Hello, I'm Travis

[Travis]

Matthew 13:37  He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38  The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39  The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40  As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.
41  The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42  And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43  Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

[Travis]

Matthew 25:41  Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

[Travis]

John 14:6  Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

[Travis]

Acts 2:36  Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
37  ¶Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
38  Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39  For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
40  And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
41  Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

[Travis]

I have provided some verses, whether or not these are sufficient for your purposes Lefein, I cannot say. I would also recommend that every person read the scriptures for themselves. If you have more questions I may not answer to your satisfaction.

I will continue to present the Gospel of Jesus Christ at this forum so long as I can.

[WhiteWings]

Matthew 25:41  Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Who are on His left hand? What does that word mean?
What going is in that fire?

[WhiteWings]

John 14:6  Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Is Jesus still the truh after someone died?

[WhiteWings]

Matthew 13:37  He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38  The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39  The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40  As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.
41  The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42  And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43  Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

How long does that kingdom last?
How long will the tars burn?

[WhiteWings]

I have provided some verses, whether or not these are sufficient for your purposes Lefein, I cannot say.

I think they won't impress many, as in none, on this forum.
Anyway I wish you many posting hours on this forum because every second you waste your time he promoting you satanism you can mess with minds of others. :thumbsup:

[Beloved Servant]

Anyway I wish you many posting hours on this forum because every second you waste your time here promoting your satanism you can't mess with minds of others.

I've always wondered why people do come here to argue.
Preaching to those who have never heard of Christ seems more fruitful for the Kingdom.

Typical example of striving in one's own works — vanity, all is vanity.

[micah7:9]

Here is a scripture passage that I came to realize how profound it really is.

Christian Universalism teaches that Jesus is the only way and that Jesus is Saviour of the world.   Most Christian Universalists have never doubted an eternal hell believers walk with God and mainly argue that it is a belief in Jesus that salvation comes about, not the nature of judgment.  Realize that to some judgement can be eternal hell but Christian universalists simply believe that Judgment has a different nature. 

You can argue for eternal damnation till your blue in the face but that doesn't change what actually saves a person.

Here is the passage.

Phl 1:14 And many of the brethren in the Lord, waxing confident by my bonds, are much more bold to speak the word without fear.

Phl 1:15 Some indeed preach Christ even of envy and strife; and some also of good will:

Phl 1:16 The one preach Christ of contention, not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my bonds:

Phl 1:18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.

Phl 1:19 For I know that this shall turn to my salvation through your prayer, and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,



We preach Christ here, so rejoice.......

:bigGrin: :thumbsup:

[Paul Hazelwood]

The universalism gospel message is a different gospel that incorporates some parts of the real Gospel.

Does belief in Jesus Christ as Saviour save people or not?

[Paul Hazelwood]

John 14:6  Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Yes Travis,   Christian Universalisam teaches that.

[Paul Hazelwood]

Matthew 25:41  Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

You cannot gaurantee that you will not avoid such a fate if you think that when we tell someone about Jesus Christ as our saviour doesn't actually save us.   

[Paul Hazelwood]

Matthew 13:37  He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38  The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39  The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40  As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.
41  The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42  And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43  Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

Prove that you are not a tare that has come into this field of grain at tentmaker.

[Paul Hazelwood]

Acts 2:36  Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
37  Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
38  Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39  For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
40  And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
41  Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.

Here is where your hypocrisy will start to show Travis,  you accuse people here of making the focus about universalism and not the gospel yet, you are making your focus about universalism.

Take a good look at verse 36

Acts 2:36  Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ

Let's paraphrase a bit.  "Therefore let the house of Travis know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus that he is crucifying at tentmaker"


See Travis,  you are essentially crucifying Christ,  you come here and claim that we need to repent for believing in Jesus as Saviour, demonstrating that you have your own repenting to do, therefore making your own salvation under the terms of the doctrine you believe suspect.

When it comes down to it, under the terms of your own words, you're one of the damned right at this moment.

[micah7:9]

It has been on my mind to start a thread on the question Lefien asked, where in the Bible does it say what the gospel is?
Travis responded with John3:16 but, Jesus did not come preaching John 3:16, so what is the Gospel-Good News?
One thing I know is that knowing that one human brother or sister that will spend a neverending amount of time in a place that will cause that brother or sister to scream in pain from a fire that will continuously burn their bodys has no witness of GOOD NEWS.

[Paul Hazelwood]

Romans 2:4  Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
5  But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;

1 John 3:7  Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8  He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9  Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10  In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.
11  For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
12  Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.
13  Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.

Are you saying you are sinless?

[Paul Hazelwood]

John 3:16  For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17  For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18  He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
19  And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20  For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21  But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

John 3:36  He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Travis, we are believers.   

[micah7:9]

John 3:16  For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
17  For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
18  He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
19  And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
20  For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
21  But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

John 3:36  He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Travis, we are believers.

Amen

[Travis]

:cloud9: Hi Travis....long time, no read.  :winkgrin: Wondered what happened to you.  :dontknow: How've you been?

I have been well.

[Beloved Servant]

You state you're well, however, your words reveal conflict.

The only True Peace is found within Him; not without.

[Lefein]

John 3:16  For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Everyone shall believe, everyone shall confess his name, everyone shall bow, worship, reverence, adore, praise, and magnify the Lord in Spirit and in Truth.

Every tongue shall confess, every knee shall bow, every one shall say he is the Lord - this can only be done by the Spirit, and only the saved have the Spirit.

Only worship that is done in Spirit and in Truth is acceptable to the Lord.

Everyone will have the Spirit, everyone will worship in Spirit and in Truth.

Indeed God so loved the world - none will perish.

God wills for all mankind to be saved, God will have his will, God will not be thwarted, God never fails.

17  For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.

Excellent, Christ was not sent to sentence the world, but to deliver it.

18  He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

This verse is clear - sentenced already, the unsaved person is already lost, he can't become "more lost", or "eternally lost" - There is nothing that can come between God almighty, and his will, and his children who are everyone.

Those without Christ, are already sentenced, and sentence themselves under guilt, and condemnation - when we are freed to Christ, we are free from that dwelling of ours in guilt, and condemnation.

We're pulled out of the muck, and put on solid ground.

19  And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

All of us have been this once.

20  For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.

All of us continue to do this.

21  But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

Everyone shall come to the knowledge of the Truth.

John 3:36  He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

Indeed it does, providing they never believe - it never says they will never believe.  It says everyone will confess, bow, praise, and call the name of the Lord, see Revelation for the pertaining verses.

Romans 2:4  Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
5  But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;

Righteous judgement is not meaningless, vindictive, unremedial, ceaseless, abusive, godless (literaly) infliction of pain, torment, and torture, without end.

1 John 3:7  Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

Indeed.

8  He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

And he will not fail.  One of the works of the devil was separating Humankind (Adam) from God.  No one will be left behind.

9  Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Okay.

10  In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

Then perhaps we should go out and do bear good fruit instead of preaching eternal vindictive Hell which makes people turn away from Christ, because they find it ludicrous, and for good reason.

11  For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
12  Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.
13  Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.

The world however, will respond to Love and all will be made beautiful in His due time.

Matthew 13:37  He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38  The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39  The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40  As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.
41  The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42  And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43  Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

No mention is said of how long the tares shall burn.  Our God is an all consuming fire who purifies the dross, and refines.

Indeed the very word "Castise" in the verse I provided earlier speaks volumes for itself - providing that the Bible is consistent as I'm sure we both believe.

Matthew 25:41  Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Aionian fire that lasts as long as it needs to last.

John 14:6  Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

And everyone will take that way.  God is not so easily vexed, or beaten by mere physical death...we have the resurrection to prove it.

Acts 2:36  Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
37  Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
38  Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
39  For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
40  And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
41  Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls

Excellent, God is powerful, amen.

__ __ __

I have provided some verses, whether or not these are sufficient for your purposes Lefein, I cannot say. I would also recommend that every person read the scriptures for themselves. If you have more questions I may not answer to your satisfaction.

They are sufficient.  I will most likely go through the original Koine Greek on most of them.

As for questions, my questions are usually simple, if I can help it.  I'm sure you'll try to answer them to my satisfaction.

I will continue to present the Gospel of Jesus Christ at this forum so long as I can.

I am looking forward to seeing how you present Christ being the Saviour of the world like he says he is.

[jabcat]

Travis, in your answer to me you gave your opinion on what you understand to be "universalism" vs. the "true gospel".   Since you apparently believe you understand this, and have the true gospel, will you answer me this?

Are you affiliated with a denomination now, and if so, which one?  And if not, with what "group" do you align yourself, i.e., charismatic, independent baptist, etc.  (I'll answer appropriate questions you may ask of me, if that will help you answer this).

Also, you're getting some very good Biblical, Spirit-revealed responses to your assertions.  Are you listening as well, or are you just here to spam with your own level of understanding?  I.e., are you open to God showing you anything further than exactly what you've currently settled on, or set in concrete so here to convince those already believing on Jesus that they're not believers?  There are surely guests that come by, and perhaps a few members who aren't re-born believers, but mostly, you're talking to saved people when you're proselytizing the membership. 

So what's your point, because it sounds like you may be generally judging (treating) people who believe in UR as not being saved?

Thanks, James.

[willieH]

  To "present the gospel of Jesus Christ"?  Great!  The Good News is posted all over this website, and many other places.  No argument here, that Jesus the Christ is the Son of God, He died and rose again for our sins and life.  The tomb is empty, He sits at the right hand of God and receiving His own. 

Oh, I guess I misspoke,  Travis agrees with us after all, since he is going to talk about the Gospel of Jesus Christ of which is what goes on here everyday.

MY BAD.

:thumbsup: