What did the Pharasees Hate?

[Paul Hazelwood]

As I have encountered Christians on other boards seems all one has to do is quote the word of God where in any translation or language it makes the universalist declaration to get resistance.

"Who wills all mankind be saved and come to the knowledge of truth"

Immediatly there is resistance to the very fact of scripure from believers that think there is everlasting punishment.   Of all the churches I have been a member of over the years there was one primary underlying factor in all of them.   This existed whether they blatently declared it or whether it came as a more subtle thought.

This was the fact that they felt set apart and special that they chose to believe in Christ and work for his kingdom. 

Now, I am thinking back to the day where Jesus was speaking in the language of the day.  The pharasees may have not understood the parables as scripture talks about, but they did speak the language of the scriptures inherantly and did not have to translate through language barriers, culture and context as we must today.

I wonder if the pharasees did not hate the understanding that the rituals and law that the pharasees learned and slaved for didn't make them any better than the blind leper that was a piece of garbage in their eyes.

I see this same effect today with religious people who think their life has set them apart from those who they think are less pleasing to God than they are.

I personally have not encountered any atheists who object to the universalist declaration of scripture.  I do see atheists resist the universalist concept when universalists take the position that they need to convince an atheist of something.

But as far as a statement that this is what God will do for everyone in due time it seems only religious people who believe that God allows for everlasting punishment is bothered by this.   

It appears in scripture that these were the only ones who may have out right hated Jesus Christ. 

[WhiteWings]

Hi Paul,

If you see the pricetag of whatever expensive (eternal life) and its pricetag is very low you don't trust the advertising.
I think that's part of the UR-ET argument.

It's just like the verses about the day-workers that all got payed the same amount at the end of the day.
Some worked 10 hours and some 1 hour for that money.

[Paul Hazelwood]

I can understand what your saying White Wings, but mainly I am drawing the analysis between scripture and my own observations.

Did the pharasees really not trust the message, or did Christs message threaten to expose theirs as false and that false message was what made them special and higher than others.   

I see a trend in christianity that they believe their choice has set them apart as special and anyone at the time who hasn't chosen and worked in Gods kingdom is not as special as themselves.   Seems a message that threatens to expose that thinking to show the truth that God thinks and works in everyones life on an emotionally equal level is hated.


For example, it is typical that a christian thinks that if they read the bible everyday that it pleases God and that is a part of being set apart from someone who doesn't read the bible everyday.

It is not to say that it doesn't matter if we read the bible or not, what the universalist message exposes, to me anyway, is that the Christian who reads the bible everyday has not actually moved God to love them and think more highly of them than someone who has not read it at all. 

[Paul Hazelwood]

Maybe another way to put it is this.

Anyone giving the  "turn or burn" message, whether it is fire and brimstone, whether it is watered down to the point that not turning will be a deep sorrow is met with the same resistance by people who do not believe in a God or Jesus.

This resistance is claimed to be a spiritual conviction of the person who is rejecting the message.   They will say these people are rejecting christ and not the person giving the message.


But the message of Christ given in the context that, you may not believe now, but God draws all men and eventually you will believe willingly because that is the power God has is not met with such resistance by unbelievers.

I am turning the tables a bit and thinking that the pharasees. then or now were religious people who are the ones convicted and are seeing their false message exposed for the evil it is.

[WhiteWings]

I can understand what your saying White Wings, but mainly I am drawing the analysis between scripture and my own observations.

Others would see that a hint to shut up. But I've never been good at taking hints so why start now?  :laughing7:

For example, it is typical that a christian thinks that if they read the bible everyday that it pleases God and that is a part of being set apart from someone who doesn't read the bible everyday.

Isn't that what I wrote in different words.
"They" worked (=Bible study) longer to satify their feeling the price tag (=eternal life) must be very high.

It is not to say that it doesn't matter if we read the bible or not, what the universalist message exposes, to me anyway, is that the Christian who reads the bible everyday has not actually moved God to love them and think more highly of them than someone who has not read it at all. 

I think it's not just this or that but a combination of several things.
The Bible states a Christian is not someone who knows the word but a Christian is who acts on the word.
Purely my own speculation but I think God would choose a world of 6 billion atheists that show love and compassion to eachother over the world as it is right now; with about 1 billion, far from perfect, "Christians"