw =

To lop or prune, as trees and wings.

To curb, check, restrain.

To chastise, correct, punish.

To cause to be punished.

English: Correction =

1. Alteration that corrects something: an alteration that removes an error.

2. Written comment on error: something written beside an error in a text to point out what should be there instead.

3. Removal of errors: the removal of errors from something, or the indication of errors in something.

4. Modification to calculation: an adjustment made to a calculation or measurement to compensate for an observed deviation from ideal conditions.

5. Punishment to reform somebody.

6. Punishment, especially when meant to improve or reform the person punished.

7. Rectitude: the act of setting right.

Correction=

HERE

[Jaareshiah]

At Matthew 10:28, Jesus said: "And do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; but rather be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Ge·hen´na." The King James Bible, along several others, incorrectly renders the Greek word Gehenna as "hell". The Greek word Gehenna is from the Hebrew word Geh Hin·nom´, meaning "Valley of Hinnom", which was a deep, narrow valley that lay to the S and SW of ancient Jerusalem and is the modern-day Wadi er-Rababi (Ge Ben Hinnom), and was where the city of Jerusalem disposed of it's garbage or refuge. Gehenna does not mean a place of torment, but rather means eternal destruction. Hence, one consigned to Gehenna after death, will never receive a resurrection to life.

Jesus, in speaking to his newly appointed apostles, said that "a disciple is not above his teacher, nor a slave above his lord." (Matt 10:24) He then tells them not to fear those who are opposers, but rather to go forth and make known what Jesus had taught them concerning the kingdom, saying: "What I tell you in the darkness, say in the light; what you hear whispered, preach from the rooftops."(verse 27)

However, due to possible violent opposition to the message that these were to publish, perhaps resulting in death, Jesus said "not (to) become fearful of those who kill the body, but cannot kill the soul; but rather be in fear of him that can destroy both body and soul in Gehenna."(Matt 10:28) The word "soul" can also mean "life", for the King James Bible, at verse 39, renders the Greek word psy·khe´ as "life", but "soul" at verse 28.

Thus, Jesus told his apostles to not fear anyone who can put them to death, which would not be permanent, but rather "be in fear of him (God) that can destroy both body and soul in Gehenna". If one is judged adversely by God, then upon death, this one has no hope of a resurrection. They are everlastingly destroyed. His "soul" or any hope of a future "life", will never be. On the other hand, those that love God, whose name is Jehovah, and follow his commands, has no reason to fear what man can do to them, even putting some to death. These are guaranteed to receive their "soul" or "life" again, being resurrected from hades, (Greek, commonly translated as "hell") the common grave of mankind.

Jesus said: "If anyone wants to come after me, let him disown himself and pick up his torture stake and continually follow me. For whoever wants to save his soul (or life) will lose it; but whoever loses his soul (or life) for my sake will find it."(Matt 16:24,25) Thus the soul is not immortal and something that separates from the body upon death, but is the person, with all their desires, including their "life" as a person.