Jesus and his ressurection

[SQ]

1 Peter 3:18–19
18 For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit, 19 through whom also he went and preached to the spirits in prison


I am not exactly understanding this but I will make an effort to get my thoughts across.
Jesus died in the body, but made alive in spirit, in the spirit he went and preached to spirits in prison.
If the spirit is unconsience along with the body why would he preach to spirits in prison?
Where is this prison and who are the spirits could this be the men of old that died before jesus died on the cross so all men could be reconciled to him?
Before the cross possibly all that died were in a place called a prison maybe their spirits was consience it appears so. :dontknow:

[WhiteWings]

You are referring to soul sleep. I'm sorta a soul sleep supporter too. But last week I found some verse that are hard to explain from that view...

John 2:19  Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
Mark 14:58  We heard him say, I will destroy this temple that is made with hands, and within three days I will build another made without hands.

The I is the problem (for me)
If, lets call it, all parts of Jesus where dead/asleep there ws no "I" to do any rebuilding.
So it must mean His spirit/soul never died.
Unless ofcourse Jesus never spoke those words but it was the HS speaking from within Him.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Well He did say, that He only spoke what He heard the Father (who is Spirit) speak.......

[WhiteWings]

Ok. But that's not really the question.
Who was controlling the voice of Jesus when He spoke those words?
a] His own spirit (that got the info from Father)
b] Father taking direct control.

My whole point is this; if the answer is "a" then that means His spirit wasn't dead for 3 days because a dead spirit can't raise a body.
Unless ofcourse the spirit could be raised by Father and the body by Son :Chinscratch:

Edit: added the italic words

[SQ]

Here is one place that confuses me he was put to death in body, but made alive in spirit. So when his body died was his spirit made alive the minute he took his last breath?
This making it possible for him to preach to spirits in prison?
To preach to spirits they had to be consience.
Then later he was seen in body but wasn't recognised at first?
He asked Thomas to put his hands in the holes and then he no longer doubted.
I am believing this was a spiritual body maybe why he was not recognised at first?
Thanks WW I will reread and think on this, but if spirits was alive in prison then it wasn't soul sleep. Unless of course the minute The Christ died spirits in prison was made alive also.
Oh I think I may be going in circles.  :laughing7:

[Molly]

Ok. But that's not really the question.
Who was controlling the voice of Jesus when He spoke those words?
a] His own spirit (that got the info from Father)
b] Father taking direct control.

My whole point is this; if the answer is "a" then that means His spirit wasn't dead for 3 days because a dead spirit can't raise a body.
Unless ofcourse the spirit got raised by Father and the body by Son :Chinscratch:

Colossians 2:9
For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.



John 2:19
Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.




[the fulness of the ] "Godhead" [bodily]

G2320
θεότης
theotēs
theh-ot'-ace
From G2316; divinity (abstractly): - godhead.


G2316
θεός
theos
theh'-os
Of uncertain affinity; a deity, especially (with G3588) the supreme Divinity; figuratively a magistrate; by Hebraism very: - X exceeding, God, god [-ly, -ward].

[WhiteWings]

So Molly; who is *I* ?

[Molly]

So Molly; who is *I* ?

G2316
θεός
theos
theh'-os
Of uncertain affinity; a deity, especially (with G3588) the supreme Divinity; figuratively a magistrate; by Hebraism very: - X exceeding, God, god [-ly, -ward].

[WhiteWings]

I can look up Strongs too. But that's not a answer.
Write down your opinion not a some quote...

[Molly]

I can look up Strongs too. But that's not a answer.

I wouldn't presume to try to reduce this to words.

But, someday, you will see him in all his glory, full of grace and truth, and it will take your breath away.  It will bring you to your knees.

Until then, it's a matter of trying to intellectually render that which is not reducible.


3All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

--John 1

[Livelystone]

The spirit is life

The body without the spirit is dead......... when the spirit that was in Jesus left His Body on earth and went back to God who gave it in the first place, everyone saw the dead body of Jesus that was left behind.

When the Spirit of Jesus that went to God at the death of Jesus came back to the Body of Jesus........ Jesus was resurrected.

Jesus then ascended into heaven as both body of man and Holy Spirit of God where He will completely raise up His Temple from (His Body on earth) by the end of the third day that we who are on earth are now somewhere near the beginning of.

Blessings

Doug

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Amen, Doug  :thumbsup: He's raising up that body now, little by little, destined to be a body like unto His glorious body......Blessings....

[Tim B]

I've wondered about that too. But, considering there doesn't seem to be any support, from I've read, in the Old Testament of consciousness after death, here's some possibilities:

Christ resurrected those "imprisoned (in death)" and then spoke with them (although, this would seem to imply that he would then put them back in the grave until he finally resurrected all men).

Or, what if after He died he was removed from the space-time continuum and spoke with them at their final resurrection from the dead? So, he, in a way, spoke to them in the future, but he settled their condition in the present time 2,000 years ago (roughly). Or, it could be that when Christ died the Father (which is one with the Son) spoke to the dead in their future resurrection, as he is, or can be, out of time.

I generally hold to the idea of soul sleep as well, and my responses don't have any scriptures (that I can think of) to back them up, but I figured I'd throw them out there.

[claypot]

1 Peter 3:18–19
18 For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit, 19 through whom also he went and preached to the spirits in prison

I am not exactly understanding this but I will make an effort to get my thoughts across.
Jesus died in the body, but made alive in spirit, in the spirit he went and preached to spirits in prison.
If the spirit is unconsience along with the body why would he preach to spirits in prison?
Where is this prison and who are the spirits could this be the men of old that died before jesus died on the cross so all men could be reconciled to him?
Before the cross possibly all that died were in a place called a prison maybe their spirits was consience it appears so. :dontknow:

God made something. He made spiritual beings....angels. He made spiritual beings clothed in flesh.....people. Flesh, dust, dirt, all seem to carry the idea of not quite measuring up to the ideal. The ideal in Gods economy seems to be a spirit led (dominated) being.

I am a spirit being inside a husk or shell. God is spirit. A child of God is spirit, not flesh. Those who worship God must do so in spirit.

Being in these husks seems to separate us from God in some way. God thought this up. It's like God wants us to experience life from conception onward. We (the seed/spirit) wake up to life in a shell. The shell needs to die much like the shell of the seed we put in the ground when planting. Once the seed bursts out of the shell the shell is needed no longer. The shell was never the 'Being', the seed was. It is in the seed that the life dwells.

The shell needs to die and it is the spirit from within working with the Spirit from without that will accomplish this. Like the life in a seed we plant in the ground needs the life of the sun and rain to go on to completion.

The sun and rain enter the place of death (the ground) to bring forth life to the seed. This is like Jesus (sun and rain) preaching to the spirits in prison (us in the shell, in the ground). Jesus dies (enters the ground to get to us). He is the light (the sun) and the rain.

cp

[claypot]

Every one of us are 'the spirits in prison' until freed by the the Christ.

cp

[SQ]

Lightbulb moment thank you cp.

[Paul Hazelwood]

If the spirit is unconsience along with the body why would he preach to spirits in prison?

Most translations tend to read that the dead know nothing whatsoever, looking at the greek word for word translation that is open to interpretation.

I doubt there is any state of being that would prevent Christ from preaching to them and affecting them through that, and since this is all spiritual, then what takes place in a spiritual state would not require consciousness at all. 

[SQ]

If the spirit is unconsience along with the body why would he preach to spirits in prison?

Most translations tend to read that the dead know nothing whatsoever, looking at the greek word for word translation that is open to interpretation.

I doubt there is any state of being that would prevent Christ from preaching to them and affecting them through that, and since this is all spiritual, then what takes place in a spiritual state would not require consciousness at all. 

Hi Paul that is an interesting view, I had never thought of that.
Will consciousness happen only at the resurrection of the dead?
The more I learn the less I know. :dontknow:

[rosered]

If the spirit is unconsience along with the body why would he preach to spirits in prison?

Most translations tend to read that the dead know nothing whatsoever, looking at the greek word for word translation that is open to interpretation.

I doubt there is any state of being that would prevent Christ from preaching to them and affecting them through that, and since this is all spiritual, then what takes place in a spiritual state would not require consciousness at all. 

Hi Paul that is an interesting view, I had never thought of that.
Will consciousness happen only at the resurrection of the dead?
The more I learn the less I know. :dontknow:

amen I am with you on that SQ ! :mblush: more questions than answers  for sure
  But I do have a peace now that I have never known before , and thats  worth it all  :icon_flower:

  you were  saying here

I am believing this was a spiritual body maybe why he was not recognised at first?
Thanks WW I will reread and think on this, but if spirits was alive in prison then it wasn't soul sleep. Unless of course the minute The Christ died spirits in prison was made alive also.
Oh I think I may be going in circles. 

  and I thought of this verse  , the very moment the Cross was  complete in Christ this happened   , now to me it can only mean that death no longer had power over them because of sin ..


:icon_king:Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. 


Mat 27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; 


Mat 27:52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, 


Mat 27:53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many. 
 
this verse  went into the holy city  and appeared unto many reminds me of rev  21  being manifested [known/ seen ]

And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 


Rev 21:3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God [is] with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, [and be] their God. 

  this is all so encouraging to me and proof enough for me that the Voice  of Jesus also was the same voice John heard when  he was in the spirit on the Lords Day .
  it is spiritual of course and by all natural accounts  seems unbelieveable
  but  the Lord did say  when the dead  hear His Voice they shall live

and the hour was the Cross of Jesus Christ  :icon_flower:
Jhn 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. 

  I looked this up for  more proof of  the Cross being the hour of glorification and His victory over DEATH  not just for  Himself but all that so come to Christ .

hope this helps some and does not confuse  anyone further , I cannot explain what I see very well and I could burst at times  for not being able to share  with others the Joy in the Lords power and glory in His revealing to us ,  God bless ya   rosered :HeartThrob:


Jhn 12:23 And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified. 

Jhn 12:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. 


Jhn 12:25 He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal. 


Jhn 12:26 If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will [my] Father honour. 


Jhn 12:27 Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour. 

[SQ]

Oh that is so good rosered.
I do have a couple questions, but being late I will wait until tomorrow, I can ask with a clearer mind.
Your post really helped. :cloud9:

[Molly]

Matthew 27:50
Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.

Hi rosered.   When Jesus cries with the loud voice we are seeing the lightning of God again. 

[a loud] "vioce"
G5456
φωνή
phōnē
fo-nay'
Probably akin to G5316 through the idea of disclosure; a tone (articulate, bestial or artificial); by implication an address (for any purpose), saying or language: - noise, sound, voice.


G5316
φαίνω
phainō
fah'ee-no
Prolongation for the base of G5457to lighten (shine), that is, (transitive or intransitive, literal or figurative): - appear, seem, be seen, shine, X think.


G5457
φῶς
phōs
foce
From an obsoleteφάω phaō (to shine or make manifest, especially by rays; compare G5316 and G5346); luminousness (in the widest application, natural or artificial, abstract or concrete, literal or figurative): - fire, light.


51And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
52And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,



--Mat 27



John 11:43
And when he thus had spoken, he cried with a loud voice, Lazarus, come forth.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Beautiful Rose and Molly..... :thumbsup:

[rosered]

  Hi Molly , thanks for looking deeper sis
  the power of  Fire and Light seem to go together dont they ?
what about the great voice in Rev 21;3 the many waters/voices as ONE again here

all gathered as One Voice though many are in this One Voice of Jesus Christ seen in those other verses too , wow  , this is awesome !!  :icon_flower: :HeartThrob:

Rev 19:6 And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.


Strong's G3173 - megas

1) great

a) of the external form or sensible appearance of things (or of persons)

1) in particular, of space and its dimensions, as respects

a) mass and weight: great

b) compass and extent: large, spacious

c) measure and height: long

d) stature and age: great, old

b) of number and quantity: numerous, large, abundant

c) of age: the elder

d) used of intensity and its degrees: with great effort, of the affections and emotions of the mind, of natural events powerfully affecting the senses: violent, mighty, strong

2) predicated of rank, as belonging to

a) persons, eminent for ability, virtue, authority, power

b) things esteemed highly for their importance: of great moment, of great weight, importance

c) a thing to be highly esteemed for its excellence: excellent

3) splendid, prepared on a grand scale, stately

4) great things

a) of God's preeminent blessings

b) of things which overstep the province of a created being, proud (presumptuous) things, full of arrogance, derogatory to the majesty of God