Tentmaker Forum

son of lawlessness, son of perdicten, son of satan, the one who oppose God to be the most high, he will exalted on god's seat in jew's home


So any idea who the anti-christ is?

Did you read all of the thread on 666 & the beast, that you started?  There is a lot of good info in it.

Anyway to your question:  Who is "the" antichrist?

Well there is no such thing in scripture as "the" antichrist (singular).  It is always just referred to as "antichrist" or "spirit of antichrist".  Read it for yourself in the KJV in 1 John 2:18, 1 John 2:22, 1 John 4:3, and 2 John 1:7.  Those are the all the verses that speak of "antichrist".  Now some other bibles add the word "the" in front of "antichrist", but that is not correct.

1 John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Read the plain meaning of these verses and you will quickly see that what the church teaches about "the" antichrist is completely unscriptural:
- there are many antichrists, not just one
- there were antichrists "even now" in John's day, therefore antichrist is not only a future person/persons
- if one is a liar and denies Jesus Christ, he is an antichrist and has the spirit of antichrist.  Who can say they have never lied and never denied Christ?  NO ONE.
- there are many deceivers - these deceivers are antichrist

The antichrist is not some world leader who will rise to power and all will worship while he imposes a one-world governement/currency.  No.

Who is "the" antichrist?  YOU are the antichrist.  I am the antichrist.  WE are all the antichrist!  We have all denied Christ - we all have the spirit of antichrist.  That is, until we come to confess Jesus and know the truth.

Likewise, who is the son of lawlessness, son of perdition, the one who sits on God's throne... who is that person?  It is YOU.  It is ME.  It is EVERYONE.  We all deny Christ at some point and exalt ourselves before God.

But how do we sit in the temple of God?  What is the temple of God?


1 Cor 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

2 Cor 16 .. For we are the temple of the living God...

2 Thes 2:3 Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for (that day will not come) until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.


We sit in the temple of God (our own body & self) claiming that we ourself are god!  We think we are in complete control, completely sovereign, exalting and worshiping ourself as if we were God.  We are the man of lawlessness, the son of perdition, an antichrist, when we fail to acknowledge that God is in control of our life and God is not in our temple (our body).  God is leading us whether we like it or not, but who believes it.

Make sense?

Legoman

Great post, legoman.

1 John 2:22
So every non Christian is an anti-Christ?

Quote from: WhiteWings on January 25, 2009, 07:41:49 PM
1 John 2:22
So every non Christian is an anti-Christ?

Personally, I feel everyone on earth has an anti-christ spirit.
For me, the anti-christ is part of us, part of who we are, our carnal selves. The part that is doomed. The part of us that is dying and will be consumed by the lake of fire. That is why we suffer.


A person who lived in some remote jungle all of their lives and never heard the name "Jesus" offers kindness to his neighbor...that's the love of God. A Christian harboring jealousy in his heart towards his neighbor...that's anti-christ. I don't really see it as "christian versus non-christian" because a person's beliefs are not always reflective of their actions or the condition of their heart. God works in mysterious ways and we tend to want to package people up put labels on them. God doesn't work that way.

Every knee shall bow. All humans are touched by God and all humans must contend with their own "anti-christ".
Hope I'm making sense here..

7After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.

8I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.



17These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.

18But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

19Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;

20And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.

21I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;

22Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

23Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

24And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

25And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

26But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.

27And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

--Daniel 7



The AC is the 'little horn' who speaks great words against the most High and wears out the saints of the most High.  And, he is already here, since the fourth beast (kingdom) was divided into ten horns.  He rose out of the head of the fourth beast (kingdom) after the ten horns.

Yep, you do make sense with the jungle example. Very logical in my eyes.
But it also has a problem. What about an atheist that is just as caring as the person in the jungle?
The atheist lives in a country where s/he has heard often about Christianity but rejects it.
Is that an anti christ.

John 2:18 seems to say there are at least 2 types of anti-Christ.
It says there are many during the time of writing. (plural)
But it also mentions the one to come. (singular)
It doesn't say "the" or "a"; but to me it reads like anti-christ is used as a name.
Baiscly I read throught the ages there will be many anti-christs but at the end there is the biggest anti-christ of all.

Quote from: WhiteWings on January 25, 2009, 08:33:28 PM

John 2:18 seems to say there are at least 2 types of anti-Christ.
It says there are many during the time of writing. (plural)
But it also mentions the one to come. (singular)
It doesn't say "the" or "a"; but to me it reads like anti-christ is used as a name.
Baiscly I read throught the ages there will be many anti-christs but at the end there is the biggest anti-christ of all.

Yes, he's the 'little horn' and he's here.

The book of Daniel describes two systems growing up side by side.

2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

--2 Thess 2


"a falling away" [first]

G646
ἀποστασία
apostasia
ap-os-tas-ee'-ah
Feminine of the same as G647; defection from truth (properly the state), ("apostasy"): - falling away, forsake.


Apostasy!

There is only one other called 'son of perdition' in the Bible and that is Judas, who walked with Jesus and betrayed him with a kiss.

Jesus himself calls Judas the son of perdition.

John 17:12
While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.


"perdition"

G684
ἀπώλεια
apōleia
ap-o'-li-a
From a presumed derivative of G622; ruin or loss (physical, spiritual or eternal): - damnable (-nation), destruction, die, perdition, X perish, pernicious ways, waste.

Quote from: WhiteWings on January 25, 2009, 08:33:28 PM
Yep, you do make sense with the jungle example. Very logical in my eyes.
But it also has a problem. What about an atheist that is just as caring as the person in the jungle?
The atheist lives in a country where s/he has heard often about Christianity but rejects it.
Is that an anti christ.

Yes. But.... an atheist also has the love of God... the atheist also can reach out in kindness..
All that is love... is from God. God works in all of our lives in different ways.
The "Christian" being not different from the "atheist" in God's eyes, in that respect, I believe.
We're all His children.
And He is doing His work in all of us.

Just because an person rejects christianity, doesn't necessarily mean they reject God.
They may be only rejecting the lies.... and not able (or maybe in some cases not wiling) to see the truths.

We're all on different paths...but again, thank God... every knee SHALL BOW! woo hoo!

Some atheists are more loving than some christians.
Little do they know where the love is coming from...but one day they will know and they shall bow.

We're all threads in the grand tapestry that God is weaving...we can't see the big picture now, but one day we all will.
It's going to be one heck of a beautiful tapestry.

Well... just my thoughts.

Quote from: WhiteWings on January 25, 2009, 07:41:49 PM
1 John 2:22
So every non Christian is an anti-Christ?

Yes you could say that.  And many Christians also have the spirit of antichrist, for they also deny Jesus.  Example:

"Jesus came to save the world right?"

"YES"

"But will he save the world?"

"OH no no, some will not be saved."

Hmm.  Big DENIAL right there - Jesus is not going to do what he said he will do.  They deny the saving power of Jesus - whether athiest or Roman Catholic or Protestant.

One has the "spirit of antichrist" - until, UNTIL, one has the "spirit of Christ".  Seems to make sense to me.  JMHO I could be wrong.

Legoman

There are many writings in the early Church that make the AntiChrist the equivalent of the Beast of the book of Revelation.  That's not a new teaching that came in with Dispensationalism in the 1830s.  Grant Jeffrey and Perry Stone in their books and videos document the prevalence of that teaching in the early Church although the early Church didn't teach dispensational premillenialism.  That came in later through Zoarastrianism.  I wish I still had the link to the online paper from someone in Australia that had written such a clear paper on that.  It was an amazing paper.  I haven't been able to find it in months and I'm starting to get angered that I didn't simply download that whole small website that was devoted to that paper. 

The AntiChrist according to John in 1John is anyone that denies the Father and Son and the incarnation of Christ Jesus in Bethlehem and in His resurrection.  So, that covers docetism as well as writings of the Enlightenment that tried to say that Jesus never existed.  That also covers Islam whose Koran and other writings say repeatedly that the doctrine of God having a Son is blasphemy and infidelity to God. 

As the reality of big brother government is growing larger and larger as the founding Fathers of the United States warned that if countries founded as republics ever degenerated into democracies then that would inevitably degenerate into socialism and then into dictatorships and many countries have tried to somewhat mirror the success of the United States's Constitutional Republic but have become democracies instead, I have to be honest with the facts that a singular individual may very well in fact someday sit at the top of all of the current world's chaos and bring some semblance of order to it -- although for sinister ends. 

Gary Amirault startled me a couple of months ago on the phone with acknowledging the possibility of one evil person ruling the world someday prior to the return of Christ Jesus that's promised in Acts 1.  We were talking about so many other things and he was a little pressed for time, so if he was looking for feedback at the time on that, I didn't have any to offer at the time.  And at the time, my thinking was still pretty far away from the possibility.  Were that to ever happen, though, there's nothing about that that necessitates a premillenial view of Revelation 19 that tries to make that spiritual vision of what's going on in heavenly places at God's right hand into the Second Coming.  Joel's prophecy about the same events in the Old Testament points instead towards the Outpouring of the Holy Spirit that's the result of fasting and prayer as what brings that AntiChrist system and all of his locusts to an end. 

Zechariah's prophecy about Israel beholding the one that they've pierced doesn't need to have a different fulfillment than it's had in each of our lives with God simply opening our eyes.  I'm saying this because the Hal Lindsey school of thought tries to connect things in that way that because the Beast is liable to be an actual individual that that necessitates their premillenial diagrams of how history will play out when their attempts of proving that the "c" that their "a" and "b" add up to leads to that conclusion isn't the way that most of the Body of Christ either historically or presently reads these Scriptures, even if they allow for the incarnated boogey man scenario that dances with the devil by the pale moonlight.

With no thought other than the thought and reasoning of one who has read the scripture and verse, of God's Word called the Bible (book), I will accept the revealings
of Sparrow and Legoman. Should one stop and consider with reason... the antichrist
most cetainly is man, Adam's nature. Should you seek elsewhere,you are seeking,
only a desire to form more excuses for man and his nature. THERE ARE MANY ANTI CHRISTS!  Great Peace to all. Dave

willieH: Hi Legoman... :hithere:

WOW bro!  I read this and it felt as if it were one of my own posts!

RIGHT freaking ON!   :first:

Couldn't agree with you more!  :goodpost:

Quote from: legoman on January 22, 2009, 02:42:39 PM
Did you read all of the thread on 666 & the beast, that you started?  There is a lot of good info in it.

Anyway to your question:  Who is "the" antichrist?

Well there is no such thing in scripture as "the" antichrist (singular).  It is always just referred to as "antichrist" or "spirit of antichrist".  Read it for yourself in the KJV in 1 John 2:18, 1 John 2:22, 1 John 4:3, and 2 John 1:7.  Those are the all the verses that speak of "antichrist".  Now some other bibles add the word "the" in front of "antichrist", but that is not correct.

1 John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Read the plain meaning of these verses and you will quickly see that what the church teaches about "the" antichrist is completely unscriptural:
- there are many antichrists, not just one
- there were antichrists "even now" in John's day, therefore antichrist is not only a future person/persons
- if one is a liar and denies Jesus Christ, he is an antichrist and has the spirit of antichrist.  Who can say they have never lied and never denied Christ?  NO ONE.
- there are many deceivers - these deceivers are antichrist

The antichrist is not some world leader who will rise to power and all will worship while he imposes a one-world governement/currency.  No.

Who is "the" antichrist?  YOU are the antichrist.  I am the antichrist.  WE are all the antichrist!  We have all denied Christ - we all have the spirit of antichrist.  That is, until we come to confess Jesus and know the truth.

Likewise, who is the son of lawlessness, son of perdition, the one who sits on God's throne... who is that person?  It is YOU.  It is ME.  It is EVERYONE.  We all deny Christ at some point and exalt ourselves before God.

But how do we sit in the temple of God?  What is the temple of God?


1 Cor 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

2 Cor 16 .. For we are the temple of the living God...

2 Thes 2:3 Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for (that day will not come) until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.


We sit in the temple of God (our own body & self) claiming that we ourself are god!  We think we are in complete control, completely sovereign, exalting and worshiping ourself as if we were God.  We are the man of lawlessness, the son of perdition, an antichrist, when we fail to acknowledge that God is in control of our life and God is not in our temple (our body).  God is leading us whether we like it or not, but who believes it.

Make sense?

Legoman

:laughing7:  willieH     :laughing7:

Quote from: legoman on January 25, 2009, 11:36:10 PM

Quote from: WhiteWings on January 25, 2009, 07:41:49 PM
1 John 2:22
So every non Christian is an anti-Christ?

Yes you could say that.  And many Christians also have the spirit of antichrist, for they also deny Jesus.  Example:

"Jesus came to save the world right?"

"YES"

"But will he save the world?"

"OH no no, some will not be saved."

Hmm.  Big DENIAL right there - Jesus is not going to do what he said he will do.  They deny the saving power of Jesus - whether athiest or Roman Catholic or Protestant.

One has the "spirit of antichrist" - until, UNTIL, one has the "spirit of Christ".  Seems to make sense to me.  JMHO I could be wrong.

IMHO misunderstanding isn't denial. It may seem odd but I think no Christian denies Jesus.
(Note: How can you be a CHRISTian without Christ?)
Some somehow read in the Bible that Christ isn't a real person or something similar.
Just as some read ET and others UR. I think none deny anything on purpose . They think they are on the right track.
The effect is the same. On that I can fully agree.

Question. Bit off-topic perhaps.
Is it correct to state:
- Anti-Christ=tare=flesh=sinner=goat
- (in) Christ=wheat=spirit=rightous=sheep
- People are dual nature

Then think about the verses where the goats and sheep are separated. The goat are kicked into the fire IIRC.
Mankind is just a beast (goat) until God put the spirit (sheep) inside.
God just undoes that by seperating goat and sheep again and permanently destroys the goats.
How insane does that sound on a scale of 1 to 666 ? :laughing7:

Quote from: WhiteWings on January 27, 2009, 09:53:01 AM
IMHO misunderstanding isn't denial. It may seem odd but I think no Christian denies Jesus.
(Note: How can you be a CHRISTian without Christ?)
Some somehow read in the Bible that Christ isn't a real person or something similar.
Just as some read ET and others UR. I think none deny anything on purpose . They think they are on the right track.
The effect is the same. On that I can fully agree.

Hi WhiteWings,

Yeah I think I basically agree with you.  Misunderstanding is not denial.  Many Christians believe in ET only because that is what has been taught to them.  They truly believe God is love, and can't quite reconcile how hell fits in, but they proceed on faith.  They know that God is all-loving, and follow that example, even though they don't understand hell or the Lake of fire.  Others fully embrace hell and are happy to send you there (they are a Christian without Christ!).    And of course what about the guy in the Jungle who has never heard of Christ, but believes there must be a God, and realizes he is not worthy, but is hopeful that God will save him?  I think he could have the spirit of Christ too, if only by divine revelation (isn't it always that way though?).  In anycase, only God knows their hearts, and who has a spirit of Christ and a spirit of antichrist.

Matthew 7:21 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

Suffice it to say on Judgement day there will be a lot of surprises.  Many Christians who believe in ET will not make it into the kingdom on that day.  Many who believe in UR will also not make it in on that day.  And likewise there will be some who will enter into the kingdom who did not expect to.  They will be humbled to be part of the chosen few.

Mark 10:31 But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.

Belief in ET or belief in UR is not what gets you into the Kingdom of Heaven when Christ returns.  But if you still have the spirit of antichrist, you will not get into the Kingdom until you are converted and take on the spirit of Christ.  That is what the lake of fire is for.

Matthew 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

To be honest I don't think anyone can say for sure if they will make it into the Kingdom when Christ returns.  I know I myself am not sure.  And scripture tells us only he who "endures to the end will be saved."  This is speaking of when Christ returns, at the first resurrection.  This implies there is a process of conversion, which will take your entire life (or longer in the lake of fire).  We won't know if we are in the first resurrection until after our death.  However we do have the assurance that we will be saved, as Jesus is the savior of the world!

The best we can do now is "allow" God to guide us into his will, with the realization that everything that is happening is for a purpose and is part of God's plan.

Peace,
Legoman

Quote from: willieH on January 27, 2009, 08:46:35 AM
willieH: Hi Legoman... :hithere:

WOW bro!  I read this and it felt as if it were one of my own posts!

RIGHT freaking ON!   :first:

Couldn't agree with you more!  :goodpost:

Thanks willie!

Quote from: MartinGary Amirault startled me a couple of months ago on the phone with acknowledging the possibility of one evil person ruling the world someday prior to the return of Christ Jesus that's promised in Acts 1.

He must be reading prophecy because that is what prophecy says--that even the elect would be deceived if that were possible.

If it doesn't happen, it won't be for lack of trying--because they are trying as hard as possible to elevate man above God--and one man in particular, who Daniel calls 'the little horn,' 'the son of perdition.'

Quote
John 2:18 seems to say there are at least 2 types of anti-Christ.
It says there are many during the time of writing. (plural)
But it also mentions the one to come. (singular)
It doesn't say "the" or "a"; but to me it reads like anti-christ is used as a name.
Baiscly I read throught the ages there will be many anti-christs but at the end there is the biggest anti-christ of all.

In John 2:18 it just says "ye have heard that antichrist shall come".  This could be singular or plural, or just generally speaking a "spirit of antichrist."

Regarding the possibility of one final really evil yet sneakily deceptive world leader dude(s):  I have no doubt it could come to that.  And this person or persons would probably have the "spirit of antichrist", just like all of the other really bad (and not so bad) leaders ... Hitler, Sadam, etc.  Its actually looking fairly likely that the world will go this way with all the new big brother technology, the united nations, all the NWO conspiracy stuff, etc.  They may even set up some "mark of the beast" buy/sell one-world currency system.  But I don't believe that is what Revelations is talking about - although on the surface, Revelations could be a shadow of things to come.

The beast in Revelations ties into this as well.  As I stated in another post, I believe the beast is us - our own ego's -  we believe we are in control and sovereign.  We succumb to our beastly nature.  The false prophet causes us to worship the beast... this is not talking about some final ONE THE ANTICHRIST.  It is talking about us worshiping our selves. 

Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

What is this great deception that is being talked about?  Most people would not be tricked into worshiping another human, yet everyone (at some point) has worshipped themselves.  We worship our own beastly nature as we think we are in control of our destiny.  We become our own god.

Anyone here feel like they have been deceived in their life?  Have you fallen prey to this great deception that "deceives the whole world"?  If you say no, then you probably are deceived right now  :winkgrin: Satan uses the false prophet to cause us to worship the beast.  Most of the population doesn't even realize this deception.  That is why it is a deception, because you don't realize it  :winkgrin:  It would deceive the elect if it were possible.

So when judgement day comes, many will see that they were deceived, and there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.  They will feel great shame over being deceived... but it will bring about humility and eventually, repentance.

JMHO
Legoman

My mom says it's this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xf2asA2J85w (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xf2asA2J85w)

Leggoman . . . dead on every comment bro.  Everyone that's been churched cringes in fear at the mere mentioning of the antichrist . .truth is . . .he's in every one of us.

Romans 8
Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.


If ya got a mind, ya got an antichrist.

 :cloud9: Exactly..... :thumbsup:

Quote from: Nathan on March 06, 2009, 06:53:06 PM
If ya got a mind, ya got an antichrist.

ha! That would make a great bumper sticker... :laughing7:

seriously though, that's really good, Nathan. :thumbsup:

 :cloud9: That would make a good bumper sticker, LOL! I'm so tired of all the stuff on the net about who THE Antichrist is...  :sigh: Blessings.....

I wonder how many pastors would honk at you and give you the finger for displaying it!!

 :cloud9: no doubt.... :laughing7:

Quote from: Nathan on March 07, 2009, 05:26:44 PM
I wonder how many pastors would honk at you and give you the finger for displaying it!!

Are you out of your mind?  :laughing7:

Wow, no one's a bit disturbed by Maitreya?

Hey everyone, newbie here!  :grin:

Newbie to these truths (2 months) and the board as well... Hope you all are doing well!

Just a brief comment of "WOW"... with all the revelations that the Holy Spirit has made real within me the last few weeks and reading through this topic... I can "see" this being the case.

I look forward to reading, studying and of course asking our "Dad" alot more questions (prayer) as the Holy Spirit continues to remove the veils!

May God continue to enlighten us all & crush that pesky little horn that has a form of Godliness, but denies God's power! (my interpretation) I still can't believe how deceived we have all been... Jesus is truly amazing!

Peace & love,

Dave  :newb:

Quote from: Akira Takahashi on March 08, 2009, 05:10:02 AM
Wow, no one's a bit disturbed by Maitreya?

No, I'm not bothered by the outlook a man may have to bring people together of all sorts of people in hope to spread a message that might make a difference in the world.

Of all the Christian warnings of end times and anti-Christ, all the islamic garbage of infidels and other nonsense has done more to promote discord, hatred and deception among people, I cannot see any "one" man being able to do a better job tha.


People reject it, but we are all beasts and we are all anti-Christs and that is not to demean anyone or promote a guilt complex it is a reality that if recognized will turn fear instantly into hope.

How much hope could be flourished if there was no one teaching the fear of end times and to be on the lookout for this one man that doesn't even exist in that manner?


How much better can we become, realizing that each of us doing something better each day effectively will defeat the anti-christ without fail?

Here is something on the "antichrist" from way back


There have been many accusations made towards certain individuals whom were (are) believed by the nominal denominational church to be the one to fulfill this last day's time prophecy (or will as time progresses). As usual the church is a few cards short in their deck of understanding simply because they are disobedient to Gods Word and treat as if it was some sort of elementary history book. Rather then listen to them lets take a look at what His Word has to say about this one who is expected to usher in other false last day prophecies.

1Jo 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

There are few obvious truths in this verse that have been discarded by these "last day" experts and they are as follows

1. It was already the last day when John penned this.
2. The antichrist already existed in the world at the time this writing was first written.
3. They are plural in number yet singular in nature.
4. Finally John is letting us know that even though there are many who look for one antichrist, he is enlightened to the future church and has been allowed to see this false teaching of the church to and proclaimed so with "as ye have heard".

So to continue on with breaking with tradition and false teachings we need to confirm the definition of the word "anti" as we already know that "Christ" is the Spirit of God in flesh. To do that we need only to do a little simple research to break the word down so that we can separate the word "anti" from Christ. I will use the online blue letter Bible as well as a Strong software installed to confirm what the antichrist really is.

Antichristos {an-tee'-khris-tos} that is from 473 and 5547. The Strong's Number 473 matches the Greek word "anti"

G473
anti "an-tee'"
A primary particle; opposite, that is, instead or because of, for, in the room of. Often used in composition to denote contrast, requital, substitution, correspondence, etc.

Now the true meaning of "in place of" instead of "in addition to" comes to light but just to make sure that we are not departing on how this word is to be understood in the Bible let us confirm it with comparing it with other scripture in accordance with 1Cor.2: 13 and Isa. 28:9-13

In Matt.2: 22 the phrase translated into English as "in the room" is the Greek word "anti" and means "in place of his father". This also witnessed just a few chapters later in Mt.5: 38 as in "eye for an eye". The translated word "for" is once again the Greek word "anti" and is used as "in exchange for". Having provided the necessary two witnesses to prove doctrine and no witness (verse) available to disprove this doctrine we can see that once again there has been a twist from how the early authors of scripture wrote and taught new believers compared to what is taught to them today.

Now we already know that Christ is the Spirit of God in flesh just as man is the spirit of man in flesh and that we (believers) have through grace been given the Holy Spirit of God to live by and guide us unto all truth. Unfortunately we have not been rid of the spirit of man, the unclean spirit that has been passed down unto all of mankind since Adam because it still exists within us. The Apostle Paul called this the "law of sin" that he found to be still remain in his members after his conversion and Jesus Christ taught of it in the parable of the unclean spirit.

Mt. 12: 43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none. 44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. 45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.

So we see that while even though we have been given the free gift of salvation in the very presence of the Spirit of God within us, we are still dogged by what Paul referred to as the "Old Man". This is why he and the other apostles "died daily" and refused to allow this old fallen spirit of man to rule within them by keeping the flesh under subjection to the risen Christ by remaining crucified with Him in the flesh but risen by the Spirit of God.

We are the temple of God and this is where the antichrist will rule from if we allow it as he (our old man) is always trying to return to the heart "in place of Christ" to rule over the temple of God. This is why we are still not all clean just as Jesus spoke to the disciples prior to when he washed their feet. When we (those who do not fall to the sin of unbelief) undergo this second cleansing we will appear as the High Priest did in He.9:28. Always remember that the Christians in the Bible were told to be able to recieve the "end of their faith the salvation of the soul" even though they had already been "saved" by todays standards. (1Pet.1: 9)

The church staying occupied by what they think is yet to come has allowed Satan to rule from far to many "temples of God" in place of Christ and is why Jesus speaks of the church in Re.2: 9,13 as the synagogue and seat (place of authority) of Satan. In the individual it is the heart and corporately it is the church that is run from the pulpit and not the pew. Granted Satan knows the scriptures well and will deceive many through manipulating the world as one of his kingdoms and through the unregenerate man. This is expected but the unfortunate part is he already rules from where he "ought not" and that my friends, has just been revealed to you. So let us do as our Lord and Savoir has shown us and turn over the tables of the moneychangers (law breakers) and those who sold sacrifices for worship (those that are paid tithes in exchange for lies) that still exist in the outer court of the temple.

Peace and Blessings

Douglas

Quote from: legoman on January 22, 2009, 02:42:39 PM
Did you read all of the thread on 666 & the beast, that you started?  There is a lot of good info in it.

Anyway to your question:  Who is "the" antichrist?

Well there is no such thing in scripture as "the" antichrist (singular).  It is always just referred to as "antichrist" or "spirit of antichrist".  Read it for yourself in the KJV in 1 John 2:18, 1 John 2:22, 1 John 4:3, and 2 John 1:7.  Those are the all the verses that speak of "antichrist".  Now some other bibles add the word "the" in front of "antichrist", but that is not correct.

1 John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

Read the plain meaning of these verses and you will quickly see that what the church teaches about "the" antichrist is completely unscriptural:
- there are many antichrists, not just one
- there were antichrists "even now" in John's day, therefore antichrist is not only a future person/persons
- if one is a liar and denies Jesus Christ, he is an antichrist and has the spirit of antichrist.  Who can say they have never lied and never denied Christ?  NO ONE.
- there are many deceivers - these deceivers are antichrist

The antichrist is not some world leader who will rise to power and all will worship while he imposes a one-world governement/currency.  No.

Who is "the" antichrist?  YOU are the antichrist.  I am the antichrist.  WE are all the antichrist!  We have all denied Christ - we all have the spirit of antichrist.  That is, until we come to confess Jesus and know the truth.

Likewise, who is the son of lawlessness, son of perdition, the one who sits on God's throne... who is that person?  It is YOU.  It is ME.  It is EVERYONE.  We all deny Christ at some point and exalt ourselves before God.

But how do we sit in the temple of God?  What is the temple of God?


1 Cor 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

2 Cor 16 .. For we are the temple of the living God...

2 Thes 2:3 Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for (that day will not come) until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness[a] is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.


We sit in the temple of God (our own body & self) claiming that we ourself are god!  We think we are in complete control, completely sovereign, exalting and worshiping ourself as if we were God.  We are the man of lawlessness, the son of perdition, an antichrist, when we fail to acknowledge that God is in control of our life and God is not in our temple (our body).  God is leading us whether we like it or not, but who believes it.

Make sense?

Legoman

Preach it brotha!  :thumbsup:

Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 08, 2009, 06:07:31 AM

Quote from: Akira Takahashi on March 08, 2009, 05:10:02 AM
Wow, no one's a bit disturbed by Maitreya?

No, I'm not bothered by the outlook a man may have to bring people together of all sorts of people in hope to spread a message that might make a difference in the world.

Of all the Christian warnings of end times and anti-Christ, all the islamic garbage of infidels and other nonsense has done more to promote discord, hatred and deception among people, I cannot see any "one" man being able to do a better job tha.


People reject it, but we are all beasts and we are all anti-Christs and that is not to demean anyone or promote a guilt complex it is a reality that if recognized will turn fear instantly into hope.

How much hope could be flourished if there was no one teaching the fear of end times and to be on the lookout for this one man that doesn't even exist in that manner?


How much better can we become, realizing that each of us doing something better each day effectively will defeat the anti-christ without fail?

That's a good answer.  I'm personally very sick and tired of being talked to about the End Times and how the Rapture is coming very shortly.  Everyone around me is telling me to be prepared, all the prophecies have been fulfilled, etc.  My mom is pretty certain that we'll all be caught up in the Rapture soon, with the exception of one of my brothers, and I'm struggling with the fact that I'm just attached to this world for the time being.  As a Christian, I know I'm not supposed to be.  However, as a 22-year-old, I still want to see where my life might lead.  Right now it's not going anywhere, as I'm out of work, but that doesn't mean I'm doomed yet.  I'm really struggling with this, because it's all that's talked about in my house, and I feel guilty over it.

The problem with Revelations is that everyone takes it way too literally, I think.  That, and they take metaphorical passages and try to replace it with something literal in today's world.  I can count on one hand the number of times I've read that book, as it both frightens and confuses me.

Well, I was pretty sure that G.W. Bush was the anti-Christ  :grin:  But the right-wing evangelicals are afraid that Obama is the anti-Christ  :icon_jokercolor:  It does get a bit silly.    Kind of makes me think of a scripture in Matthew chapter 20:20-23

Then the Zebedee's wife came to Jesus with her sons. She bowed down in front of him to ask him for a favor.  He asked her, "What do you want?" She said to him, "Promise that in your kingdom these two sons of mine will sit on your right and on your left."  Jesus replied, "You don't realize what you're asking. Can you drink from the cup that I'm going to drink from?"  They told him, "We can."  He said to them, "You will indeed drink from my cup. But it's not up to me to grant you a seat at my right hand or at my left. These positions have already been prepared for others by my Father."

Quote from: Akira Takahashi on March 09, 2009, 05:52:37 AM

That's a good answer.  I'm personally very sick and tired of being talked to about the End Times and how the Rapture is coming very shortly. 

Shortly is an open ended term when it comes to the end times.  I don't care if it's the end times, don't give one rip about it.   Lets get it over with already and quit yapping about em christians.   

In the 70's akira  I was in a church and the evangelist sold his great book on the end times coming sooooooooon in the year 2000....

Heck I guess all those Christians going on and on and on about it have been  "uuuheeem"  "Left behind".   Including the minister........

Every generation before us felt that Christ could come back imminently during "their" generation . . . I just don't see why we're supposed to be so focussed on something that may or may not come in our generation . . .while at the same time . .consider the lillies . . they don't toil or spin . .they don't worry and watch . . .they just "are".

Quote from: Nathan on March 09, 2009, 09:52:47 PM
Every generation before us felt that Christ could come back imminently during "their" generation . . . I just don't see why we're supposed to be so focussed on something that may or may not come in our generation . . .while at the same time . .consider the lillies . . they don't toil or spin . .they don't worry and watch . . .they just "are".

Especially when we are told to watch and pray.

Still waiting?  :mshock:

Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 09, 2009, 10:01:20 PM

Quote from: Nathan on March 09, 2009, 09:52:47 PM
Every generation before us felt that Christ could come back imminently during "their" generation . . . I just don't see why we're supposed to be so focussed on something that may or may not come in our generation . . .while at the same time . .consider the lillies . . they don't toil or spin . .they don't worry and watch . . .they just "are".

Especially when we are told to watch and pray.

"They" were told to watch and pray for the end of the religious system was about to be violently removed from them.  (70 AD.)There was no indication that God's intention was for the church to watch and pray for something that wasn't going to happen.

Quote from: Nathan on March 10, 2009, 02:44:58 PM

Quote from: Paul Hazelwood on March 09, 2009, 10:01:20 PM

Quote from: Nathan on March 09, 2009, 09:52:47 PM
Every generation before us felt that Christ could come back imminently during "their" generation . . . I just don't see why we're supposed to be so focussed on something that may or may not come in our generation . . .while at the same time . .consider the lillies . . they don't toil or spin . .they don't worry and watch . . .they just "are".

Especially when we are told to watch and pray.

"They" were told to watch and pray for the end of the religious system was about to be violently removed from them.  (70 AD.)There was no indication that God's intention was for the church to watch and pray for something that wasn't going to happen.

Thats right, the whole religious system is looking for something that will never come.


Mk 14:38 Watch and pray lest you may be entering into trial. The spirit indeed is eager, yet the flesh is infirm."

Mk 13:33 Beware! Be vigilant and pray, for you are not aware when the era is.

Mk 13:35 Watch, then, for you are not aware when the lord of the house is coming, at evening, or midnight, or cockcrowing, or morning,

Mk 13:36 that, coming suddenly, he may not be finding you drowsing.




None of that has anything to do with end times and I personally couldn't care less what context it was in 2000 years ago. 

It has to do with being aware of the kingdom that is at hand now.   Had I been drowsing and not being aware I would have missed out on some wonderful events of my life that have taken place recently and are of the kingdom. (of course the religious system would be completely blind to them).  I was not aware of when, but I do know to look out so when they appear I see them

 :cloud9: The only appearing I really concern myself with is HIS appearing, as He appears to those that look for Him. I see Him in the clouds on here every day.  :winkgrin:

Quote from: Cardinal on March 10, 2009, 05:24:18 PM
:cloud9: The only appearing I really concern myself with is HIS appearing, as He appears to those that look for Him. I see Him in the clouds on here every day.  :winkgrin:

Amen Sis

Do you think that the awareness that the antichrist (the falling away) is not going to walk on earth as one individual will soon translate into the knowledge that "the gathering" of a many membered body coming to be "in Christ' means not only will we not see one individual as the antichrist neither will the world see one individual as Christ walk on earth again ?....... words that would have gotten one burned at the stake at one time.

Blessings

Doug

Quote from: Livelystone on March 10, 2009, 05:40:06 PM

Quote from: Cardinal on March 10, 2009, 05:24:18 PM
:cloud9: The only appearing I really concern myself with is HIS appearing, as He appears to those that look for Him. I see Him in the clouds on here every day.  :winkgrin:

Amen Sis

Do you think that the awareness that the antichrist (the falling away) is not going to walk on earth as one individual will soon translate into the knowledge that "the gathering" of a many membered body coming to be "in Christ' means not only will we not see one individual as the antichrist neither will the world see one individual as Christ walk on earth again ?....... words that would have gotten one burned at the stake at one time.

Blessings

Doug

It's a concept I have only recently become aware of--that the Christ is a hologram.  Then I found that recent experiments are proving the universe is holographic.  Anyway, now that I have become aware of it,  I see lots of people coming into the same awareness.  Christ doesn't come alone--he comes with clouds.

"hologram"

Greek

holos= whole

gramma=message


each piece contains the whole message

God appeared to Moses in the clouds over the Mercy Seat that came from the incense that represent the prayers of the Saints........ so He appears unto us in our prayers.

The scriptures say that Jesus is to remain the the right hand of God until all His enemies are made His footstool ...... and says so seven times with the last time indicating that Jesus is waiting for us while the church has ben sitting on their duff waiting for Him.

Blessings

Quote from: Molly on March 10, 2009, 05:48:44 PM

Quote from: Livelystone on March 10, 2009, 05:40:06 PM

Quote from: Cardinal on March 10, 2009, 05:24:18 PM
:cloud9: The only appearing I really concern myself with is HIS appearing, as He appears to those that look for Him. I see Him in the clouds on here every day.  :winkgrin:

Amen Sis

Do you think that the awareness that the antichrist (the falling away) is not going to walk on earth as one individual will soon translate into the knowledge that "the gathering" of a many membered body coming to be "in Christ' means not only will we not see one individual as the antichrist neither will the world see one individual as Christ walk on earth again ?....... words that would have gotten one burned at the stake at one time.

Blessings

Doug

It's a concept I have only recently become aware of--that the Christ is a hologram.  Then I found that recent experiments are proving the universe is holographic.  Anyway, now that I have become aware of it,  I see lots of people coming into the same awareness.  Christ doesn't come alone--he comes with clouds.

"hologram"

Greek

holos= whole

gramma=message


each piece contains the whole message

Doug and Molly, great words. Molly, that hologram insight speaks much to me right now.

cp

Quote from: Cardinal on March 10, 2009, 05:24:18 PM
:cloud9: The only appearing I really concern myself with is HIS appearing, as He appears to those that look for Him. I see Him in the clouds on here every day.  :winkgrin:

Good morning sis! (or afternoon...depending where you live :bigGrin:)

I love this that you wrote....and is so true!

I see Him here too.... :cloud9:

I love to think about the moment when He will pull back the curtain and all of His son's and daughters throughout the earth will be MANIFESTED ....to share in HIS GLORY....I can imagine but I know that I still cannot even comprehend what that will be like.

Wow.

I also believe that He (Jesus/Yahshua) himself will appear along with all the saints that are IN CHRIST. I know some don't think that way....but I do. So many within the 'church system' are still looking for the singular Jesus...not the corporate one....and for those especially I believe they will have their heart's desire come true...to see Him....and He will reveal the truth to them that He has brought many son's to glory and not to be afraid of His brother's and sister's because He that is JOINED to the Lord is ONE SPIRIT....and as He is so are WE in the earth....whewww....! :bigGrin: :happyclap: :ginlove:

I also wanted to send a SHOUT OUT to "LIVELYSTONE".....just wanted to let you know that I have been richly blessed by your blog....what a glorious brother you are! To Father be praised! :dsunny:

Be blessed Tentmaker Family!
DaughterofDavid

Quote from: Livelystone on March 10, 2009, 05:40:06 PM

Quote from: Cardinal on March 10, 2009, 05:24:18 PM
:cloud9: The only appearing I really concern myself with is HIS appearing, as He appears to those that look for Him. I see Him in the clouds on here every day.  :winkgrin:

Amen Sis

Do you think that the awareness that the antichrist (the falling away) is not going to walk on earth as one individual will soon translate into the knowledge that "the gathering" of a many membered body coming to be "in Christ' means not only will we not see one individual as the antichrist neither will the world see one individual as Christ walk on earth again ?....... words that would have gotten one burned at the stake at one time.

Blessings



Doug

I see DaughterofDavid has my same thoughts in mind . . .but I'll say it anyway . . .for me, the falling away is not people from Christ . . .but it's the veil from the mind . . .when it falls away, it will become clear who it is that is standing in my temple . . .and when the revelation of that takes place in people, they will be able to overthrow that abomination of desolation within them and manifest as the Sons of God we all are.

Quote from: Livelystone on March 10, 2009, 05:40:06 PM

Quote from: Cardinal on March 10, 2009, 05:24:18 PM
:cloud9: The only appearing I really concern myself with is HIS appearing, as He appears to those that look for Him. I see Him in the clouds on here every day.  :winkgrin:

Amen Sis

Do you think that the awareness that the antichrist (the falling away) is not going to walk on earth as one individual will soon translate into the knowledge that "the gathering" of a many membered body coming to be "in Christ' means not only will we not see one individual as the antichrist neither will the world see one individual as Christ walk on earth again ?....... words that would have gotten one burned at the stake at one time.

Blessings Doug

:cloud9: Absolutely, I think He's going to appear in a many-membered body of fully matured Sons, as in one loaf of bread/Word that's been thru the fire of experience, that is going to roll (not of their own momentum) down the mountain of God and destroy all the Midianites. Midianite means division, as in the carnal mind that divides us from the mind of Christ and the Father, ie. we are only separated from Him in our minds.

Not that anyone is to take my word for it, it's all in the Word, but I have also been shown this in dreams and visions. They are going to walk in total power and authority over this realm, something He has let me feel twice (while awake) for about 5 seconds the first time, and about 10 minutes the second time, and it is indescribable. But He cannot give it to anyone whose heart has not been cleansed of all motives other than HIS. The reason being, the tares within us are raised up together, and if not bound (as they were in me at the time) or eliminated completely they would raise up and seize the opportunity to destroy. Blessings....

Quote from: Livelystone on March 10, 2009, 06:01:10 PM
The scriptures say that Jesus is to remain the the right hand of God until all His enemies are made His footstool ...... and says so seven times with the last time indicating that Jesus is waiting for us while the church has been sitting on their duff waiting for Him.

:cloud9: Which is probably why we were told to enter the throne room BOLDLY.....and yet most sit waiting to fly away......sad. Blessings.....

Card, you and Nathan are hitting stuff right on the head here.  :thumbsup:

By reading this thread, I feel like I'm being yanked out of the ground by my roots.  Deep stuff and great food for thought.  Right now, my roots are still groping for the ground they sat comfortably in for so many years, but I may have to relocate.

Quote from: Cardinal on March 10, 2009, 06:20:38 PM

Quote from: Livelystone on March 10, 2009, 06:01:10 PM
The scriptures say that Jesus is to remain the the right hand of God until all His enemies are made His footstool ...... and says so seven times with the last time indicating that Jesus is waiting for us while the church has been sitting on their duff waiting for Him.

:cloud9: Which is probably why we were told to enter the throne room BOLDLY.....and yet most sit waiting to fly away......sad. Blessings.....

Awesome thoughts, Livelystone and Cardinal!  Profound.  I find that God continues to feed us profound thoughts daily, beyond all we ever imagined he would show us!   Do you know that the bible used to be nothing but death to me?  Wow!  I am amazed by the Spirit.

:girlheart:  Anne

Quote from: Akira Takahashi on March 11, 2009, 04:31:21 AM
By reading this thread, I feel like I'm being yanked out of the ground by my roots.  Deep stuff and great food for thought.  Right now, my roots are still groping for the ground they sat comfortably in for so many years, but I may have to relocate.

:cloud9: LOL, liked the way you phrased that.....relocate to your roots being in the sky drawing sustenance from it and not the earth, and you'll be an upside down tree, which is His intention. Blessings....

Quote from: Livelystone on March 08, 2009, 08:40:16 AM
Here is something on the "antichrist" from way back


  the church is a few cards short in their deck of understanding 
1. It was already the last day when John penned this.
2. The antichrist already existed in the world at the time this writing was first written.
   The church staying occupied by what they think is yet to come.

Peace and Blessings

Douglas
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Doug,

Good post, I've only put in quote the part about  the churches because until folks quit trusting and leaning on the traditions, rituals, ceremonies and doctrines preached from behind the pulpits in their churches they are not aware of anything beyond that.

True, the church sits on its duff waiting for Christ while Christ sets at the right hand of the Father waiting for the Church, also true there were already many anti- Christs in the world and the end times or the last days to put it more accurately were already here even while John was writing.

It is sad but true the church has been sitting on their pews believing and trusting all they hear from behind the pulpits in their churches and never see while in this false comfort anything beyond it save for those that have had a Damascus road experience that have been called out of traditionaly organized corporate religion.

Peace,
Fire Walker

.

Quote from: Akira Takahashi on March 11, 2009, 04:31:21 AM
By reading this thread, I feel like I'm being yanked out of the ground by my roots.  Deep stuff and great food for thought.  Right now, my roots are still groping for the ground they sat comfortably in for so many years, but I may have to relocate.

Hows about you let go of your earth all together, lift up your wings . . .and let the spirit teach you how to fly . . .with no strings of earth attached

I believe the ribbon attaching my laptop's screen to the rest of it is perhaps loose, seeing as how there's a black bar down the center of it, so I can't read your entire post, nor can I seeall that I'm typing.  However, I think I've got the gist of what you're saying.

As they say, you have to crawl before you can walk, and that's what I'm working on.  My wings aren't strong enough to fly yet, so I'm still just learning how to flap!

Just a quick question, but how does the Universalist mindset typically view the End Times?

What end times?

Is there a 2012 end as "maybe" the mayan calendar or a certain dark age mystic might be indicating....... or a denominational mindset on the end of the nations and a one world under Jesus Christ being ruled from a Temple in Israel?........ Not by me !!!

IMO unless there is a change in universal physical laws and/or how things exist today the world is not going to go anywhere soon....... although those changes could come to be I question how well they would fit into the scriptures of all things remaining the same and nothing new under the sun.

However IMO there will be a revolutionary change that comes to the minds of all mankind as to how they perceive God as well as spiritual laws and things such as the truth of spirit and soul.

Since the times that started at the end of the truth first being taught (when he who lets is taken out of the way) that initiated in the rise of the tail that still today sweeps a third part of the stars from their inheritance in heaven there have been more end time scenarios imagined then the broadband space here allows for to be posted.

People get visions and/or have NDE's but if they do not correspond to the truth as written in the Holy Word they need to be re-thought out as to either what they really imply or as to the source of their origin. I have never heard of anyone outside of the Apostles who experienced anything beyond the Great White Throne and have returned to share their knowledge with us.

Through my own experience that stopped at the GWT I think everyone will experience that resurrection immediately upon their death as we call it today........ Those wo go into the lake of fire are not going there to be destroyed or punished but to be purified until they too appear not just in name but as a Book of Life themselves.

However there is a resurrection that can be had in this life but that the fulness of is something that we have not yet seen on earth. Without that happening then God's Word that stated than man would come to be in both the image and likeness of Him (that can only be Jesus Christ as in many) again on earth will not be fulfilled...... and that is something I cannot accept.

My  :2c: that others may or may not agree with

Blessings

Doug

 :cloud9:  :thumbsup:

Quote from: LivelystonWhat end times?

Is there a 2012 end as "maybe" the mayan calendar or a certain dark age mystic might be indicating....... or a denominational mindset on the end of the nations and a one world under Jesus Christ being ruled from a Temple in Israel?........ Not by me !!!

IMO unless there is a change in universal physical laws and/or how things exist today the world is not going to go anywhere soon....... although those changes could come to be I question how well they would fit into the scriptures of all things remaining the same and nothing new under the sun.

However IMO there will be a revolutionary change that comes to the minds of all mankind as to how they perceive God as well as spiritual laws and things such as the truth of spirit and soul.

Since the times that started at the end of the truth first being taught (when he who lets is taken out of the way) that initiated in the rise of the tail that still today sweeps a third part of the stars from their inheritance in heaven there have been more end time scenarios imagined then the broadband space here allows for to be posted.

Oh, yes, we most certainly must be at the end of some age and the beginning of another.  Look at us--we will never meet in person but we think like some huge mind, loving God as one.

And, we do so at the speed of light.

The only thing that could be sweeter is when we learn to do this without the need for intervening machines and man made grids.

That, too, will happen.  How could it not?  It's been happening since the beginning.  Or how else could one man's three year ministry change the world?

The musterion anomia has tried to stop it for 2000 years and when that didn't work, pervert it beyond all recognition.   But, they have never succeeded and they never will.


44And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.

--Dan 2

Hi Molly

When I said "mindset" I am referring first to those who are being placed where God will have them to be so at His chosen time the prophecy of Luke 6:1 will be fulfilled

Luk 6:1   And it came to pass on the second sabbath after the first, that he went through the corn fields; and his disciples plucked the ears of corn, and did eat, rubbing [them] in [their] hands.

Just as there was a foundation for the first Temple that Jesus was the cornerstone of so will IMO there be a second foundation for His newely built "third day Temple".

I have no doubts as to how I see you holding up many more just like you  :thumbsup:

Blessings

Doug

Quote from: DaughterofDavid
I also believe that He (Jesus/Yahshua) himself will appear along with all the saints that are IN CHRIST. I know some don't think that way....but I do. So many within the 'church system' are still looking for the singular Jesus...not the corporate one....

Finally, someone who sees this the way I do.   :happy3:

CHB

I have more questions, but I need to be on a better computer to type them.