stored up for fire

[anna274]

This thread has been very enlightening, edifying, and now encouraging (esp with Marie's input and gracious acknowledgement of all who posted to this thread)...

re: ...the Word explains itself... (eaglesway)
re: ...full unveiling of truth  (Marie)

Rev 1:1  The Revelation (unveiling) of Jesus Christ...
John 14:6  Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the TRUTH, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me.
1 Cor 15:22 ..in Christ all shall be made alive  (OT Genesis  In thy seed ALL nations shall be blessed --  NT Gal 3:16 ...He saith not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ)

[rosered]

His ways are not searchable according to a pattern that man assumes God is bound to keep. There may be a pattern you cannot see yet. I don't believe Christ, for example, is going to literally kill mankind with a literal sword literally jutting out of his mouth per Revelation 19. Christ says he will judge the world with his word because he came not to destroy men's lives but to save. God is under no obligations to fulfill any prophecy according to man's perceived patterns.

...the sWord, two sided can separate in the tapestry of life, the threads of truth from the threads of error..
The sWord of God out of Jesus' mouth.. truth slays lies.. Light slays darkness
I.e, agree with Eaglesway.. :girlheart: :smile:

Me too. The reason I brought up revelation 19 is because I do not believe that there is a physical/literal fulfillment of that scripture prophecy. in other words I do not believe Christ is going to literally put a literal sword in his mouth and go about killing humanity literally by cutting them up into pieces. I believe that scripture fully metaphorical.

   :thumbsup:   Yes Marie and Seth   everyones contributions   really ,  all this as of late has been

   dynamic     in learning

I do see the Sword of the Spirit      coming to   to slice and dice  and cut away    shredding to ribbons , these false images      we have about  ourselves    and    how we are supposed to be 

according to the law   , this law that puts us to death  first    the mirror image we think the Lord  expects from us   , but its a false   image of God and of ourselves to God
     being  dead cannot make alive        and cannot   change   
it takes to coming of the Lord Jesus Christ   [ Sword of the Spirit of His Mouth  ]   to  blast  that image     right out of the temple of our hearts   !!   man  has always   tried to do it on his own first and makes a monster a   beast out of   his own vain imaginations  from his own heart    whom is ruling and reigning as a king of the earth , his own life

  as you judge so shall you be judged   [ the beastly nature tries so hard to be LIKE GOD  ,  and is so deceptive   even the elect can be fooled if not for the Holy Spirit within them  [ with prodded conviction    , hold back , till the time the LORD COMES to slay with the breath [SPIRIT /SWORD WORD OF HIS COMMING ]   


my own conviction  was   feeling like a hypocrit a play actor , pretending to be somthing    holy and was not  holy , but   guilty as  charged , this  causes the anger and  frustration   and hating the whore [ false church ]  a trap set  for us all the fail in  first .....  this darkness is the    most   desolate place      where we weep and gnash our teeth for the pain of not being     the very image  of God we think we should be  , but its a  false sense of security     and soon leaves us in a  war  within ourselves thats     beyond a   natural event    ,  its somthing  of a shaking and   slicing and    seperating     that is painful to endure .....      the chasting of the Lord is very  sharp and   painful    ,  you remember that battle and never  want to experience it again   ,
mercy becomes your    plea ,  LORD HAVE MERCY ON US ALL !!


If any man have an ear, let him hear. 


Rev 13:10   He that leads into captivity shall go into captivity: he that kills with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints. 


Rev 13:11  And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.  [ we are trying to be holy images of Gods son  and speak like a lamb but oh    the accuser   is there judging  all flesh and  sentencing death on all  , but themselves ]   its the  doom and gloom  message ]


Rev 13:12   And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. 

[satans power of the liar and murderer  from the begining    the condemnation we  felt   when we first  needed  to be saved  and   the Lord showed mercy   to heal    us from that stroke of death when the LAW  come  SLAYED US  DEAD ,   now  we have become the two fold  sons of hell  ,  twice dead!! a beast before Him  ,      the land  beast is all adam the sea monster is the Babylon self rightous spirit    ,  thinking its right  always  and holding a false image of God in our hearts ! ]    this one is worse than the first one !!      an image  , a fake  idea   mirror of the old man   of whom he forgot who he was    :sigh:

  we need Jesus WE NEED HIS  MIRROR IMAGE   TO reflect  perfect love and eyes of the Father  to see  what  we are really supposed to  look  like , and be like and immitate !!

Rev 13:13   And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, 


Rev 13:14   And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. 


Rev 13:15   And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. 


  this is the  FALSE   IMAGE OF THE BEAST    , "if you dont see it like me , your dead  by  the letter of the law [every word of GOD every  jot and tittle ] !    and  judge and condemn all mankind    " :(  its aweful to be in that state of being !!!!

but you dont even know it , because your twice dead , soul and spirit to God !   building up treasure for yourself    that will be a witness against you , the word  you speak will judge you in the last day !!      last day of your   so called beastly life and nature ! 
  to be cleansed   is painful and deadly to that beast and image   the shattering can be heard  to the very core of your being / soul  !   

     
Rev 13:16   And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: 


Rev 13:17   And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. 


Rev 13:18   Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. 

man of sin / old adam       and son of perdition  /loss and destruction 
both having the false image of Gods glory   and power to save  , its JESUS CHRIST   WHOM  makes war with these false concepts and images to be torn down to  dust and burned in the fire of death    and thn makes NEW LIFE SPRING FORTH PLANTED BY THE FATHER  IN OUR HEARTS !
 
ECC  3   has always blessed me to know its truth

its GOD WHOM DOES THIS  THOUGHH JESUS CHRIST  , THE MIGHTY WARRIOR  faithful and true  whom  destrys the false images and tears them down to dust and ashes   for us all   , in the FATHERS TIME   this is why no man  knows the time nor hour    ,  none but God when  HIS  mercy comes   after the   destruction and  slaying of the wicked  within us   all  each and everyone in their own order      by the LORDS  WORK  HIS OWN SPIRIT AND LIVING WORD    SHARP  SWORD    TWO EDGED HEB 4 !! .....



Ecc 3:1  To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven: 


Ecc 3:2   A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted; 


Ecc 3:3   A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up; 


Ecc 3:4   A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance; 


Ecc 3:5   A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing; 


Ecc 3:6   A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away; 


Ecc 3:7   A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak; 


Ecc 3:8   A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace. 


Ecc 3:9  What profit hath he that worketh in that wherein he laboureth? 


Ecc 3:10   I have seen the travail, which God hath given to the sons of men to be exercised in it. 


Ecc 3:11   He hath made every thing beautiful in his time: also he hath set the world in their heart, so that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning to the end. 


Ecc 3:12  I know that there is no good in them, but for a man to rejoice, and to do good in his life. 


Ecc 3:13   And also that every man should eat and drink, and enjoy the good of all his labour, it is the gift of God. 


Ecc 3:14   I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be for ever: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him. 


Ecc 3:15   That which hath been is now; and that which is to be hath already been; and God requireth that which is past. 


Ecc 3:16  And moreover I saw under the sun the place of judgment, that wickedness was there; and the place of righteousness, that iniquity was there. 


Ecc 3:17   I said in mine heart, God shall judge the righteous and the wicked: for there is a time there for every purpose and for every work. 


Ecc 3:18   I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts. 


Ecc 3:19   For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity. 


Ecc 3:20   All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again. 


Ecc 3:21   Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth? 


Ecc 3:22   Wherefore I perceive that there is nothing better, than that a man should rejoice in his own works; for that is his portion: for who shall bring him to see what shall be after him? 


I thank God he is still dealing with me  still showing His mercy  STILL , this I know all  will be saved   by HIS  OWN WORK !!  its so humbling and  rewarding to just  find out  how He does it 
for so many , many  years      just having faith    knowing that HE WOULD  , never knowing how He would just knowing He would do a perfect work   in all      and never ever  , ever fails any of us

Believe  now  and  can say now!!!   more than ever  WE LOVE HIM  and see HIM   PERFECT and glorious  and beautiful     !!! GOD our Savior of the whole world  !! 

[rosered]

This thread has been very enlightening, edifying, and now encouraging (esp with Marie's input and gracious acknowledgement of all who posted to this thread)...

re: ...the Word explains itself... (eaglesway)
re: ...full unveiling of truth  (Marie)

Rev 1:1  The Revelation (unveiling) of Jesus Christ...
John 14:6  Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the TRUTH, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me.
1 Cor 15:22 ..in Christ all shall be made alive  (OT Genesis  In thy seed ALL nations shall be blessed --  NT Gal 3:16 ...He saith not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ)

Amen , Anna , God IS  building His Kingdom   here and now   among the chaos  of this worlds   end and destruction     , we see HIM IN ALL HIS BEAUTY    and glory and AWE !!

   we would none of us  ever would have post with the Help   the HOLY SPIRIT   SHOWING US THE WAY TRUTH AND LIFE   and His word     fighting for us   , found in all here  gathered into ONE  ,  HE IS IN OUR MIDST!!!    :dsunny:

[rosered]

Secrets of Enoch ch 29...regarding celestial bodies..of heavenly troops as an essence

of fire[He who makes His angels as flaming ministers of fire]

  And for all the heavenly troops,I imaged the image and essence of fire,and my eye

  looked at the very  hard firm rock, and from the gleam[twinkle] of my eye, the lightening

  received it's wonederful nature,which is both fire in water and water in fire,and one does

not put out the other,nor does the one dry up the other, therefore the lightening is brighter

then the sun,softer then water and firmer then hard rock.

   and from the rock I cut off a great fire[Our God is a rock],and from the fire I created

the great orders of the ten troops of the incorpeal angels.  And their weapons are fiery

and their rainment a burning flame,and I commanded that each one should stand in his order.

     Here satan and his angels are thrown out[war broke out in heaven,Michael and his angels fought and satan and his..but satan was not strong enough[incorruptible bodies..not weak corruptible flesh of man...see war to take land of Canaan..for pattern/Michael stand up]


      the children of the resurrection are like the angels..the children of God.  Each in his own

order.

   Father,glorify me with the glory I had with you before the world was.

     Rev 1;14-17

   it is sown a natural body in weakness..and raised a celestial body of power.

    and do not worry what you will wear......[ye shall not be unclothed]  Mt 6;28 Luke 12;27,28

     DO NOT BE AFRAID,LITTLE FLOCK,FOR THE FATHER HAS BEEN PLEASED TO GIVE

   YOU THE KINGDOM.[and I have other sheep not of this flock[all men are sheep]

     the 'best robe'  bone of His bone,flesh of His flesh...when we see Him face to face

  and are just like Him[one body,one spirit,one celestial flesh]

    now, the heart of man has not imagined what God has stored up for all that love Him

   and it is the spirit of God which reveals all these things pertaining to Christ and the things

  He has freely given us.

       do not eat from the tokogae lest ye die..and thus  sin entered all men..and all men died.

    through the righteousness of one man..the free gift of life comes to all men.

   we should not be loving our life in this world..it is not our eternal dwelling place.....

     Rev20;11....earth and sky fled from His presence...and there was no place for them

I was wondering about those glorified/spiritual  bodies !   and the glow , what Jesus showed on the Mount of transfiguration     matt 17;2  mark 9 Luke 9:29        natural language seems to limit   the depths of understanding it  fully  ...

King James 2000 Bible
And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his clothing was white as the light.

American King James Version
And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.

American Standard Version
and he was transfigured before them; and his face did shine as the sun, and his garments became white as the light.

Douay-Rheims Bible
And he was transfigured before them. And his face did shine as the sun: and his garments became white as snow.

Darby Bible Translation
And he was transfigured before them. And his face shone as the sun, and his garments became white as the light;

English Revised Version
and he was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his garments became white as the light.

Webster's Bible Translation
And he was transfigured before them: and his face shone as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.

Weymouth New Testament
There in their presence His form underwent a change; His face shone like the sun, and His raiment became as white as the light.

World English Bible
He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his garments became as white as the light.

Young's Literal Translation
and he was transfigured before them, and his face shone as the sun, and his garments did become white as the light,

[donken]

God is love.  God is a consuming Fire.  God is Spirit.   Love, indwelling, is the consuming fire that burns up everything that is contrary to love, contrary to the divine nature.  The divine nature and thus the Spirit that is God is everything that life is, which is everything that true love is.  When the Love of God is in a person as who they and the love can not be "dethroned" in one then "death" is dead because all the "lusts" that work works of death upon living things is "dead", burned up by Love.   Psalms says that God shall judge in righteousness.   The work of righteousness is PEACE Isaiah 32:15 ff says.  So, when GOD judges in righteousness then PEACE is present as the judgment.  Anything that is not peaceable is not of the Spirit of God but is of the ENMITY that Jesus destroyed in His witness on the cross.

God is Spirit.  God is life.   Life is spirit and is invisible, and is our God, invisible and spirit, the spirit that GIVES LIFE.

Life is Spirit.   Life is Holy.   When life matures the living being it is creating, then Eternal Life in Holiness is the father of and in that created being, Jesus Christ.

Jesus Christ is ALWAYS God's finished creature, in this case, mankind.  All one person or personality if you like, and many vessels, but all one.  No division at all.

God bless, Donken

[eaglesway]

I am one body. The only division within me is the cell wall between my cells, or perhaps the tissue that is joint where it meets the tissue that is ligament. The head is the head and not a foot, but the head and the foot are one, only the function is different, but the "cause" of their union is one, and they are united in one identity, a house for my spirit and soul- and a means for carrying out my will.

[donken]

Hi.  The scripture does say that the first man "IS" natural, it does not say man "became" natural or "was spiritual first".   This is the same as saying the first appearance of anyone in the world through birth is a baby, and is not an adult.  First is the baby, and afterward is the adult.  The baby is immature, but the adult is the mature natural man.  Unless we become as little children, both spiritually and naturally in physical body, we will never ever become an adult.

In a human baby, the adult they came from and were birthed from is not able to be seen.  Nor is the maturity of the adult able to be known by the baby or by anyone seeing only the baby and never having seen an adult.   We as mankind had never seen God as a model for who we will be when grown, which a human baby all through his childhood in the world does have models with them.

So, Jesus came to show us who we will be and what the Spirit of God, life, in us, is like when the human body is entirely obedient to the spirit of life in it.
The enmity that is contrary to God in the flesh, {law of sin lusts and needs} is able to be kept under the dominion of the Spirit of life in that body, when we are a mature son of God.
The law of sin is the so mentioned lusts of the flesh that are the "law" we live by and must live by to stay alive individually, when we are immature spiritually and apart from the maturity of God.   
Sin is said to be the state of being short of the glory {ability, knowledge, maturity} of God.   Every human child when born is short of the glory of a human adult.

That is the parable that fully describes what is called sin in the bible.  Not accusatory, just true.

God bless, ken

[eaglesway]

As I see it part of becoming mature is learning accountability. An infant at first responds only to the needs it feels, hunger, thirst, affection, etc. As the infant grows it begins to express its personality and respond to its environment. Whether or not it is nurtured and loved vastly affects the way the seed of glory within will grow up, first the shoot, then the stalk then the full head of wheat bearing fruit.

A balance of nurturing, fellowship, reason and discipline are what good parenting skills bring to that child.

When a parent loves their child they look within that person, with respect and a certain sense of the holiness of God's unique creation in that child, and a keen appreciation for the beauty of that unique child's inner person. They labor to help that child discover that beauty as a seed that grows in the light, planted in good soil and the living water.

Paul speaks about reaping and sowing and the harvest of the flesh versus the harvest of the Spirit. As a good Father our creator is teaching us maturity in many ways.

[donken]

Who shall live with the EVERLASTING devouring flames.??  The Lamb of course.
Isa 33:9  The earth mourneth and languisheth: Lebanon is ashamed and hewn down: Sharon is like a wilderness; and Bashan and Carmel shake off their fruits.
Isa 33:10  Now will I rise, saith the LORD; now will I be exalted; now will I lift up myself.
Isa 33:11  Ye shall conceive chaff, ye shall bring forth stubble: your breath, as fire, shall devour you.
Isa 33:12  And the people shall be as the burnings of lime: as thorns cut up shall they be burned in the fire.
Isa 33:13  Hear, ye that are far off, what I have done; and, ye that are near, acknowledge my might.
Isa 33:14  The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?
Isa 33:15  He that walketh righteously, and speaketh uprightly; he that despiseth the gain of oppressions, that shaketh his hands from holding of bribes, that stoppeth his ears from hearing of blood, and shutteth his eyes from seeing evil;
Isa 33:16  He shall dwell on high: his place of defence shall be the munitions of rocks: bread shall be given him; his waters shall be sure.
Isa 33:17  Thine eyes shall see the king in his beauty: they shall behold the land that is very far off.
Isa 33:18  Thine heart shall meditate terror. Where is the scribe? where is the receiver? where is he that counted the towers?
Isa 33:19  Thou shalt not see a fierce people, a people of a deeper speech than thou canst perceive; of a stammering tongue, that thou canst not understand.
Isa 33:20  Look upon Zion, the city of our solemnities: thine eyes shall see Jerusalem a quiet habitation, a tabernacle that shall not be taken down; not one of the stakes thereof shall ever be removed, neither shall any of the cords thereof be broken.
Isa 33:21  But there the glorious LORD will be unto us a place of broad rivers and streams; wherein shall go no galley with oars, neither shall gallant ship pass thereby.
Isa 33:22  For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; he will save us.

[eaglesway]

His eyes are as flames of fire.......(Rev 19)

All things are open to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do.....(Heb 12)

Jerusalem will be inhabited as a town without walls for I will be a wall of fire around it.....(Zech 2:4,5)


In order to get into Jerusalem(the heavenly city, our mother, the New Jerusalem from above who is free...Heb 12) , one must pass through the wall of fire. The fire kindles on anything that is not suitable to dwelling in "a town without walls"- a free place where no law(wall) is needed. God tests us with fire to see if we will "endure".

"Let patience(endurance) have its perfect(complete) work that you may mature and whole, lacking nothing"

Outside the city are all things that offend, burning in Gehenna- adulterers, sorcerers, murderers, etc- the works of the flesh that make us unsuitable to dwell within the walls of freedom, the fire of the divine nature.

Inside, the inhabitants "walk among the stones of fire" and "dwell in the midst of the everlasting burnings" because they have endured the "flames" of the"purifying of their faith, which is more precious than gold tried in the fire".

Our God is a consuming fire all that dwell in His presence have been consumed, into His glory, love, holiness and power- through forgiveness and the spirit of resurrection.

We hav not come to a mountain burning with fire that cannot be touched........ we have come to Mt Zion and the heavenly Jerusalem, unto myriads of angels and unto the spirits of righteous men made perfect, unto the general assembly of the firstborn registered in heaven and unto the blood that speaks better things than the blood of Abel(Heb 12)

The fire on the mountain of the lawgiver caused men to shudder with fear and turn away. The fire on the mountain of our God consumes fear and guilt and lust and turns the corrupt heart into a jewel that shines in the fire, which is God, "who alone dwells in unapproachable light". As we are drawn closer to Him the light consumes every shadow until we are filled up to all the fulness of God- at ease in the glory, at rest in the light, walking among the everlasting flames.

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Chrst from the dead to obtain an inheritance that is imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in the heavenly realms for you unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last times. In this you greatly rejoice even tho for now for a little while, if necessary, you have been distressed by various trials so that the proof of your faith, more precious than gold that is perishable even tho tried in the fire, may be found to result in glory and honor and praise at the revelation of Jesus Christ....(1 Pet 1) 


Cool stuff, glorious, as the veil draws thinner--

Upon this mountain I will remove the mists that veil all the peoples....

And the veil in the heavens was rolled back like a scroll and the sign of the son of man appeared in the heavens.........

Glory.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Amen and amen, yes it is glorious. Glory to Your name, Father..... :banana:

[donken]

This is what happens when New Jerusalem, the married bride is threatened or an attempt to breach it is made.

Rev_20:9  And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Should we think that this is different fire than the CONSUMING fire of God.  God is love, God is spirit, God is unchanging.   So, the consuming fire is God's love.  And when something is consumed it is WITHIN that which is consuming it.

This is the process by which we are "saved" or matured INTO the bride all things that are not of GOD not being allowed in, not being clothed with wedding clothes at the time of the wedding.  In verse 15 below we see what those wedding clothes are to be, and we can also see that it is GOD who gathers the unclothed to the battle.  Could it actually be that he is going to clothe them?  What do you believe, those of us who believe in all in all.

Rev 16:13  And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
Rev 16:14  For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
Rev 16:15  Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
Rev 16:16  And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
Rev 16:17  And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

Armageddon is GOD's Battle, not a worldly one.   We are to clothe the naked, are we not, etc.   When verse 17 says it is DONE is the very same thing that happens when the voice of the seventh angel sounds and the seven thunders utter what is not written in the scriptures.

God bless, donken

[eaglesway]

God is a consuming fire. The love of God and the light and fire of God are one- but they manifest in different ways. Above (imo) these definitions of God's being- love, light, fire, wind, living water, etc; to me- is God's definiton of Himself- I Am That I Am.

God has emotions, thats why we do. If He is angered, it does not anull or transcend His love. Beyond that anger there is love- which imo IS NOT AN EMOTION. Fire, to me, IS NOT AN EMOTION, nor is light.

These three things describe the essence of God's being who HE IS.

His disciplinary actions are not coming from some "compartment" of Himself or His Spirit. He Is Who He Is.

All things lead into the love, light, fire of God because He will be all in all and He Is Who He Is.

IMO there is no contradiction, or need to fear that accrediting God with anger will somehow discredit any other aspect of His character, or any emotion He expresses, because all the aspects of His character and PERSONALITY lead to the core of His True Self.

Anger is dangerous. That is why we are so frequently warned about its expression and how to govern it when it manifests, as it does, in God and in us- a fundamental emotional response to violation, for example- something that speaks within us, an awareness that a righteous limit has been exceeded by another. To me this is real, and also very cautionary, but nevertheless genuine.

Be angry, but sin not- and let not the sun go down on your wrath.(James)

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Amen  :thumbsup:

[donken]

I offer that God is the divine nature, in the sense that that is who He is.  I am everything that I am, is the way I understand I am that I am that God is said to say about his name.  Ie..  a name such as tom or mike or even Jesus or God, does not let us identify him intimately.

The attributes of the divine nature are everything he is.   NO evil attributes in him, no anger, nothing that causes violence just as Jesus witnessed, and the attributes or emotions are spiritual messengers.

God's messengers of who he is do not include the carnal "emotions" of anger, greed, envy, and so on.   We believe this or not, Up to us.  Choose the good and refuse the evil we are told.  The evil doing emotions in us are the enmity in our flesh that Jesus did not witness as being of the spirit of God, {the ghost} IN HIM.  The father of all living is LIFE.  It is ours to believe and consider or reject, personally each one of us.

Either Jesus did not witness all of God our father, or he did.  you decide.    Isa_53:9  And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had ***done no violence**, neither was any deceit in his mouth.

If you believe this scripture about Jesus, then you\I\we have to find a different understanding of the temple cleansing incident if WE think that Jesus did that in violent manner and in anger.    Why?  Because it is OUR TEMPLE that he is cleansing {entirely} in THIS DAY.  By it done unto you by your\our faith.

God bless, ken

[eaglesway]

"Therefore I was angry with this generation and said, 'They always go astray in their hearts, and do not kno my ways.'" @ Hebrews 3:17

IMO, The testimony of the scriptures presents a different conclusion than the one you have presented. Listing anger in a list of evil works- does not make it so, nor does it necessarily limit God to your interpretation of His nature.

[jabcat]

Rev. 6
16 and they say to the mountains and to the rocks, `Fall upon us, and hide us from the face of Him who is sitting upon the throne, and from the anger of the Lamb,'

17 because come did the great day of His anger, and who is able to stand?

[donken]

Hello.  I would just ask, what is the fruit of anger.  There is no place in scripture that has righteous as an adjective describing anger... unless of course some "man" has rewritten one bible to mean what he thinks it should mean so that he can justify his own anger.

God IS love, not sometimes, but eternally.  Love and Anger are contrary.  Anger is part of the ENMITY Jesus abolished in HIS FLESH and will abolish IN OURS with our understanding and agreement as we become THE ONE SON.

Man's anger fights wars and does many things called "righteous" but that bring results of people that Jesus did not witness.  If a person DO MY WORDS, he said, they shall NEVER die.  But if we hear his words and do not do them ALL, he said, we build our house {body} on the sand... and when we are washed away by the ways of satan\man\world we die.    Jesus did not ever say keep ALL the scriptures, but he did say if we do not hear his words then hear\see HIS LIFESTYLE {works}.    The serpent is ANGER and all of it's relatives.   By the fruit the emotions in us would produce if we fulfill their lusts\drives, we will know what spirit they are of, or from.

James 1:20.  The wrath of man does not work Goid's righteousness.  So.. do we turn the other cheek and resist the evil of anger in us, or do we slay Jesus Christ to ourselves AGAIN.  Heb. 6:6.

Here is the "spirit" of the wisdom that is from above.   The fruit of, or full righteousness is SOWN IN PEACE, not in war and burnings of hell and so on, or do we believe otherwise or want to do so.

Jas 3:17  But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
Jas 3:18  And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.

How beautiful on the mountains are the feet {ways} of them that preach the GOSPEL OF PEACE. 

Here is what evil does and the mind of it.    Is anger a cause of sTRIFE.  I think we know the answer, at least I hope we do.

Jas 3:14  But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
Jas 3:15  This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
Jas 3:16  For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

Please notice that every evil work is in something we commonly do as mankind many times a week.  Earthy, Sensual {lust of flesh??} DEVILISH.  All the same thing.  to be earth, to be sensual to sin, is DEVILISH or of... the lie about God and what God and Jesus are really like.   The devil is a lair from the beginning.

Can we say that a human baby can not be or present the truth of what a human adult is like in maturity if one has not seen a well mannered human adult.  Therefore a human baby is a lie about what man is like, to one who has not seen a human adult person acting in good manners and different in many ways that the baby is limited to.

Natural Adam is naturally and without condemnation, automatically a lie about GOD to those who think natural Adam is already the image of GOD.  Adam is blameless about this lie, except when Adam begins to teach that God is like he is too.

NO wonder many people would like to toss James out by saying it is not a book of the "real" scripture.  By our lifestyle we will actually show what we truly believe, and that can not be hidden forever. 
God bless, ken

[Seth]

Love and Anger are contrary. 

This is not true...from my perspective. Anger is a strong feeling of displeasure. There is nothing wrong with man or God having a strong feeling of displeasure at things which are (and should be) displeasing. Nothing in the Bible indicates to me that love must run headlong against anger. Anger can be very motivating in a positive way.

How one acts as a result of anger is what counts. The wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God. However, God's anger and man's anger are not the same. Whether or not the term "righteous anger" appears in the Bible has no bearing on these two facts:

God has anger
God is righteous in all his attributes

So the completely logical outcome of those Biblical facts are that God's anger is a righteous one. Otherwise I would have to conclude that God's anger is unrighteous, or neutral. But I know that God is righteous in all attributes.

[eaglesway]

Exactly Seth, therefore the only other logic is to excise the scriptures that declare and define God's anger from the scriptures, or transcend them by some "teaching from the Spirit".

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: The Jewish sages of old have a rule of study; that being that no interpretation can remove the clear meaning intended first. If it says it rained, it rained. Wisdom reveals more ABOUT the rain, where it came from, what it symbolized, Who it is, what it's for, but it doesn't say, it DIDN'T rain. This is where we get into, hath God not said?, and it's a slippery slope from there.

Wisdom always builds upon or opens up what is there, it doesn't remove what is there. My and their (Jewish sages of old) opinion.....Blessings....

[lastpost]

Personally, based on how I view the progressive unfolding of the Sacred Record, I think it is more accurate to say (in my opinion) under such circumstances, God is anguished because true Divine Love always oversees the welfare of His children, even if they are wicked and wayward children, as they are destined to be part of All-inAll.

As the Supreme Being, He already knew where, when and how they would sin - therefore a suitable response that could be understood by evil people was necessary - and that response was already known and planned since before the beginning of the Aeon of aeons.

I know God has blessed you already. In His Peace and His Love.

[Aside. Tomorrow, I pay a return visit across the water and I am pleased to say I will visit the Codex Sinaiticus again. I just want to see it for some reason although it is not the Bible of today, it is a rare thing and I hope to receive inspiration even if it is symbolic.]

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Blessings on your trip and I hope it works out for you this time. I think it would be fascinating to see also. God is good. Blessings....

[donken]

Love and Anger are contrary. 

This is not true...from my perspective. Anger is a strong feeling of displeasure. There is nothing wrong with man or God having a strong feeling of displeasure at things which are (and should be) displeasing. Nothing in the Bible indicates to me that love must run headlong against anger. Anger can be very motivating in a positive way.

How one acts as a result of anger is what counts. The wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God. However, God's anger and man's anger are not the same. Whether or not the term "righteous anger" appears in the Bible has no bearing on these two facts:

God has anger
God is righteous in all his attributes

So the completely logical outcome of those Biblical facts are that God's anger is a righteous one. Otherwise I would have to conclude that God's anger is unrighteous, or neutral. But I know that God is righteous in all attributes.

Hello Seth.  God does not change, scripture says, does it not.  IF you are feeling peaceful and loving toward anyone or all, and something makes you angry, what is now replacing or dethroning the love?    Is God who IS love ever dethroned?

I would ask you to look at yourself\ourself and see if perhaps we are justifying our own anger and other like emotions in believing we are allowed to do them because we have a righteous purpose.    Also, let me ask you if you make up your mind to get or feel angry, or does it dictate itself to you.  The only way God, who IS love, eternally, not just sometimes, IS LOVE is to be love at all times, forever, changing not.  Do you think love if DETHRONED as God.

When we think, naturally, that God has anger and changes mood and emotions, we are making God like ourselves, which is the wrong tree.  No death causing or evil fruit in the tree that is LIFE.  The tree of LIFE can not bring forth evil and death causing fruit.   It is the other tree that has TWO fruits or results caused by it.  It is what makes itself God to us because our first state is to be that tree with both fruit able to be produced.

So does anger, hate, envy, etc. produce life, is that what we believe?    Or, are we asked to be angry and do not sin, put the anger away before darkness {night time} comes  {into us}.
Is anger frustration.  IS God able to be frustrated?   

Isa_27:4  Fury is not in me: who would set the briers and thorns against me in battle? I would go through them, I would burn them together.

Here we read that fury is not in God.   So what will we do with the following scripture if we believe that is true.
Jer_32:37  Behold, I will gather them out of all countries, whither I have driven them in mine anger, and in my fury, and in great wrath; and I will bring them again unto this place, and I will cause them to dwell safely:

Eze 24:13  In thy filthiness is lewdness: because I have purged thee, and thou wast not purged, thou shalt not be purged from thy filthiness any more, till I have caused my fury to rest upon thee.

If fury is not in God, then what is the answer for such scriptures.   I offer this for anyone who can believe God is good only.   The fury is IN US, as is the ANGER.  The fury etc. that exists because of what God is doing, is in us and is THE ENMITY in us that Jesus Christ being obeyed and followed IN us by us, will abolish.

Just as scripture also says that God did not say anything about blood sacrifice and burnt offerings when he first spoke to them.  He calls Israel the GENERATION of HIS WRATH.  That which is in them and us, and causes us to believe that God is also like we are, is the WRATH IN US, the enmity against the truth of God.
Follow Jesus' words in our own life and we will find that out for ourselves.   
The fury has to REST or be settled down IN US before we are able to enter into the promises of God.  Why.  WRATH can not enter.  Heb. 3.  When it says in my wrath they shall not enter into my rest, it means that the wrath in them can not bring them or us into the peace and holiness we all need to BE before we can SEE {understand\know} God fully.  {again, my take, but also my life}
God bless, ken

Bless, donken

[Seth]

Hello Seth.  God does not change, scripture says, does it not.  IF you are feeling peaceful and loving toward anyone or all, and something makes you angry, what is now replacing or dethroning the love?    Is God who IS love ever dethroned?

I believe this to be a false dilemma. Anger does not dethrone love. Anger is a strong feeling of displeasure. Some things cause a strong feeling of displeasure BECAUSE of love.

"peaceful and loving" are YOUR definitions of love. And yet Christ says:

Matt 10:34
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

The most loving man on earth, in that world, in his ministry, was Jesus Christ. Yet, he did not come to bring peace.

Mark 3
5 After looking around at them WITH ANGER, grieved at their hardness of heart, He *said to the man, "Stretch out your hand." And he stretched it out, and his hand was restored.

I would ask you to look at yourself\ourself and see if perhaps we are justifying our own anger and other like emotions in believing we are allowed to do them because we have a righteous purpose. Also, let me ask you if you make up your mind to get or feel angry, or does it dictate itself to you.

I believe I have made the distinction between man's anger and God's anger, haven't I?

When we think, naturally, that God has anger and changes mood and emotions, we are making God like ourselves, which is the wrong tree.

The Bible literally says that God has anger, but not the anger of MAN. When your interpretations cause you to make statements which literally contradict what the Bible says, you ought to at least consider rephrasing your statements to make sure they align with what is written in Scripture.

Isa_27:4  Fury is not in me: who would set the briers and thorns against me in battle? I would go through them, I would burn them together.

Here we read that fury is not in God.   So what will we do with the following scripture if we believe that is true.
Jer_32:37  Behold, I will gather them out of all countries, whither I have driven them in mine anger, and in my fury, and in great wrath; and I will bring them again unto this place, and I will cause them to dwell safely:

Eze 24:13  In thy filthiness is lewdness: because I have purged thee, and thou wast not purged, thou shalt not be purged from thy filthiness any more, till I have caused my fury to rest upon thee.

If fury is not in God, then what is the answer for such scriptures.   I offer this for anyone who can believe God is good only.   The fury is IN US, as is the ANGER.  The fury etc. that exists because of what God is doing, is in us and is THE ENMITY in us that Jesus Christ being obeyed and followed IN us by us, will abolish.

I think you missed the context. Isaiah 27 is talking about when the anger of the Lord HAS PASSED.

Isaiah 26
20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast. 21 For, behold, the Lord cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.

Isaiah 27
27 In that day (when his indignation is passed) the Lord will take his terrible, swift sword and punish Leviathan, the swiftly moving serpent, the coiling, writhing serpent. He will kill the dragon of the sea. 2 In that day sing ye unto her, A vineyard of red wine. 3 I the Lord do keep it; I will water it every moment: lest any hurt it, I will keep it night and day. 4 Fury is not in me: who would set the briers and thorns against me in battle? I would go through them, I would burn them together. 5 Or let him take hold of my strength, that he may make peace with me; and he shall make peace with me.

The reason the fury is not in him, is because "in that day" it will have been passed, and he will be judging Laviathan, the serpent, rather than the people.