Worldly Christians?

[SQ]

I was reading another forum, one thread caught my interest, It was titled Christanity has become to worldly or something of that order.
What is a worldly christian, your thoughts on worldly christians?

[jabcat]

Hey SQ...I believe many different people mean many different things by that.  Not saying I necessarily agree with all these, or that they're all right, etc., but I've been around a bunch of different groups, observed them and interacted with them, and here are some ideas I'd say are floating around out there about this topic;

Here's what it was when I was growing up;  anybody different than our group/denomination - women wear their hair too short, pants too tight, the men's hair is too long, they go to movies, have TVs in their house, don't rest on Sundays.

Here are some other things I've heard - living in sin, having secret sins, dressing like the world, looking like the world, living like the world, loving the things of the world, living for entertainment and pleasure, not being able to tell the difference between a believer and unbeliever (very little or no "fruit"), being lukewarm, not pursuing or caring about the things of God...

I'm gonna go look at a few scriptures to see if they can give a clearer picture/understanding....

[jabcat]

I found some scriptures and comments that speak to me...bolded some things that really stuck out to me.  Could some of this describe being "worldly"?

Eph. 5:1Therefore be imitators of God, as beloved children. 2And walk in love, as Christ loved us and gave himself up for us, a fragrant offering and sacrifice to God.
3But sexual immorality and all impurity or covetousness must not even be named among you, as is proper among saints. 4Let there be no filthiness nor foolish talk nor crude joking, which are out of place, but instead let there be thanksgiving. 5For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. [WORLDLY?]   6Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience. 7Therefore do not become partners with them;  8for at one time you were darkness, but now you are light in the Lord. Walk as children of light 9(for the fruit of light is found in all that is good and right and true), 10and try to discern what is pleasing to the Lord. 11Take no part in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them. 12For it is shameful even to speak of the things that they do in secret............15Look carefully then how you walk, not as unwise but as wise, 16making the best use of the time, because the days are evil. 17Therefore do not be foolish, but understand what the will of the Lord is. 18And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit....

Quote - "In John 17 Jesus says told the disciples they were in the world but not OF the world...and He prayed they would be kept safe and SEPARATE from it.  According to one author, When Jesus speaks of the world in vs 14-17, he is referring to the satanic system which is hostile to God.  The world (kosmos) in this sense is the enemy of God (see 1 Jn. 5:19).  It is designed to distract and seduce people from a love relationship with God.  How does it do this?
Read 1 Jn. 2:15-17.  This system is antithetical to God, so loving it is incompatible with loving God.  Notice that "the things of the world" are not things or people, but rather values:
"The lust of the flesh" refers to HEDONISM--living for the gratification of physical and sensual desires
"The lust of the eye" refers to MATERIALISM--living for the accumulation and enjoyment of material things
"The boastful pride of life" refers to EGOTISM--living for self-aggrandizement and people's approval vs. living as a self-effacing servant for God's approval" - End Quote.

The writer says "Jesus prays in this passage that his followers will be different from the world ("sanctify") in the area of truth.  In other words, we are to reject conformity to the world's beliefs, ethics, and values."

2 Corinthians 6:14 Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness? 15What harmony is there between Christ and Belialb? What does a believer have in common with an unbeliever? 16What agreement is there between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said: "I will live with them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people."
17"Therefore come out from them
and be separate,
says the Lord.
Touch no unclean thing,
and I will receive you."
18"I will be a Father to you,
and you will be my sons and daughters,
says the Lord Almighty."


I think unless He brings these passages alive in us, we could get into self-righteousness and judgmentalism if not careful - have a spirit of a Pharisee, etc.  Discernment, humility, obedience....could it include watching out for anything that keeps us from walking with and pursuing God?  :2c:  

[CHB]

Hi SQ,

Most think that we are worldly Christians because we believe in the salvation of all. They think we believe that we can do anything we want to because we are going to be saved anyway.

CHB

[sheila]

Colossians 2;23  which things have indeed a shew of wisdom

  in WILL WORSHIP,and humility, and neglecting of the

body;not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.


whatcomes to my mind is various religious cults..the women

forbidden to cut their hair,but must cover it...long dresses and

much religiosity...and then you find the men still lusting over

the underage young women and taking many wives.Seems like

all their man-made ordinances didn't 'help' in the least with the

lust spirit in them.

  By contrast, I know of couples that dressed 'worldly'

shorts/make-up etc. And remained faithful to one spouse all

their lives.

   I just read an article a few days ago about the problem with

some men in the muslim countries leering lustfully at an inch of

ankle that was exposed..staring andmasturbating on the strret

while looking at part of an arm or ankle..etc.

   Seems those severe man-made ordinances of religiosity

do nothing to quell a spirit of lust if it is lively.

   The living word of God recorded in Col 2;18-23 bears wittness

to this very thing

[SQ]

Hi SQ,

Most think that we are worldly Christians because we believe in the salvation of all. They think we believe that we can do anything we want to because we are going to be saved anyway.

CHB

Hi everyone thanks for the replys.
CHB, I agree with you most that I come in contact with believe Universalist live just any way, that it is an excuse. I know since I came to believe in salvation for all God has brought an awareness I never had before.

[SQ]

Hi Sheila, your post makes perfect sense, it is not the outside that makes one a Christian, however the outside and inside seem to be in agreement.
Isn't that amazing though how the muslim men still lust for the women that are covered.
It shows me the inside is what counts, not so much how one appears from outside.
God burns this lusts and uncleanliness out of us,
also agree with jabcat God instills values.
  I at one time valued material things, now to have comfort is enough for me.
guessing if someone is worldly they will remain so until God shows them, all work is of God.
I am coming to an understanding, things are not always as they seem to us. :icon_flower:

[jabcat]

 :thumbsup:

[willieH]

willieH: Hi sister CHB... :hithere:

Hi SQ,

Most think that we are worldly Christians because we believe in the salvation of all. They think we believe that we can do anything we want to because we are going to be saved anyway.

CHB

You are SOOOOOOOOOOOOO right, CHB!  

I have discussed this at so many forums as to have lost count, and this is BY FAR -- their FAVORITE "comeback" to the proposal that God shall SAVE ALL...  

And no matter how much you explain that one REAPS what one SOWS, they (deafly) cling to this foolishness:

If everyone is SAVED, ---> "then you can DO what you WANT, because you will be SAVED anyway" <---

Unawares that within their OWN WORDS, they openly admit in stating this, that they SERVE to be SAVED, and not out of UNSELFISH LOVE and respect for GOD, rather of SELFISH GAIN and reward...

As well as exposing themselves, that they would rather be "doing what they WANT", but that they would lose their  SALVATION by "doing what they WANT" -- :rolleye: -- which means that they are therefore, ...NOT...  "doing what they WANT"  :mshock:

In this sorrowful mindset, ..."THEIR WORKS" (of service) are destined to become just that -- THEIR WORKS -- and THOSE WORKS shall one day be met with these words -- Matt 7:22-23 -- obeying in order to GAIN (salvation & reward), rather than simply SERVING for the UNSELFISH sake of SERVICE, with NO motive,  other than LOVE and RESPECT for YHVH and His Son.  :sigh:

...willieH  :cloud9:

[Molly]

..rather than simply SERVING for the UNSELFISH sake of SERVICE, with NO motive,  other than LOVE and RESPECT for YHVH and His Son.

I guess I would have to say that our love of God is a gift of God through the author and perfector of our faith.  It's easier to please him because we believe in him and are in relationship to him.

This love relationship must be what is meant by his law being written on our hearts.

There is a huge difference between doing something out of duty or out of love.

[sheila]

 :thumbsup:

   the prostitute reduces a man to a loaf of bread.....

   Babylon reduces God to services rendered for a price,too!!

[rosered]

  I love the 1 Johns 1,2,3,4,5 . for this reason   speaking  of the world and whats in it
  1Jo 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things [that are] in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
1Jo 2:16 For all that [is] in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
1Jo 2:17 And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

  I always looked for a better definition of what a ''will''  is

  what is Gods will / desire pleasure  for us ?   
  I now  know that those who  praise Him are ALive for Him and to him  :icon_flower:  and   render HIM excellent    :HeartThrob:

[SQ]

Living in the bible belt almost,  everyone goes to church. a pentacostal neighbor that thinks I should go to their church, she thinks I need to wear big hair and certain style of clothes, trying to get me to conform to come around to their thinking.

Then have another neighbor who would love to get me to go with her, have to wear dresses out of respect for God, yet she wears pants at home.
From my point of view if one has to wear dresses out of respect for God, then they should wear dresses at home for the same reason.

I tell everyone that asks me to church, I went to church most of my adult life, I never learned much mostly how to give money for a building fund how to give money to be blessed then wind up not having enough for my own needs.
I can't go that route anymore, unless I am led by the Holy Spirit.
I am free praise God. :2c:

[rosered]

Living in the bible belt almost,  everyone goes to church. a pentacostal neighbor that thinks I should go to their church, she thinks I need to wear big hair and certain style of clothes, trying to get me to conform to come around to their thinking.

Then have another neighbor who would love to get me to go with her, have to wear dresses out of respect for God, yet she wears pants at home.
From my point of view if one has to wear dresses out of respect for God, then they should wear dresses at home for the same reason.

I tell everyone that asks me to church, I went to church most of my adult life, I never learned much mostly how to give money for a building fund how to give money to be blessed then wind up not having enough for my own needs.
I can't go that route anymore, unless I am led by the Holy Spirit.
I am free praise God. :2c:

  ahhh  sweety , 
you Bless my heart :HeartThrob: , I tell you the truth some of the best  times praising the Lord was when I was naked in the shower   thats the truth !!! :mblush:  ha never felt closer or more   pure than that ! :giveheart:

[SQ]

Living in the bible belt almost,  everyone goes to church. a pentacostal neighbor that thinks I should go to their church, she thinks I need to wear big hair and certain style of clothes, trying to get me to conform to come around to their thinking.

Then have another neighbor who would love to get me to go with her, have to wear dresses out of respect for God, yet she wears pants at home.
From my point of view if one has to wear dresses out of respect for God, then they should wear dresses at home for the same reason.

I tell everyone that asks me to church, I went to church most of my adult life, I never learned much mostly how to give money for a building fund how to give money to be blessed then wind up not having enough for my own needs.
I can't go that route anymore, unless I am led by the Holy Spirit.
I am free praise God. :2c:

  ahhh  sweety , 
you Bless my heart :HeartThrob: , I tell you the truth some of the best  times praising the Lord was when I was naked in the shower   thats the truth !!! :mblush:  ha never felt closer or more   pure than that ! :giveheart:

Amen, We are the temple! :HeartThrob:

[Beloved Servant]

           Few statements have ever been made that carry a more intense message than these words of the apostle Paul written to the Roman believers: "For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace" (Rom. 8:6). To be spiritually minded means to walk in the spiritual mind and pay no mind to the desires, thoughts and claims of the carnal mind which minds only earthly things. The three trees of Eden are three kinds of men, three potentialities within man, and three kinds of lives that may be lived out by every regenerated person: body life, soul life and spirit life. It is interesting to watch these three kinds of lives revealed in a gathering of the Lord's people where there are saints who are walking on different levels of spiritual development. When a deep revelatory word is coming forth, and the Spirit of God is probing into the depths of the hearts of those saints walking in the SPIRITUAL REALM, others seem to withdraw and appear to be bored with the service. Then if another voice begins to speak, appealing to the SOULISH REALM, with shallow sentimental preaching, peppy music, clapping of the hands, emotional appeal for people to "come forward" for this and that blessing, this second group of saints suddenly becomes alive and responds accordingly with their manifestations. And finally, as yet another voice speaks and announces that the meeting has ended and donuts and coffee will now be served, there is this third group who live in the BODY REALM, who endured all the service thus far, who now begin to respond and come alive. Each has seen, heard, tasted, touched and smelled on one of the three levels, whether of the spirit, the soul or the body.

— Brother Eby
ECHOES FROM EDEN
Part VII

[Nancy]

hi everyone,
i'm not sure about this but in 1st century christianity weren't the surrounding peoples worshipping idols (i mean not ones like today, money, pleasure etc) but real flesh and blood ones like Ashteroth and Artemis, etc. And a lot of worship involved sexual rites and such like.
So to talk about christian values in those days is a world apart from today where christian values have shaped society whether we followed it or not. I mean they had gladiators killing each other for sport for goodness sake.
My point is today you can be an atheist and look as if you are behaving better than a christian.  You can have 2 atheists who have been married all their life and 2 christians who have divorced, etc. I don't think it is black and white what a worldly christian is anymore.
Like i said i may be wrong just my pennys' worth.
Godbless
Nancy