Turn the other cheek

[jugghead]

For me, in my opinion, what I see in: "all spirits are from God but not all spirits are like God" is:

a spirit of judgment

We have all been given a spirit of judgment, and we have all been given a spirit of freedom, but the combination of the two can be lethal, meaning the combination of the two can cause death.

Do we, in our spirit of freedom take the spirit of judgment and use it to judge another
OR
Do we, in our spirit of freedom take the spirit of judgment and use it to judge ourselves

And what are we judging in another or in ourselves, is it not what is righteous (good) and what is unrighteous (evil)? In other words: are we not judging what is sin and what is not sin?

We are given the freedom to judge, but do we use it to judge others or do we use it to judge just sin?

What I believe, through the work of Jesus Christ upon the cross, we are now given a freedom to judge sin without judging the person

In which, this is what I see when Jesus speaks of "the speck and the plank in the eye", we can see the speck (sin) in the eye of another, but do we see the plank (the bigger sin) in our own eye, that being the judgment of the person.

We first have to remove our own judgment of the person (the plank from our own eye) before we can see clearly as to how to remove the small judgment (speck) in the eye of another.

The Spirit of judgment that is from God, separates the sin from the person and righteously judges sin not the person

The spirit of judgement that is of man, cannot separate the two in his own mind thereby judging sin and judging the person at the same time.

Thereby all spirits are from God, including the spirit of judgment, but not all spirits are like God, judging only sin and not the person.

My  :2c:

This was written as Rose was posting

[marie glen]

Amen Rose! :thumbsup: I think it helps to understand any verse to read many of the translations! For the verse you quoted I like the Contemporary English Version best! - If you had done the right thing, you would be smiling. But you did the wrong thing, and now sin is waiting to attack you like a lion. Sin wants to destroy you, but don't let it! 



Amen Jugghead! Great post! :thumbsup:

[CST]

CST quote ;

Hmm, I have no problem believing in the awakening to the Spiritual nature (although we may discover some of us are almost awake already) but I'm not some what you mean by all spirits are from God but not all spirits are like God. Mainly because the word 'spirit' has at least three uses in modern theological discussion 1). the Spirit of God which obviously is from God and like God, 2).the spirits in man which He breathed into us and presumably were once in the image of God but may have been diverted or corrupted and 3). other spirit beings which i'm not convinced i literally believe in. Not knowing how many of these you mean I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

  The Father  all  of spirits,   but not all spirits are  Holy   as God  is Holy ..
  The" unclean spirits  '' EVIL /b] is mostly as I was referring to   CST as the bible refers  to  Jesus casting them out of humans taken captive by their  influences  and temptations  to destroy our flesh  and well being .

Jesus was doing more than  removing ,"bad thoughts "out of humans in my opinion  when reading the  book of Mark especially ...  the unclean spirits are just that impure spirits  , not clean or holy .

169 akáthartos (an adjective, derived from 1 /A "not" and 2513 /katharós, "clean, purged") – properly, not pure (because mixed), i.e. adulterated with "a wrong mix" and hence "unclean" (because tainted by sin).

[The antonym, 2508 /kathaírō ("clean"), means "free from wrong mixture" (unadulterated, unmixed).]

Hope this helps  be more clear

  Sin is a great study to  really understand   for there are many   references to  sin in the bible with many   ways to see sin as more than just error or  missing the mark  or guilt offering  etc... Hebrew has several other words for sin beyond hata, each with its own specific meaning. The word pesha, or "trespass", means a sin done out of rebelliousness. The word aveira means "transgression". And the word avone, or "iniquity", means a sin done out of moral failing.


  Is sin an evil spirit  crouching at the door of our hearts and wanting to rule over your soul / life and  body ? 

  With Cain   we  have to  wonder,   because he was of the Evil One 1 John 3:12...

Gen 4 ;7
New International Version
If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it."

New Living Translation
You will be accepted if you do what is right. But if you refuse to do what is right, then watch out! Sin is crouching at the door, eager to control you. But you must subdue it and be its master."

English Standard Version
If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is contrary to you, but you must rule over it."

Berean Study Bible
If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you refuse to do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; you are its object of desire, but you must master it."

New American Standard Bible
"If you do well, will not your countenance be lifted up? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is for you, but you must master it."

King James Bible
If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

Christian Standard Bible
If you do what is right, won't you be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is for you, but you must rule over it."

Contemporary English Version
If you had done the right thing, you would be smiling. But you did the wrong thing, and now sin is waiting to attack you like a lion. Sin wants to destroy you, but don't let it!

Good News Translation
If you had done the right thing, you would be smiling; but because you have done evil, sin is crouching at your door. It wants to rule you, but you must overcome it."

Holman Christian Standard Bible
If you do what is right, won't you be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is for you, but you must rule over it."

International Standard Version
If you do what is appropriate, you'll be accepted, won't you? But if you don't do what is appropriate, sin is crouching near your doorway, turning toward you. Now as for you, will you take dominion over it?"

NET Bible
Is it not true that if you do what is right, you will be fine? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at the door. It desires to dominate you, but you must subdue it."

New Heart English Bible
If you do well, will it not be lifted up? If you do not do well, sin crouches at the door. Its desire is for you, but you are to rule over it."

GOD'S WORD® Translation
If you do well, won't you be accepted? But if you don't do well, sin is lying outside your door ready to attack. It wants to control you, but you must master it."

JPS Tanakh 1917
If thou doest well, shall it not be lifted up? and if thou doest not well, sin coucheth at the door; and unto thee is its desire, but thou mayest rule over it.'

New American Standard 1977
"If you do well, will not your countenance be lifted up? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is for you, but you must master it."

Jubilee Bible 2000
If thou doest good, it shall certainly be accepted; and if thou doest not good, sin lies at the door. And his desire shall be unto thee, but thou must rule over him.

King James 2000 Bible
If you do well, shall you not be accepted? and if you do not well, sin lies at the door. And you shall be its desire, and you must rule over it.

American King James Version
If you do well, shall you not be accepted? and if you do not well, sin lies at the door. And to you shall be his desire, and you shall rule over him.

American Standard Version
If thou doest well, shall it not be lifted up? and if thou doest not well, sin coucheth at the door: and unto thee shall be its desire, but do thou rule over it.

Douay-Rheims Bible
If thou do well, shalt thou not receive? but if ill, shall not sin forthwith be present at the door? but the lust thereof shall be under thee, and thou shalt have dominion over it.

Darby Bible Translation
If thou doest well, will not [thy countenance] look up [with confidence]? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door; and unto thee [shall be] his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

English Revised Version
If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin coucheth at the door: and unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

Webster's Bible Translation
If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And to thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.

World English Bible
If you do well, will it not be lifted up? If you don't do well, sin crouches at the door. Its desire is for you, but you are to rule over it."

Young's Literal Translation
Is there not, if thou dost well, acceptance? and if thou dost not well, at the opening a sin-offering is crouching, and unto thee its desire, and thou rulest over it.'

With all these translations we begin to get the idea      , With the Help of the Lord we can  begin to reign with Him already doing so , not of ourselves it seems  we cannot rule over sin without Gods helping us  ...

Obviously 'unclean spirits' and more than bad thoughts; they're a collection on pervasive and converging thought processes that together make up various mental health problems. They're certainly not demons or, if they are the chances are that you've got one and I've got one, everyone on the forums got one, at this stage most everyone in the world's got or or possibly more in which case how can we possibly trust each other without thinking that what they say is probably directed by a demon?

The various ways our scholars imagine the different words for 'sin' should translate is certainly an interesting study but, unless the text is self-explaining somewhere, and i'm sure it isn't, they've seemly made a best guess based on someone else's (a non-Hebrew's) difference forms of 'sin'.

And you can quote Genesis 4 in as many translations as you like but it doesn't change the fact that the warning is in exactly the same form as the one given to the Woman in the previous chapter.

And only one spirit is Holy: God, the Holy Spirit. That is why He is called 'The' Holy Spirit.

[guest6024]

You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.'h 39But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also. 40And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. 41If anyone forces you to go one mile, go with them two miles. 42Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you.

How are we to actually live this out?
Does Jesus's teachings allow for self defense or violence/killing in war?

I would tend to say that the Old Testament does but Jesus's teachings don't.

So again, how do we live this out?

It says that Jesus was sent only to the Lost sheep of the House of Israel.  ...  So this isn't something that concerns me or that I would try to live out. He isn't talking to me or you.

Also Jesus apparently overturned the tables of the money lenders and drove them all out of the temple with a whip.  Was that turning the other cheek...

[bushy]

The way I see it is that Jesus came to bring in a better covenant so after His resurrection that dividing wall between the two (Israel and gentiles) was torn down.

And He was sent to be the savior or the whole world, not just Israel. And He paid the price for our sins, and not just ours but for the sins of the whole world.

[eaglesway]

IMO The Old Testament taught a community of people how to live as such.

The law was about both pleasing God and making space for one another by respecting the gift given by God to each and to all.

The prophets continually illuminated the law, focusing on the essence of it(love) when Israel would sink into religion or the corruption of the Gentiles, and calling the community back to love and honor between the members of the family, the community and God who was their oneness and union.

Jesus came with the words of the prophets in His heart(because He is the Logos and their words had come from Him in the first place) and transcended the law as the actual form transcends the shadow of that form, and at the cross displayed the heart and soul of the law in a way so pure and bright that any who would "Come, follow Me" would transcend the law with Him, because perfect love casts out all fear and fear has to do with judgment- and love does no ill to its neighbor so that is the day dawning and the morning star arising in our hearts.

In love, there is no division, no Jew, no Gentile, and Jesus spread His arms wide on that cross to invite everyone into the community of the kingdom of God.

Like Bushy said.  :LH:

[marie glen]

 :thumbsup: Amen!