This is the most misunderstood passage in the Bible.
This is also the most misused passage in the Bible by non-believers who use it (blasphemously of course)
as justification for doing whatever sinful and vile actions they wish.
How do you answer this? Can this be answered?
God Bless.
There is self-righteous judgment that says: Look what they do.
There is righteous judgment that says: I will not do that.
God's judgments are loving corrections.
But is it wrong to say: It is wrong what they do?
God Bless
We all have enough fires burning in our own Gehenna.
Why watch someone else's life go up in smoke when your own house is burning.
So if someone is murdering another you stand by and remove the "log from your own eye"?
Of course not.
It is really easy to show how this passage is mis-interpreted.
The best explanation I have ever heard is judge not, lest ye also be judged (in the same manner),
which essentially means don't be a hypocrite.
God Bless.
How I've personally been able to reconcile this within myself is, I not only am allowed to, but required to, be aware of "the fruit" and what the scriptures say about it. Whether it's my life or someone else's. However, whenever possible (active murder's probably an exception :mblush:) not "condemn", as in be negatively critical, being harsh with my words, tell someone they're not a child of God, etc. (in essence, "judging").
I basically believe it's my place to present what I understand the scriptures to say, encourage someone to look at it, then if possible, leave it between them and God - for Him to work His work in their life, and them face the consequences for themselves. Just as I will do. :2c:
Quote...which essentially means don't be a hypocrite.
And, also judge righteously? which would include mercy?
Yep. I've got enough stubble in my own life to be too overly concerned with someone else's.
Judge not, that you be not judged.
For with what judgment you judge, you shall be judged: and with what measure you mete, it shall be measured to you again.
And why look at the mote that is in your brother's eye, but consider not the beam that is in your own eye?
Or how will you say to your brother, Let me pull the mote out of your eye; and behold, a beam is in your own eye?
"You hypocrite, first cast the beam out of your own eye; and then you shall see clearly to cast the mote out of your brother's eye."
Jesus corrected the religious leaders of his day, not for judging; but for NOT using good judgment.
It takes wisdom, discernment, and the exercise of truth to Judge righteously.
peacemaker
Thank you all for your responses. They really helped.
I have a real problem with non-believers, and some believers essentially "silencing" all statements regarding their evil acts by blasphemously claiming that we cannot judge.
Of course, God has already judged them, as he has us all.
Eventually, all will come through Christ to God, it's just a question of time.
God Bless
Quote from: jabcat on July 28, 2010, 07:34:53 AM
I not only am allowed to, but required to, be aware of "the fruit" and what the scriptures say about it. Whether it's my life or someone else's. However, whenever possible (active murder's probably an exception :mblush:) "condemn", as in be negatively critical, being harsh with my words, tell someone they're not a child of God, etc. (in essence, "judging").
I basically believe it's my place to present what I understand the scriptures to say, encourage someone to look at it, then if possible, leave it between them and God - for Him to work His work in their life, and them face the consequences for themselves. Just as I will do. :2c:
I very much agree with your post. My judging of others is not in condemnation, but for discernment.
Quote from: peacemaker on July 28, 2010, 09:18:56 AM
Jesus corrected the religious leaders of his day, not for judging; but for NOT using good judgment.
It takes wisdom, discernment, and the exercise of truth to Judge righteously.
peacemaker
Thanks peacemaker.
That blessed me.
:cloud9: Amen, peacemaker..... :thumbsup:
Me and the Lord have been working on my beam(trying to get it out) for a long time. My beams so big I can look past it and see the mote in my brothers eye and actually point it out to him!
Christ in me the hope.....!
Yeah . . .I'm still not quite swallowing all of this yet . . .unless you can answer this . .
Why did Jesus never pull Judas aside and "instruct" him on how a "good" treasurer should handle other people's money? Why is it we never saw anywhere in Scripture where Jesus threatened Judas that he'd have to step down as a disciple because he was being a bad representative? Did Jesus not have every right to share with Judas his point of view?
I get the feeling, when one asks "would you stop a murder from taking place or just let it go cuz you don't want to judge?" it is sort of an unanswerable question because the premise is judgment has to take place before intervention can happen. I think defining judgment should be addressed before putting a question such as that out there.
For me, judging and judgment of another carries with it a heavy dose of condemnation. For example, I'm an archer, and before making a shot, I "judge" the distance. It's an assessment, not an enforced verdict on anything. Peter used the term "perceive". There is no condemnation, simply an educated conclusion based on the circumstances presented.
Now, if I see another walking astray, the fact that I believe they're astray is evidence I've already judged them . .no condemnation, just guaged where they are in the Lord. The question then arises, is my judgment accurate or is it inaccurate? What am I basing my conclusions on? Is it because of what they are doing? If it is, then "that" would raise the question, how many times has someone else seen "me" acting inappropriately? Did that mean "I" am no longer a child of God now?
Even if I'm accurate, what's the most effective way of getting them to turn around? Do I think that they don't already know they're going the wrong way? Or would it be more beneficial for both of us if I went to the Lord in prayer and prayed over them rather than going directly to them and point out what they already know?
It's one thing to point out to another where they went wrong if they came and asked for your POV. But for me, it's a whole other matter when I take it upon myself to go to them and without any invitation on their part, tell them that they need to do this or that. Be it in love or not, is there any one of us that can proclaim that we don't have at least a log or two in our own eyes that we should be more concernced about? Rather than assuming the role of the Holy Spirit by trying to convict others of the speck in their eye?
As hard as it is, I think Jesus let Judas carry on with his own greed because until Judas was willing to be changed, Jesus wouldn't change him. Rather than force him to change against his will on the outside, Jesus paid the price in full and changed the order of authority for all men on the inside.
If you ask me, then I'll advise you. if you don't, then I'll pray that God also gives you the strength to endure the consequences you've set up for yourself to experience.
Quote from: Beloved Servant on July 28, 2010, 07:25:38 AM
We all have enough fires burning in our own Gehenna.
Why watch someone else's life go up in smoke when your own house is burning.
I like that. And agree.
Quote from: sanguine on July 28, 2010, 07:29:43 AM
So if someone is murdering another you stand by and remove the "log from your own eye"?
Of course not.
It is really easy to show how this passage is mis-interpreted.
The best explanation I have ever heard is judge not, lest ye also be judged (in the same manner),
which essentially means don't be a hypocrite.
God Bless.
I think you probably understand the difference in legal judgment and gossip. For civilization to exist we need laws...therefore judgment. To judge within our legal system (ie murder) is essential and productive for mankind. To call the woman down the street a whore because she is bedding another woman's husband isn't productive or essential. When/if you judge...ask yourself a couple questions:
-What good will come from my judgment?
-Why am I judging?
Most of the time the answers are...None and because it makes me feel better about myself.
Shawn, your last line . . .it is very ugly, but I so believe that it is also exactly true. Hard to admit when you've convinced yourself you're doing what you're doing out of love. But you've asked a great question and have answered it maturely as well. Awesome.
Having said all of that, this is not to say that I don't still do it on occasion . . .I wonder how many times I've done it by reflex without even being aware I'm doing it. May God's grace abound.
Quote from: Nathan on July 28, 2010, 07:56:18 PM
Shawn, your last line . . .it is very ugly, but I so believe that it is also exactly true. Hard to admit when you've convinced yourself you're doing what you're doing out of love. But you've asked a great question and have answered it maturely as well. Awesome.
Having said all of that, this is not to say that I don't still do it on occasion . . .I wonder how many times I've done it by reflex without even being aware I'm doing it. May God's grace abound.
Nathan, I am as guilty as the next man when it comes to judging. It is indeed ugly, true and I know because I have been guilty of it. God is still working on me.
Mat 7:1 `Judge not, that ye may not be judged,
G2919
κρίνω
krinō
kree'-no
Properly to distinguish, that is, decide (mentally or judicially); by implication to try, condemn, punish: - avenge, conclude, condemn, damn, decree, determine, esteem, judge, go to (sue at the) law, ordain, call in question, sentence to, think.
Jesus said
I judge no man, but there is one who judges, my word, shall judge him at the last day
But yet Jesus did make judgments, he said to the pharisses "hypocrites, ya den of vipers"
The best explanation I have ever heard is judge not, lest ye also be judged
I don't see judging as evil, unless one makes it their business to condemn others as the pharisses did.
But people tent to judge peoples appearance and so on , I don't think the act of not approving the clothes, job is the evil but rather the act of looking down, disrespecting and downgrading the person and not treating them as an individual because of the way they look or their status etc is the real evil.
So I think if a person, says oh I don't like your hairstyle, but despite that I will treat you with respect and dignity, then that is good.
"The last day, comes sooner than we think; judge not."
:cloud9: There is no righteous judgment possible, apart from His Spirit. Because: remember the tree was the tree of the knowledge of GOOD and evil. Good will bring death to you just as well as evil, if it's not in His perfect will.
This is a difficult concept to get ahold of, but we never know what God is doing in ANY situation, unless He makes a point of telling us, therefore we can interfere with the best of intentions. My :2c: Blessings...
Yes, Card, it happens everyday.
I can't think about this topic without thinking about what Paul said "I care very little if I am judged by you or by any human court; indeed, I do not even judge myself. My conscience is clear, but that does not make me innocent. It is the Lord who judges me. Therefore judge nothing before the appointed time; wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men's hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God." 1 Cor 4
Only God knows a persons life from the end to the beginning, knows their inner thoughts, knows even how their brain was formed in the womb and what tendencies or struggles they will have programmed into them from birth. Only He can judge accurately. We can look at behavior but not the heart, except by revelation.
I have enough trouble judging my own thoughts and motives let alone someone elses.
Ultimately what good is our judgment? What is it's purpose? Paul wrote what is above but then laid down a lot of black and white standards for people and made judgments.
I'll tell you what, I won't judge you for judging. How about that? But if you judge me I might just not hang around you much because I'm pretty much screwed without God's grace.
I saw this verse by Paul
1 corinthians 5:9-13
So I think some kind of judgment is necessary, but you could argue that Paul is proven to be in christ and can therefore excercise rightous judgment :dontknow:
:cloud9: Paul said he prayed in the Spirit more than them all, so I'm pretty sure that wasn't for naught, and He revealed things to him that needed judged by His Spirit. Blessings...