...and if we(humanity) are all brothers and sisters then... we are all everyone's spiritual uncle(or aunt) and spiritual nephew(or niece) too!(and vice versa) :icon_jokercolor: We are brothers and sisters of everyone's parents(spiritually) which makes us their spiritual aunt or uncle(and vice versa) and if everyone is everyone else's aunt or uncle then everyone is also everyone else's nephew or niece. But there is more! If we are our parent's brother or sister then we are our own uncle(or aunt) AND our own nephew(or niece)! (Okay there are some logical flaws but it is a joke and not meant to be taken seriously lol) :icon_jokercolor: (I also made a picture to explain it in the attachment)
[attachment deleted by admin]
Quote from: DanielB on September 25, 2014, 11:30:49 PM
...and if we(humanity) are all brothers and sisters then... we are all everyone's spiritual uncle(or aunt) and spiritual nephew(or niece) too!(and vice versa) :icon_jokercolor: We are brothers and sisters of everyone's parents(spiritually) which makes us their spiritual aunt or uncle(and vice versa) and if everyone is everyone else's aunt or uncle then everyone is also everyone else's nephew or niece. But there is more! If we are our parent's brother or sister then we are our own uncle(or aunt) AND our own nephew(or niece)! (Okay there are some logical flaws but it is a joke and not meant to be taken seriously lol) :icon_jokercolor: (I also made a picture to explain it in the attachment)
But Shimeon opened his mouth and he said, "
In truth, I understand that God is no respecter of persons. :winkgrin:
That's cute! I like the picture! :smile: ..and of course, it's very true! :)
I think, in the spirit, all those distinctions fade away with us believers, and we are all one with Christ and the Father.
I was once told that no one on this earth is farther away than a 100th cousin anyway... :friendstu:
My sister's into genealogy, but I just figure we're all related if you go back far enough.
I believe that we are all God's children by Creation, but the wicked have not yet been born into the kingdom of God and are not our brothers and sisters "in Christ".
I personally think the distinction is necessary and clearly made in the scriptures.
It is only judgmental and arrogant when declared in a judgmental and arrogant spirit.
The sons of disobedience hav a different spirit reigning in them.
"You are of your father the devil."
You have Cain as your father."
"If you were children of Abraham you would not seek the death of the innocent."
"You are guilty of all the blood of the prophets from Abel to Zechariah who you killed between the porch and the altar(shedding the blood of the righteous in the temple of God).
IMO, There is a necessary warning to the wicked, and the consequences of their ignoring it is serious, in this age and in the age to come.
"I think in the spirit all those distinctions fade away, and we are all one with Christ and the Father." Yeah it has major logical flaws(being your biological parent's spiritual "sibling" probably does not mean that you are spiritually your own uncle for example) but I was joking. I thought about this on a road-trip and just thought it seemed funny even if it is not technically true it reminds me of "I'm my own grandpa" lol Also when I say we are all spiritual siblings I say that because God created all life(except his own) so in that sense all living beings are brothers and sisters(even animals if animals are truly alive rather than just having the illusion of life). I think we can also be brothers and sisters with other christians in another sense but to me God is the creator of our life even more so than our biological mother and father(our human parents can not create something out of nothing unlike God) so that is why I call him my spiritual father(and the father of all life)
"And I have given them the glory which Thou has given Me, that they may be one, according as We are One, I in them and Thou in Me, that they may be perfected in one, and that the world may know that Thou dost commission Me and dost love them according as Thou dost love Me." (John 17:22)
I think Paul walked in the spirit, and he till made those distinctions.
I agree that God is the creator of all, but only believers have the type of relationship that allows us to call him Father.
This is what I was thinking about when I said the distinctions fade away when we're in the spirit.
"For whoever are baptized into Christ, put on Christ, in Whom there is no Jew nor yet Greek, there is no slave nor yet free, there is no male and female, for you all are one in Christ Jesus." (Galatians 3:27,28)
In the flesh, of course, we still observe the distinctions.
I agree, "in Christ" there are no distinctions. :Peace2:
I think there is a distinction between the "brotherhood of man" as it might be called, and sonship with Christ unto God. When I see people hurt or starving on the news I feel a brotherhood with them simply from an empathy point of view. We've all shared suffering. But the sonship with Christ is for believers unto a special purpose in the fulfillment of God's plans.
I agree.
but don't forget the parable of the good samaritan...seems levites and such in 'special' relationship with God,fell short in loving
their neighbor as themselves. Better a neighbor that is near..then a brother that is far away..on the day of trouble.
have we not all heard of or seen on the news..in time of trouble..great acts of loving-kindness..and even some laying down
their lives for a total stranger/fellowman? Don't look down on your fellow man..God just may exalt such as those above you.
...the harlots and tax-collectors enter the kingdom before you.
I agree, Sheila. We need to be compassionate toward all our fellow human beings on the planet even non-believers. That action of love is the most powerful witness there is to the grace of God.
"...I am saying to you, Love your enemies, and pray for those who are persecuting you, so that you may become sons of your Father Who is in the heavens..."
It may be dated now yet the message is more pertinent than ever:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVsCnk1b5qc
"My dad always used to say: 'You are what you do, not what you say' "
"I challenge you, make your actions reflect your words" [Severn]
"...nor yet to be giving heed to stories and endless genealogies,—the which, bring, arguings, rather than that stewardship of God which is with faith..."
She's got a lot of wisdom for a child.
Ecclsiastes 4;13
Quote from: sheila on September 27, 2014, 07:26:36 PM
Ecclsiastes 4;13
:yes:
New International Version
Better a poor but wise youth than an old but foolish king who no longer knows how to heed a warning.
New Living Translation
It is better to be a poor but wise youth than an old and foolish king who refuses all advice.
English Standard Version
Better was a poor and wise youth than an old and foolish king who no longer knew how to take advice.
New American Standard Bible
A poor yet wise lad is better than an old and foolish king who no longer knows how to receive instruction.
King James Bible
Better is a poor and a wise child than an old and foolish king, who will no more be admonished.
Holman Christian Standard Bible
Better is a poor but wise youth than an old but foolish king who no longer pays attention to warnings.
International Standard Version
A poor but wise youth is better than an old but foolish king who will no longer accept correction.
I agree ladies.
Quote from: Seth on September 27, 2014, 04:40:16 AM
I think there is a distinction between the "brotherhood of man" as it might be called, and sonship with Christ unto God. When I see people hurt or starving on the news I feel a brotherhood with them simply from an empathy point of view. We've all shared suffering. But the sonship with Christ is for believers unto a special purpose in the fulfillment of God's plans.
Jesus felt that empathy for evry human being who ever lived. Being sons of God is not about judgment. God judges men out of their own consciences(Rom 2; heb 4)
Paul said the foundation of God is sealed with these words-"The Lord knows those who are His and let everyone who names the name of the Lord depart from iniquity".
Making a distinction is one thing, trying to apply that distinction to someone is another thing entirely- "Why go on judging before the time?"
Jesus made distinctions, (sons of the evil one, children of light)- but He loved evryone and offered hope to all- any who would bow the knee to the love of God which He embodied- and He trusted God that all would eventually come.
"If I be lifted up from the earth I will draw all men unto me."
I agree. Scripture distinguishes between believers and non-believers, but we are supposed to love all.
:thumbsup:
:HeartThrob:
I tell you this , Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you. !! :HeartThrob:
The distinction is amazing overcome evil with good ..
How to be perfect as the Father in Heaven is perfect is to learn , practice & OBEY Matt 5
beatitudes
In Christianity, the Beatitudes are the set of teachings by Jesus that begin "Blessed are...", and appear in the Gospels of Matthew and Luke. The term beatitude comes from the Latin noun beātitūdō which means "happiness".
Quote from: eaglesway on September 28, 2014, 12:06:14 AM
Quote from: Seth on September 27, 2014, 04:40:16 AM
I think there is a distinction between the "brotherhood of man" as it might be called, and sonship with Christ unto God. When I see people hurt or starving on the news I feel a brotherhood with them simply from an empathy point of view. We've all shared suffering. But the sonship with Christ is for believers unto a special purpose in the fulfillment of God's plans.
Jesus felt that empathy for evry human being who ever lived. Being sons of God is not about judgment. God judges men out of their own consciences(Rom 2; heb 4)
Paul said the foundation of God is sealed with these words-"The Lord knows those who are His and let everyone who names the name of the Lord depart from iniquity".
Making a distinction is one thing, trying to apply that distinction to someone is another thing entirely- "Why go on judging before the time?"
Jesus made distinctions, (sons of the evil one, children of light)- but He loved evryone and offered hope to all- any who would bow the knee to the love of God which He embodied- and He trusted God that all would eventually come.
"If I be lifted up from the earth I will draw all men unto me."
I don't believe judgement is a bad thing, first of all, though I think it's gotten a bad rap and misunderstanding in Christianity. But the purpose for the sons of God are clearly outlined in Romans 8 and 1 Cor 6 and Romans 2:27. Check out Psalm 149 (notice the instruments they use) and Revelation 2:26. The Bible says to rejoice for God comes to judge the earth. Nevertheless, feeling a kind of kinship with everyone is an appropriate thing in my opinion.
For the Father judges no man, but has committed all judgment unto the Son (John 5:22)
According the Greek, the word judges is a word that literally means to pick out or choose (see Strongs and J. thayer ). The word committed means to give in many different senses, including to place or to put. In a general sense, the word judgement means divine judgement or accusation and is most commonly used in the sense of a negative, condemning verdict upon sin deserving of condemnation.
The verse could equally be written:
The father picks out no man, but has put all judgement (all accusation) onto the Son.
Some versions of the bible have the verse reading to say that Jesus has been given the authority to judge. If this interpretation seems more reasonable for you - so be it. The word of God is alive and active! Cling to it if it for as long as it is yours in your heart :) For me, this verse and context is seen in the light of Calvary, where every scripture and context is ultimately enlightened, when all judgement was placed upon Christ in direct fulfillment of Isaiah's prophecy of the suffering servant (Isaiah 53: 4-12).
As for our (the saints) role in judgement of others, both now and in the future, it is the same measure of judgement...forever...For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
By what measure am I judged? By the measure of Christ upon his cross
By what measure shall I judge? By the measure of Christ upon his cross
Yes, 'the earth rejoices as God comes to judge the earth' - because it was His punishment that brought us peace...
For judgement I have come into the world
Not to give it out but to take it on himself
When we find his cross's judgement for ourselves we find his cross's judgement for others
Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
"Consequently, then, as it was through one offense for all mankind for condemnation, thus also it is through one just award for all mankind for life's justifying. For even as, through the disobedience of the one man, the many were constituted sinners, thus also, through the obedience of the One, the many shall be constituted just." (Romans 5:18,19)
Christ upon the cross means that all must be crucified to their flesh as he was. That's what believe is the judgment of the world.
"For when we are judged we are chastened of the Lord that we should not be condemned (katakrino - downjudged) with the world." (1Cor 11:32)
Quote from: Tom on September 28, 2014, 03:07:45 AM
"Consequently, then, as it was through one offense for all mankind for condemnation, thus also it is through one just award for all mankind for life's justifying. For even as, through the disobedience of the one man, the many were constituted sinners, thus also, through the obedience of the One, the many shall be constituted just." (Romans 5:18,19)
:thumbsup:
Absolutely, that will indeed happen. I believe in universal salvation.
prince world judged John 16 1"I have spoken these things with you that you would not be subverted."
2"For they shall put you out from their assemblies, and the hour will come when everyone who would kill you will think that he presents an offering to God."
3"And they shall do these things because they do not know either my Father or me."
4"I have spoken these things with you that when their time comes, you will remember them;
I did not tell you these things before, because I was with you."
5"But now I am going to join him who sent me, and no man among you asks me, 'Where are you going?'"
6"For I said these things to you and sadness has come and has filled your hearts."
7"I tell you the truth: it is beneficial for you that I go away, for if I do not go away, the Redeemer of the accursed will not come to you, but if I depart I shall send him to you." 8"And when he comes, he will correct the world concerning sin and concerning righteousness and concerning judgment;" 9"Concerning sin, because they do not trust me;" 10"Concerning righteousness, because I will go to my Father's presence and you will not see me again;" 11"Concerning judgment, because The Prince of this world is judged."
12"I have much to say to you, but you are not able to grasp it now." 13"But whenever The Spirit of The Truth comes, he will lead you into the whole truth, for he will not speak of his own will, but he shall speak whatever he shall hear and he shall reveal the future to you." 14"And he shall glorify me, because he shall take that which is mine and shall show you." 15"Everything that my Father has is mine, therefore I said to you that he shall take that which is mine and he shall show you."
16"A little while and you will not see me; again a little while and you will see me because I am going to the presence of The Father."
John 5
21"For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son also gives life to whom He wishes.
22"For not even the Father judges anyone, but He has given all judgment to the Son,
23so that all will honor the Son even as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him
39And Yeshua said, "For the judgment of this world I have come, that those who do not see may see, and that those who see may become blind."
40And those of the Pharisees who had been with him heard these things and they said to him,
"Are we also blind?"
41Yeshua said to them,
"If you were blind, you would not have sin, but now you say, 'We see.' Because of this, your sin stands."
So is it that , those that judge are being judged by the very law they speak in favor of !!! when the sin remains it is a stain or mark of division as a filthy garment or nakedness even ? :eek:
Rose, check out Isaiah 30 all the way from top to bottom especially concerning what imperfection causes the wall to come down and how God patiently waits for repentance. Its an amazing chapter. :HeartThrob:
Quote from: rosered on September 28, 2014, 04:06:11 AM
39And Yeshua said, "For the judgment of this world I have come, that those who do not see may see, and that those who see may become blind."
40And those of the Pharisees who had been with him heard these things and they said to him,
"Are we also blind?"
41Yeshua said to them,
"If you were blind, you would not have sin, but now you say, 'We see.' Because of this, your sin stands."
So is it that , those that judge are being judged by the very law they speak in favor of !!! when the sin remains it is a stain or mark of division as a filthy garment or nakedness even ? :eek:
Lots of truth in your great post of scriptures, Rose :)
As for the pharisees, even they find mercy..
For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.Still, yes, that law which they served under (in bondage) was also that which judged them.
We also can fall into this well-stocked pit. For if we upgrade (or, more rightly, downgrade) the writings from Mathew to Revelation into laws to which we are subject, we place ourselves back under the same bondage of the Pharisees. For by the same principle, whereby James said that "whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble at one point, is guilty of all" we become obliged to all the instructions, precepts and commands of these books. (James 2:10). Guilty of one, guilty of all..
Praise God for the cross (the actual New Testament - Luke 22:20). It's the place to be! Especially for those who have found themselves unable to keep laws - whatever sort and however few or many they may be :).
This is why Paul said the New Covenant is not written (2 Corinthians 3:6) - for when we attempt to reduce, define and limit the New Covenant with written words they soon become mere laws, and we rebuild that system of law, sin and death which - for our freedom - Christ came to destroy.
It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery. (NIV)
So Christ has truly set us free. Now make sure that you stay free, and don't get tied up again in slavery to the law. (NLV)
If we are not under law who can judge us?
He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him over for us all, how will He not also with Him freely give us all things? Who will bring a charge against God's elect? God is the one who justifies; who is the one who condemns? Christ Jesus is He who died, yes, rather who was raised, who is at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us. (Romans 8: 32-34)
Thanks Seth and Simon ,I appreciate you both answering in different ways .
I am going to make this one post for both ,
I did read Isaiah 30 all of it and do see this as prophecy to be fulfilled in Christ as Jesus Witness " He would do this very thing " .
a deadly wound is healed in Judah .. for me those young lions of Ezekiel 19 of failure , I see the beast natures of them as Lions devouring one another .
We know Jesus is of the Lion tribe of Judah Rev 5 ;5 Then one of the elders said to me,
"Do not weep! See, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has triumphed.
He is able to open the scroll and its seven seals."
I do believe beyond a shadow of a doubt , when Jesus come as a babe , lamb in the fullness of time and grew strong in Spirit Luke 1 :80 And the child grew and became strong in spirit; and he lived in the wilderness until he appeared publicly to Israel.
and as He ministered HE DID JUDGE what was right in the sight of God , healing the broken and the poor and prisoners bound by sin and ignorance a darkness of the Knowledge of God , He also judged the scribes , ones who had the word of God and lawyers who knew the Law of Moses and showed NO MERCY with 2 or 3 false witnesses and also judged the self righteous Pharisees those in power to make a difference and only abused this power to lord and master over the weak and pitiful , while they become more fat and wicked with every turn , to become prey themselves in the end to Gods wrath against them
they put Jesus to death , they did not desire this King over them , they wanted to reign as kings themselves for a time and everyone was at their mercy and used the Law of Moses to destroy others
just as we see it being fulfilled in the east countries even now !! they say they SEE , because they know the Law and still reject Jesus Christ to this very day
so the same sin /error remains , they have stumbled over the stumbling STONE and rock of offense
We also can be as they are and not even realize it , we want Law and justice and hate sin and yet allow our own sins and the ones we love and support as forgiven and ignored , But still wont forgive them ???
I agree with you Simon , you have made a very good case , If we accept the Cross of Jesus Christ as the place to lay down sin in our own lives and the judgment of sin as Christ being the Just Judge so being the Lord of the dead and living
and allow Him to fulfill all things by faith trusting His judgement as righteous there would be no need to judge anything before its time , because the TIME would be when the LORD COMES
and our witness would be to declare His righteousness in the earth and help those whom are broken and bound and are still under guilt because of sin
How can they be set free unless the LORD COMES ? and How does He come ?
the Brightness of His coming in the SAME SPIRIT OF HOLINESS AND TRUTH to them as was also given to us
to put that old man of sin to death and make the new man in Christ ALIVE to God for Gods own purpose .
For me the spirit of slumber is very much upon the churches today fulfilling the 10 virgins parable even today !! the wise and foolish ones still exist
Romans 11 7 What then? What Israel is seeking, it has not obtained, but those who were chosen obtained it, and the rest were hardened; 8just as it is written, "GOD GAVE THEM A SPIRIT OF STUPOR, EYES TO SEE NOT AND EARS TO HEAR NOT, DOWN TO THIS VERY DAY." 9And David says, "LET THEIR TABLE BECOME A SNARE AND A TRAP, AND A STUMBLING BLOCK AND A RETRIBUTION TO THEM.
For one thing who is Israel but Gods first born ? but is Gods chosen and who is Christ Jesus but HIS OWN SON
Being under the Law of Moses the curse was to kill the first born son , that is the same spirit of slumber /stupor
being under is bondage and overcoming is on top of that very Law of the knowledge of good and evil
Jesus is the Tree of Life and we all must overcome the knowledge of good and evil in order to EAT of the tree of life
Jesus said make the tree good and its fruits good or make it corrupt and also its fruit a tree is KNOWN by its fruits
How are we to be KNOWN ? To be Like Jesus , a tree of life ? , or the corrupt tree still under the same sin and corruption that has always been in Gods garden
Jesus hung on the tree of knowledge of good and evil , that was HIS CROSS TO BEAR !! same cross we have to follow Him into that baptism of death
in order for the sin to end , that Satan or no man can condemn accuse nor judge for the TREE OF LIFE to come
If sinless perfection is to be the new creatures in Christ WE have to OBEY HIS WORDS BY HIS SPIRIT , THIS RESURRECTION and Life
HOW ?? for one Jesus tells us exactly how to overcome the world and its sinful sway
We have to fight against a carnal nature that wants to rule and reign and have dominance and power over everything that crosses our path
and cannot ever justify it with scriptures and a spirit in a man , these will not do ever !! :sigh:
When you let Christ reign your heart , you will rest in hope, a true hope and not become weary
I was looking at the evil one yesterday , that one we must overcome every last one of us , God is fair , it can only be though Christ power and blood and not of ourselves
the evil one or just evil is full of toils and hardships and sickness and troubles , just as we see in the world , this WITNESS against Christ
and you know what ? it goes all the way back to cain , YES CAIN !! the same curse God places on him , being a man and his brothers blood he spilled on the ground by anger and jealousy
Cain has a mark on him that any man kill him , he was under the 7 fold curse , but cain was banished from Gods presence and set out to wander and would produce nothing but labors and toils and troubles and everything he put his hand to turned to nothing good !!
I believe this is the wrath of God abiding on the children of disobedience ,
TWO marks/As signs As any man who wanted to kill him was also given this curse as a mark of the beast , cannot buy trade or sell their own souls /lives for the the truth nor eat of the fruits of the Spirit and life , tree of Life
as the wrath of God is upon him
and those with the mark of Christ are sealed till the day of redemption and the wrath of God does not abide or dwell on or in them , but the wrath of man does
Allegory , in Galatians 4
You Are Children of the Promise
21 Those who want to be controlled by Moses' laws should tell me something. Are you really listening to what Moses' Teachings say? 22 Scripture says that Abraham had two sons, one by a woman who was a slave and the other by a free woman. 23 Now, the son of the slave woman was conceived in a natural way, but the son of the free woman was conceived through a promise made to Abraham.
24 I'm going to use these historical events as an illustration. The women illustrate two arrangements.[c] The one woman, Hagar, is the arrangement made on Mount Sinai. Her children are born into slavery. 25 Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia. She is like Jerusalem today because she and her children are slaves. 26 But the Jerusalem that is above is free, and she is our mother. 27 Scripture says:
"Rejoice, women who cannot get pregnant,
who cannot give birth to any children!
Break into shouting, those who feel no pains of childbirth!
Because the deserted woman will have more children
than the woman who has a husband."
28 Now you, brothers and sisters, are children of the promise like Isaac.
29 Furthermore, at that time the son who was conceived in a natural way persecuted the son conceived in a spiritual way. That's exactly what's happening now. 30 But what does Scripture say? "Get rid of the slave woman and her son, because the son of the slave woman must never share the inheritance with the son of the free woman." 31 Brothers and sisters, we are not children of a slave woman but of the free woman.
the seeds of the two that come from the tree of knowledge of good and evil [of Adam & Eve eating of the forbidden tree produced death & life ] are enmities of the head and the heel bruising /wounds of striking each other as blows
But Jesus Christ come to fulfill all the law , of both trees , the knowledge of Good and evil and the tree of Life
He come to open the seals of the Book . law of Moses and make known by the knowledge of God , so BOTH SONGS are Sung in the heavens , song of Moses and the song of the Lamb Deut 32 Exodus 15
under the 2 or 3 witnesses AS MERCY !, Both the old and new testaments and by His own Spirit of Truth & the Word of God
This is soooo long , sorry if it does not hold interest in some , The thing is there is a lot more
:HeartThrob:
Quote from: roseredCain has a mark on him that any man kill him , he was under the 7 fold curse , but cain was banished from Gods presence and set out to wander and would produce nothing but labors and toils and troubles and everything he put his hand to turned to nothing good !!
This is the wrath of God abiding on the children of disobedience
:iagree:
And this is the breach in their wall that bulges until the wall comes crashing down. It's an effective way to bring about repentance.