yellowstone is emiting unusually high levels of helium . Genesis 7;11-on that day all the springs
of the great deep burst forth,and the floodgates of the heavens were opened.
Peter ;7,1 By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire......
v BUT IN KEEPING WITH HIS PROMISE WE ARE LOOKING FORWARD TO A NEW HEAVEN
AND A NEW EARTH.
Rev 0;9 they marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God's people,
the city He loves[all men] But fire come down from heaven and devoured them.
and the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of burning sulpher,where the beast
and the false prophet had been thrown.
I'm wondering, the great deep can also refer to the heart....???
sure can. but there is a natural and a spiritual fufillment......the heart of the earth[bottomless] can melt
just as spiritually speaking..man's heart can melt[soften like wax so the Lord can write His laws of
love in them. out of the hearts abundance..the mouth speaks[so we see rock...melting and overflowing
out of the mouth]
I do not expect what I wrote hear to not disconcert........He is going to remove all life from this planet
[I will no lnger allow them to live in Egypt/world]
Judges 13;18. why do you ask my name? It is beyond understanding.
THEN MANOAH[MAN/NOAH] TOOK A YOUNG GOAT,TOGATHER WITH THE GRAIN OFFERING
AND SACRIFICED IT ON A ROCK TO THE LORD. AND THE LORD DID AN AMAZING THING
WHILE MANOAH AND HIS WIFE WATCHED. AS THE FLAME BLAZED UP FROM THE ALTAR
TOWARD HEAVEN, THE ANGEL[SPIRIT CREATURE] OF THE LORD ASCENDED IN THE FLAME
And because Yellowstone is doing what it is supposed to be doing, has caused this concern? Has anyone given thought that perhaps all that is happening that the news reports as odd, amazing, incredible is all right in tune with how creation is supposed to react to the time EST,CST,MST,PST. :HeartThrob:
you think I have gone the way of Babylon..and are fear mongering? on the contrary I speak of these
things,so that when they happen,you should not be afraid...or in terror...thinking some strange thing
has befallen you. Because just as when Jesus was on the cross..it looked like the dominion of darkness
had overcome the light..when in truth He had overcom and was in fact putting death under His feet.
in the spiritual...hearts burning with the flame of love/God[clean on the inside] overflow and make
a new creature[then the outside will be clean,also] in the natural melting rocks inside mountains
make new earth[nature's terraformers] thus the stone that hit the image and grew until it became
a mountain that filled the earth....
Luke 17;6 just as it was in the days of Noah,so also will it be in the days of the son of man
2 Peter ; first of all you must understand,that in the last days scoffers will come,scoffing
and following their own evil desires. They will saay 'where is this coming He promised? Ever
since our father's died,everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation. But they
deliberately forget that long ago by God's word the heavens existed and the earth was formed
out of water and by water. By these waters also the world that was at that time was deluged
and destroyed. BY THE SAME WORD the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire.
v 10,11 Since everything will be destroyed in this way,what kind of people ought you to be
You ought tolive holy and godly lives..as you look forward to the day of God and speed it's coming
that day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire and the elements will melt in
the heat. But in keeping with His promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth
Rev 21.....then I saw a new heaven and a new earth,for the first heaven and the first earth had
passed away.
1 Thess ;4;16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a loud command,with
the voice of the arkangel and with the trumpet call of God,and the dead in Christ shall rise first
After that we who are still alive and are left will be caught up with them in the clouds to meet
the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.
we do not want you to be ignorant of those who fall asleep or greive like the rest of men who
have no hope[like those who think when the Lord does these things that men are eternally
condemned to death..and that their ministry of etrnal hell is right..for in fact..God and Jesus are
working a great deliverance of all mankind from this world..and men are being delivered from the
body undergoing that death..and into the eternal Kingdom. In fact all men raised up in Christ
are patterned after Him....the putting to death in the flesh but the raising up in the spirit[he who loses
his life in thisworld forthe sake of the Kingdom of heaven..preserves it.]
Hebrews 11;'7 they went about in sheepskins and goatskins destitute persecuted and mistreated-
THE WORLD WAS NOT WORTHY OF THEM[the prince of this world has been judged that his works
are wicked] deliver us from the evil one. We are approaching the Great deliverance.......
this exercize in evil is coming to it's end....a great deliverance of man into a Freedom from
all evil..into a place where righteousness dwells......no more hunger,pain,tears,death
Zephaniah ;19 At that time I will deal with all who oppressed you. I will rescue the lame
and gather all who have been scattered. I will give them praise an honour in every land where they
were put to shame. At that time I will gather you....AT THAT TIME I WILL BRING YOU HOME
I will give you honour and praise among all the people's of the earth,when I restore your
fortunes before your very eyes.[yes,man is honoured of God,with His salvation and restoration]
SOS 8;6 Place me like a seal over your heart,like a seal on your arm;
for love is as strong as death....it's jealousy as unyeilding as the grave.
it burns like blazing fire like a mighty flame.
Many waters can not quench love; rivers can not wash it away.
if one was to give all the wealth of his house for love..it would be utterly scorned[think of all the
kingdoms of the earth that satan offered in thetemptation in the wilderness to Christ..for one act]
In my humble opinion, I don't see any requirement or guarantee that God fulfill any prophecy both literally or spiritually/metaphorically. I believe God can fulfill them in any way he wishes. No offense intended to anyone who disagrees.
Romans 11:33
O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
Quote from: Seth on February 26, 2014, 01:44:22 AMI believe God can fulfill them in any way he wishes.
He can't because He has committed Himself to the patterns He made. Just like He won't break His own laws.
His ways are not searchable according to a pattern that man assumes God is bound to keep. There may be a pattern you cannot see yet. I don't believe Christ, for example, is going to literally kill mankind with a literal sword literally jutting out of his mouth per Revelation 19. Christ says he will judge the world with his word because he came not to destroy men's lives but to save. God is under no obligations to fulfill any prophecy according to man's perceived patterns.
Secrets of Enoch ch 29...regarding celestial bodies..of heavenly troops as an essence
of fire[He who makes His angels as flaming ministers of fire]
And for all the heavenly troops,I imaged the image and essence of fire,and my eye
looked at the very hard firm rock, and from the gleam[twinkle] of my eye, the lightening
received it's wonederful nature,which is both fire in water and water in fire,and one does
not put out the other,nor does the one dry up the other, therefore the lightening is brighter
then the sun,softer then water and firmer then hard rock.
and from the rock I cut off a great fire[Our God is a rock],and from the fire I created
the great orders of the ten troops of the incorpeal angels. And their weapons are fiery
and their rainment a burning flame,and I commanded that each one should stand in his order.
Here satan and his angels are thrown out[war broke out in heaven,Michael and his angels fought and satan and his..but satan was not strong enough[incorruptible bodies..not weak corruptible flesh of man...see war to take land of Canaan..for pattern/Michael stand up]
the children of the resurrection are like the angels..the children of God. Each in his own
order.
Father,glorify me with the glory I had with you before the world was.
Rev 1;14-17
it is sown a natural body in weakness..and raised a celestial body of power.
and do not worry what you will wear......[ye shall not be unclothed] Mt 6;28 Luke 12;27,28
DO NOT BE AFRAID,LITTLE FLOCK,FOR THE FATHER HAS BEEN PLEASED TO GIVE
YOU THE KINGDOM.[and I have other sheep not of this flock[all men are sheep]
the 'best robe' bone of His bone,flesh of His flesh...when we see Him face to face
and are just like Him[one body,one spirit,one celestial flesh]
now, the heart of man has not imagined what God has stored up for all that love Him
and it is the spirit of God which reveals all these things pertaining to Christ and the things
He has freely given us.
do not eat from the tokogae lest ye die..and thus sin entered all men..and all men died.
through the righteousness of one man..the free gift of life comes to all men.
we should not be loving our life in this world..it is not our eternal dwelling place.....
Rev20;11....earth and sky fled from His presence...and there was no place for them
Quote from: Seth on February 26, 2014, 05:00:08 PM
His ways are not searchable according to a pattern that man assumes God is bound to keep. There may be a pattern you cannot see yet. I don't believe Christ, for example, is going to literally kill mankind with a literal sword literally jutting out of his mouth per Revelation 19. Christ says he will judge the world with his word because he came not to destroy men's lives but to save. God is under no obligations to fulfill any prophecy according to man's perceived patterns.
I thnk the sword that comes out of Jesus' mouth, and His eyes of fire, are defined in Hebrews 4:12,13
For the word of God is living and active and sharper thana any two-edged sword and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, joints and marrow, a discerner of the thoughts and intentions of the heart....and no creature is hidden from His sight but all things are openand laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do.
I agree :thumbsup:
Greetings
Computer was down this week , But saw this ,
I just wanted to share some comforting thoughts that the Lord has so helped us with along lifes journey
Thanks Shelia , those of His Spirit do not fear what can be done to the body ..
Beliving in the written Word and can remember reading this with my carnal mind , Fear was a factor
and all whom read the word without the ears to hear and heart to understand what the Spirit is saying can and does tremble at His Word as it is written .
Hbr 12:18 ¶ For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest,
Hbr 12:19 And the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more:
Hbr 12:20 (For they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart: Hbr 12:21 And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake:)
[For me, this is speaking of the mind of a beast the carnal mind that death reigns still ]
Hbr 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,
Hbr 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
Hbr 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
Hbr 12:25 ¶ See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:
Hbr 12:26 Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.
Hbr 12:27 And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.
Hbr 12:28 Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:
Hbr 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire.
Being still in these fleshly bodies its hard to always remain [dwell ] in the Spirit and His Word abiding in us , at times the cares of this life does choke out the Word of God , that warning is real as well , I thank you for the Spirit in which you sent this warning and comfort Shelia !
I believe with all my heart as 3 parts are very real , the written for our instruction the Spoken that we remain clean and the Living word as the works of God though Christ are being done now , the written is the literal carnal command as a man of God Moses sent the firey Law and the prophets whom witnessed to the coming of Jesus Christ , and the Hear the Spoken Word though Gods Son , Jesus Christ , to whom all prophecies have and will and continue to be filled , by the Spirit of prophecy which is the testimony of Jesus Christ and those whom are also His witnesses !
God bless those whom , see , hear and understand in their hearts Gods peace though Jesus Christ .
I love the way the word explains itself if we can see it.
"And this word signifies the removal of things that are shaken until only those things which cannot be shaken remain"
This what the fire does, until God is all in all-
"These three abide, faith hope and love, but the greatest of these is love"
:HeartThrob: thank you Yes , its truth Bro John !
1Th 5:1 Now concerning how and when all this will happen, dear brothers and sisters, we don't really need to write you.
1Th 5:2 For you know quite well that the day of the Lord's return will come unexpectedly, like a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 When people are saying, "Everything is peaceful and secure," then disaster will fall on them as suddenly as a pregnant woman's labor pains begin. And there will be no escape.
1Th 5:4 But you aren't in the dark about these things, dear brothers and sisters, and you won't be surprised when the day of the Lord comes like a thief.
1Th 5:5 For you are all children of the light and of the day; we don't belong to darkness and night.
1Th 5:6 So be on your guard, not asleep like the others. Stay alert and be clearheaded.
1Th 5:7 Night is the time when people sleep and drinkers get drunk.
1Th 5:8 But let us who live in the light be clearheaded, protected by the armor of faith and love, and wearing as our helmet the confidence of our salvation.
1Th 5:9 For God chose to save us through our Lord Jesus Christ, not to pour out his anger on us.
1Th 5:10 Christ died for us so that, whether we are dead or alive when he returns, we can live with him forever.
1Th 5:11 So encourage each other and build each other up, just as you are already doing.
1Th 5:12 Dear brothers and sisters, honor those who are your leaders in the Lord's work. They work hard among you and give you spiritual guidance.
1Th 5:13 Show them great respect and wholehearted love because of their work. And live peacefully with each other.
1Th 5:14 Brothers and sisters, we urge you to warn those who are lazy. Encourage those who are timid. Take tender care of those who are weak. Be patient with everyone.
1Th 5:15 See that no one pays back evil for evil, but always try to do good to each other and to all people.
1Th 5:16 Always be joyful.
1Th 5:17 Never stop praying.
1Th 5:18 Be thankful in all circumstances, for this is God's will for you who belong to Christ Jesus. 1Th 5:19 Do not stifle the Holy Spirit.
1Th 5:20 Do not scoff at prophecies,
1Th 5:21 but test everything that is said. Hold on to what is good.
1Th 5:22 Stay away from every kind of evil.
1Th 5:23 Now may the God of peace make you holy in every way, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless until our Lord Jesus Christ comes again.
1Th 5:24 God will make this happen, for he who calls you is faithful.
1Th 5:25 Dear brothers and sisters, pray for us.
1Th 5:26 Greet all the brothers and sisters with Christian love.
1Th 5:27 I command you in the name of the Lord to read this letter to all the brothers and sisters.
1Th 5:28 May the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you.
Amen...
Oh rosered, I've been so "lonely"...for your posts--copiously sharing the Word with extraordinarily practical suggestions aka wisdom on how to be not only hearers but also doers of the Word. I had been thinking about sharing my loneliness...but stopped for a few minutes to eat my lunch. When I came back to share, I first read your replies on the Stored up for Fire thread as well as your reply on the Glory of God thread and felt a very strong, but soft and loving hand place my fingers on the keyboard.
I'm sharing on this thread because I, too, am grateful for Sheila's constant and consistent sharing of what the Lord has laid on her heart... also appreciate eaglesway who sometimes shares very long posts and sometimes like on this thread, very brief, but all inclusive reply re: the Word explains itself.
from the Amplified Bible Version...
1 Peter 4:7-11
v 7 But the end and culmination of all things has now come near; keep sound minded and self-restrained and alert therefore for the practice of prayer.
v 8 Above all things have intense and unfailing love :HeartThrob: for one another, for love covers a multitude of sins [forgives and disregards the offenses of others].
v 9 Practice hospitality to one another (those of the household of faith). [Be hospitable, be a lover of strangers, with brotherly affection for the UNKNOWN GUESTS, the foreigners, the poor, and all others who come your way who are of Christ's body.] And [in each instance] do it ungrudgingly (cordially and graciously, without complaining but as representing HIM).
v 10 As each of you has received a gift (a particular spiritual talent, a gracious divine endowment), employ it for one another as [befits] good trustees of God's many-sided grace [faithful stewards of the extremely diverse powers and gifts granted to Christians by grace].
v 11 Whoever speaks, [let him do it as one who utters] oracles of God; whoever renders service, [let him do it] as with the strength which God furnishes abundantly, so that in all things God may be glorified through Jesus Christ (the Messiah). To Him be the GLORY and dominion forever and ever (through endless ages). Amen (so be it).
Birth Pangs.
Shall the Lord bring to bear and not bring to birth?
The consuming of things that can be shaken involves shaking them :o)
Like ripe figs shaken of a tree the days of transition as the kingdoms of this earth are being swallowed up by the kingdoms of our God may involve something similar to the Exodus. YHWH prepared the hearts of the Egyptians to let His people go with tribulation.
Our safety is in being "in" the tree that cannot be uprooted and "on" the rock that doesnt roll.
Meanwhile, the whole creation groans with anticipation for its restoration from futility and chaos, which will be delivered through the revelation of the children of God.
Groaning for the new birth, the birth pangs grow intense, then great relief and intense joy when the man child is born.
Amen to all that was said , Anna great and timely verses sister & John !! :iagree: :HeartThrob:
Quote from: WhiteWings on February 24, 2014, 07:56:31 PM
I'm wondering, the great deep can also refer to the heart....???
I've long thought the bottomless pit or "abyss" of Rev 9 is in the fallen heart
..that the Rev 9 abyss, is the bottomless pit of potential in the fallen heart, as in, "how low can we go"? And of course that which hinders the dream of man (world domination in the guise of "peace!") must be removed and gotten out of the way..
How low can we go? look at history.. the holocaust.. of which in last or final days, is said will be greater evil.. [which makes us/(me) want to tell clear signs to our kids, with clear instructions/commands on how (and when) to avoid]
:girlheart:
Quote from: Seth on February 26, 2014, 05:00:08 PM
His ways are not searchable according to a pattern that man assumes God is bound to keep. There may be a pattern you cannot see yet. I don't believe Christ, for example, is going to literally kill mankind with a literal sword literally jutting out of his mouth per Revelation 19. Christ says he will judge the world with his word because he came not to destroy men's lives but to save. God is under no obligations to fulfill any prophecy according to man's perceived patterns.
...the sWord, two sided can separate in the tapestry of life, the threads of truth from the threads of error..
The sWord of God out of Jesus' mouth.. truth slays lies.. Light slays darkness
I.e, agree with Eaglesway.. :girlheart: :smile:
Quote from: eaglesway on March 02, 2014, 07:24:26 PM
I love the way the word explains itself if we can see it.
"And this word signifies the removal of things that are shaken until only those things which cannot be shaken remain"
This what the fire does, until God is all in all-
"These three abide, faith hope and love, but the greatest of these is love"
:iagree: :iagree: Also Rosered and Anna!!! Great posts! :))
Quote from: marie glen on March 07, 2014, 05:26:05 PM
Quote from: Seth on February 26, 2014, 05:00:08 PM
His ways are not searchable according to a pattern that man assumes God is bound to keep. There may be a pattern you cannot see yet. I don't believe Christ, for example, is going to literally kill mankind with a literal sword literally jutting out of his mouth per Revelation 19. Christ says he will judge the world with his word because he came not to destroy men's lives but to save. God is under no obligations to fulfill any prophecy according to man's perceived patterns.
...the sWord, two sided can separate in the tapestry of life, the threads of truth from the threads of error..
The sWord of God out of Jesus' mouth.. truth slays lies.. Light slays darkness
I.e, agree with Eaglesway.. :girlheart: :smile:
Me too. The reason I brought up revelation 19 is because I do not believe that there is a physical/literal fulfillment of that scripture prophecy. in other words I do not believe Christ is going to literally put a literal sword in his mouth and go about killing humanity literally by cutting them up into pieces. I believe that scripture fully metaphorical.
Quote from: Seth on March 07, 2014, 05:39:31 PM
Quote from: marie glen on March 07, 2014, 05:26:05 PM
Quote from: Seth on February 26, 2014, 05:00:08 PM
His ways are not searchable according to a pattern that man assumes God is bound to keep. There may be a pattern you cannot see yet. I don't believe Christ, for example, is going to literally kill mankind with a literal sword literally jutting out of his mouth per Revelation 19. Christ says he will judge the world with his word because he came not to destroy men's lives but to save. God is under no obligations to fulfill any prophecy according to man's perceived patterns.
...the sWord, two sided can separate in the tapestry of life, the threads of truth from the threads of error..
The sWord of God out of Jesus' mouth.. truth slays lies.. Light slays darkness
I.e, agree with Eaglesway.. :girlheart: :smile:
Me too. The reason I brought up revelation 19 is because I do not believe that there is a physical/literal fulfillment of that scripture prophecy. in other words I do not believe Christ is going to literally put a literal sword in his mouth and go about killing humanity literally by cutting them up into pieces. I believe that scripture fully metaphorical.
Amen! :gsmile: ...fully metaphor (imo) to describe something literal.. that what is not true can only fall/collapse, part of the large lesson mankind is learning..
I see God's 'judgment' as results and consequences of mankind's own doings.. A wise parent He is.. the sword as truth.. in that only truth can stand, and imo, this is why Apocalypse as collapse, is the full unveiling of truth from error/untruth/all babble..
This thread has been very enlightening, edifying, and now encouraging (esp with Marie's input and gracious acknowledgement of all who posted to this thread)...
re: ...the Word explains itself... (eaglesway)
re: ...full unveiling of truth (Marie)
Rev 1:1 The Revelation (unveiling) of Jesus Christ...
John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the TRUTH, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me.
1 Cor 15:22 ..in Christ all shall be made alive (OT Genesis In thy seed ALL nations shall be blessed -- NT Gal 3:16 ...He saith not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ)
Quote from: Seth on March 07, 2014, 05:39:31 PM
Quote from: marie glen on March 07, 2014, 05:26:05 PM
Quote from: Seth on February 26, 2014, 05:00:08 PM
His ways are not searchable according to a pattern that man assumes God is bound to keep. There may be a pattern you cannot see yet. I don't believe Christ, for example, is going to literally kill mankind with a literal sword literally jutting out of his mouth per Revelation 19. Christ says he will judge the world with his word because he came not to destroy men's lives but to save. God is under no obligations to fulfill any prophecy according to man's perceived patterns.
...the sWord, two sided can separate in the tapestry of life, the threads of truth from the threads of error..
The sWord of God out of Jesus' mouth.. truth slays lies.. Light slays darkness
I.e, agree with Eaglesway.. :girlheart: :smile:
Me too. The reason I brought up revelation 19 is because I do not believe that there is a physical/literal fulfillment of that scripture prophecy. in other words I do not believe Christ is going to literally put a literal sword in his mouth and go about killing humanity literally by cutting them up into pieces. I believe that scripture fully metaphorical.
:thumbsup: Yes Marie and Seth everyones contributions really , all this as of late has been
dynamic in learning
I do see the Sword of the Spirit coming to to slice and dice and cut away shredding to ribbons , these false images we have about ourselves and how we are supposed to be
according to the law , this law that puts us to death first the mirror image we think the Lord expects from us , but its a false image of God and of ourselves to God
being dead cannot make alive and cannot change
it takes to coming of the Lord Jesus Christ [ Sword of the Spirit of His Mouth ] to blast that image right out of the temple of our hearts !! man has always tried to do it on his own first and makes a monster a beast out of his own vain imaginations from his own heart whom is ruling and reigning as a king of the earth , his own life
as you judge so shall you be judged [ the beastly nature tries so hard to be LIKE GOD , and is so deceptive even the elect can be fooled if not for the Holy Spirit within them [ with prodded conviction , hold back , till the time the LORD COMES to slay with the breath [SPIRIT /SWORD WORD OF HIS COMMING ]
my own conviction was feeling like a hypocrit a play actor , pretending to be somthing holy and was not holy , but guilty as charged , this causes the anger and frustration and hating the whore [ false church ] a trap set for us all the fail in first ..... this darkness is the most desolate place where we weep and gnash our teeth for the pain of not being the very image of God we think we should be , but its a false sense of security and soon leaves us in a war within ourselves thats beyond a natural event , its somthing of a shaking and slicing and seperating that is painful to endure ..... the chasting of the Lord is very sharp and painful , you remember that battle and never want to experience it again ,
mercy becomes your plea , LORD HAVE MERCY ON US ALL !!
If any man have an ear, let him hear.
Rev 13:10 He that leads into captivity shall go into captivity: he that kills with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.
Rev 13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. [
we are trying to be holy images of Gods son and speak like a lamb but oh the accuser is there judging all flesh and sentencing death on all , but themselves ] its the doom and gloom message ]
Rev 13:12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
[satans power of the liar and murderer from the begining the condemnation we felt when we first needed to be saved and the Lord showed mercy to heal us from that stroke of death when the LAW come SLAYED US DEAD , now we have become the two fold sons of hell , twice dead!! a beast before Him , the land beast is all adam the sea monster is the Babylon self rightous spirit , thinking its right always and holding a false image of God in our hearts ! ] this one is worse than the first one !! an image , a fake idea mirror of the old man of whom he forgot who he was :sigh:
we need Jesus WE NEED HIS MIRROR IMAGE TO reflect perfect love and eyes of the Father to see what we are really supposed to look like , and be like and immitate !! Rev 13:13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
Rev 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
Rev 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and
cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. this is the FALSE IMAGE OF THE BEAST , "if you dont see it like me , your dead by the letter of the law [every word of GOD every jot and tittle ] ! and judge and condemn all mankind " :( its aweful to be in that state of being !!!!
but you dont even know it , because your twice dead , soul and spirit to God ! building up treasure for yourself that will be a witness against you , the word you speak will judge you in the last day !! last day of your so called beastly life and nature !
to be cleansed is painful and deadly to that beast and image the shattering can be heard to the very core of your being / soul !
Rev 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
Rev 13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
man of sin / old adam and son of perdition /loss and destruction
both having the false image of Gods glory and power to save , its JESUS CHRIST WHOM makes war with these false concepts and images to be torn down to dust and burned in the fire of death and thn makes NEW LIFE SPRING FORTH PLANTED BY THE FATHER IN OUR HEARTS !
ECC 3 has always blessed me to know its truth
its GOD WHOM DOES THIS THOUGHH JESUS CHRIST , THE MIGHTY WARRIOR faithful and true whom destrys the false images and tears them down to dust and ashes for us all , in the FATHERS TIME this is why no man knows the time nor hour , none but God when HIS mercy comes after the destruction and slaying of the wicked within us all each and everyone in their own order by the LORDS WORK HIS OWN SPIRIT AND LIVING WORD SHARP SWORD TWO EDGED HEB 4 !! .....
Ecc 3:1 To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
Ecc 3:2 A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
Ecc 3:3 A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;
Ecc 3:4 A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance;
Ecc 3:5 A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing;
Ecc 3:6 A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away;
Ecc 3:7 A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;
Ecc 3:8 A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace.
Ecc 3:9 What profit hath he that worketh in that wherein he laboureth?
Ecc 3:10 I have seen the travail, which God hath given to the sons of men to be exercised in it.
Ecc 3:11
He hath made every thing beautiful in his time: also he hath set the world in their heart, so that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning to the end.
Ecc 3:12 I know that there is no good in them, but for a man to rejoice, and to do good in his life.
Ecc 3:13 And also that every man should eat and drink, and enjoy the good of all his labour, it is the gift of God.
Ecc 3:14 I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be for ever: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him.
Ecc 3:15 That which hath been is now; and that which is to be hath already been; and God requireth that which is past.
Ecc 3:16 And moreover I saw under the sun the place of judgment, that wickedness was there; and the place of righteousness, that iniquity was there.
Ecc 3:17 I said in mine heart, God shall judge the righteous and the wicked: for there is a time there for every purpose and for every work.
Ecc 3:18 I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts.
Ecc 3:19 For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.
Ecc 3:20 All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again.
Ecc 3:21 Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?
Ecc 3:22 Wherefore I perceive that there is nothing better, than that a man should rejoice in his own works; for that is his portion: for who shall bring him to see what shall be after him?
I thank God he is still dealing with me still showing His mercy STILL , this I know all will be saved by HIS OWN WORK !! its so humbling and rewarding to just find out how He does it
for so many , many years just having faith knowing that HE WOULD , never knowing how He would just knowing He would do a perfect work in all and never ever , ever fails any of us
Believe now and can say now!!! more than ever WE LOVE HIM and see HIM PERFECT and glorious and beautiful !!! GOD our Savior of the whole world !!
Quote from: anna274 on March 07, 2014, 06:16:23 PM
This thread has been very enlightening, edifying, and now encouraging (esp with Marie's input and gracious acknowledgement of all who posted to this thread)...
re: ...the Word explains itself... (eaglesway)
re: ...full unveiling of truth (Marie)
Rev 1:1 The Revelation (unveiling) of Jesus Christ...
John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the TRUTH, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by Me.
1 Cor 15:22 ..in Christ all shall be made alive (OT Genesis In thy seed ALL nations shall be blessed -- NT Gal 3:16 ...He saith not, and to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ)
Amen , Anna , God IS building His Kingdom here and now among the chaos of this worlds end and destruction , we see HIM IN ALL HIS BEAUTY and glory and AWE !!
we would none of us ever would have post with the Help the HOLY SPIRIT SHOWING US THE WAY TRUTH AND LIFE and His word fighting for us , found in all here gathered into ONE , HE IS IN OUR MIDST!!! :dsunny:
Quote from: sheila on February 26, 2014, 05:38:40 PM
Secrets of Enoch ch 29...regarding celestial bodies..of heavenly troops as an essence
of fire[He who makes His angels as flaming ministers of fire]
And for all the heavenly troops,I imaged the image and essence of fire,and my eye
looked at the very hard firm rock, and from the gleam[twinkle] of my eye, the lightening
received it's wonederful nature,which is both fire in water and water in fire,and one does
not put out the other,nor does the one dry up the other, therefore the lightening is brighter
then the sun,softer then water and firmer then hard rock.
and from the rock I cut off a great fire[Our God is a rock],and from the fire I created
the great orders of the ten troops of the incorpeal angels. And their weapons are fiery
and their rainment a burning flame,and I commanded that each one should stand in his order.
Here satan and his angels are thrown out[war broke out in heaven,Michael and his angels fought and satan and his..but satan was not strong enough[incorruptible bodies..not weak corruptible flesh of man...see war to take land of Canaan..for pattern/Michael stand up]
the children of the resurrection are like the angels..the children of God. Each in his own
order.
Father,glorify me with the glory I had with you before the world was.
Rev 1;14-17
it is sown a natural body in weakness..and raised a celestial body of power.
and do not worry what you will wear......[ye shall not be unclothed] Mt 6;28 Luke 12;27,28
DO NOT BE AFRAID,LITTLE FLOCK,FOR THE FATHER HAS BEEN PLEASED TO GIVE
YOU THE KINGDOM.[and I have other sheep not of this flock[all men are sheep]
the 'best robe' bone of His bone,flesh of His flesh...when we see Him face to face
and are just like Him[one body,one spirit,one celestial flesh]
now, the heart of man has not imagined what God has stored up for all that love Him
and it is the spirit of God which reveals all these things pertaining to Christ and the things
He has freely given us.
do not eat from the tokogae lest ye die..and thus sin entered all men..and all men died.
through the righteousness of one man..the free gift of life comes to all men.
we should not be loving our life in this world..it is not our eternal dwelling place.....
Rev20;11....earth and sky fled from His presence...and there was no place for them
I was wondering about those glorified/spiritual bodies ! and the glow , what Jesus showed on the Mount of transfiguration matt 17;2 mark 9 Luke 9:29 natural language seems to limit the depths of understanding it fully ...
King James 2000 Bible
And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his clothing was white as the light.
American King James Version
And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
American Standard Version
and he was transfigured before them; and his face did shine as the sun, and his garments became white as the light.
Douay-Rheims Bible
And he was transfigured before them. And his face did shine as the sun: and his garments became white as snow.
Darby Bible Translation
And he was transfigured before them. And his face shone as the sun, and his garments became white as the light;
English Revised Version
and he was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his garments became white as the light.
Webster's Bible Translation
And he was transfigured before them: and his face shone as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.
Weymouth New Testament
There in their presence His form underwent a change; His face shone like the sun, and His raiment became as white as the light.
World English Bible
He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his garments became as white as the light.
Young's Literal Translation
and he was transfigured before them, and his face shone as the sun, and his garments did become white as the light,
God is love. God is a consuming Fire. God is Spirit. Love, indwelling, is the consuming fire that burns up everything that is contrary to love, contrary to the divine nature. The divine nature and thus the Spirit that is God is everything that life is, which is everything that true love is. When the Love of God is in a person as who they and the love can not be "dethroned" in one then "death" is dead because all the "lusts" that work works of death upon living things is "dead", burned up by Love. Psalms says that God shall judge in righteousness. The work of righteousness is PEACE Isaiah 32:15 ff says. So, when GOD judges in righteousness then PEACE is present as the judgment. Anything that is not peaceable is not of the Spirit of God but is of the ENMITY that Jesus destroyed in His witness on the cross.
God is Spirit. God is life. Life is spirit and is invisible, and is our God, invisible and spirit, the spirit that GIVES LIFE.
Life is Spirit. Life is Holy. When life matures the living being it is creating, then Eternal Life in Holiness is the father of and in that created being, Jesus Christ.
Jesus Christ is ALWAYS God's finished creature, in this case, mankind. All one person or personality if you like, and many vessels, but all one. No division at all.
God bless, Donken
I am one body. The only division within me is the cell wall between my cells, or perhaps the tissue that is joint where it meets the tissue that is ligament. The head is the head and not a foot, but the head and the foot are one, only the function is different, but the "cause" of their union is one, and they are united in one identity, a house for my spirit and soul- and a means for carrying out my will.
Hi. The scripture does say that the first man "IS" natural, it does not say man "became" natural or "was spiritual first". This is the same as saying the first appearance of anyone in the world through birth is a baby, and is not an adult. First is the baby, and afterward is the adult. The baby is immature, but the adult is the mature natural man. Unless we become as little children, both spiritually and naturally in physical body, we will never ever become an adult.
In a human baby, the adult they came from and were birthed from is not able to be seen. Nor is the maturity of the adult able to be known by the baby or by anyone seeing only the baby and never having seen an adult. We as mankind had never seen God as a model for who we will be when grown, which a human baby all through his childhood in the world does have models with them.
So, Jesus came to show us who we will be and what the Spirit of God, life, in us, is like when the human body is entirely obedient to the spirit of life in it.
The enmity that is contrary to God in the flesh, {law of sin lusts and needs} is able to be kept under the dominion of the Spirit of life in that body, when we are a mature son of God.
The law of sin is the so mentioned lusts of the flesh that are the "law" we live by and must live by to stay alive individually, when we are immature spiritually and apart from the maturity of God.
Sin is said to be the state of being short of the glory {ability, knowledge, maturity} of God. Every human child when born is short of the glory of a human adult.
That is the parable that fully describes what is called sin in the bible. Not accusatory, just true.
God bless, ken
As I see it part of becoming mature is learning accountability. An infant at first responds only to the needs it feels, hunger, thirst, affection, etc. As the infant grows it begins to express its personality and respond to its environment. Whether or not it is nurtured and loved vastly affects the way the seed of glory within will grow up, first the shoot, then the stalk then the full head of wheat bearing fruit.
A balance of nurturing, fellowship, reason and discipline are what good parenting skills bring to that child.
When a parent loves their child they look within that person, with respect and a certain sense of the holiness of God's unique creation in that child, and a keen appreciation for the beauty of that unique child's inner person. They labor to help that child discover that beauty as a seed that grows in the light, planted in good soil and the living water.
Paul speaks about reaping and sowing and the harvest of the flesh versus the harvest of the Spirit. As a good Father our creator is teaching us maturity in many ways.
Who shall live with the EVERLASTING devouring flames.?? The Lamb of course.
Isa 33:9 The earth mourneth and languisheth: Lebanon is ashamed and hewn down: Sharon is like a wilderness; and Bashan and Carmel shake off their fruits.
Isa 33:10 Now will I rise, saith the LORD; now will I be exalted; now will I lift up myself.
Isa 33:11 Ye shall conceive chaff, ye shall bring forth stubble: your breath, as fire, shall devour you.
Isa 33:12 And the people shall be as the burnings of lime: as thorns cut up shall they be burned in the fire.
Isa 33:13 Hear, ye that are far off, what I have done; and, ye that are near, acknowledge my might.
Isa 33:14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?
Isa 33:15 He that walketh righteously, and speaketh uprightly; he that despiseth the gain of oppressions, that shaketh his hands from holding of bribes, that stoppeth his ears from hearing of blood, and shutteth his eyes from seeing evil;
Isa 33:16 He shall dwell on high: his place of defence shall be the munitions of rocks: bread shall be given him; his waters shall be sure.
Isa 33:17 Thine eyes shall see the king in his beauty: they shall behold the land that is very far off.
Isa 33:18 Thine heart shall meditate terror. Where is the scribe? where is the receiver? where is he that counted the towers?
Isa 33:19 Thou shalt not see a fierce people, a people of a deeper speech than thou canst perceive; of a stammering tongue, that thou canst not understand.
Isa 33:20 Look upon Zion, the city of our solemnities: thine eyes shall see Jerusalem a quiet habitation, a tabernacle that shall not be taken down; not one of the stakes thereof shall ever be removed, neither shall any of the cords thereof be broken.
Isa 33:21 But there the glorious LORD will be unto us a place of broad rivers and streams; wherein shall go no galley with oars, neither shall gallant ship pass thereby.
Isa 33:22 For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver, the LORD is our king; he will save us.
His eyes are as flames of fire.......(Rev 19)
All things are open to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do.....(Heb 12)
Jerusalem will be inhabited as a town without walls for I will be a wall of fire around it.....(Zech 2:4,5)
In order to get into Jerusalem(the heavenly city, our mother, the New Jerusalem from above who is free...Heb 12) , one must pass through the wall of fire. The fire kindles on anything that is not suitable to dwelling in "a town without walls"- a free place where no law(wall) is needed. God tests us with fire to see if we will "endure".
"Let patience(endurance) have its perfect(complete) work that you may mature and whole, lacking nothing"
Outside the city are all things that offend, burning in Gehenna- adulterers, sorcerers, murderers, etc- the works of the flesh that make us unsuitable to dwell within the walls of freedom, the fire of the divine nature.
Inside, the inhabitants "walk among the stones of fire" and "dwell in the midst of the everlasting burnings" because they have endured the "flames" of the"purifying of their faith, which is more precious than gold tried in the fire".
Our God is a consuming fire all that dwell in His presence have been consumed, into His glory, love, holiness and power- through forgiveness and the spirit of resurrection.
We hav not come to a mountain burning with fire that cannot be touched........ we have come to Mt Zion and the heavenly Jerusalem, unto myriads of angels and unto the spirits of righteous men made perfect, unto the general assembly of the firstborn registered in heaven and unto the blood that speaks better things than the blood of Abel(Heb 12)
The fire on the mountain of the lawgiver caused men to shudder with fear and turn away. The fire on the mountain of our God consumes fear and guilt and lust and turns the corrupt heart into a jewel that shines in the fire, which is God, "who alone dwells in unapproachable light". As we are drawn closer to Him the light consumes every shadow until we are filled up to all the fulness of God- at ease in the glory, at rest in the light, walking among the everlasting flames.
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Chrst from the dead to obtain an inheritance that is imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in the heavenly realms for you unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last times. In this you greatly rejoice even tho for now for a little while, if necessary, you have been distressed by various trials so that the proof of your faith, more precious than gold that is perishable even tho tried in the fire, may be found to result in glory and honor and praise at the revelation of Jesus Christ....(1 Pet 1)
Cool stuff, glorious, as the veil draws thinner--
Upon this mountain I will remove the mists that veil all the peoples....
And the veil in the heavens was rolled back like a scroll and the sign of the son of man appeared in the heavens.........
Glory.
:cloud9: Amen and amen, yes it is glorious. Glory to Your name, Father..... :banana:
This is what happens when New Jerusalem, the married bride is threatened or an attempt to breach it is made.
Rev_20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
Should we think that this is different fire than the CONSUMING fire of God. God is love, God is spirit, God is unchanging. So, the consuming fire is God's love. And when something is consumed it is WITHIN that which is consuming it.
This is the process by which we are "saved" or matured INTO the bride all things that are not of GOD not being allowed in, not being clothed with wedding clothes at the time of the wedding. In verse 15 below we see what those wedding clothes are to be, and we can also see that it is GOD who gathers the unclothed to the battle. Could it actually be that he is going to clothe them? What do you believe, those of us who believe in all in all.
Rev 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
Rev 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
Rev 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
Rev 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Armageddon is GOD's Battle, not a worldly one. We are to clothe the naked, are we not, etc. When verse 17 says it is DONE is the very same thing that happens when the voice of the seventh angel sounds and the seven thunders utter what is not written in the scriptures.
God bless, donken
God is a consuming fire. The love of God and the light and fire of God are one- but they manifest in different ways. Above (imo) these definitions of God's being- love, light, fire, wind, living water, etc; to me- is God's definiton of Himself- I Am That I Am.
God has emotions, thats why we do. If He is angered, it does not anull or transcend His love. Beyond that anger there is love- which imo IS NOT AN EMOTION. Fire, to me, IS NOT AN EMOTION, nor is light.
These three things describe the essence of God's being who HE IS.
His disciplinary actions are not coming from some "compartment" of Himself or His Spirit. He Is Who He Is.
All things lead into the love, light, fire of God because He will be all in all and He Is Who He Is.
IMO there is no contradiction, or need to fear that accrediting God with anger will somehow discredit any other aspect of His character, or any emotion He expresses, because all the aspects of His character and PERSONALITY lead to the core of His True Self.
Anger is dangerous. That is why we are so frequently warned about its expression and how to govern it when it manifests, as it does, in God and in us- a fundamental emotional response to violation, for example- something that speaks within us, an awareness that a righteous limit has been exceeded by another. To me this is real, and also very cautionary, but nevertheless genuine.
Be angry, but sin not- and let not the sun go down on your wrath.(James)
:cloud9: Amen :thumbsup:
I offer that God is the divine nature, in the sense that that is who He is. I am everything that I am, is the way I understand I am that I am that God is said to say about his name. Ie.. a name such as tom or mike or even Jesus or God, does not let us identify him intimately.
The attributes of the divine nature are everything he is. NO evil attributes in him, no anger, nothing that causes violence just as Jesus witnessed, and the attributes or emotions are spiritual messengers.
God's messengers of who he is do not include the carnal "emotions" of anger, greed, envy, and so on. We believe this or not, Up to us. Choose the good and refuse the evil we are told. The evil doing emotions in us are the enmity in our flesh that Jesus did not witness as being of the spirit of God, {the ghost} IN HIM. The father of all living is LIFE. It is ours to believe and consider or reject, personally each one of us.
Either Jesus did not witness all of God our father, or he did. you decide. Isa_53:9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had ***done no violence**, neither was any deceit in his mouth.
If you believe this scripture about Jesus, then you\I\we have to find a different understanding of the temple cleansing incident if WE think that Jesus did that in violent manner and in anger. Why? Because it is OUR TEMPLE that he is cleansing {entirely} in THIS DAY. By it done unto you by your\our faith.
God bless, ken
"Therefore I was angry with this generation and said, 'They always go astray in their hearts, and do not kno my ways.'" @ Hebrews 3:17
IMO, The testimony of the scriptures presents a different conclusion than the one you have presented. Listing anger in a list of evil works- does not make it so, nor does it necessarily limit God to your interpretation of His nature.
Rev. 6
16 and they say to the mountains and to the rocks, `Fall upon us, and hide us from the face of Him who is sitting upon the throne, and from the anger of the Lamb,'
17 because come did the great day of His anger, and who is able to stand?
Hello. I would just ask, what is the fruit of anger. There is no place in scripture that has righteous as an adjective describing anger... unless of course some "man" has rewritten one bible to mean what he thinks it should mean so that he can justify his own anger.
God IS love, not sometimes, but eternally. Love and Anger are contrary. Anger is part of the ENMITY Jesus abolished in HIS FLESH and will abolish IN OURS with our understanding and agreement as we become THE ONE SON.
Man's anger fights wars and does many things called "righteous" but that bring results of people that Jesus did not witness. If a person DO MY WORDS, he said, they shall NEVER die. But if we hear his words and do not do them ALL, he said, we build our house {body} on the sand... and when we are washed away by the ways of satan\man\world we die. Jesus did not ever say keep ALL the scriptures, but he did say if we do not hear his words then hear\see HIS LIFESTYLE {works}. The serpent is ANGER and all of it's relatives. By the fruit the emotions in us would produce if we fulfill their lusts\drives, we will know what spirit they are of, or from.
James 1:20. The wrath of man does not work Goid's righteousness. So.. do we turn the other cheek and resist the evil of anger in us, or do we slay Jesus Christ to ourselves AGAIN. Heb. 6:6.
Here is the "spirit" of the wisdom that is from above. The fruit of, or full righteousness is SOWN IN PEACE, not in war and burnings of hell and so on, or do we believe otherwise or want to do so.
Jas 3:17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
Jas 3:18 And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.
How beautiful on the mountains are the feet {ways} of them that preach the GOSPEL OF PEACE.
Here is what evil does and the mind of it. Is anger a cause of sTRIFE. I think we know the answer, at least I hope we do.
Jas 3:14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
Jas 3:15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
Jas 3:16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.
Please notice that every evil work is in something we commonly do as mankind many times a week. Earthy, Sensual {lust of flesh??} DEVILISH. All the same thing. to be earth, to be sensual to sin, is DEVILISH or of... the lie about God and what God and Jesus are really like. The devil is a lair from the beginning.
Can we say that a human baby can not be or present the truth of what a human adult is like in maturity if one has not seen a well mannered human adult. Therefore a human baby is a lie about what man is like, to one who has not seen a human adult person acting in good manners and different in many ways that the baby is limited to.
Natural Adam is naturally and without condemnation, automatically a lie about GOD to those who think natural Adam is already the image of GOD. Adam is blameless about this lie, except when Adam begins to teach that God is like he is too.
NO wonder many people would like to toss James out by saying it is not a book of the "real" scripture. By our lifestyle we will actually show what we truly believe, and that can not be hidden forever.
God bless, ken
Quote from: donken on May 07, 2014, 04:47:14 AMLove and Anger are contrary.
This is not true...from my perspective. Anger is a strong feeling of displeasure. There is nothing wrong with man or God having a strong feeling of displeasure at things which are (and should be) displeasing. Nothing in the Bible indicates to me that love must run headlong against anger. Anger can be very motivating in a positive way.
How one acts as a result of anger is what counts. The wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God. However, God's anger and man's anger are not the same. Whether or not the term "righteous anger" appears in the Bible has no bearing on these two facts:
God has anger
God is righteous in all his attributes
So the completely logical outcome of those Biblical facts are that God's anger is a righteous one. Otherwise I would have to conclude that God's anger is unrighteous, or neutral. But I know that God is righteous in all attributes.
Exactly Seth, therefore the only other logic is to excise the scriptures that declare and define God's anger from the scriptures, or transcend them by some "teaching from the Spirit".
:cloud9: The Jewish sages of old have a rule of study; that being that no interpretation can remove the clear meaning intended first. If it says it rained, it rained. Wisdom reveals more ABOUT the rain, where it came from, what it symbolized, Who it is, what it's for, but it doesn't say, it DIDN'T rain. This is where we get into, hath God not said?, and it's a slippery slope from there.
Wisdom always builds upon or opens up what is there, it doesn't remove what is there. My and their (Jewish sages of old) opinion.....Blessings....
Personally, based on how I view the progressive unfolding of the Sacred Record, I think it is more accurate to say (in my opinion) under such circumstances, God is anguished because true Divine Love always oversees the welfare of His children, even if they are wicked and wayward children, as they are destined to be part of All-inAll.
As the Supreme Being, He already knew where, when and how they would sin - therefore a suitable response that could be understood by evil people was necessary - and that response was already known and planned since before the beginning of the Aeon of aeons.
I know God has blessed you already. In His Peace and His Love.
[Aside. Tomorrow, I pay a return visit across the water and I am pleased to say I will visit the Codex Sinaiticus again. I just want to see it for some reason although it is not the Bible of today, it is a rare thing and I hope to receive inspiration even if it is symbolic.]
:cloud9: Blessings on your trip and I hope it works out for you this time. I think it would be fascinating to see also. God is good. Blessings....
Quote from: Seth on May 07, 2014, 04:55:19 AM
Quote from: donken on May 07, 2014, 04:47:14 AMLove and Anger are contrary.
This is not true...from my perspective. Anger is a strong feeling of displeasure. There is nothing wrong with man or God having a strong feeling of displeasure at things which are (and should be) displeasing. Nothing in the Bible indicates to me that love must run headlong against anger. Anger can be very motivating in a positive way.
How one acts as a result of anger is what counts. The wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God. However, God's anger and man's anger are not the same. Whether or not the term "righteous anger" appears in the Bible has no bearing on these two facts:
God has anger
God is righteous in all his attributes
So the completely logical outcome of those Biblical facts are that God's anger is a righteous one. Otherwise I would have to conclude that God's anger is unrighteous, or neutral. But I know that God is righteous in all attributes.
Hello Seth. God does not change, scripture says, does it not. IF you are feeling peaceful and loving toward anyone or all, and something makes you angry, what is now replacing or dethroning the love? Is God who IS love ever dethroned?
I would ask you to look at yourself\ourself and see if perhaps we are justifying our own anger and other like emotions in believing we are allowed to do them because we have a righteous purpose. Also, let me ask you if you make up your mind to get or feel angry, or does it dictate itself to you. The only way God, who IS love, eternally, not just sometimes, IS LOVE is to be love at all times, forever, changing not. Do you think love if DETHRONED as God.
When we think, naturally, that God has anger and changes mood and emotions, we are making God like ourselves, which is the wrong tree. No death causing or evil fruit in the tree that is LIFE. The tree of LIFE can not bring forth evil and death causing fruit. It is the other tree that has TWO fruits or results caused by it. It is what makes itself God to us because our first state is to be that tree with both fruit able to be produced.
So does anger, hate, envy, etc. produce life, is that what we believe? Or, are we asked to be angry and do not sin, put the anger away before darkness {night time} comes {into us}.
Is anger frustration. IS God able to be frustrated?
Isa_27:4 Fury is not in me: who would set the briers and thorns against me in battle? I would go through them, I would burn them together.
Here we read that fury is not in God. So what will we do with the following scripture if we believe that is true.
Jer_32:37 Behold, I will gather them out of all countries, whither I have driven them in mine anger, and in my fury, and in great wrath; and I will bring them again unto this place, and I will cause them to dwell safely:
Eze 24:13 In thy filthiness is lewdness: because I have purged thee, and thou wast not purged, thou shalt not be purged from thy filthiness any more, till I have caused my fury to rest upon thee.
If fury is not in God, then what is the answer for such scriptures. I offer this for anyone who can believe God is good only. The fury is IN US, as is the ANGER. The fury etc. that exists because of what God is doing, is in us and is THE ENMITY in us that Jesus Christ being obeyed and followed IN us by us, will abolish.
Just as scripture also says that God did not say anything about blood sacrifice and burnt offerings when he first spoke to them. He calls Israel the GENERATION of HIS WRATH. That which is in them and us, and causes us to believe that God is also like we are, is the WRATH IN US, the enmity against the truth of God.
Follow Jesus' words in our own life and we will find that out for ourselves.
The fury has to REST or be settled down IN US before we are able to enter into the promises of God. Why. WRATH can not enter. Heb. 3. When it says in my wrath they shall not enter into my rest, it means that the wrath in them can not bring them or us into the peace and holiness we all need to BE before we can SEE {understand\know} God fully. {again, my take, but also my life}
God bless, ken
Bless, donken
QuoteHello Seth. God does not change, scripture says, does it not. IF you are feeling peaceful and loving toward anyone or all, and something makes you angry, what is now replacing or dethroning the love? Is God who IS love ever dethroned?
I believe this to be a false dilemma. Anger does not dethrone love. Anger is a strong feeling of displeasure. Some things cause a strong feeling of displeasure BECAUSE of love.
"peaceful and loving" are YOUR definitions of love. And yet Christ says:
Matt 10:34
Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
The most loving man on earth, in that world, in his ministry, was Jesus Christ. Yet, he did not come to bring peace.
Mark 3
5 After looking around at them
WITH ANGER, grieved at their hardness of heart, He *said to the man, "Stretch out your hand." And he stretched it out, and his hand was restored.
QuoteI would ask you to look at yourself\ourself and see if perhaps we are justifying our own anger and other like emotions in believing we are allowed to do them because we have a righteous purpose. Also, let me ask you if you make up your mind to get or feel angry, or does it dictate itself to you.
I believe I have made the distinction between man's anger and God's anger, haven't I?
QuoteWhen we think, naturally, that God has anger and changes mood and emotions, we are making God like ourselves, which is the wrong tree.
The Bible literally says that God has anger, but not the anger of MAN. When your interpretations cause you to make statements which literally contradict what the Bible says, you ought to at least consider rephrasing your statements to make sure they align with what is written in Scripture.
QuoteIsa_27:4 Fury is not in me: who would set the briers and thorns against me in battle? I would go through them, I would burn them together.
Here we read that fury is not in God. So what will we do with the following scripture if we believe that is true.
Jer_32:37 Behold, I will gather them out of all countries, whither I have driven them in mine anger, and in my fury, and in great wrath; and I will bring them again unto this place, and I will cause them to dwell safely:
Eze 24:13 In thy filthiness is lewdness: because I have purged thee, and thou wast not purged, thou shalt not be purged from thy filthiness any more, till I have caused my fury to rest upon thee.
If fury is not in God, then what is the answer for such scriptures. I offer this for anyone who can believe God is good only. The fury is IN US, as is the ANGER. The fury etc. that exists because of what God is doing, is in us and is THE ENMITY in us that Jesus Christ being obeyed and followed IN us by us, will abolish.
I think you missed the context. Isaiah 27 is talking about when the anger of the Lord HAS PASSED.
Isaiah 26
20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment,
until the indignation be overpast. 21 For, behold,
the Lord cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.
Isaiah 27
27
In that day (when his indignation is passed) the Lord will take his terrible, swift sword and
punish Leviathan, the swiftly moving serpent, the coiling, writhing serpent. He will kill the dragon of the sea. 2
In that day sing ye unto her, A vineyard of red wine. 3 I the Lord do keep it; I will water it every moment: lest any hurt it, I will keep it night and day. 4 Fury is not in me: who would set the briers and thorns against me in battle? I would go through them, I would burn them together. 5 Or let him take hold of my strength, that he may make peace with me; and he shall make peace with me.
The reason the fury is not in him, is because "in that day" it will have been passed, and he will be judging Laviathan, the serpent, rather than the people.
When something is past or over, it is not of the eternal spirit. Think about it for a moment anyway. The reason Christians do not obey Jesus' words ALL THE TIME is because they make allowance for things of anger or self righteousness, that they may think is God's righteousness, that they do. Ie.. stoning sinners, even mentally and in their own spirit, etc. Anything that causes death is not of life. Life in captivity to immature creatures is what gives those creatures the ability to do works of evil and death. That is where and when Jesus is not the cross IN US, as per Hebrews 6:6.
How about you, Seth. I do not mean you have to answer me or in print, just to think about it for your own self. We are to be like Jesus. I hope you believe that but like some may not believe it. So, if you did only Jesus words and his example, such as forgiving all men their trespasses against us, etc., when could you be angry and act on it and be being like Jesus. This is the crux of the whole image of Christianity. Man is afraid to trust in God alone, and I agree, it is a walked out position that will arise as time goes on IF we are following Jesus that closely. Today we are going to be taught to do so because evil is evil, and if I think it against someone, or do it against some one no matter what the provocation, I do not obey Jesus and I love myself {old man ken} more than I love or follow Jesus.
Believers are afraid of actually having to do this, and perhaps to quit any job that asks them to be dishonest a bit, or lie about a product, or gouge and over charge a customer and use guile and so on for self gain. They hate these things and do not want them to be true. This may sound accusative, but really I am only speaking the truth as I know it or see it if you prefer, because this is the day we are going to be judged. If Christians believe that God does evil then they may believe that if they do evil then God will do or bring evil on them. But the whole O.T. is saying threatenings and fear of being punished DO NOT ACCOMPLISH OBEDIENCE.
If I do evil to someone who does evil, supposedly to teach them a lesson, then they are only receiving EVIL as if it were able to make one good. It is GOODNESS in one as who they are and who they only are that makes one do and be good FOREVER.
God bless. Ken
Quote from: donken on May 08, 2014, 11:17:28 PM
When something is past or over, it is not of the eternal spirit. Think about it for a moment anyway. The reason Christians do not obey Jesus' words ALL THE TIME is because they make allowance for things of anger or self righteousness, that they may think is God's righteousness, that they do. Ie.. stoning sinners, even mentally and in their own spirit, etc. Anything that causes death is not of life. Life in captivity to immature creatures is what gives those creatures the ability to do works of evil and death. That is where and when Jesus is not the cross IN US, as per Hebrews 6:6.
How about you, Seth. I do not mean you have to answer me or in print, just to think about it for your own self. We are to be like Jesus. I hope you believe that but like some may not believe it. So, if you did only Jesus words and his example, such as forgiving all men their trespasses against us, etc., when could you be angry and act on it and be being like Jesus.
Here is what you are missing in my statements: The wrath of MAN worketh not the righteousness of God. I am not talking about the wrath of MAN.
Mark 3
5 After looking around at them
WITH ANGER, grieved at their hardness of heart, He said to the man, "Stretch out your hand." And he stretched it out, and his hand was restored.
Jesus Christ was a spotless lamb, without sin. Therefore, his anger was not the product of sin, which shows that anger in itself is neutral. What counts is what comes of anger.
So, if "we are to be like Jesus" ....well? Jesus was angry.
QuoteBut the whole O.T. is saying threatenings and fear of being punished DO NOT ACCOMPLISH OBEDIENCE.
I have no problem with that. And yet, I also have no problem with the idea of God creating evil to TEACH them that.
Hello Seth. Thanks for bringing this up. I will re-print it here for a reminder for us and anyone who may be reading along.
You quoted..... Mark 3 :5 After looking around at them WITH ANGER, grieved at their hardness of heart, He said to the man, "Stretch out your hand." And he stretched it out, and his hand was restored.
Yes, Jesus was so angry he actually did a very kind and compassionate work. He RESTORED the hand. Here is my take again, even though this is the only scripture {mark} were anger is even mentioned around Jesus. Look at it this way. Jesus looked around at them {who had} anger {about Jesus re the sabbath} {daringly}, being grieved {inwardly moved with SORROW} at THEIR hardness of heart {against a good thing for the man with the withered hand}.
There is no law against doing good at any time.
There is always another good answer Seth, even if it is not believed by any or many. God supplies an answer that shows no anger or hate or unforgiveness and so on in Him or in HIS SON either. You defend anger, and I know you sincerely believe it is of God at this time, but believe the good and refuse to believe the evil {about GOD}. That is the mistake evil that was with "eve" in the parable of the garden and the serpent. She too thought doing evil was being like GOD or having evil done in the world was the work of God, take your pick. Evil, just because it exists, is not a witness of God.
The wrath of man that does not do the righteousness of God is "the evil" that exists because man is not yet all good only, as Jesus is.
So, that "is" the evil and darkness that is to be removed by completion\perfection as we become the finished finisher.
There IS things we are going to be given today that are NOT WRITTEN in the book. Words on paper are always at the mercy of the meaning the reader gives them from "their own spirit" and ideas.
Rev 10:4 And when the seven thunders had uttered their voices, I was about to write: and I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Seal up those things which the seven thunders uttered, and *** write them not***.
Thanks again, God bless, donken
Quote from: donken on May 09, 2014, 12:33:13 AM
You quoted..... Mark 3 :5 After looking around at them WITH ANGER, grieved at their hardness of heart, He said to the man, "Stretch out your hand." And he stretched it out, and his hand was restored.
Yes, Jesus was so angry he actually did a very kind and compassionate work.
Yes, he did a compassionate work
for the man, while he looked around at them with anger.
QuoteYou defend anger, and I know you sincerely believe it is of God at this time, but believe the good and refuse to believe the evil {about GOD}.
I am simply saying that anger is not unrighteous of itself, which is true since God demonstrates that throughout the scripture. Between the two of us, I am the only one who has not been reduced to declaring the prophets to be of the spirit of man, rather than speaking by the Spirit of God.
QuoteThe wrath of man that does not do the righteousness of God is "the evil" that exists because man is not yet all good only, as Jesus is. So, that "is" the evil and darkness that is to be removed by completion\perfection as we become the finished finisher.
That is the evil that God creates. When he creates man who is evil by nature, he is creating evil because he stitches them together and sends them into the world. THEN, as with Nebbuchadnezzar, he uses those men as a servant (he literally declared the Babylonian king to be his servant in this) to bring Israel into captivity.
Hi Seth. I will not be going on much longer as nothing is being changed "in either"
1Ki 19:18 Yet I have left me seven thousand in Israel, all the knees which have not bowed unto Baal, and every mouth which hath not kissed him.
Jer 50:17 Israel is a scattered sheep; the lions have driven him away: first the king of Assyria hath devoured him; and last this Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon hath broken his bones.
Jer 50:18 Therefore thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; Behold, I will punish the king of Babylon and his land, as I have punished the king of Assyria.
So, supposedly we have in the above scripture of Jeremiah God now punishing someone who was obeying him, as you seem to believe. So even in obeying God, it seems, one can also then be punished by the same things unto them that they supposedly did to Israel and others at God's Behest. This is the message your present belief about God causing evil by his direction will result in, and has resulted in.
Jer 51:6 Flee out of the midst of Babylon, and deliver every man his soul: be not cut off in her iniquity; for this is the time of the LORD'S vengeance; he will render unto her a recompence.
Jer 51:7 Babylon hath been a golden cup in the LORD'S hand, that made all the earth drunken: the nations have drunken of her wine; therefore the nations are mad.
Jer 51:8 Babylon is suddenly fallen and destroyed: howl for her; take balm for her pain, if so be she may be healed.
Jer 51:9 We would have healed Babylon, but she is not healed:** forsake her,** and let us go every one into his own country: for her judgment reacheth unto heaven, and is lifted up even to the skies.
Isa_10:20 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the remnant of Israel, and such as are escaped of the house of Jacob, shall no more again stay upon him that smote them; but shall stay upon the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, ***in truth***.
In Job it is "satan" that smites, the same way that the King of Babylon does it. No longer stay upon confusion about this fact.
Jer 51:34 Nebuchadrezzar the king of Babylon hath***devoured me***, he hath crushed me, he hath made me an empty vessel, *** he hath swallowed me up like a dragon***, he hath filled his belly with my delicates, he hath **cast me out**.
Yes, the "veil" that does not let us see God clearly, the KING and ways of BABYLON, the worldly ways man still uses, even all the while often naming the name of Jesus. Filled HIS BELLY, {lusts} with God's delicates, or good things. Eaten but because of the appetites and ways and mind of the flesh that are enmity and unlike God and His ways entirely.
Where is he going to resurrect the truth. Right out of the mouth of that which swallowed him up, THE FLESH immature BODY.
Jer 51:49 As Babylon hath caused the slain of Israel to fall, so **at Babylon shall fall the slain of **all** the earth.
Slain "of the earth". Babylon is confusion and a multitude of differing doctrines, beliefs, ideas, etc. Confusion of face, even about God's "face".
Jer 51:51 We are confounded, because we have heard reproach: shame hath covered our faces: for **strangers are come into the sanctuaries of the LORD'S house.*** {The strangers are men who conquer Israel and the stone temple by the sword and the fire of mankind, etc, and have made people believe that these methods are of God....it is STRANGE FIRE in the HOLY PLACE, spiritually speaking}
Jer_51:44 And I will punish Bel in Babylon, and I will bring forth out of his mouth that which he hath swallowed up: and the nations shall not flow together any more unto him: yea, the wall of Babylon shall fall.
There we see that the lie, the deception, is going to be "corrected" and it is OUT OF THE SAME MOUTH that which men and his warring evil ways cause men to be blind to, the truth of God as in Jesus Christ.
Recall, God's delicates have been swallowed up by the LUSTS or appetites of "Babylon" and her king, and that is what is going to be coming out of the same mouth, the deilicates ONLY, only the truth.
God bless, donken
Quote from: donken on May 09, 2014, 09:20:22 PM
Hi Seth. I will not be going on much longer as nothing is being changed "in either"
1Ki 19:18 Yet I have left me seven thousand in Israel, all the knees which have not bowed unto Baal, and every mouth which hath not kissed him.
Jer 50:17 Israel is a scattered sheep; the lions have driven him away: first the king of Assyria hath devoured him; and last this Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon hath broken his bones.
Jer 50:18 Therefore thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; Behold, I will punish the king of Babylon and his land, as I have punished the king of Assyria.
So, supposedly we have in the above scripture of Jeremiah God now punishing someone who was obeying him, as you seem to believe. So even in obeying God, it seems, one can also then be punished by the same things unto them that they supposedly did to Israel and others at God's Behest. This is the message your present belief about God causing evil by his direction will result in, and has resulted in.
God used those kings for his purpose. That doesn't necessarily mean they knew it was happening. Nebbuchadnezzar was punished in Daniel after saying
"'Is this not Babylon the great, which I myself have built as a royal residence by the might of my power and for the glory of my majesty?"
Before we seek to understand those scriptures, we must first ask this question:
Is Jeremiah speaking the truth? If you cannot believe that Jeremiah was speaking through the Spirit of God, then you can never understand WHY God said he would judge them. You cannot build a roof without the foundation of the house in place.
QuoteJer 51:6 Flee out of the midst of Babylon, and deliver every man his soul: be not cut off in her iniquity; for this is the time of the LORD'S vengeance; he will render unto her a recompence.
Jer 51:7 Babylon hath been a golden cup in the LORD'S hand, that made all the earth drunken: the nations have drunken of her wine; therefore the nations are mad.
Jer 51:8 Babylon is suddenly fallen and destroyed: howl for her; take balm for her pain, if so be she may be healed.
Jer 51:9 We would have healed Babylon, but she is not healed:** forsake her,** and let us go every one into his own country: for her judgment reacheth unto heaven, and is lifted up even to the skies.
Isa_10:20 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the remnant of Israel, and such as are escaped of the house of Jacob, shall no more again stay upon him that smote them; but shall stay upon the LORD, the Holy One of Israel, ***in truth***.
In Job it is "satan" that smites, the same way that the King of Babylon does it. No longer stay upon confusion about this fact.
Jer 51:34 Nebuchadrezzar the king of Babylon hath***devoured me***, he hath crushed me, he hath made me an empty vessel, *** he hath swallowed me up like a dragon***, he hath filled his belly with my delicates, he hath **cast me out**.
There is no confusion. Jeremiah and Isaiah credit judgment to GOD.
One scripture does not undo the other. So either they are saying God
is Satan, or God uses Satan for his purpose.
"Flee out of the midst of Babylon, and deliver every man his soul: be not cut off in her iniquity; for this is the time of the LORD'S vengeance; he will render unto her a recompence. " Since Satan is not the Lord (which is blasphemy), then Satan is USED of the Lord to accomplish this: "HE (the Lord) will render unto her a recompense."
....or, the prophets attributed this judgment incorrectly to God, in which case they spoke incorrectly from the spirit of man, which is what you have been promoting on this forum. In that case, the prophets would have ignorantly committed blasphemy.
And at the very least, they would have been ignorant- I think Jesus accorded them a loftier status than that.
Hello . If I pay a person to beat up another person, I am just as guilty, and if I do not do it myself I also may be a coward. I am saying, if some one needs to be judged with pain and sorrow, then let God do it and move on yourself. Even thinking evil to another IS EVIL. Evil thoughts, etc. We are dead in that case.
Isa_28:7 But they also have erred through wine, and through strong drink are out of the way; the priest and the prophet have erred through strong drink, they are swallowed up of wine, they are out of the way through strong drink; they err in vision, they stumble in judgment.
What do we think the "strong drink" that makes one drunk, even as a prophet can be drunk, is.?
To flee out of Babylon is to remove confusion and darkness\ignorance out of our own lives through the Spirit and wisdom of God, or we will drink that cup even in ignorance.
We have a chance to do that now. Christians have been being hurt, sick, dying, etc. just like everyone else in the world experiences. Because the whole world lies IN DARKNESS the scripture says. There is NO EXCEPTION even for prophets and priests and so on.
Joh_8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
If Jesus IS the light of the world then anything the scriptures teach as if it were of God that is different or contrary to what Jesus shares and does is darkness, because of that strong drink that all mankind just loves.
Joh_12:46 I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.
Implication is. anyone who did not share or teach or believe as Jesus IS, was already in darkness and stays there. Moses said there was going to be another prophet AFTER HIM that would be saying things that were true and if they were not "heard" {done} then those things that do not hear or do what that person said would be extinquished. {perish from existence, like death is going to}. Does Jesus kill the ways of God or speak against the ways of God. He apparently does if we do things that kill and hurt people and yet think GOD made men and empires in the past DO THEM TO OTHER MEN AND ISRAEL.
That is confusion of face and that belief and idea that God directs, thinks, and desire evil and death upon anyone, IS the confusion of dwelling in or visiting Babylon. Since Jesus never taught or did that to anyone and forgave all even without requiring them to ask for it first, then I guess we would have to say that he did not know the father or he kept some secrete from us. Because we are not to do what those who believe God causes evil upon others think God does, and God is HOLY. We are to be holy also, Mat. 5 tells us, just like our Father in Heaven is holy. Yet we know we are not to accuse, blame, strive "against" people, steal, cheat, kill, strike back at those who strike us, and so on. SO just who is the true witness.
We are to be like GOD I believe many do believe that. Yet, if GOD does do evil to others and we are to be like God, the how could we be like God if we forgive every one, do no violence, and turn the other cheek all the time. Does GOD not turn the other cheek etc. How about it.?
Eph_6:12 For we wrestle not ***against flesh and blood***, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
So, do we or do we not wrestle against flesh and blood, or is it about beastly attributes IN MEN that we battle against, even our own "man".{self}.
The things Christ and God battle is the things that man is NATURALLY. 2Pe_2:12 But these, ***as natural brute beasts***, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;
Jud_1:10 But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but ***what they know naturally*** as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.
Who knows the things of a man except the spirit of a man that is **IN** Him.
1Co_2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
1Co_2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
donken
Quote from: donken on May 11, 2014, 03:40:05 AM
Hello . If I pay a person to beat up another person, I am just as guilty, and if I do not do it myself I also may be a coward. I am saying, if some one needs to be judged with pain and sorrow, then let God do it and move on yourself.
I have no problem with that. :thumbsup:
QuoteTo flee out of Babylon is to remove confusion and darkness\ignorance out of our own lives through the Spirit and wisdom of God, or we will drink that cup even in ignorance.
See, I removed confusion in my life through
understanding the scripture, and setting aside what I thought made sense in my former beliefs about hell. I did not remove confusion through believing that I should decide for myself which scriptures don't reflect what I believe God SHOULD do or be. Confusion is eliminated through the scripture, not apart from it.
I don't believe it's up to individual Christians to pick and choose from the same prophets and books which scriptures should stay and which ones should go. It's either all or nothing. Either the OT writers lied, or were deceived, or not. They weren't deceived on this, but not about that. Lies don't have fellowship with truth in scripture.
1 Cor 10
8 We should not commit sexual immorality, as some of them did—and in one day twenty-three thousand of them died. 9 We should not test Christ, as some of them did—and were killed by snakes.
These are two references to judgment by God. I accept that they happened and that God brought it to their door.
See, at the very least, you have to deal with the obvious:
If God has the power to stop an evil thing from happening and he chooses not to, then that is the same as creating evil. You seemed to have dealt with that problem without resorting to atheism as many do. I have heard many convoluted arguments to get around this fact, most of which place God in a less than sovereign position.
If God has power to stop a child from being killed in war, and does not use his power to stop that from happening, then he has done something that you, Ken, would not do.
hi. Luk_2:35 (Yea, a sword shall pierce through thy own soul also,) that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.
The piercing of this sword, to different sides, is so the thoughts of man hearts may be revealed, in the soul. The three word phrase using pierce can be understood to mean travel, as in travel through.. {I offer, to divide}. The sword is the "channel of an act" or how it is done etc, by passing through.
The spirit of Jesus' mouth. {noteably, not Moses' mouth and not the prophets mouth per se}. 2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the **spirit of his mouth**, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
So, according to an understanding that agrees with 2 Cor. 3:6, we offer that the spiritual meaning of Jesus' words and the spirit of his witness and forgiveness and love is the sword and the light or wisdom of GOD he give us and the world will destroy the mystery of iniquity, the man of iniquity\sin, natural Adam, who lives and is ruled naturally by the law of sin in the flesh body, more than the Spirit of God in that is also in Adam... 1 Cor. 3:1 - 3. When we are not fully obedient to the ways of Jesus Christ "spiritually" in our body then we are Christian but still children, under the ways of the world. Gal. 4:1 - 6. This is natural and not a condemnation of anyone or anything, just like we do not condemn children in the world for acting like children do.
Growing up spiritually, each of us being taught by God, or raised as God's son individually, puts away the childish things, the "child of sin" or worldliness that is naturally in us all when we are born of water first, as the scripture calls it. The mystery of iniquity, or what the man of sin is made up of, is only removed when the mystery of Godliness is revealed to be established. Anything contrary to God, with Jesus' witness of God, is of the man of sin or .. our immaturity. No condemnation about this at all by God. God knows this is HIS method of creating man to be completed as HIS BODY in the earth, which will be HIS SON JESUS every time.
Joh 6:32 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you **not** that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.
Joh 6:33 For the **bread of God*** is he which cometh down **from heaven**, and giveth life unto the world.
The "he that comes down to earth from heaven is the "quickening Spirit man".. THE SPIRIT in the final day, not a physical man. The result of this quickening or enlivening spirit, maturity in Christ, is GOD beginning to teach us so we will be raised by God, {like jesus from the grave} by the SPIRIT OF LIFE from INSIDE OF OUR PRESENT PHYSICAL BODY.
The knife or sword Jesus uses is a "circumcising knife", can we say? 1Co_15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
I hope we can really notice or receive that the FIRST ADAM was made a living soul, which is earthy, natural, man, carnal. He was not JESUS CHRIST who does not "sin" in maturity. Even Jesus as a human baby was short of the glory of GOD simply by immaturity, which is the meaning of sin if we have a non condemning heart and mind in our selves toward ALL OTHERS including our selves. Can we admit we have been a baby or child as Christians so far. I can.
Unless we become as a little child we can not enter into the Kingdom of heaven yet. Why? Because we will think we are "already completed and thus already saved from dying. Salvation is to take place in the physical body in this earth in this time.
Joh_6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me. {we "can" read the last three words to mean, becomes me.}
1Th_4:9 But as touching brotherly love ye need not that I write unto you: for ye yourselves are taught of God to love one another.
God bless, Ken
Quote from: Cardinal on May 08, 2014, 06:55:13 AM
:cloud9: Blessings on your trip and I hope it works out for you this time. I think it would be fascinating to see also. God is good. Blessings....
Dear Cardinal, I have been meaning to just say a little thank you for your blessings but did not have the chance.
I know you do not expect it but I am grateful. I believe that manners are of Heaven, and I also believe that in God's Highest Heaven there will not be found a bad manner - all is of Harmony amongst those beings who are able to exist in such awful Purity. That is just my opinion.
Incidentally, this time I observed others and often it seemed that people passed the Codex Sanaiticus in the same manner that they passed an original Beethoven score or original Beatle lyrics...assigning, it would appear, the same value to each.