Is there a verse?

[micah7:9]

Is there a verse in the Bible that denies or contradicts the verses below? I have not found one. :HeartThrob: :dsunny:
Thanks
1Ti 2:3  For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
1Ti 2:4  Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

[reFORMer]

You must've forgotten those other verses.  You can't trust your own mind.  They're all over the Bible.  Leave these things to the people who are ordained and paid to know the Bible.  You're just a poor student.  The Pastor knows.

[micah7:9]

ok thanks but could you point me in the correct direction please pastor.

[VineBranch]

Can someone please tell me this is all irony on their part.  Please!!

[jabcat]

James (reFORMer) is being [kiddingly] sarcastic.

[micah7:9]

I knew that, and answered as such. :dsunny: I am just wondering that it is so stated in Timothy, should the statement have refutable evidence in scripture and verse that denies it's truth or a scripture or verse that contradicts such, where would it be. Are there any if's, and's, or but's that are added to "Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth." I am just wondering where the denial had it's beginning? Thanks.

[VineBranch]

Thanks Micah, and thanks Jab.

None come to mind.  Intriguing though.  Are you including the Apocrypha as well, or just scripture?

[micah7:9]

From what I understand most study and our proclaims come from the sixty-six books. The Apocrypha, I have read, but isn't that like using 53 cards? Just my opinion. :dsunny:

[VineBranch]

From what I understand most study and our proclaims come from the sixty-six books. The Apocrypha, I have read, but isn't that like using 53 cards? Just my opinion. :dsunny:

NICE ...  Apocrypha as Joker. :icon_jokercolor:

[Lazarus Short]

Now let me get this straight - the OP is asking if the Bible contradicts itself?  Does that question put things into proper focus??

[VineBranch]

Now let me get this straight - the OP is asking if the Bible contradicts itself?  Does that question put things into proper focus??

I'm not sure if it means a contradiction, but I think it might be asking if there is a verse which ... that is to say ... I mean ... well, you know... yes (?).

[Lazarus Short]

um...um...um...um...yeah

[jabcat]

I think I got it!  I think I got it!  :laugh:

I believe micah's point is not whether the Bible contradicts itself, or if any such scriptures really exist.  I think he's saying, "this scripture says everyone will be saved.  Why does mainstream teach otherwise, where do they find their "evidence" in the scriptures to teach such a thing as eternal torment in hell?"   :2c:

[jabcat]

So now that I think about it, I think the first 2 posts were tongue-in-cheek.   :2c:

[VineBranch]

I think I got it!  I think I got it!  :laugh:

I believe micah's point is not whether the Bible contradicts itself, or if any such scriptures really exist.  I think he's saying, "this scripture says everyone will be saved.  Why does mainstream teach otherwise, where do they find their "evidence" in the scriptures to teach such a thing as eternal torment in hell?"   :2c:

But Micah's opening sentence was:  "Is there a verse in the Bible that denies or contradicts the verses below?"  :dunno2:

Is I missin' somat?

[micah7:9]

I think I got it!  I think I got it!  :laugh:

I believe micah's point is not whether the Bible contradicts itself, or if any such scriptures really exist.  I think he's saying, "this scripture says everyone will be saved.  Why does mainstream teach otherwise, where do they find their "evidence" in the scriptures to teach such a thing as eternal torment in hell?"   :2c:

Yup.

[Lazarus Short]

Have we beat this one to death yet?  :bdh: :bdh: :bdh: :bdh: :bdh: :bdh: :bdh: :bdh:

[eaglesway]

Does the Bible agree with itself?
Perhaps those who believe in Hell will go to Hell.

Is what we believe of any consequence at all to what God has planned( I think not)

O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out! For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor? Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again? For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
(Rom 11:33-36)

You would think we would be much more concerned about WHAT REALLY IS than so busy about PROVING OUR POINTS :o)

Oh Well....It is what it is anyway, no matter what we think LOL

[ded2daworld]

A simple explanation. If the words in the Bible don't agree with your doctrine - simply re-interpret.
My ET wife says, "Of course God WILLS all to be saved and come to a knowledge but he doesn't interfere with free will
so God's will is thwarted"  (She said it, not me) :LH:

[eaglesway]

Little god

[VineBranch]

Does the Bible agree with itself?
Perhaps those who believe in Hell will go to Hell.

Is what we believe of any consequence at all to what God has planned( I think not)

O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out! For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor? Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again? For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
(Rom 11:33-36)

You would think we would be much more concerned about WHAT REALLY IS than so busy about PROVING OUR POINTS :o)

Oh Well....It is what it is anyway, no matter what we think LOL

A couple of years ago I told of group of my friends that I come to see:  'It is what it is, the rest is spin.'

[VineBranch]

A simple explanation. If the words in the Bible don't agree with your doctrine - simply re-interpret.
My ET wife says, "Of course God WILLS all to be saved and come to a knowledge but he doesn't interfere with free will
so God's will is thwarted"  (She said it, not me) :LH:

I'm not sure I will be reading the Gospel according to Mrs. ded.  But I've heard the doctrine all my life, and not always with her explanation.  At least she is honest in her assertion that God's will can be thwarted.  Most people I've asked don't talk about the consequences of free-will.

[ded2daworld]

Yeah, her assertion is that BECAUSE God loves us, He will allow us to exercise our free will and NOT choose him with our limited knowledge and warped experiences of what others have said God is. She feels that even though "their eyes have been blinded" that to "force" someone to love you is akin to rape - and we've all heard the ET'ers say that "God is a gentleman". It doesn't say that in my Bible and I'm sure the moneychangers being driven out and pharisees in the temple being driven from it didn't think Jesus was a gentleman. The Lion of Narnia as was said "He is good - but he is dangerous"

[VineBranch]

Yeah, her assertion is that BECAUSE God loves us, He will allow us to exercise our free will and NOT choose him with our limited knowledge and warped experiences of what others have said God is. She feels that even though "their eyes have been blinded" that to "force" someone to love you is akin to rape - and we've all heard the ET'ers say that "God is a gentleman". It doesn't say that in my Bible and I'm sure the moneychangers being driven out and pharisees in the temple being driven from it didn't think Jesus was a gentleman. The Lion of Narnia as was said "He is good - but he is dangerous"

Amen.

I told a woman at work today that I no longer believe in a God who will let me interfere with His universe simply because I feel like it.  I must confess, it felt good to say that ... even better to believe it.

[eaglesway]

To me, the issue is not just that He would allow us to choose destruction. The issue is HOW SMALL IS THIS GOD, HOW IMPOTENT HIS WISDOM AND LOVE, if He cannot persuade man by His Son lifted up on a cross, by the sun rising every morning and the stars twinkling each night, by the rain falling on the just and the unjust, by harvest, by child bearing, by the beauty of creation.

The God of ET is NO GENTLEMAN_ HE IS AN PETTY IMPOTENT WEAKLING WHO CREATED A RACE OF PROGRAMMED LOSERS AND HE CANNOT SHINE BRIGHTLY ENOUGH TO WIN THEM OUT OF DARKNESS.

Marie Antoinette said, "Let'em eat cake!"

ET God says, "Let'em burn!"