A Definitive Scripture for the Salvation of All

[Tony N]

"seeing that out of Him
and through Him
and for Him is all:
to Him be the glory
for the eons! Amen!"
Romans 11:36

Everything and everybody that came out of Him is going to end up going into Him.

The third line above "and for Him is all" is literally "and into Him is all."
Everyone is going to be for God.

Is this not wonderful?

[martincisneros]

And then there's the parable where the Lord takes a little bit of heat for paying His 11th hour workers the same as He's paid those that had worked all day, which could mean several things, including those that die early but did His will getting the same type of reward as some of these folks throughout the centuries in Biblical times and supposedly during the Church age as well that lived to be 140 - 160 years old.  Our Lord's simple reply is "Can't I do what I want with what's mine??" 

Arminianism and Calvinism are usually quick to say "no" because either man's demension of choice is the empowerment to eternally damn himself (which I've often likened to the image of an abusive parent that would allow their todler to play with a loaded shotgun, remembering that todlers are notorious for everything going in their mouths), or that somehow God has some purpose in damnation that's either equal to or more important than His purpose in salvation.  His glory and/or holiness (depending on one's understanding of the two since some erroneously make 'em synonymous) being at stake is usually the famous charge.  So, either God is glorified in the damnation of the irreverent or His holiness is at stake if He doesn't have the flames of Hell (literal or emotional flames) cannibalizing people's bodies or souls for all of eternity.

But our Lord implies this radical concept in His parable that He can do what He wants with what's His.  Ezekiel 18:4 says that all souls are His.  And although people could try to argue with the Ezekiel passage and try to say that all of His watchmen are His or that just all of Israel are His, or that in the context of judgment that He can do whatever He wants to whomever He wants, to me, there's no getting around the word "ransom" in 1Timothy 2 since words like atonement and reconciliation have been so brutalized by the man of sin, St. Augustine, and the rest of the seed of the serpent.  But, we have a ransom for all that's [evidently and manifestly] already been paid with such brutality "to the uttermost farthing" to where absolutely no part of Jesus' spirit, soul, and body was "safe" from what happened at the Cross.

And then the passages that make the work of Christ greater than the first Adam, as well as the passages that indicate peace having been made for all seen and unseen principalities and powers through the Blood of His Cross are equally as weighty for me.  Had the Bible intended the doctrine of eternal punishment, then why go all of the way back to Adam rather than simply leaving it at a claim for salvation for all who manifest the faith of Abraham?  Abraham is mentioned by St. Paul as the father of all believers, but not in a sense that limits the work of Christ at the Cross. 

Were it only for the triumphant overcomers, then having limited it to the typology of Abraham or David would have sufficed.  But when He took this all of the way back to Adam and beyond with peace even being made for all seen and unseen principalities and powers in Colossians 1:15-20, then whether or not someone would try to limit the passage you've brought up from Romans 11 to His work in true Israel and in the Church or narrower still to His work in the Church at Rome, then all of these other things regarding the salvation of Adam and seen and unseen principalities and powers, plus His having been a ransom for all must still be disproven by the eternal separationists, whether their argument is unending conscious separation and ruin or unending total annihilation.

I find it odd that some find the case for UR inconclusive when all that's necessary to prove is that the punishments aren't eternal, the exclusionary language of the last chapter of Revelation isn't the final word, and that the promises of restoration and of God's Heart being moved in a redemptive way is actually equally intended for all with language in the promises that leave no one out -- whatever must happen in the interim regarding His handling of national ills and all of the nonsense of religion, of the flesh, and of economic woe.  It seems like the number one stumbling block for people is confusing passages regarding "the process" with the ultimate end results.  Hebrews 9:27 is divorced by many from being contextually about comparing the High Priestly ministry of Christ with the High Priestly ministry of Israel that as Israel's High Priest figuratively died in his sacrifice and Israel was judged based on that, that likewise it was appointed for Christ to die once and then to bring salvation to those that were expecting it.

When Old Testament Israel expected salvation via the work of their High Priest, they weren't expecting the exclusion of anyone from their nation from that process.  The fact that you and I expect this salvation for ourselves in the United States is Biblically supposed to be an expectation on our parts for the salvation of the entirety of the United States.  Not exclusively for the United States, but minimally for our entire nation in the implication of Hebrews 9 that salvation was brought to Old Testament Israel for those that were expecting it.  Those that were taught right were expecting a national salvation. 

The same implication is there for us that the salvation of the one in any area is a foretaste of the salvation of everyone in that region.  That's likely what the language in Acts 1 is supposed to mean with the Gospel going to Jerusalem, Judea, Sumeria, and to the uttermost parts of the earth.  All of us that are experiencing God's salvation on a daily basis form a web that covers the whole earth and everyone that's not yet experienced God's salvation is caught in the webbing of the promise of all that God's doing in our lives for Abraham's sake as heir of the world.  That's the reason for all present suffering: the just for the unjust, as it says in St. Peter's writing.  From the moment we're seated with Christ in Ephesians, we're Kings and Priests for the rest of the duration that Christ is King and Priest.  In that language of our being Kings and Priests is the implication that what befalls us from the Hand of God befalls everyone else in our jurisdiction, particularly if that's what Christ's Kingship and High Priestly ministry mean to us who believe.

I'm deeply surprised that Pentecostals in particular don't catch on to this any quicker than they do with their beliefs [and frequent emphasis] regarding intercessory prayer, standing in the gap, one prayer warrior can make the difference for a whole nation, just a handful of righteous souls and Sodom and Gomorrah would have remained to the present day, one person being saved has the promise of household salvation, etc.  Believe on the Lord Jesus and you'll be saved, you and your house.  How big is a house in Scripture?  Was the house of David 3 to 5 people?  Or do we find a multitude being implicit with that?  I guess it comes down to people not believing that Jesus is Lord of the dead as well, or the assumption that His Lordship in this world means salvation, but turns to damnation in another world though He's supposed to be the same yesterday, today, and forever (according to the KJV rendering) though more properly it would be "to the age" with the implication being until 1Corinthians 15:28, which alone is when His services as deliverer, judge, restorer, and repairer of the breach will no longer be needed.

[sheila]

    He has created all from His substance. The chair I am sitting

in...materialized..is of His substance...as is ALL the seen and

unseen creation.

    He used to go to and fro in great emptiness...and there was

nothing but Him. He took thought and counsel with Himself

and created everything from His own substance


   Secrets of Enoch 24;4


   He has merely to turn His face away...and all would be

dissolved back into Himself...but then He would be ALONE

  and if it is not good for Adam to be alone...created in the

image of God..it is NOT GOOD FOR GOD TO BE ALONE


   and so.. He has and is creating a family...progency of

  Himself. and is populating the eternal HEAVENS...and

has many things laid up for His children..Prepared

  beforehand.


    Just as He prepared the earth and then Adam..and placed

   him in a garden He had planted beforehand

[SpiritDriven]

Isaiah 45:23

"I have sworn by Myself, The word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness And will not turn back, That to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance

Crikey!....he has sworn by himself over the matter.......

Glory be to God !

[jabcat]

Isaiah 45:23

"I have sworn by Myself, The word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness And will not turn back, That to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance

Crikey!....he has sworn by himself over the matter.......

Glory be to God !

Agreed!  Very good!

[Tony N]

Isaiah 45:23

"I have sworn by Myself, The word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness And will not turn back, That to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance

Crikey!....he has sworn by himself over the matter.......

Glory be to God !

Very good, SpiritDriven. And Philippians 2:8-11 is the outcome of that which God swears by Himself:

"and, being found in fashion as a human,
He humbles Himself, becoming obedient unto death,
even the death of the cross." 
(9)  Wherefore, also, God highly exalts Him, and graces Him
with the name that is above every name, 
(10)  that in the name of Jesus every knee should be bowing,
celestial and terrestrial and subterranean, 
(11)  and every tongue should be acclaiming that Jesus Christ is Lord,
for the glory of God, the Father." (Philippians 2:8-11).

"No one can say "Jesus is Lord" but by Holy Spirit" (1 Cor.12:3) therefore all mankind must be filled with the holy spirit in that future day!

Maybe the above is when "God is All in all" (1 Cor.15:28)?

[IceDash]

Isaiah 45:23

"I have sworn by Myself, The word has gone forth from My mouth in righteousness And will not turn back, That to Me every knee will bow, every tongue will swear allegiance

Crikey!....he has sworn by himself over the matter.......

Glory be to God !

Very good, SpiritDriven. And Philippians 2:8-11 is the outcome of that which God swears by Himself:

"and, being found in fashion as a human,
He humbles Himself, becoming obedient unto death,
even the death of the cross." 
(9)  Wherefore, also, God highly exalts Him, and graces Him
with the name that is above every name, 
(10)  that in the name of Jesus every knee should be bowing,
celestial and terrestrial and subterranean, 
(11)  and every tongue should be acclaiming that Jesus Christ is Lord,
for the glory of God, the Father." (Philippians 2:8-11).

"No one can say "Jesus is Lord" but by Holy Spirit" (1 Cor.12:3) therefore all mankind must be filled with the holy spirit in that future day!

Maybe the above is when "God is All in all" (1 Cor.15:28)?

that's the problem with hellfire preacher today, they said that only people with the holy spirit can said jesus is lord, the preacher think they are filled with holy spirit and they allow to do God's will, that's why.

[sparrow]

I just have to say..
I LOVE this thread.
:happy3:

Tony N, great verse! I love it.

[CHB]

Hi All,

Wouldn't it be great if all of these verses could be written in book form and distributed to the world?

Here is another one.

(Rev. 5:13) And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sittith upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for the ages.

Now why would every creature praise, honor, give glory, and power to someone who is going to cook them for all ages without end?

CHB 

[WhiteWings]

Hi All,

Wouldn't it be great if all of these verses could be written in book form and distributed to the world?

Here is another one.

(Rev. 5:13)heaven, and on the earth, and such as are in the sea,

On not inside where hell is supposed to be. Or according to some inside the sun.

[sven]

something came in my mind in the gospel of John

John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

John 6:44

No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 12:32

And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

what do you think?

[CHB]

something came in my mind in the gospel of John

John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

John 6:44

No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 12:32

And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

what do you think?

Sounds to me like it is all up to God. :happy3:

CHB

[SpiritDriven]

something came in my mind in the gospel of John

John 14:6

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

John 6:44

No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 12:32

And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.

what do you think?

Hi Sven...

Dont Ya just Love the words that God chose to be used...!

Was it Wooo.... ? was it Coax ?

Nope....it was draw...To cause to move after or toward one by applying continuous force; drag:

Glory be to God!

[Tony N]

That's right SpiritDriven.
When one draws the sword they don't ask the sword "allow me to draw you, pretty please?"

When the disciples would draw their net they didn't make an altar call for the fish to "come as thou art, without one plea" to the net. And the net was drawn with force.

Christ's death is so powerful that it will draw all mankind unto Him.

[SpiritDriven]

Loved your Posts Tony !

Saw an advert here on TV for an up comming Show, Creation Versus Science.....one of the short out takes had an ederly Gentelman stating that nothing exists except via the Will of God.

Very Wise Old Gentleman...

Peace