Deuteronomy 4:10 "Remember the day you stood before the LORD your God at Horeb, when the LORD said to me, 'Assemble the people to Me, that I may let them hear My words so they may learn to fear Me all the days they live on the earth, and that they may teach their children.'
This is when God handed out the law, and fear was attached to this... a spirit of fear was given them... but for what end?
Deuteronomy 5:29 "Oh that they had such a heart in them, that they would fear Me and keep all My commandments always, that it may be well with them and with their sons forever!"
Hmmm, so that by following the law they would have wellness.
Deuteronomy 6:2 "so that you and your son and your grandson might fear the LORD your God, to keep all His statutes and His commandments which I command you, all the days of your life, and that your days may be prolonged."
Again to have long life.... but there is a continual connection to keeping the law... that the fear would cause them to keep the law so that they would inherit goodness from the law... cause as we all know that failing to keep the law is "curse and punishment", definatley a fearful thing.
Deuteronomy 6:24 "So the LORD commanded us to observe all these statutes, to fear the LORD our God for our good always and for our survival, as it is today."
Deuteronomy 8:6 "Therefore, you shall keep the commandments of the LORD your God, to walk in His ways and to fear Him."
When the Old Covenant system of the dutieness of the law came into power and authority man was compelled by fear to do that which was right otherwise he would be punished...
Romans 13:1 "For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad."
But for those in Christ...
Romans 7:1 "Or do you not know, brothers—for I am speaking to those who know the law—that the law is binding on a person only as long as he lives?
7:4 Likewise, my brothers, you also have died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you may belong to another, to him who has been raised from the dead, in order that we may bear fruit for God.
Romans 4:15 "For the law brings wrath, but where there is no law there is no transgression."
Fear is qualifed specifically be Jesus also...
John 3:19 "And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil. 20 For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, for fear his works should be exposed. 21 But whoever does what is true comes to the light, so that it may be clearly seen that his works have been carried out in God."
Genesis 3:8And they heard the sound of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and the man and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God among the trees of the garden."
Genesis 3:10 "And he said, "I heard the sound of you in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked, and I hid myself."
Right from the beginning man's ability, rather their inability to be as God by deed caused fear, an actual fear not a reverance but a fright. This fright caused man to hide from God, from their justly due punishment.
But Chirst taking us to the grave allowed us freedom through death to the law that brought fear of judgement... and thus because of the great love with which he loved us we saw in Him love perfected in that in His forbarence He passed over sins previously comminted. So that it is true...
Romans 8:15 "For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, "Abba! Father!"
1 John 4:18 "There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love."
There is no fear for those who have come into the love of Christ, there cant be fear, because His love has removed it!
Good post :thumbsup:
Another reason there is no fear, at least for me, is because I am in Christ. God sees Christ when He sees me. Even with all my problems God sees Christ in all His perfect righteousness!
Jesus said 'if you love me,you will obey my commands"
[John 14;15 ] we obey out of love,not fear.
if we fail,,we confess to Him..and he forgives us.
One of His commands,'Love your brother as yourself"
Above all,Love each other intensely,because love covers over
a multitude of sins 1Peter 4;8
Quote from: Tony N on February 07, 2009, 01:26:35 AM
Another reason there is no fear, at least for me, is because I am in Christ. God sees Christ when He sees me. Even with all my problems God sees Christ in all His perfect righteousness!
Yup!!! This is the very reason why we say that it's impossible for you to sin . . .God doesn't see the sin . . .all he sees is the life of his Son in us!
Quote from: Nathan on February 08, 2009, 03:18:32 AM
Quote from: Tony N on February 07, 2009, 01:26:35 AM
Another reason there is no fear, at least for me, is because I am in Christ. God sees Christ when He sees me. Even with all my problems God sees Christ in all His perfect righteousness!
Yup!!! This is the very reason why we say that it's impossible for you to sin . . .God doesn't see the sin . . .all he sees is the life of his Son in us!
I'm really not being a wise guy by asking this question...it's honest exploration. I've been contemplating this, the "it's no longer I that sin, but the sin that dwells in me" issue...So my question for you both is; do you confess your sins/ask for forgiveness as you realize you've sinned? I.e., do you feel convicted, and if so, then what do you do? I've got another thought or two on this, but a step at a time...thanks
With conviction, comes repentance . . . or at least an effort to repent . . .because with conviction, comes the power and strength to repent . .which to me means . . .KNOCK IT OFF . . . or stop being this way or that . . .or . . .don't be doing that anymore . . .repentence isn't about saying your sorry for every little issue you mess up . . .it's about being obedient to turn around when the voice within you says to turn around. In the mean time . . .
Zechariah 4:7
Who art thou, O great mountain? before Zerubbabel thou shalt become a plain: and he shall bring forth the headstone thereof with shoutings, crying, Grace, grace unto it
OK, that's part of what I've been thinking about...more of an attitude of recognition and admission (confessing...agreeing with God that it's sin) then submitting to His ways...which brings me to this...wrt "knocking it off"...I'm often (usually) not really able to do that...it works better if I turn to Him and sort of release it to Him, letting Him work it through me...again, yielding, agreeing...otherwise, I'm more so "turning over a new leaf"/trying to do it in my own effort/strength... from knowing you on here, I'm guessing that's also more what you mean?
Some things are harder for me to knock off than others . . .the harder ones are when I continue to screw it up but don't get mad at myself for being human . . . it's a process . . .but it's like you said . . .when I just let go . .and this may sound provocative, I don't mean for it to, but seriously . . .in those areas of my weakness . . . I stopped trying to fight them . . .
I stopped trying to defend myself against them . . .when they were there, especially early on . . .I would act on them and move on . . . but here's the thing . . .the less I fought them, the less they reoccurred in me. Once I realized it wasn't a big a deal as I was making them out to be . . . the desire to act on them really got less and less.
Thus, the releasing you're referring to. I just quit trying to overcome it on my own . . . and that even meant giving into the flesh . . .but . . .I never stopped pursuing the spirit and "that's" what gave me the ability to be free from the bondages that I once thought I was going to hell for . .and even at one time accepted them to be that thorn that God purposefully put in me to keep me grounded in him . .and it worked.
I think people truly throw out the baby with the bath water . .they not only give up trying to resist their fleshly desires . .but they give up on their pursuit of Christ as well . . .and that only leads to disaster. But it was "because" of Christ that I stopped trying to control my flesh . . . it's so much more effective that way. But again . . .I can't stress this enough . . the key is not giving into the flesh as much as it is . . .continue pursuing Christ . .which means ignore the accusations within you telling you you're a fake, your not worthy, Scripture only pertains to those who are holy . . .all of that. Because that is the voice of a defeatist . . . not one of soverignty.
Yep, that makes a lot of sense. I think sometimes God shows us our flesh so we can realize how helpless and hopeless we are without looking to Him and depending on His mercy, strength and grace. I was thinking today how much my flesh "stinks" (not for need of a shower, the other way)...I didn't murder anyone today, or even want to...still, you know, all those "un-Christian" thoughts and attitudes, all that I am without Jesus. I really got the sense God was just showing me...it just won't work without looking to and depending on Him...and spending all my time staring at that stinking flesh is looking in the wrong direction...Paul mentioned it, but his focus was on the "Who shall deliver me", wasn't it?