The purpose and point of this thread is to discuss and to learn and to teach the commandments of Jesus Christ to those who want to read and participate. I will go through the new testament and take them one by one.
We will start with this.
John, Chapter 14, 15:If ye love me, keep my commandments.
John, Chapter 14, 21: He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
John, Chapter 15, 10: If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 02:21:03 AM
The purpose and point of this thread is to discuss and to learn and to teach the commandments of Jesus Christ to those who want to read and participate. I will go through the new testament and take them one by one.
We will start with this.
John, Chapter 14, 15:If ye love me, keep my commandments.
John, Chapter 14, 21: He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
John, Chapter 15, 10: If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
John, Chapter 14, 15:If ye love me, keep my commandments.If you do not keep the commandments of Jesus Christ,
you do not love Jesus Christ.True or false?
1 John 3:23
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
Quote from: eaglesway on May 24, 2014, 07:02:18 PM
1 John 3:23
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
If you believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ,
you will keep His commandments.
True or false?
Well I never heard Jesus say, "True or false"? I am not really into being grilled. I prefer reasonable and open conversation. So I will answer as I see fit.
One of them, a lawyer, asked Him a question, testing Him, "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?" And He said to him, "'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.' This is the great and foremost commandment. The second is like it, 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."
I am wondering which particular commandments you are lawyering me towards :o)
Quote from: eaglesway on May 24, 2014, 08:22:50 PM
Well I never heard Jesus say, "True or false"? I am not really into being grilled. I prefer reasonable and open conversation. So I will answer as I see fit.
One of them, a lawyer, asked Him a question, testing Him, "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?" And He said to him, "'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.' This is the great and foremost commandment. The second is like it, 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."
I am wondering which particular commandments you are lawyering me towards :o)
Please explain to me how you can love the Lord thy God
with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind,
and with all thy strength:
If you do not obey even the least, of the commandments of Jesus Christ?
How could I explain that to you when I dont know what you consider the least commandment to be that you think I may not be obeying :o) Which commandment is the least commandment?
It is far more natural to have conversation where information exchanges and we get a feel for where each other is coming from. Cryptic questions and implications work very poorly in a forum environment.
Come, let us reason together.
Quote from: eaglesway on May 24, 2014, 09:07:15 PM
How could I explain that to you when I dont know what you consider the least commandment to be that you think I may not be obeying :o) Which commandment is the least commandment?
It is far more natural to have conversation where information exchanges and we get a feel for where each other is coming from. Cryptic questions and implications work very poorly in a forum environment.
Come, let us reason together.
I can tell you this you have said to me is not acceptable to God.
Do you believe me? Yes or no?
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 07:05:40 PM
Quote from: eaglesway on May 24, 2014, 07:02:18 PM
1 John 3:23
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
If you believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ,
you will keep His commandments.
True or false?
ill take a stab at it and answer YES(but I don't go by the name jesus which is a wrong translation of the Son's name--I say Yahshua)the Hebrew never had a J in it and the Son never heard his name called Jesus in his lifetime.
Acts 26:14-15--says thatPaul proclaimed that he heard a voice speak un to him in Hebrew Tongue(language)NO J in Hebrew language.
in most versions it has the Son saying his name was Jesus---this is a contradiction of the very same scripture--The Son spoke Hebrew to paul and told him his name--could not have been Jesus---Jesus has no literal meaning of itself and has corrupt soundings from the original--his name was Yahshua!!!same name as who we call Joshua--but no letter J in Hebrew.
Just some thoughts and of course IMO :dsunny: :dsunny:
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 09:16:15 PM
Quote from: eaglesway on May 24, 2014, 09:07:15 PM
How could I explain that to you when I dont know what you consider the least commandment to be that you think I may not be obeying :o) Which commandment is the least commandment?
It is far more natural to have conversation where information exchanges and we get a feel for where each other is coming from. Cryptic questions and implications work very poorly in a forum environment.
Come, let us reason together.
I can tell you this you have said to me is not acceptable to God.
Do you believe me? Yes or no?
No, I dont believe you. You are not communicating, and you are not impressing me, much less engaging me in any meaningful discussion. If you keep this up you will not be on the forum much longer.
Quote from: eaglesway on May 25, 2014, 05:50:01 AM
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 09:16:15 PM
Quote from: eaglesway on May 24, 2014, 09:07:15 PM
How could I explain that to you when I dont know what you consider the least commandment to be that you think I may not be obeying :o) Which commandment is the least commandment?
It is far more natural to have conversation where information exchanges and we get a feel for where each other is coming from. Cryptic questions and implications work very poorly in a forum environment.
Come, let us reason together.
I can tell you this you have said to me is not acceptable to God.
Do you believe me? Yes or no?
No, I dont believe you. You are not communicating, and you are not impressing me, much less engaging me in any meaningful discussion. If you keep this up you will not be on the forum much longer.
I passed this on to the the Lord.
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 06:47:36 PM
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 02:21:03 AM
The purpose and point of this thread is to discuss and to learn and to teach the commandments of Jesus Christ to those who want to read and participate. I will go through the new testament and take them one by one.
We will start with this.
John, Chapter 14, 15:If ye love me, keep my commandments.
John, Chapter 14, 21: He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
John, Chapter 15, 10: If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
John, Chapter 14, 15:If ye love me, keep my commandments.
If you do not keep the commandments of Jesus Christ,
you do not love Jesus Christ.
True or false?
The ONLY way anyone, can abide in the love of Jesus Christ, is to keep the Commandments of Jesus Christ, as Jesus Christ kept the commandments of God, His Father.
True or false?
He passed it back to me. I am passing it back to you. You are mistaken about your authority in Him and you haven't listened to the reasonable instruction you hav received about how the forum operates. Goodbye.
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 25, 2014, 08:00:45 AM
Quote from: eaglesway on May 25, 2014, 05:50:01 AM
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 09:16:15 PM
Quote from: eaglesway on May 24, 2014, 09:07:15 PM
How could I explain that to you when I dont know what you consider the least commandment to be that you think I may not be obeying :o) Which commandment is the least commandment?
It is far more natural to have conversation where information exchanges and we get a feel for where each other is coming from. Cryptic questions and implications work very poorly in a forum environment.
Come, let us reason together.
I can tell you this you have said to me is not acceptable to God.
Do you believe me? Yes or no?
No, I dont believe you. You are not communicating, and you are not impressing me, much less engaging me in any meaningful discussion. If you keep this up you will not be on the forum much longer.
I passed this on to the the Lord.
Bye.
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 25, 2014, 08:42:29 AM
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 06:47:36 PM
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 02:21:03 AM
The purpose and point of this thread is to discuss and to learn and to teach the commandments of Jesus Christ to those who want to read and participate. I will go through the new testament and take them one by one.
We will start with this.
John, Chapter 14, 15:If ye love me, keep my commandments.
John, Chapter 14, 21: He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
John, Chapter 15, 10: If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
John, Chapter 14, 15:If ye love me, keep my commandments.
If you do not keep the commandments of Jesus Christ,
you do not love Jesus Christ.
True or false?
The ONLY way anyone, can abide in the love of Jesus Christ, is to keep the Commandments of Jesus Christ, as Jesus Christ kept the commandments of God, His Father.
True or false?
The gospel of Jesus Christ is his commandments.
When you repent you are to do what?
OBEY HIS COMMANDMENTS
The Commandments of Jesus Christ
is
the way
the life
the truth.
The commandments of Jesus Christ
is eternal life.
The Salvation of God.
Jesus Himself is the way, the truth and the life. His commandment is that we love one another, as He loved us. "No greater love has a man than this than to lay down his life for his friends.
You are my friends if you do what I tell you.
What does He tell us?, Love one another. Bear one anothers burdens. Exhort one another to love and good works.
Are these the commandment of which you are speaking?
Quote from: eaglesway on May 25, 2014, 10:28:10 AM
Jesus Himself is the way, the truth and the life. His commandment is that we love one another, as He loved us. "No greater love has a man than this than to lay down his life for his friends.
You are my friends if you do what I tell you.
What does He tell us?, Love one another. Bear one anothers burdens. Exhort one another to love and good works.
Are these the commandment of which you are speaking?
You treat me as you have then you want me to teach you?
I have no need that any man teach me. The Holy Spirit teaches me directly, by the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of God. He speaks to me by my brothers and sisters. He illuminates the scriptures. He brings to remembrance all that Jesus the Logos of God has spoken. He whispers to me, "It is written". Mainly tho He just says, "Love one another".
You havent been asked to teach. You have been asked to discuss with a little openess and humility whatever point you are trying to make.
Why not just say,
" As I see it, these are the 7 spirits of God as revealed in the Apocalypse of John, what d'yall thnk about that?" And then list them so we can discuss it, agree, or agree to disagree. Instead of coming off like an angry mystic.
The maybe we could experience some mutual edification.
Instead, I see nothing but posturing. Come down off your throne friend. You behind is not big enough to cash the check you are writing with your mouth.
Quote from: FreeAtLast on May 25, 2014, 03:15:09 AM
Quote from: Stephen Levi on May 24, 2014, 07:05:40 PM
Quote from: eaglesway on May 24, 2014, 07:02:18 PM
1 John 3:23
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.
If you believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ,
you will keep His commandments.
True or false?
ill take a stab at it and answer YES(but I don't go by the name jesus which is a wrong translation of the Son's name--I say Yahshua)the Hebrew never had a J in it and the Son never heard his name called Jesus in his lifetime.
Acts 26:14-15--says thatPaul proclaimed that he heard a voice speak un to him in Hebrew Tongue(language)NO J in Hebrew language.
in most versions it has the Son saying his name was Jesus---this is a contradiction of the very same scripture--The Son spoke Hebrew to paul and told him his name--could not have been Jesus---Jesus has no literal meaning of itself and has corrupt soundings from the original--his name was Yahshua!!!same name as who we call Joshua--but no letter J in Hebrew.
Just some thoughts and of course IMO :dsunny: :dsunny:
Didnt mean to ignore your post, Freeatlast. I think you are generally correct about the name, but actually, all the names and all the words have been translated to English through Greek and Latin and Aramaic. I have felt since i have been presnted with this doctrine on the name many times over the years, that it is good to speak the name as it was in Hebrew, and I do at times. At other times it is more expedient for me to use the English rendering of the name for simple understanding- actually, most of the time I find it a-ok to use Jesus and have never felt convicted by the Spirit that I 'must use Yashua or Yeshua or Y'shua or Yehoshua. But, as I said, I think you are generally correct, and I appreciate the way you shared your view on it. Peace,
not a problem friend---never took it as you were ignoring me :HeartThrob: :HeartThrob:
also sometimes because of the original name as being not known by most--I sometimes have to use jesus or some of the people I talk with would have no clue who I was referring unto--
also as to this other person asking about keeping the commandments--I have a question for him if he is still here--Do YOU keep ALL the commandments perfectly every day of your life ??? :dsunny: :dsunny:
he's no longer here FAL...
Quote from: eaglesway on May 25, 2014, 10:41:51 AM
I have no need that any man teach me. The Holy Spirit teaches me directly, by the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of God. He speaks to me by my brothers and sisters. He illuminates the scriptures. He brings to remembrance all that Jesus the Logos of God has spoken. He whispers to me, "It is written". Mainly tho He just says, "Love one another".
You havent been asked to teach. You have been asked to discuss with a little openess and humility whatever point you are trying to make.
Why not just say,
" As I see it, these are the 7 spirits of God as revealed in the Apocalypse of John, what d'yall thnk about that?" And then list them so we can discuss it, agree, or agree to disagree. Instead of coming off like an angry mystic.
The maybe we could experience some mutual edification.
Instead, I see nothing but posturing. Come down off your throne friend. You behind is not big enough to cash the check you are writing with your mouth.
Yup.
Still, I was looking forward to what he had to say.
I wanted the particular doctrinal noose that he was driving at. I don't think he ever got there.
Interesting thread.
:thumbsup:
LOL. He definitely never got there Ed. I was interested in hearing where he was going also, but he just wouldnt come out with it
That is usually evidence that the point is not the actual goal, really, as much as the feeling of self importance reaped by the person baiting the hook.
This guy reminded me a bit of myself. At the very first moments of waking up out of the dream (nightmare) I became very zealous also. When I look back now I can see the err of my ways a bit more clearly. The more zealous I became the more Yahweh humbled me and in that humility my eyes were opened to even more revelation. The humiliation that I am experiencing is the most painful and sorrowful time of my life so far and I am brought to my knees in repentance. But anyway I feel for this guy because I have been there.
DuWayne
:thumbsup: MPL I hear you..and have been there. I was interested in what he had to say,too.
' Not many of you should be teachers....." how true" faithful servant whm the Master appints
to give those of His household their food at appointed time[talents of light shared to edify
the body...increase the Lord's holdings....I am about my Father's buisiness.... to me the preceding
happens when we we share what the Holy spirit may have quickened to us in the 'scriptures' etc
with each other..and all are increased. the one talent holder..hid it in the
ground[fleshly/carnalness].
anyway, I google searched the least commandment...and it has been said..it relates to
the bird[sparrow] sitting on the nest...and not t take eggs/nestlings and the mother bird,too.
.........even the sparrow has found a home for herself near your altar......and you are worth more
then many sparrows. God's concern for what is deemed of negligible value in the eyes of men......
he who teaches any to break one of these comandments shall be called 'least' in the Kingdom
of heaven.......no other greater then John the Baptist..but he who is least in the Kingdom of
heaven is greater then he......I tell ye,whatever ye have done unto one of the 'least' of these..ye
have done to me. He who is faithful in what is least[one talent]..is faithful in much[increased]
of coarse no-way of knowing if this is what the op was getting at.........
like a hen that gather's her chicks under her wings........whomis it you want? leave these alone
then.........it is for your benefit that I go away....I will not leave you as orphans..but will send
the comfortor.....I believe I can see the Holy spirit in the bodily form of a dove in Him fulfilling
this least commandment..........He was faithful in what what is least commandment.........
GLORY!
:cloud9: :thumbsup:
I hear you too, MPL. We've been in the winepress for the last few years now, and just when you're SURE you can't take anymore pressing, more comes. Taking on the image of sinful flesh and the shame and humiliation of the cross, is not fun. If it was not a sure thing that good fruit comes out of it, we would despair of life completely (or I would). Blessings...
well, He trampled the winepress alone.....and there was blood up to the brid-els of His
horses........Christ grape[red-blood-wine of atonement] on their lips.
.....we 'MUST" be wine-bibbers,too!
for those curious (as was I, because I did a lot of research over the past several days) here ya go
http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=93533
Good research Jabcat. Many thanks.
:iagree:
thank you :handshake:
Quote from: jabcat on May 26, 2014, 09:15:55 PM
for those curious (as was I, because I did a lot of research over the past several days) here ya go
http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=93533
Fifteen pages of fun. :winkgrin:
Thanks. :smile:
Well that's a dance that only has three steps methinks.
Be cryptic
Be unresponsive
Get banned :o)
...boy o' boy.....I had google searched the name he used on this forum and seen where he just
recently joined a cathlic forum....but wow Jab.. those ..15 pages !
Quote from: ed on May 27, 2014, 01:36:30 AM
Quote from: jabcat on May 26, 2014, 09:15:55 PM
for those curious (as was I, because I did a lot of research over the past several days) here ya go
http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=93533
Fifteen pages of fun. :winkgrin:
Thanks. :smile:
Quote from: eaglesway on May 27, 2014, 04:38:11 AM
Well that's a dance that only has three steps methinks.
Be cryptic
Be unresponsive
Get banned :o)
interesting, sad, intriguing...at some point, pointless?
Meant to be scary and intimidating, but as you said, really just sad,
:cloud9: I made it to page 4 and tuned out. Sad. :sigh:
I didn't know the guy personally, but I'd wager to guess that this attitude comes from rejection. I've known people personally with that kind of attitude and it tends from wanting to feel chosen of God to feel more needed. Some people tend to use the Scriptures this way because unlike science, there is no peer review for making yourself a prophet in your own esteem. Again, in all fairness, his story might be completely different, but what I saw over the past few days made me sad because it so closely mirrors what I personally have seen. I think Stephen has been seriously hurt in life.
The problem with that is, the enemy lodges in the breach caused by the wound, and out of that festering bitterness a spirit is emitted that defiles many, including the one in whom it is lodged. Anger is a dangerous weapon in the hands of a person who sees everyone as a target for their "special message". This something I have seen myself, in myself, and it took the Lord may years and many trials to open my eyes to it. I think in my case it was even more difficult because it was less pronounced and more sophisticated in presentation.
Humility is such a repairer of the breach, and a sure defense against the intrusion of spirits and legalistic or prophecy based deceptions..... but it is hard to come by.
"A haughty spirit goes before a fall"
The only way to get set free from that kind of thing is kolassis. Walking into walls and tripping over logs nd wandering in fogs :o) A sure prescription for deliverance from the healer of our souls and the mender of our ways.
"Humble yourselves under the mighty hand of God and in the proper season He will lift you up"
"Let patience have its perfect work that you may be mature and complete, lacking nothing"
"Cease striving and know that I am God"
I agree. I think the Baptist forum let that go on 13-14 pages too long. It's good to have compassion but equally good to preserve order. Paul taught the churches not to tolerate nonsense.
:iagree:
Also interesting that the summation of all the law is love.
Romans 13;9 "The commandments are summed up by this; love your neighbor as yourself."
All those posts of Stephen supposedly pointing to the law seem to show immaturity of growth; probably not his time to know yet.
What I find so sad is that most of the postings on any given message board that get the most postings seem to be those engaged in some sort of disagreement, or argument, or, in this case, someone who is esoteric, and not engaging others in equal to equal dialogue. I find it not surprising that he was able to engage others in his game for some 15 pages. It is much more normal than not. It reminds me of my earlier days when I absolutely loved to argue back and forth (coming from my stint as one of Jehovah's witnesses, in the Worldwide Church of God, etc). Father has since stripped me of my ability to argue like this.
Ronen
And without arguing it's just making statements which are viewed as teaching. That's not allowed either...
Learning comes only by:
- Listening to a teacher --> teachers are forbidden on TM
- Arguing ---> Forbidden on TM
- Self-study ---> No forum needed for that.
Arguing is a great way of learning. What I was missing in Levi's posts is that he never really answered any questions. But unfortunately that's quite common on this forum because the threads go off-topic very often in a very early stage.
Levi could have handled things differently but likewise could those who answered him. Take for example, Levi's view about following commandments. Very Scriptual. But such statements are illegal teaching while an misused/misunderstood verse like 'love is the greatest commandment of all" are suddenly wise and not teaching? Sorry to say I call that double standards and hiding from actually learning something new.... :sigh:
:2c:
Quote from: WhiteWings on May 27, 2014, 06:49:22 PM
Levi could have handled things differently but likewise could those who answered him. Take for example, Levi's view about following commandments. Very Scriptual. But such statements are illegal teaching while an misused/misunderstood verse like 'love is the greatest commandment of all" are suddenly wise and not teaching? Sorry to say I call that double standards and hiding from actually learning something new.... :sigh:
I really did want him to present an argument.
I started typing a reply several times but realized it was all just my ego, and hit the refresh button and waited for his teaching to form................................My guess is that he does not have a doctrine to stand on.
I may be wrong.
:Peace2:
Quote from: ed on May 27, 2014, 07:59:48 PM
Quote from: WhiteWings on May 27, 2014, 06:49:22 PM
Levi could have handled things differently but likewise could those who answered him. Take for example, Levi's view about following commandments. Very Scriptual. But such statements are illegal teaching while an misused/misunderstood verse like 'love is the greatest commandment of all" are suddenly wise and not teaching? Sorry to say I call that double standards and hiding from actually learning something new.... :sigh:
I really did want him to present an argument.
I started typing a reply several times but realized it was all just my ego, and hit the refresh button and waited for his teaching to form................................My guess is that he does not have a doctrine to stand on.
I may be wrong.
:Peace2:
Everyone is entitled to there opinion. Hwever, we as moderators(thanks to James) had additional information that he was spamming other sites in a similar fashion, stirring up strife, declaring himself a unique spiritual authority- and NEVER presenting any other additional discussion to his declarations and questions.
If he had wanted to dispute or clarify my responses to his posts, he had ample opportunity to do so and refused. He was also communicated with, pleasantly and repeatedly in PMs and E-mails explaining how the forum works and inviting him to participate in an appropriate way. He did not respond to ANY of those invitations.
By the time he was banned, he was implying that God was going to discipline anyone who did not follow his agenda. He seemed to think that reasonable resistance to an authoritarian approach were insults to his standing in the kingdom of God.
These kinds of behavior are not welcome, and long-running history has proven that these types of characters never integrate for fellowship, sharing and discussion on the boards- they continue to press there exclusive agenda until disorder and strife runs rampant.
Levi could have handled things differently, but he didn'.t choose to despite being provided plenty of opportunity. Perhaps we s moderataors could have handled things in some better way, but honestly, I don't think it would have made ANY difference to Stephen Levi.
Please remember, the purpose of the board is to provide fellowship for seekers and believers in the salvation of all through Jesus Christ. I myself hold views on peripheral subjects, that were I to press them as issues here, would detract from that purpose and could lead to lengthy heated debates. There are other sites for that though.
That is neither the purpose of nor the mode of operation of the site owner or Tentmaker in general.
I for one was definitely getting frustrated with his act, but I was also having more interaction with him than might hav been apparent on the threads. If I hav offended anyone in my personal responses to him on the threads, I am sorry for that, but I feel we gave him MORE THAN ENOUGH opportunity to come clean and present his case.
Provocative posts that only provoke.
Leave a bad taste.
True or False?
Quote from: eaglesway on May 27, 2014, 09:30:30 PM
Quote from: ed on May 27, 2014, 07:59:48 PM
Quote from: WhiteWings on May 27, 2014, 06:49:22 PM
Levi could have handled things differently but likewise could those who answered him. Take for example, Levi's view about following commandments. Very Scriptual. But such statements are illegal teaching while an misused/misunderstood verse like 'love is the greatest commandment of all" are suddenly wise and not teaching? Sorry to say I call that double standards and hiding from actually learning something new.... :sigh:
I really did want him to present an argument.
My guess is that he does not have a doctrine to stand on.
:Peace2:
spamming other sites in a similar fashion, stirring up strife, declaring himself a unique spiritual authority- and NEVER presenting any other additional discussion to his declarations and questions.
If he had wanted to dispute or clarify my responses to his posts, he had ample opportunity to do so and refused. He was also communicated with, pleasantly and repeatedly in PMs and E-mails explaining how the forum works and inviting him to participate in an appropriate way. He did not respond to ANY of those invitations.
By the time he was banned, he was implying that God was going to discipline anyone who did not follow his agenda. He seemed to think that reasonable resistance to an authoritarian approach were insults to his standing in the kingdom of God.
These kinds of behavior are not welcome, and long-running history has proven that these types of characters never integrate for fellowship, sharing and discussion on the boards- they continue to press there exclusive agenda until disorder and strife runs rampant.
I was also having more interaction with him than might hav been apparent on the threads. If I hav offended anyone in my personal responses to him on the threads, I am sorry for that, but I feel we gave him MORE THAN ENOUGH opportunity to come clean and present his case.
Quote from: gregoryfl on May 27, 2014, 06:01:21 PM
What I find so sad is that most of the postings on any given message board that get the most postings seem to be those engaged in some sort of disagreement, or argument, or, in this case, someone who is esoteric, and not engaging others in equal to equal dialogue. I find it not surprising that he was able to engage others in his game for some 15 pages. It is much more normal than not. It reminds me of my earlier days when I absolutely loved to argue back and forth (coming from my stint as one of Jehovah's witnesses, in the Worldwide Church of God, etc). Father has since stripped me of my ability to argue like this.Ronen
I think Ronen is right - if we wanted an argument, getting people "involved" [i.e., swatting at a hornet's next] emotions stirred up, then yes, this was an opportunity. IMO, arguing is not of the fruit of the Spirit. It is not based in peace and joy - instead, sows dischord. I believe we need to learn in other ways.
Having discernment and setting limits doesn't have to include anger, unkindness, etc. It can be done with gentleness and prayer, and with good hopes for the one on whom limits have been set. To me that should always be my/our goal.
There are many things that go on that are not obviously apparent (PM's, attempts at decision and reconciliation). Whatever is done will not please everyone. On one side, there may be those saying "give it a chance, I want to see what he/she has to say". However, on the other side, there may be just as vocal or more so, opposition, saying "why is he/she still here, it's hurting the boards, I'm leaving unless they do"... SO..that's why moderation decisions are not a matter of public argument and criticism. If that were not the case, then different factions (or those with varying wishes) can just fight it out in public, nobody budging, feelings hurt, anger rising, and chaos ensues. Before long it can just become an unproductive, unfruitful setting and then NO ONE is benefiting.
I hope that is sufficient or at least acceptable to most involved. IF there's something actually focused on the thread title "The Commandments of Jesus Christ" we can still discuss it here. I think there's some interest in it, i.e., the Law, the cross, Jesus' words before the cross in the age of Law, His words after the cross (including through Paul, Peter, John, etc.)... So we'll leave it open a bit to see if there's any relevant discussion of the issue? Thanks, God bless.
Quote from: dajomaco on May 28, 2014, 12:06:32 AM
Provocative posts that only provoke.
Leave a bad taste.
True or False?
:laughing7:
If Christ is the WORD of God and what He says to us (personally) is the WORD of God... if we love what He is speaking to us of course we are going to obey it. It is the outward manifestation or testimony of what is in us (loving Christ, the Word of God). :)
:cloud9: Just so everyone knows, it's always a unanimous decision to ban members, and it ONLY comes after repeated behind the scenes attempts in a variety of methods and personal encouragement styles, trying to get the person to adhere to the rules of the forum and understand why they must be in place. These are the things you DON'T see going on, so it may appear heavy-handed to others not privy to what is actually happening, but nothing could be farther from the truth.
A REASONABLE person would respond reasonably and adjust their attitudes accordingly. No one is interested in running off new members, quite the opposite, in fact. But a reticence or outright refusal of a new member to adjust either the forbidden content (such as New Age beliefs or the invalidation of the scriptures) or the confrontational attitude of their posts, shows a marked UN-reasonableness that is only going to lead to more strife down the road, as the past has shown us.
Tentmaker is one of the few, if not the only, boards where strife is kept to a minimum. For those of us that have been around for a few years, I think we would all agree that the relative peace we have on here now, is a blessing not to be found just anywhere on the net. My :2c: Blessings....
Quote from: WhiteWings on May 27, 2014, 06:49:22 PM
And without arguing it's just making statements which are viewed as teaching. That's not allowed either...
Learning comes only by:
- Listening to a teacher --> teachers are forbidden on TM
- Arguing ---> Forbidden on TM
- Self-study ---> No forum needed for that.
Arguing is a great way of learning. What I was missing in Levi's posts is that he never really answered any questions. But unfortunately that's quite common on this forum because the threads go off-topic very often in a very early stage.
Levi could have handled things differently but likewise could those who answered him. Take for example, Levi's view about following commandments. Very Scriptual. But such statements are illegal teaching while an misused/misunderstood verse like 'love is the greatest commandment of all" are suddenly wise and not teaching? Sorry to say I call that double standards and hiding from actually learning something new.... :sigh:
:2c:
Discernment is an issue here. That may be unfortunate in a way, because it is not black and white. It was clear to me right away that he had no intention to discuss. Arguing is not forbidden on TM if by that you mean discussion or even debate in a reasonable tone. "Teaching" is something we all do as we share our views, but "teaching" from an exalted "I'm in the know, my position is the correct one" attitude is not allowed for long because it always ends up involving judging and personal attacks. This because love, the supreme teacher, does not need that extra emphasis from the flesh.
True teaching just breaks bread and if it multiplies, gives the glory to God.
Strife in the soulish realm does not do that.
Certainly adding the "and if you don't receive me and my words Father will get after you" is absolutely what James called it, earthly, sensual(psuche-soulical or psychological)- even at times demonic. This was the real issue with Stephen, and it is the reason he would not "come out" unless someone took his bait :o)
I for one believe there was a general sense that this was the case, because no one did take his bait.
IMO Learning comes much more through fellowship and the resulting grace that flows from member to member in a generous and patient discussion or midrash than from listening to "teachers".
True teachers, within the context of the Body, will teach in a humble and patient manner, as paul instructed Timothy, "The servant of the Lord must not strive(add soul power to force submission/acceptance), but be gentle to al, patiently instructing them...."
This teaching Paul and James give about teaching is just as foundational doctrinally as anything else we are trying to learn about the kingdom, and certainly more foundational than the doctrines and facts and systematic theologies people get excited about because.........
These are His ways. He was among them as a Lamb. He only roared when the Lion rose up- rarely- and if we are going to roar we better be sure it is the Lamb roaring through us, otherwise we will stumble over the stumbling stone.
The forum is as much about fellowship as it is about facts- more so really. For believers who come here, tentative, threatened by their theological pasts, looking for a safe place to ask the questions that most of us struggled through over longer periods fr lack of such fellowship- minimizing weirdness and dominion driven agendas is very important.
Stephen was looking to dominate. That's the real reason he is gone.
I honestly have not discussed this thread (or anything else) with any of the other mods today, but I think I'm going to go ahead and lock it for now...if anyone has any compelling reason to leave it open so they can discuss "The Commandments of Jesus Christ" please PM and let me/us know...or, if there are more issues to discuss regarding moderation, also PM. Thanks, James.