Jesus and Jesus Christ

[micah7:9]

My thread "death:an ending" has brought up a question for me (at least the last part of the thread did.) Im sure to be presumed foolish for the question(s.)

Was Jesus, the man, Joseph and Mary's son, just as human as the rest of mankind?
Or was He above all the calamities that fall upon mans human body of flesh?
And if so, in what way could He have related to the human being and his infirmities?
And is getting sick-a cold-cancer-polio- MD- Alziemers- are these caused from sinning?
And is Jesus The Christ different from Jesus the son of Mary and Joseph?

[jabcat]

Holy smokes, micah.  Are you trying to tie my poor brain in a knot?  LOL  :laughing7:

Interesting questions...though I myself may need to go back to some basics - Jesus, Son of God, Savior of the world.

You should get some interesting replies/conjecture though.   :bigGrin:

[Lefein]

He's either Divine, or not.  If he isn't Divine, then our faith is completely vain, and we are all going to fully die. ^_^

[Beloved Servant]

I do not believe that God fertilized one of Mary's eggs.

I believe that Jesus is the second Adam created from the dust of Mary's womb just as the first Adam was created from the dust of the earth.

He is a new Creation.

[Molly]

Was Jesus, the man, Joseph and Mary's son, just as human as the rest of mankind?

Yes.

And if so, in what way could He have related to the human being and his infirmities?

with compassion

And is getting sick-a cold-cancer-polio- MD- Alziemers- are these caused from sinning?

No

And is Jesus The Christ different from Jesus the son of Mary and Joseph?

Yes

[CHB]

I agree with Molly, plus I believe God the Father by the Holy Spirit implanted Jesus in Mary's womb. Mary was a surrogate mother.

CHB

[micah7:9]

Molly and CHB and Jabcat for me are good replys.

[WhiteWings]

Was Jesus, the man, Joseph and Mary's son, just as human as the rest of mankind?

I would say a body just as mankind. But His skill and knowledge where far beyond humankind.

Or was He above all the calamities that fall upon mans human body of flesh?

Surely he felt a lot of pain on the cross.  He was sweating blood in the garden.
For me that are calamities. (I think calamities is an understatement)

And if so, in what way could He have related to the human being and his infirmities?

Micah I think it's a bit like saying: I understand how thirsty people are that are lost in the desert. Or I understand what starvation means (for African children). Yeah, sometimes I'm a little hungry and thirsty. But do I really understand how thristy those people are when I always have enough drinks at home to fill a bathtub? Do I really know what hunger is if I daily throw away 5 pounds of food because again I bought to much?

And is getting sick-a cold-cancer-polio- MD- Alziemers-

Surely all you mentioned is getting sick. But obiously Jesus didn't experience everything. For example He didn't die of a heart attack. I'm still waiting for that 38 stripes post of Cardinal. Somehow I think it's part of the answer.

are these caused from sinning?

I personally have not found a verse that states illness is always punishment for sin.
Sometimes it is. Even saints can get ill. See the story of Job. Father was very pleased with Job. He praised the ways of Job. And  a few verses later he allowed satan to strike Job with illness. So imo the answer is: Sometimes/possible.

And is Jesus The Christ different from Jesus the son of Mary and Joseph?

There is only one Jesus. Or do you mean something else Micah?
Joseph helped to raise Jesus but obviously was not the natural father.
If I quoute Beloved Servant:

I do not believe that God fertilized one of Mary's eggs.

I believe that Jesus is the second Adam created from the dust of Mary's womb just as the first Adam was created from the dust of the earth.

I don't know how it's called in English but a one on one translation of Dutch is: Mary was a carry-mother.
Let's take 2 human woman and 1 male human as an example.
They goto a clinic. The married couple 'gives' semen and an egg to the doctor. The doctor fertilizes the egg and implant it in the other woman.
It's clear who is the father. But who is the mother.....?
Philosophical problem  :winkgrin:

[micah7:9]

I find your input good WW. I have yet to learn the method to take and seperate your statements and give my thoughts, but just as I am learning about my question...in time...in time. :grin:

[micah7:9]

Can we get stuck gathering yesterdays manna and have no desire to move on?

[micah7:9]

My faith in Jesus is not and can not be deminished should the man Jesus have  succumbed to the ills of the flesh in His walk.
He faced the temptation of the the adversary and won, He did not sin.
As a man, in the very body of flesh that all mankind must walk, if the infirmities that cause man to be sick, was above Him, then He really did not bear our sorrows. Does sickness of the flesh have anything to do with sin? If it does we/mankind are but a joke. But I think not.
I love Jesus, He is my Way, He is where I look to overcome these maladys that over take our flesh. It is Chirst in me the hope of Glory. He must have known these things, in a personal matter.

[Molly]

I don't know how it's called in English but a one on one translation of Dutch is: Mary was a carry-mother.
Let's take 2 human woman and 1 male human as an example.
They goto a clinic. The married couple 'gives' semen and an egg to the doctor. The doctor fertilizes the egg and implant it in the other woman.
It's clear who is the father. But who is the mother.....?
Philosophical problem

Mary was a surrogate mother?  Where do you get that, ww?  You mean it wasn't her egg?

[WhiteWings]

I find your input good WW. I have yet to learn the method to take and seperate your statements and give my thoughts, but just as I am learning about my question...in time...in time. :grin:

You are not required to answer everything. Or even one thing. It's your choice how you spend your time :winkgrin:

[micah7:9]

And is getting sick-a cold-cancer-polio- MD- Alziemers-
Surely all you mentioned is getting sick. But obiously Jesus didn't experience everything. For example He didn't die of a heart attack. I'm still waiting for that 38 stripes post of Cardinal. Somehow I think it's part of the answer.

Ive been told that Jesus died of a broken heart, perhaps that wouod suffice a heart attack

[micah7:9]

I find your input good WW. I have yet to learn the method to take and seperate your statements and give my thoughts, but just as I am learning about my question...in time...in time. :grin:

You are not required to answer everything. Or even one thing. It's your choice how you spend your time :winkgrin:

Thanks for that :happy3:

[thinktank]

My thread "death:an ending" has brought up a question for me (at least the last part of the thread did.) Im sure to be presumed foolish for the question(s.)

Was Jesus, the man, Joseph and Mary's son, just as human as the rest of mankind?

Yes , or otherwise he would not waste time going form village to village, he had an urgent job to do but he travelled on foot , due to his physical limitations

Or was He above all the calamities that fall upon mans human body of flesh?
He was above them because he was a holy man and trusted in his father 100% unlike us, who have difficulty trusting the father or Jesus to cure a headache. I belive the more holy one lives their life through Christ then their faith rises automatically because they are close to God. Obeying the commandments makes one close to God according to the scriptures.

And if so, in what way could He have related to the human being and his infirmities?
Getting tired i.e in the ship, when he wanted to sleep and have some rest but the disciples woke him up. Wanting privacy, but the son of man had nowhere to hide his head and the people constantly harrased him, most of them simply wanted a miracle form the miracle man and did not care about him, such as the blind men he cured, only one of them returned to say thank you.
Being a human being with it's limitations? He used to be as God, but now has to be confined in a house of clay, the equivalent is a man becoming a worm, must be a very agonizing experience.
To me Jesus is the second Adam, perfect as Adam was but without sin. In many ways Jesus is what Adam should have been, but where Adam failed Jesus succeeded to avoid all temptations and on top of that defeated sin for all mankind, what a genius.

And is getting sick-a cold-cancer-polio- MD- Alziemers- are these caused from sinning?

Yes and no. The scriptures in the old testament don't mess about, and say clearly that if one sins then one must pay the price, but today when one sins, thanks to Jesus and the prayers of the saints mercy endureth and the curse no longer has such a dramatic effect, but if one continues in sin, then what one sows will reap. But if one is sick, oftentimes it is the sins of others that infect us and unlike Jesus we do not have the faith to believe that we can be cured by the father. Also curses pass from one generation to another as you often hear the same thing from doctors, who call it genes passed down, but where did that deffective gene come from? The bible says that sins causes a curse, so sometimes it is the sins of the forefathers that cause defective genes to pass down from one generation to another and so unlike Jesus who was born free from sin and thus perfect as a human being, people are born with defects but faith is necessary to belive that Jesus defeated the effects of curses, for it is written "cursed is he that hangeth on a tree" He paid the price to defeat curses on that tree also, so having defective genes is an excuse, God can cure them and break the curse.

But I don't know if Jesus and his followers is invincible, i.e if a flu attacks us, would the anointing automatically destroy it or would the flu penetrate and then at this point we excercise the faith and ask the father to cure the flu. So it would be, sneazee, "oh I need to pray" Then Cure happens. "Healthy again"

And is Jesus The Christ different from Jesus the son of Mary and Joseph?

Christ means anointed one. When did he get anointed? At birth I imagine, just like John the baptist, but John had a much more powerful anointing it seems, at that time at least, because he spake as a baby.

I hope I have spoken truth here oh lord Jesus, may your spirit guide us, amen.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Sorry, Micah and WW, but I don't know now where or who said it about the 38. Wish I did.  :sigh:

[WhiteWings]

:cloud9: Sorry, Micah and WW, but I don't know now where or who said it about the 38. Wish I did.  :sigh:

Can you then write down what you remember? Bits and pieces is fine. It makes it easier for me to Google.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: All I remember is, someone quoted a scientist's conclusion about all diseases coming from a root amount, and the person, who was a Christian, noted that it looked to be "related" to the stripes He received.  :dontknow:

[WhiteWings]

This one? http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/146885.html
As you see they speak of 39.
IIRC a Catholic forum/site also "discussed" 39 instead of 38.
I think 38 or 39 doesn't really matter unless there is another relavant hidden meaning in the number itself

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: I'll just share this pertaining the "stripes". I prayed for a woman once and the Spirit showed me a stripe on her heart. I didn't know her, but the Lord said it was "bitterness". I found out later she had had heart surgery, and was bitter over something. So she was bearing the stripe that HE bore for us. Blessings....