Tentmaker Forum

Apologetics - Universal Reconciliation => Arguments Against Universal Salvation => Topic started by: Tim B on June 12, 2009, 09:45:47 AM

Title: Feign Obedience?
Post by: Tim B on June 12, 2009, 09:45:47 AM
This is said in Psalm 66:3-4 (Young's Literal Translation):

"3Say to God, `How fearful [are] Thy works, By the abundance of Thy strength, Thine enemies feign obedience to Thee.

4All the earth do bow to Thee, They sing praise to Thee, they praise Thy name.' Selah."

Could this be taken as an argument against UR, considering it says God's enemies don't truly bow down (aka, sounding as if they do not have a change of heart when bowing down to God)?
I'm guessing not, because there seems to be plenty of stronger verses that say otherwise, but what do you guys think?
Title: Re: Feign Obedience?
Post by: WhiteWings on June 12, 2009, 10:59:05 AM
It doesn't say they will never bow down.
It doesn't say the consequence is eternall hell.
The verse is only about the strength of God.

3584 vx;K' kachash {kaw-khash'}

Meaning:  1) to deceive, lie, fail, grow lean, be disappointing, be untrue, be insufficient, be found liars, belie, deny, dissemble, deal falsely 1a) (Qal) to become lean 1b) (Niphal) to cringe, feign obedience 1c) (Piel) 1c1) to deceive, deny falsely 1c2) to act deceptively 1c3) to cringe 1c4) to disappoint, fail 1d) (Hithpael) to cringe, feign obedience

Origin:  a primitive root; TWOT - 975; v

Usage:  AV - lie 5, submit 3, deny 3, fail 3, denied 2, belied 1, deceive 1, dissembled 1, deal falsely 1, liars 1, submitted 1; 22





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




Romans 14:11  For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

Isaiah 45:23  I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.




QuoteMeaning:  1) to swear, adjure 1a) (Qal) sworn (participle) 1b) (Niphal) 1b1) to swear, take an oath 1b2) to swear (of Jehovah by Himself) 1b3) to curse 1c) (Hiphil) 1c1) to cause to take an oath 1c2) to adjure

Origin:  a primitive root; TWOT - 2318; v

Usage:  AV - sware 167, charge 8, oath 7, adjure 3, straitly 2; 187



Quote1843 evxomologe,w exomologeo {ex-om-ol-og-eh'-o}

Meaning:  1) to confess 2) to profess 2a) acknowledge openly and joyfully 2b) to one's honour: to celebrate, give praise to 2c) to profess that one will do something, to promise, agree, engage

Origin:  from 1537 and 3670; TDNT - 5:199,687; v

Usage:  AV - confess 8, thank 2, promise 1; 11

QuoteCould this be taken as an argument against UR, considering it says God's enemies don't truly bow down (aka, sounding as if they do not have a change of heart when bowing down to God)?
Actually it's argument against the ET view that God simply breaks the legs of sinners so that they bow down.

The verse you quoted clearly shows God knows it is/was false obedience.
That isn't stated in the other verses that speak of inward bowing.