Sometimes in christianity faith is made to be our end of the bargain of salvation. We give God faith and he rewards us with salvation. But this is not quite correct, because in a concept like this faith is made like a deed, almost like something from the law.
But instead faith simply means grasping that our salvation has been decided by God already, on the cross, in the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Paul attempted to make this clear in many of his words, but he had to use OT scripture as his material, and in OT scripture the faith things of Christ are not revealed yet so the scriptural material was not as rich as he would have it.
Again, faith does not mean a deed that means so much to God that he would save you. Instead faith taps into the salvation that has already begun, at first in the cross of Christ and then in the life of Christ.
Christ does not mean a change from action things to belief things.Christ means a change from man-focus to a God-focus. Instead of being about what I have done and is thinking (including my faith), it is about what God has done, and is thinking. It is not about my love so much anymore, it is about God's love that loves me and inspires me to love God back. Every event in me of faith and love must be inspired by God's faith and love. He loved us first.
Now there might be someone who expresses no belief in Christ. Since we cannot see Christ we cannot well prove him except by what we have learned, by what we have become in Christ. We ourselves must be little Christ to show what God has made us to be and, most importantly, what God thinks of a man, which are loving and faith and kind thoughts.
What would it mean if God were to hate a man? This is downright senseless that God would hate someone. This big God who created the cosmos and who created us in the wombs of our mothers, why should he hate us? He sent Christ to the cross for us, gave his own son so that we might be saved easily from our sins. We are not innocent but we are declared innocent, not in order to betray truth but to add to truth the loving thoughts of God!
Our faith simply attaches to something that is bigger than our faith. God's free grace and his free love. God looked down on Earth and saw us imprisoned in hatred, sin, evil and hopelessness against the face of death. So he came down and conquered death, and the devil who was a mighty evil angel that had been able to snare us awfully. But Jesus threw him out like it says in John, that it was the judgment that went through the world on the day of vengeance that was Good Friday. Because the devil was really worse than us, even when we were sinful.
And on that Cross Jesus Christ even forgave his murderers. Christ did not love himself on the cross. He did not think of avenging himself. Instead he thought of those who hated him and did not hate them. Instead he said, and he means that for all sinners, "Forgive them, for they know not what they are doing!".
And then, the resurrection! What a wonderful Easter Monday this was. Jesus rose from the dead to show that the forgiveness for all that he had won at the Cross, was not to be a one time thing. He was raised from the dead to show that forgiveness and love were to continue, and if you can trust him, that we humans don't have to fear death anymore and can know that we will live forever in the vast and beautiful realms of Heaven, with this Christ who loves us and has the strength and the love to save us always!
To know these things is faith, and it is more that this faith is part of salvation than that this faith causes salvation. We can know that everyone will find this faith eventually because the salvation of God will not rest until someone has this faith and can bow his knees to God and recognize his lordship. God is a righteous king who wants an earned lordship. He gives us salvation, so we can have faith!
God bless you!
edit - from http://christianity.livejournal.com/4226978.html
Beautiful. After reading this and thinking about when Jesus would say to his disciples 'Oh Ye of little faith' it really gives a rich meaning. After He rose again,could they really grasp what faith is.
I don't think people have a problem with having faith in God albeit in the wrong things but rather lack of faith in what God is doing. The most asked question is how can a loving God allow or cause all the evil in the world. Like Peter they don't understand that good and evil is a part of Gods love. Since we don't know the end from the beginning we need to have faith that God is on our side despite what we do. We must have faith that God is responsible for all things and everything that happens good or bad is not a mistake. Nothing is random.
:2c:
But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them. (Ephesians 2:4-10)
Got to love Ephesians! :dsunny:
Quote from: Aerex on October 01, 2015, 04:20:49 PM
I don't think people have a problem with having faith in God albeit in the wrong things but rather lack of faith in what God is doing. The most asked question is how can a loving God allow or cause all the evil in the world. Like Peter they don't understand that good and evil is a part of Gods love. Since we don't know the end from the beginning we need to have faith that God is on our side despite what we do. We must have faith that God is responsible for all things and everything that happens good or bad is not a mistake. Nothing is random.
:2c:
hi when I hear that question "why does God allow suffering and evil?" (If He's so Good.. is the implication..) I tell them (even tho choice is SO VERY limited) God could have instead never formed/created ever, any rational creatures. Why do I say that? Because with thinking ability comes, sooner or later the ability to make choices. My short answer to them is.. He could, instead have made us to be robots.
:dsunny: :cloud9: :cloud9:
I have recently begun to see that evil in this world is allowed by God (he knew what was going to happen, did he not?) to teach us what to is like to live a part from God.
From http://concordant.org/expohtml/TheProblemOfEvil/evil002.html
"Sin has an essential, though transient, part in God's purpose. God made due preparation for it before it came. The Lamb was slain from the disruption of the world. Creation may reveal some aspects of God's power and wisdom, but His love can be displayed only where sin has sown the seeds of hate. There can be no Saviour apart from sin. There can be no reconciliation apart from enmity. God locks up all in stubbornness in order that He may be merciful to all.
Shall God's affections remain forever pent up in His own bosom? Shall He never taste the sweet response of love? Then all He needs is a perfect universe, where His creatures have no need of Him and His gracious ministrations. But if He wants the deep satisfaction of requited love, and desires to impart to His creatures the delicious sense of His fatherly affection, then there must be distance, distress and condemnation, to form the field for the exercise of His favor.
Since sin must enter this scene and play its part, since it is essential to God's purpose, and absolutely under His control; since it will eventually change the universe from cold, independent creatures into a loving family circle, and God from a distant Creator into an affectionate Father, it was by no means a mistake (or sin) on God's part when he created a creature who should not only sin but should scatter it in all creation."
Quote from: GodIsLove on October 02, 2015, 05:07:17 AM
I have recently begun to see that evil in this world is allowed by God (he knew what was going to happen, did he not?) to teach us what to is like to live a part from God.
From http://concordant.org/expohtml/TheProblemOfEvil/evil002.html
"Sin has an essential, though transient, part in God's purpose. God made due preparation for it before it came. The Lamb was slain from the disruption of the world. Creation may reveal some aspects of God's power and wisdom, but His love can be displayed only where sin has sown the seeds of hate. There can be no Saviour apart from sin. There can be no reconciliation apart from enmity. God locks up all in stubbornness in order that He may be merciful to all.
Shall God's affections remain forever pent up in His own bosom? Shall He never taste the sweet response of love? Then all He needs is a perfect universe, where His creatures have no need of Him and His gracious ministrations. But if He wants the deep satisfaction of requited love, and desires to impart to His creatures the delicious sense of His fatherly affection, then there must be distance, distress and condemnation, to form the field for the exercise of His favor.
Since sin must enter this scene and play its part, since it is essential to God's purpose, and absolutely under His control; since it will eventually change the universe from cold, independent creatures into a loving family circle, and God from a distant Creator into an affectionate Father, it was by no means a mistake (or sin) on God's part when he created a creature who should not only sin but should scatter it in all creation."
That's very interesting.. I agree with most of it but perhaps in a slightly different shade, as sin being imperfection, and the Greek used for "sin" means to "miss the mark". I can't help but see it as the Father had basically two options. Create rational creatures. or never create rational creatures.. ever?
It seems to me, with thinking ability, sooner or later someone, somewhere and sometime, is bound to "think".. say... do we really have to do all things God's way? (Including in thought, word and deed.) So I guess this is what imo occurred in the adversary, which i do believe is fallen/imperfect, now evil, Lucifer, that olde dragon and serpent (rev 12).
And it seems logical to me that every rational creature, sooner or later will wander from God in thought , word or deed.. I had a series of questions, or actually two.. which my son had asked me when he was 16, about 19 years ago. He asked me "why was the tree of knowing good and evil in the garden?" and "Isn't it great we get to be an ant farm?"
I wasn't all that happy with my answers so i prayed for better answers, and the answers came back to me sort of like "bang, bang, bang! :smile: And they ended with a question, I felt the HS (presence of the Father) was asking me! "Why did God wait so
very long, creating the universe and man and woman, not only after the first (bound to occur) rebel thought occurred, but it had matured into outright deceit, sedition and trickery? (Didn't He know what would happen? :laughing7: We are absolutely agreed here.. of course He did!)
When endowing thinking ability, a whole new world (or tree) of possibilities 'came to be', and God only able to be honest, there was that tree in the original garden.
I won't type any more.. as I've already typed a whole bunch :laughing7: But the reason He waited so long - I think of it as long because with 'only' the Father, son and angels, it just seems there wouldn't be all that much to go astray about.. so patiently waited long, so all of us, in heaven and earth would take this unavoidable journey and lesson all together, instead of one rational creature wandering away now, another later, and another later, and so on and on, virtually taking 'for ever'.. The answers knocked my socks off. He is writing, deeply engraving on every heart and psyche the understanding of good from evil (life from death, nonlife - He being both Life and Perfection, thus imperfect is the opposite of life - hence He built the rescue in from the foundation/'beginning')
:Peace2: Peace! And God bless! :smile:
We are still just clay. Yeah we may be rational beings that think but so do computers and no sane person would say that computers generate original thought. IMO to believe that you are in control of your actions and thoughts is as equivalent in believing in the big bang --- it just happened.
So you cant say the creature ran away from God because the creature is exactly where God wants it to be.
"...so patiently waited long, so all of us, in heaven and earth would take this unavoidable journey and lesson all together, instead of one rational creature wandering away now, another later, and another later, and so on and on, virtually taking 'for ever'.. The answers knocked my socks off. He is writing, deeply engraving on every heart and psyche the understanding of good from evil (life from death, nonlife - He being both Life and Perfection, thus imperfect is the opposite of life - hence He built the rescue in from the foundation/'beginning') "
Yes!! This part really spoke to me! I totally agree :)
To me, the key point of the whole scenario is the question; " Whose faith do we live by?"
I used to attempt to live by my faith. Never really satisfied my mind or emotions. Always had in the back of the mind the question have I got enough faith to be saved? Will I ever lose that faith? Have I got enough faith to be useful?
Paul makes a key point in Gal 2;20 where he states that " it is no longer him but Christ".
Also when he says, " For me to live is Christ".
I now hold up the faith of knowing protection comes from the shield of faith; which is what Christ's faith and life/death on the cross, plus resurrection, has done for me.
So faith, to me, is what Christ has done for me;
HIS FAITH;
which I appreciate more and more when seeing what He went through and did for me and for all mankind.
Taking up the cross, for me, is putting to death personal effort.
Would seem pointless if it were not for the real detail our Father and Christ had planned from before the world began.