God helps those who help themselves?

[arcticmonster2003]

I hear often and am told often, by christians, that God helps those whom help themselves. It has become a doctrine. It has become a "sound byte". Most of the people out in this world whom I see helping themselves the most, and to everything in sight don't even care about God.

Just putting this post out there as a pattern breaker, to help break societies brainwashing.

Biblically, whom does God help?

God helps those whom love him, trust in him, seek him, humble themselves, believe in his son Jesus Christ, repent to him, ect... He takes us under his wings like a mother hen.

Just sayin... :dontknow:

[martincisneros]

God helps those whom love him, trust in him, seek him, humble themselves, believe in his son Jesus Christ, repent to him, ect...

So you believe that God helps those who help themselves in these particular ways.  Still sounds like you believe the same thing, but just with Scripture do's instead of other types of do's.

But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. (Romans 4:5)

For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. (Romans 5:6)

In whom we have redemption through his blood (don't miss the "alls" in this passage), the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;
Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven (where the conflict with Satan has been), and which are on earth (where the enmity with mankind and creation has been); even in him (Ephesians 1:7-10)

To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them (2Corinthians 5:19)

Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself (i.e. all things subdued with the same tenderness as He'll subdue our bodies) (Philippians 3:21)

For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe. (1Timothy 4:10)

I do believe that God helps those that appropriate the Covenants of the Scriptures, so don't misunderstand me.  But the Covenants are about the Salvation of all men.  We bare one another's burdens in this world and fulfill the law of Christ.  Galatians 3:9 says:

So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.

So, we're not the fulfillment of the fullness of the Abrahamic blessing, if we're simply blessed with faithful Abraham.  It's a grave mistake to think that the Covenant that God made with Abraham is fulfilled in our salvation.  We're simply a necessary step along the way.  The promise is that we're heir of the world.  Galatians 3:29 says:

And if you belong to Christ, then you're Abraham's Seed, and heirs according to the promise.

The chapter covers two promises:

1.) the promise of the Spirit;
2.) the justification of all of the Nations.

These are the two unchangeable things by which it is impossible for God to lie.  These are the two things by which God cannot lie, that God can't take back, that God can't change, and for which Jesus Christ is the same, yesterday, today, and to the age:

1.) the fullness of the Spirit's unlimited powers being ours to mix with faith in the Covenants;
2.) reigning with Christ over an entirely restored Creation, which includes every person that ever didn't overcome with Christ.  And we're not reigning over an eternal barbecue.

So, God helps those who help themselves by reaching out to Him.  And God helps those who don't know their left hand from their right.

[Loveroftruth]

I had dinner last night with a man who is an atheist. I ask him how he could be one? He had many reasons... but what I kept thinking in the back of my mind was that to the atheist, they must always have a sense that they "must control their life and destiny"... (HELP THEMSELVES) . I think the one thing I so appreciate is that with a God who has his hand ever so slightly on ones life, it brings peace to know that "I don't have to be in such control" and that even the "Yucky" stuff in life works out for good... I would hate to not have that sensing.

[Michele]

I had dinner last night with a man who is an atheist. I ask him how he could be one? He had many reasons... but what I kept thinking in the back of my mind was that to the atheist, they must always have a sense that they "must control their life and destiny"... (HELP THEMSELVES) . I think the one thing I so appreciate is that with a God who has his hand ever so slightly on ones life, it brings peace to know that "I don't have to be in such control" and that even the "Yucky" stuff in life works out for good... I would hate to not have that sensing.

Hey Loveroftruth......great post!  As of lately there have been many things taking place in my life that have worked out miraculously....and I see God's hand in it all.  I believe that God has a way of giving us what we desire in our heart, but He doesn't necessarily always give us what we've planned out so perfectly in our mind.  I believe God has a way of surpassing our greatest expectations.  I know that Joseph dreamed that one day his brothers would bow down to Him, but little did he know how awesome the plan would be that began to unfold in his life, and how one day he would be able to save his brothers. 

Joseph was truly a dreamer, but He always stayed true to God and followed His heart.  I think that is the key to helping ourselves as well as others. :HeartThrob:

[Nathan]

I had dinner last night with a man who is an atheist. I ask him how he could be one? He had many reasons... but what I kept thinking in the back of my mind was that to the atheist, they must always have a sense that they "must control their life and destiny"... (HELP THEMSELVES) . I think the one thing I so appreciate is that with a God who has his hand ever so slightly on ones life, it brings peace to know that "I don't have to be in such control" and that even the "Yucky" stuff in life works out for good... I would hate to not have that sensing.

What you are experiencing is the power of Grace!  And I absolutely agree.  It's what Paul was preaching about with the thorn in his side . . . God puts yucky stuff in us so that we realize just how great his grace can be.  We think we need to get the yucky stuff out . . .but God keeps telling us . . his grace is sufficient.  Walk in his grace and it lets you still be the you God created when he called for you to be born in the flesh.  The biggest hurdle for people to get over is the sense of losing control . . .can't fly in the spirit and still expect to be in control.  Freedom just doesn't work well when under someone's control.

Great post.

[WhiteWings]

God puts yucky stuff in us so that we realize just how great his grace can be.  We think we need to get the yucky stuff out . . .but God keeps telling us . . his grace is sufficient.

Nathan. Guess who....  :laughing7:

So you say God gives us the flu to show how great His aspirine's are?

To save you some typing I added this for you to quote:
Stop thinking with your carnal mind :thumbdown:
Think spiritually  :thumbsup:

[Paul Hazelwood]

I think the misunderstanding here is how we can be accountable if its not our fault.

Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these [things].


There are people that will say the spiritual meaning does not cause this verse to mean what it says about God creating evil.   

The reason is because we cannot fathom why evil has a divine purpose.   We do not have to like evil, nor is that an excuse to commit evil. We are not the sovereign controllers of the universe so we cannot determine properly what a good use of evil may be, nor do we have the power to spiritualize it in the first place.

God can justify creating evil and using it to sift us as wheat because only he knows how.  Sifting wheat is a good thing to do to wheat, that is a fact.

Lk 22:31 Now the Lord said,  "Simon, Simon, lo! Satan claims you men, to sift you as grain.

We are accountable because it is "us" "individually" that has to have work done on us no matter who's responsible for the faults.

[Loveroftruth]

 :hijacked: :hijacked: :hijacked: :hijacked: :hijacked: :hijacked: :hijacked:

How the heck did this become about "Evil" and "Accountability" :dunno:

[Paul Hazelwood]

Not hijacking anything.

If God only helps us when we help ourselves then God must be uninvolved in the evil men do on their own and lets things run ramapant till we want help.

The reason I pointed out what I did is that when we are accountable due to the work God must do in us, then God is working in us before we want to help ourselves.

[Nathan]

Didn't understand a word of that one.

What is it I'm to be accountable for?

[Molly]

35A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.

36But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

37For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

--Mat 12

[Nathan]

So you're saying the power of the cross isn't enough?  That I'll still be judged by my words as well?  Doesn't seem accurate.

[Taffy]

35A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.

36But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

37For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

dearest Molly...have ya ever done a wee study on the Tongue?..it would sure aid a bigger understanding to these verses and to whom they were aimed at...scribes and Pharisees...

what is a LYING Tongue scripturally speaking ?...the lips , the Mouth , the Tongue..throat..ALL SPEAK.

life and death are In the power of the Tongue Molly.

Pro 18:21 Death and life [are] in the power of the tongue: and they that love it shall eat the fruit thereof.  



.may I explain in easy language,...those who taught the Ministry of DEATH , spoke DEATH molly, OPEN tombs who speak from the GRAVE,,...and theres those, who speak Life Molly , by teaching where TRUE life can Be found.....Therefore ONE is a LIE and the Other is TRUTH...

Do you really think come judgment day( oh those in HIM have had that now) God keeps a diary  of every IDLE word man speaks...we are talking scripture Molly not everyday LIFE.

OR WE COULD PUT IT THIS WAY.

all things become NEW in the NEW C,...New body, New feet, new eyes and ears , we given a NEW HEAD,...BE IT ONLY ONE,...AND WE are  GIVEN AT pentecost  NEW TONGUES,..The symbolic purpose , is NOW to speak TRUTH and preach of the ONE WHO IS LIFE..for the OLD TONGUE,of the Flesh, being UNDERLAW, is no longer..that LYING TONGUE.

This FOR MINE Molly are the Idle WORDS spoken in Mathew...., those like the Pharisees who spoke death shall be condemed,..those who Justified through the Cross speak TRUTH with NEW tongues and are JUSTIFIED.

MOLLY ONE COULD LIST HUNDREDS of scriptures which fit like bug in a rug to support THE ABOVE .. heres a FEW

Maybe you can see a Picture developing..In James it speaks of the Tongue which Blessess and curses,,,,this Molly means they were mixedwith confusion, speaking Both LAW and the The Christ of the NEWC.....what scripture also refers as the DOUBLE MINDED MAN,..

THE WICKED TONGUE..speaks LIES..

Psa 5:9 For [there is] no faithfulness in their mouth; their inward part [is] very wickedness; their throat [is] an open sepulchre; they flatter with their tongue

Psa 12:3 The LORD shall cut off all flattering lips, [and] the tongue that speaketh proud things:check out who BOASTED Molly..and build the picture even MORE.#

Psa 34:13 Keep thy tongue from evil, and thy lips from speaking guile

Psa 64:3 Who whet their tongue like a sword, [and] bend [their bows to shoot] their arrows, [even] bitter words

Psa 109:2 For the mouth of the wicked and the mouth of the deceitful are opened against me: they have spoken against me with a lying tongue.
Psa 39:3 My heart was hot within me, while I was musing the fire burned: [then] spake I with my tongue,  

Psa 120:2 Deliver my soul, O LORD, from lying lips, [and] from a deceitful tongue

Isa 3:8 For Jerusalem is ruined, and Judah is fallen: because their tongue and their doings [are] against the LORD, to provoke the eyes of his glory

Jam 3:8 But the tongue can no """""""""""""man tame;"""""""""""" [it is] an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.  

the NEW righteous Tongue speaks TRUTH

Psa 35:28 And my tongue shall speak of thy righteousness [and] of thy praise all the day long.

Pro 10:31 The mouth of the just bringeth forth wisdom: but the froward tongue shall be cut out.    

Isa 30:27 Behold, the name of the LORD cometh from far, burning [with] his anger, and the burden [thereof is] heavy: his lips are full of indignation, and his tongue as a devouring fire:  


Isa 35:6 Then shall the lame [man] leap as an hart, and the tongue of the dumb sing: for in the wilderness shall waters break out, and streams in the desert

Mar 7:35 And straightway his ears were opened, and the string of his tongue was loosed, and he spake plain.  

The RICH MAN becomes easy to understand why his TONGUE NEEDED COOLIG

Luk 16:24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame

ONE CANNOT CONFESS UNLESS the NEW tongue is GIVEN


Rom 14:11 For it is written, [As] I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

If ya wish..see how Lips, throat, Mouth all interact with the tongue ...

blessings

[Paul Hazelwood]

So you're saying the power of the cross isn't enough?  That I'll still be judged by my words as well?  Doesn't seem accurate.

Nathan,  it is scripturally possible that the human act of saying "I accept Christ" is not the true dividing line of "saved" "unsaved"  but salvation itself is a process and true undeniable acceptance of Christ will be at a point when you are without sin.

Those who may feel they have had some conversion experience might simply be feeling emotion that is self delusional.

If a human truly accepts Christ, then what is preventing them from being perfect as Jesus?  Jesus truly accepted the will of the Father and did not falter.  Why do we falter if we fully accept?

[Nathan]

Not to sound like a broken record Paul . .but that's not how I see it at all as far as being saved.  I do agree that there's more than just a confession with your mouth . . .there needs to be . .to me .. . first and foremost a believing in your heart.  Many come to the altar believing in their heads . . .because that's what's being taught to them that they must do . . .but the relationship they have from there is denominational rather than personal.

But I don't think accepting Christ is a process . . .I think "Christian living" is due process.  and my mind is renewed daily and every day I'm maturing in that relationship.  But when it comes to perfection . . . that isn't a process . .it's an experience in that no matter how many faults you see in my flesh, I am already perfected in Christ.  Time is not more powerful than the cross . . .so salvation shouldn't come through the process of time.

To me.

[joyful1]

Question: "God helps those who help themselves - is it in the Bible?"

Answer: "God helps those who help themselves" is probably the most often quoted phrase that is not found in the Bible. This is actually a quote from Ben Franklin and it appeared in Poor Richard's Almanac in 1757. In fact the Bible teaches the opposite. God helps the helpless! Isaiah 25:4 declares, "For You have been a defense for the helpless, a defense for the needy in his distress, a refuge from the storm, a shade from the heat..." Romans 5:6 tells us, "For while we were still helpless, at the right time Christ died for the ungodly."

[Molly]

Question: "God helps those who help themselves - is it in the Bible?"

Answer: "God helps those who help themselves" is probably the most often quoted phrase that is not found in the Bible. This is actually a quote from Ben Franklin and it appeared in Poor Richard's Almanac in 1757. In fact the Bible teaches the opposite. God helps the helpless! Isaiah 25:4 declares, "For You have been a defense for the helpless, a defense for the needy in his distress, a refuge from the storm, a shade from the heat..." Romans 5:6 tells us, "For while we were still helpless, at the right time Christ died for the ungodly."

Help of the helpless, Lord, Abide with me.

--Henry Lyte, 1847, "Abide with me"

[Molly]

So you're saying the power of the cross isn't enough?  That I'll still be judged by my words as well?  Doesn't seem accurate.

Jesus was speaking to the Pharisees.  They are under the law, so they will be judged by the law.

They consider themselves under the law, so they make draconian laws that favor themselves and break the backs of the people.

If you only knew how they lie, cheat, steal, rob, and kill innocent others, you, too, would call them 'generation of vipers,' 'den of thieves,'  and 'serpents' to their faces, as did our Lord.

[Michele]

They consider themselves under the law, so they make draconian laws that favor themselves and break the backs of the people.

Molly, sounds like dracula laws...the laws of the living dead. :winkgrin:  The only motivation to follow these kind of laws would be FEAR.

Thank Goodness that perfect love casts out all fear!

When you allow fear to rule your life.....you're not truly living.  Fear has a way of slowly killing you, but now Love on the other hand...Love has the power to heal and restore, and most of all makes you free.

Choose love!