No man enters heaven

[lastpost]

I believe that, yes, Heaven is a state of being, a state of consciousness, Christ-consciousness – a state. However, in God's House there are many abiding and tarrying places for God's children. And also, in my opinion, there are places for those whose state of consciousness is degraded to a foul and vile existence, a hideous distortion of a healthy being, who simply could not exist in a spiritualised atmosphere as the Light would cause an 'everlasting' pain - and there, in those places, a purification process must occur before being able to exist in those heavenly abiding places – which will most definitely happen because God must be all in all. It is not difficult to imagine, we see the shadow of health and illness in this shadow-world for our education. All that is in this world, from that which is beautiful to that which is vile, is but a pale reflection of what was once perfect, before man abused the laws of God and brought that he was supposed to be a steward to down with him. That is how I would summarise spiritual heavens and the outer darkness (or jail of 'lake of fire' etc.) as opposed to a material place high up there in the material universe called 'the heavens'. That is just my interpretation of course.

[marie glen]

I kinda, sorta, believe that too.. But not as a totality. so i guess i do believe that, yes. But I also believe in a literal Earth and Universe made new.. wherein there will be springtime and harvest (w/o extremes).. and even sabbath and Tabernacles.. where and when, "the lion will eat straw like the ox and the bear will graze with the cow" (Is 11:7) And where "each one will abide under their vine and fruit tree".. the nations will beat their weapons into plows and gardening tools.." Micah 4:4,3

I even believe Jesus literally returns to the planet, "His feet standing upon Mt of Olives on that day" (Zech 14:4) just like the angel(s) at His ascension from Mt of Olives said, "you will see Him return just as you have seen Him go up.." Acts 1:9(?)

"My people will be able to sleep in the forest" (somewhere in Isaiah).. Rev 21:5.. all things new, a new heavens and a new earth.. a big universe.. lots of people being resurrected.. namely "all"... To me, it's not what God has created, but what He is creating. And I believe it is quite glorious.

But I definitely agree, there is light and there is darkness.. like dimensions and the mind/heart can be in both.. Levels of darkness? (and imperfection as opposed to Perfection/God/Life) - I kind of agree? I think of darkness/imperfection as an abyss / bottomless pit of not so good potential.. which :eek: history has often demonstrated. But Truth will vanquish all untruth.. Purity all impurity.. Light all darkness.. Life all death.. All the same thing.. Him.
:thumbsup: :Peace2:

[jugghead]

If we believe that heaven is not just a place but a state of being, here are some thoughts that I never thought of before until just a few days ago.

We know that we have the ability to feel with this physical body, and that we will have a spiritual body that is incorruptable, unable to corrupt the creation ..... imagine objects in heaven that can do the same thing. Imagine touching a rock and just by touching it we know what it is like to be a rock, or touch a flower and know what it is like to be a flower, now imagine the same in return, that what is created, whether a rock, a tree, a flower can know what it is like to be a person, to have the experience of having life as we do and us having a life like they do .....  wouldn't that in itself be "all in all", imagine being a seed, being planted in the ground, taking nourishment from the ground, knowing what it is like to grow like a tree.

Imagine a rock just waiting in anticipation for someone to come along and love it as much as God loves us, does not the creation itself wait in anticipation for the Sons of God to be manifested?

If all things are possible with God, is this not a possibility? Wouldn't this be infinite understanding? That understanding would never end?

my  :2c:

[jugghead]

Something else was brought to mind which may sound improbable, impossible and very unbelievable ..... picture Saul's life before his experience on the road to Damascus and his life after that experience ..... what if Adolph Hitler experienced this same thing ..... that his physical death is like Paul's experience and now Adolph is one of the greatest evangelists suffering for Christ among the Jews that he killed while he was here on earth just as Paul suffered for Christ among the ones he once killed.

Just a  :2c: thought

[Dandelion]

The bigger they are, the harder they fall....fall on their knees, that is? 

Something like that, jugghead?        :gsigh:   

D.

[jugghead]

The bigger they are, the harder they fall....fall on their knees, that is? 

Something like that, jugghead?        :gsigh:   

D.

Yes ..... but a more detailed explanation of what I believe, I will post under my tidbits, in order to not hijack this thread.

[marie glen]

If we believe that heaven is not just a place but a state of being, here are some thoughts that I never thought of before until just a few days ago.

Very interesting posts, JUgghead! I do think we will be so much more "aware" in the Kingdom / what it is God is creating.. One thing I think about God is that He is very thorough, very organized, and very able. Why do I think organized? Idk.. maybe just because I like that idea, lol. Yet, He does seem organized to me, in how He has done things and is doing things. What a wise parent! He will end up with exactly what it is He has set out to do (create). And of course, I think the main theme is His writing His law and duplicating His character upon every heart and mind.. If it's on the heart, I have to think it's written / imbedded in the mind.. The smoke of apocalypse which will rise up forever and ever? [Which idea is not a reason to fear but to celebrate, that only truth can stand. And being in Jesus, we wear God's armor, I'm convinced anyone in tribulation He envelopes them.. And still others He leads safely away from tribulation.. Either scenario He is with us.. Whether we live or whether we die, He is with us..

And the more we study on it, we know that He is fully capable and willing/wanting to redeem all and bring every single one in heaven and earth into complete joy. The more we study on it, the more we find it confirmed in His Word and in His Spirit. As Jesus, said, no man enters the kingdom but through Him, and He will draw all to Him (Jn 14:6; 12:32)

Um.. sorry to ramble on so.. :mblush:
    :banana: :dsunny:

The bigger they are, the harder they fall....fall on their knees, that is? 

Something like that, jugghead?        :gsigh:   

D.

     :iagree: with that!

[eaglesway]

I kinda, sorta, believe that too.. But not as a totality. so i guess i do believe that, yes. But I also believe in a literal Earth and Universe made new.. wherein there will be springtime and harvest (w/o extremes).. and even sabbath and Tabernacles.. where and when, "the lion will eat straw like the ox and the bear will graze with the cow" (Is 11:7) And where "each one will abide under their vine and fruit tree".. the nations will beat their weapons into plows and gardening tools.." Micah 4:4,3

I even believe Jesus literally returns to the planet, "His feet standing upon Mt of Olives on that day" (Zech 14:4) just like the angel(s) at His ascension from Mt of Olives said, "you will see Him return just as you have seen Him go up.." Acts 1:9(?)

"My people will be able to sleep in the forest" (somewhere in Isaiah).. Rev 21:5.. all things new, a new heavens and a new earth.. a big universe.. lots of people being resurrected.. namely "all"... To me, it's not what God has created, but what He is creating. And I believe it is quite glorious.

But I definitely agree, there is light and there is darkness.. like dimensions and the mind/heart can be in both.. Levels of darkness? (and imperfection as opposed to Perfection/God/Life) - I kind of agree? I think of darkness/imperfection as an abyss / bottomless pit of not so good potential.. which :eek: history has often demonstrated. But Truth will vanquish all untruth.. Purity all impurity.. Light all darkness.. Life all death.. All the same thing.. Him.
:thumbsup: :Peace2:

I agree. The New Jerusalem is coming down out of the heavens. Jesus said, I am the living bread having come down out of heaven.

When, in John's revelation, the coming of the Lord is spoken of as "the heavens were rolled up like a scroll and the ark of the covenant appeared in the heavens, I believe this speaks of the testimony(ark of the testimony a.k.a.) in the "tent of meeting" (huse of prayer for all people). The veil pulled back so "every eye will see him)- all consciouness from all time opened to the face of Christ(and we allw ith unveiled face beholding as in a glss the reflection of the Lord are being transformed from glory to glory into the same image"- which is the destiny of all mankind, which will be one vine, united in love, but also with "each one under His own vine and under his own fig tree". We are the first fruits of this coming universal union of consciousness- "In my Father's house are many mansions"- but it will be a "new earth" in a "new heavens" and "all things will be made new" which, to me, means alive in the Spirit and eternal in nature, gloriously shared like "the voice of God" being as the sound of "the rushing of many waters, like the sound of 10,000s of 10,000s praising God", to me a metaphorical description of the "all in all" in the age of ages which, without fear of sounding new age, I believe is universal consciousness united in love, through Messiah, in God.

In Romans 8, the "whole creation groans" for the "revelation of the children of God"- the first fruits James speaks of as "a kind of first fruits of creation"- who will set the (whole) creation free from futility.

His coming and appearing are spoken of as "epiphaneia"( bursting open or flooding of consciousness), as "parousia"(arrival of presence), as "erchomai" (to come to a time and a place). I believe it is all of the above, from the dawn(Alpha) to the full noon(Omega).