Eternal life

[thetruthprospector]

I have been going through a lot of upheaval with all the Bible I know. I don't want to brag but i have read the KJV about 4 or 5 times and at 61 I feel I know more than most church goers and pastors I meet. BUT BUT BUT am I living it? No. not to my satisfaction. I am coming out of a lot of man's doctrines in the last ten years.
I used to beleive in dispensationalism, the rapture or "the gathering together", or Jesus returning two times(?), I beleived that there was going to be a literal anti CHrist (I am not sure if that is a person or a religious system), I used to believe we where the Body as the "church" and Israel is the "bride, ( now I beleive we are all in the same assembly but that the Zionists are Anti christ) Going through lots of changes. I have always believed that Romans 10:9, 10 was my gaurantee to ETERNAL LIFE. then I started to realized I may be saved by the holy spirit that dwells in me. And since I have been speaking in tongues, I always felt that was a comfort that GOd was with me and that i had "eternal life". Then I started realizing that "Christ must be formed in me", I must work out my salvation, and that we are being preserved or saved in our body and soul. So salvation is a constant process. Now I ask how could I know so much and not know a thing all these years?
Why even bother preaching Jesus is I am not sure I am saved. I feel like the more we know the more is required. Sometimes I wish I never searched so much.  I don't want to be responsible.  Only a year ago I realized all "churches" are man made spin offs from Rome. and I was on a mission to show my old religious associations what I learned. I started a blog. I gave it up.

I was praying and I was inspired to use face book to look up as many of my friend through out my whole life through face book and I did. I began a Christian facebook group and tried to get all the people I touched in my past in to it to discuss new ideas and set them free from RELIGION.

But I am now so confused as to what I believe. I am having a real hard time moving forward... I am such a weak beleiver.

I started to put credence in this web site when I realized what the words Aionios and Aidios mean.

So I used to believe we are saved by grace. ONCE SAVE ALWAYS SAVED> by the faith of Jesus Christ. THAT is was ALL ABOUT HIM not my faith, but HIS PERFECT FAITH that saved a wretch like me.

I used to think that I need to reach out to those around me to save them from the fire. But  now I may be in it with them!  :eek:
So what does Eternal life mean. Please tell me. I need some kind of comfort. DOes it just mean Age long life,, so that is temporary? and the same as the LOF being age long.  That is hard for me to swallow. I beleive in all the sin I allowed in my flesh and body that I have had ETERNAL LIFE.  I believed that Because I could pray in the spirit (speak in tongues) it was  a witness to me that I was a child of God and I was saved in my inner man.  But what is your take on Eternal life, why is it written then Aionios Life?

[josh]

the word in greek that always means eternal
is only used twice in the new testament
what is often translated as eternal
has more the sense of age or ages
and a proper study of this concern
might be to study the different kind of ages the bible speaks of

e-sword.net  has a lot of bible study tools one can download for free
this might be helpful when you are trying to understand the bible...

also a search engine like google might find material that helps one to better understand
particular concerns..

one site that has a lot of studies on the words for eternal and ages is
tentmaker.org...
it makes the case for all humans souls will some way be redeemed
but the  powers that be there
i think fail to see how reincarnation is part of biblical salvation
thus there case for universal salvation is weakened some i think

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: @ thetruthprospecter....may I suggest that God put it in you to search out these things, and then God also opened your eyes to see the truth, FOR A REASON? He's doing a quick work in you, peace be still, just praise Him for it. My  :2c: Blessings...

[ed]

So what does Eternal life mean. Please tell me. I need some kind of comfort. DOes it just mean Age long life,, so that is temporary? and the same as the LOF being age long.  That is hard for me to swallow. I beleive in all the sin I allowed in my flesh and body that I have had ETERNAL LIFE.  I believed that Because I could pray in the spirit (speak in tongues) it was  a witness to me that I was a child of God and I was saved in my inner man.  But what is your take on Eternal life, why is it written then Aionios Life?

I took the same class you did that taught that you knew the proof of salvation through the outward manifestation of SIT.  I already knew that I had the life, long before that class.  The life is in the relationship to the one who loves us.  In the relationship we know the life.  Outside of the relationship we struggle.

Romans 8:6 is a simple verse with a test for our spiritual path.
Romans 8
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

We can know the life and peace of God if we are spiritually minded.  It is still the renewed mind that brings us to the place of knowing.  Knowing is deeper then the mind.

One time when I was in a great struggle of complex issues, a simple word came to me to get back to the basics.  What are the basics?  Faith, hope, and love.............the greatest of these is love.

We are loved, and we get to practice love.  That is where the simplicity of faith usually takes me. 

.

[Molly]

I feel compelled to respond to this because you sound worried and, maybe, somewhat shaken in your faith.

Don't be worried.

7"Blessed is the man who trusts in the LORD And whose trust is the LORD. 8"For he will be like a tree planted by the water, That extends its roots by a stream And will not fear when the heat comes; But its leaves will be green, And it will not be anxious in a year of drought Nor cease to yield fruit.

--Jer 17


My take on the aionios life Jesus talks about is that it is life for this Age.  We will not die, just change form.  He has a house built for us in heaven.  Just like the Christian church teaches.  Then, after that, we will receive our glorified body for the next Age.  He is the King of Ages and he loves us!  He will not let one of his sheep be taken out of his hand.


38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,  39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

--Romans 8


Do not let your heart be troubled.  Rest in Jesus.  He is the Lord of the Sabbath and every day in him is his Sabbath rest.

[Seth]

So what does Eternal life mean. Please tell me. I need some kind of comfort. DOes it just mean Age long life,, so that is temporary? and the same as the LOF being age long.  That is hard for me to swallow. I beleive in all the sin I allowed in my flesh and body that I have had ETERNAL LIFE.  I believed that Because I could pray in the spirit (speak in tongues) it was  a witness to me that I was a child of God and I was saved in my inner man.  But what is your take on Eternal life, why is it written then Aionios Life?

Hi Truth Prospector, here is my take.

Aionios Zoe is "the life of the age." Not to be confused with immortality, which I believe the church at large does.

Romans 2
6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds: 7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality: the life of the age (aionios zoe). 8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness: indignation and wrath

So them who seek for immortality, he will give the life of the age. What is that life? Why, Jesus Christ of course. He said "I am the way, the truth, and the LIFE." This is an indwelling life that saves us from the carnal mind (which is death). So, spiritual life is saving us from spiritual death today, in anticipation of immortality to come.

2 Tim 1:10
but it has now been revealed through the appearing of our Savior, Christ Jesus, who has destroyed death and has brought life AND immortality to light through the gospel.

Watch how John speaks about it:

1 John 3
14We know that we HAVE passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death. 15Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath the life of the age abiding in him.

The life of the age is to be "abiding in" us.

John 17
3And this is the life of the age: that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

So the life of the age is to know God and Jesus, is abiding in us now, and is given to them who hope for immortality.

[marie glen]

:cloud9: @ thetruthprospecter....may I suggest that God put it in you to search out these things, and then God also opened your eyes to see the truth, FOR A REASON? He's doing a quick work in you, peace be still, just praise Him for it. My  :2c: Blessings...

I agree with this, post of Cardinals.. There are so many contortions upon the truth! I've thought of it like the planet having an atmosphere like a heavy, wet quilt hanging low in the air ..we can hardly breathe!

And I think the only remedy is a Quiet spirit at rest daily.. not only our daily bread(the Word) but also our daily communion with the Holy Ghost/God's Presence..

I really think those two - Jesus' on the Eve of His crucifixion instructions, which will cause us to "abide in Him" - are the remedy, or we will be tossed about with every wind of doctrine.

I also believe very much in the verse "believe no bad report" (paraphrased)

[marie glen]

I think God Himself is Life.. and also Perfection, Perfect loses nothing. Ever. Makes no mistakes.

This whole thing, life as we presently know it, all came about because God chose to create rational creatures.

Why? you say.. because with thinking ability, sooner or later, comes the ability to choose and make choices.

But what was God our Father's other option? No rational creatures? ...ever?

So, if God is Life.. and Perfection, well, perhaps we can see the dilemma.. to choose any teeny, tiny thing other than He chooses, in thought, word or deed, is to become imperfect! the opposite of life!

So, He created the rescue "from the beginning/foundation" and built it right into all of creation, in that Jesus, is the "firstborn of all creation" and "In Him is being gathered all things in heaven and earth"

I do not believe any creature will have eternal life inherent within them.. but we will "put on immortality".. This life, of His letting man's will seem to run things, is teaching us all (engraving upon every heart, mind and psyche) the utter truth that one cannot, simply cannot wander from God. For God iS life.

I think the idea of "perishing" is very real. Could someone be so hard of a hold out against God that they could perish? I think it is being presented to us as a possibility - to wander from God/Life is to well, wander from life.. BuT! It won't happen.. because God Most High and Almighty is Perfect.

But! what this life is, is the lesson of good from evil, which is (surely?) life from nonlife. This is the world of all things done wrong! And the consummation of man's will and all things done wrong, and to wander away from God, is to crash (perish) in a puff of self destructive smoke. (Apocalypse, the total unveiling of true from false / life from nonlife/death. Unveiling in that untruth can only collapse, crash, fall. End of lesson. A most important part of God's drama from Adam and Eve, Cain and Abel, and from Babel Tower to Babble On and On going global..

..that's it from the peanut gallery! :laughing7: God bless!

[marie glen]

Oops! I forgot.. I believe verses which point to what is referred to as 'the antiChrist' is Rev 13:13, which rather than pointing to a specific person, I believe points to an office.

However... one cannot see that unless they can perceive the (first) lock on the Book of Revelation prophecy (drama)..

It's the seals.. no one understands me when I talk about it, but what the hey, why quit now? Indeed, I doubt the Spirit would let me..

The Seals of God in chapter six are explained as a blend of two things - what they are when they beGin, and what they are at the 'eNd'... in this way things which occur veRy late on the planet, are told here so veRy early in the narrative :)

So the whole vision is skewed! The rider on the "white horse" going out conquering and to conquer openlyu victorious over 'the gods' and paganism, victory symbolized by the wreath of victory.. covered the pagan (stolen) holi-days.. that makes the seals to be the prime elements of the latter age, the age of our Lord, A.D. - imo.

Span ahead to the fire let loose by the (ending up to be the) anti-Christ office, in Revelation 13:13, and this event all of a sudden is no longer some far off future event, but perhaps has already happened..

After all, wasn't Seal Two the Second Horseman of the Apocalypse (war) given a "long" and/or "great" sword...?

Rev 13:13 - he brings (brought, a new) fire to earth in the sight of men.. a great new fire which changed the very fabric of life (big clue, think 1945).. (rev 6:12!! and don't forget the key to that lock concerning the seals of rev 6)

..this releasing of a new fire in the sight of mankind, btw, just happened to tell mankind to rebuild the first beast of rev 13, the big beast or world beast/body.. which had expired because its head had not signed on after all.. (and of course we're talking end of the ages, not yesteryear here.. in that prophecy is a repeating pattern!)

Here's one last piece to the PUZZLE - after this new fire (windy fire) was released, it was paused for a time. Revelation chapter 7, verse 1.

We are in that pause. When that pause of the use of this new fire of war is no longer paused (albeit limited at that time) it will be the opening of the 7th seal, the lining up of the 7 angels with trumpets to be sounded.. an escalation in events..

The pieces to the ANTI-CHRIST - puZZLe - {1} rev 13:13 the fire/long,great sword - {2} Rev 6:12-17 told as a blend of its beginning and its full blown maturity at the 'end' - {3} 6:4 - war, red horse and rider (was) given a long sword/weapon - {4} the new fire/great weapon is paused in its use for war -Rev 7:1 -- imo, we are in that pause.

:Peace2: :hiya:

[thetruthprospector]

Wow,

thanks a lot every one.  I have a lot to chew on!!  The idea of immortality that make sense. Death = carnal mind. Yes.
the interpretation of Revelations Marie Glen. hmmm. I have heard a lot of different ways to interpret it and now it is on hold in my mind. I am looking at Revelations in light of what I understand of my life here today and getting my own self a revelation. But yes I have though of it a book not so much about future events regarding israel, etc. but more symbolic and not so literal like the Evangelist types think. Interesting. but I do believe their has been a movement of the enemy in action since the begining and Paul said "the mystery of iniquity doth already work" even in his time. So what is this mystery if not the secret societies created by the Kabbalists? I don't know and I am probably just taking my concentration of my own wlk with the Lord by looking for outside events.. I am starting to think watching how the enemy moves is a waste of time if I can't get my own flesh in under me.  God please have mercy on me.

But thanks everyone great and help ful answers !!

[Seth]

Truth Prospector, I have an article that expands more on what I was saying, if interested in some earth to mine for nuggets: http://mercifultruth.com/eternity.html

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Thanks everyone for pitching in to lift up the brethren!  :thumbsup:

[marie glen]

Wow,

thanks a lot every one.  I have a lot to chew on!!  The idea of immortality that make sense. Death = carnal mind. Yes.
the interpretation of Revelations Marie Glen. hmmm. I have heard a lot of different ways to interpret it and now it is on hold in my mind. I am looking at Revelations in light of what I understand of my life here today and getting my own self a revelation. But yes I have though of it a book not so much about future events regarding israel, etc. but more symbolic and not so literal like the Evangelist types think. Interesting. but I do believe their has been a movement of the enemy in action since the begining and Paul said "the mystery of iniquity doth already work" even in his time. So what is this mystery if not the secret societies created by the Kabbalists? I don't know and I am probably just taking my concentration of my own wlk with the Lord by looking for outside events.. I am starting to think watching how the enemy moves is a waste of time if I can't get my own flesh in under me.  God please have mercy on me.

But thanks everyone great and help ful answers !!

..I think what happens to us, also happens to the world.. we crash and burn.. all history and every life.. all the same story! which is, of course, the utter failure of "life" without God (who, irony of ironies, is life! :laughing7: ) take care.. and God bless!  2¢ :))