Hell after a tragic life

[GodIsLove]

One of the saddest things to me is when a Christian truly believes that a non-believer (or someone who wasn't "Christian enough" or "truly saved" or part of the correct denomination etc) is in hell after that person had a tragic life or suffered here on earth, only to then suffer for all eternity at the hands of God.

My friend is of the belief that very few will be in heaven and her mother in law just committed suicide after a life of hardship and some poor choices that resulted in more hardship. After she died my friend said "and she wasn't saved" and I told her that I have faith that God will make it all work out. I had previously shared my belief in UR with this friend but she just thinks I'm misled/wrong so I stopped sharing with her.

There are certainly other examples of people with even more tragic lives who then are believed to be in hell by some Christians. For example many who died in the holocaust weren't Christian (though some were), people who are/were born into poverty, slavery, abusive homes, and so many other examples. A friend's sister in law was born to a mom who was a prostitute and drug addict and she was abandoned by this mother, then she grew up and made the same choices, became a prostitute and heroin addict, had a child and died of an overdose a year later.

I am happy that from this point on, these people are in God's hands and, however it works for them individually, they will finally receive peace and love through Jesus reconciling them to God.

[Cristina100]

what I don't understand is why does god have to punish all of humanity just because one man and one woman decide to eat a fruit from a tree?
I mean did any of us choose to eat from the fruit from the tree.Imagine that one of your ancestors committed genocide.Does executing you bring justice to the people your ancestors murdered.Traditional Christianity in my opinion is full of complete and utter retards.

[eaglesway]

IMO, at some point or another we all eat of the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil, but even so, the idea that God created the world in order to populate it with people He knew would suffer eternal torment is a demonic doctrine for sure. However, people have been deceived in many ways, and we are to love them and pray for them, that they can escape the snare of the devil in which they have been taken captive.

I love these verses in Romans 8

For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it, in hope 21 that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. 22 For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now. 23 And not only this, but also we ourselves, having the first fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting eagerly for our adoption as sons, the redemption of our body. 24 For in hope we have been saved, but hope that is seen is not hope; for who hopes for what he already sees? 25 But if we hope for what we do not see, with perseverance we wait eagerly for it.

and Romans 11

For God has shut up all in disobedience so that He may show mercy to all.

33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways! 34 For who has known the mind of the Lord, or who became His counselor?
35 Or who has first given to Him that it might be paid back to him again?
36 For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things. To Him be the glory forever. Amen.

And Eph 1

In all wisdom and insight 9 He made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His kind intention which He purposed in Him 10 with a view to an administration suitable to the fullness of the times, that is, the summing up of all things in Christ, things in the heavens and things on the earth. In Him 11 also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will, 12 to the end that we who were the first to hope in Christ would be to the praise of His glory.

From these verses I know that all things are in His control, and that He instituted futility as a way to teach us who He is and how to be as He is, and that eventually every one will see Him as He is, and rejoice :o)

[Patinak]

One of the saddest things to me is when a Christian truly believes that a non-believer (or someone who wasn't "Christian enough" or "truly saved" or part of the correct denomination etc) is in hell after that person had a tragic life or suffered here on earth, only to then suffer for all eternity at the hands of God.

My friend is of the belief that very few will be in heaven and her mother in law just committed suicide after a life of hardship and some poor choices that resulted in more hardship. After she died my friend said "and she wasn't saved" and I told her that I have faith that God will make it all work out. I had previously shared my belief in UR with this friend but she just thinks I'm misled/wrong so I stopped sharing with her.

There are certainly other examples of people with even more tragic lives who then are believed to be in hell by some Christians. For example many who died in the holocaust weren't Christian (though some were), people who are/were born into poverty, slavery, abusive homes, and so many other examples. A friend's sister in law was born to a mom who was a prostitute and drug addict and she was abandoned by this mother, then she grew up and made the same choices, became a prostitute and heroin addict, had a child and died of an overdose a year later.

I am happy that from this point on, these people are in God's hands and, however it works for them individually, they will finally receive peace and love through Jesus reconciling them to God.

35 By this shall all [men] know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another. [Jhn 13:35 KJV]
        GodIsLove
           - a true disciple!

[eaglesway]

 :iagree:

[sheila]

James 2;12...so speak ye and so do, AS THEY THAT SHALL BE JUDGED BY THE LAW OF LIBERTY...for he shall have judgement without mercy..who has shown no mercy........


   AND MERCY REJOICETH AGAINST JUDGEMENT

   Luke 4;18   The spirit of the Lord is upon me for He has anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor;He hath sent me to heal the broken hearted;to preach deliverance

   to the captives..and recovery of sight to the blind....TO SET AT LIBERTY THOSE THAT ARE BRUISED.  To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.


    the law of LIBERTY=freedom/healing/deliverance/recovery................of those bound/captive/poor in spirit/blind/condemned to death[bruised] through sins law in the flesh.

      sins law/sold...liberty's Law..redeemed.            :2c:

[bushy]

One of the saddest things to me is when a Christian truly believes that a non-believer (or someone who wasn't "Christian enough" or "truly saved" or part of the correct denomination etc) is in hell after that person had a tragic life or suffered here on earth, only to then suffer for all eternity at the hands of God.

My friend is of the belief that very few will be in heaven and her mother in law just committed suicide after a life of hardship and some poor choices that resulted in more hardship. After she died my friend said "and she wasn't saved" and I told her that I have faith that God will make it all work out. I had previously shared my belief in UR with this friend but she just thinks I'm misled/wrong so I stopped sharing with her.

There are certainly other examples of people with even more tragic lives who then are believed to be in hell by some Christians. For example many who died in the holocaust weren't Christian (though some were), people who are/were born into poverty, slavery, abusive homes, and so many other examples. A friend's sister in law was born to a mom who was a prostitute and drug addict and she was abandoned by this mother, then she grew up and made the same choices, became a prostitute and heroin addict, had a child and died of an overdose a year later.

I am happy that from this point on, these people are in God's hands and, however it works for them individually, they will finally receive peace and love through Jesus reconciling them to God.

This reminds me of one of the examples in the gobbledygook gospel by Charles Slagle.

"People who commit suicide go to hell because they die before they have a "chance" to repent of their sin before their spirit leaves their body. So are you despairing to the point of wanting to take your own life? Don't risk it, buddy! (or sis!) If you commit suicide YOUR LOVING HEAVENLY FATHER WILL TEACH YOU WHAT *REAL* DESPAIR IS FOR ALL ETERNITY.
(But of course, He will always love you. :-))"

[Patinak]

James 2;12...so speak ye and so do, AS THEY THAT SHALL BE JUDGED BY THE LAW OF LIBERTY...for he shall have judgement without mercy..who has shown no mercy........


   AND MERCY REJOICETH AGAINST JUDGEMENT

   Luke 4;18   The spirit of the Lord is upon me for He has anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor;He hath sent me to heal the broken hearted;to preach deliverance

   to the captives..and recovery of sight to the blind....TO SET AT LIBERTY THOSE THAT ARE BRUISED.  To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.


    the law of LIBERTY=freedom/healing/deliverance/recovery................of those bound/captive/poor in spirit/blind/condemned to death[bruised] through sins law in the flesh.

      sins law/sold...liberty's Law..redeemed.            :2c:

Thanks for the reminder... thanks for the  :goodpost:

[Seth]

I honestly think it's the rudest and most callous thing for Christians to bring up the salvation status of people  who have passed, especially to a loved one. How do they think they are helping anyone by doing that. It's like the old saying goes, never miss a good opportunity to zip your lip.

[sheila]

 :thumbsup:

[Dandelion]

what I don't understand is why does god have to punish all of humanity just because one man and one woman decide to eat a fruit from a tree?
I mean did any of us choose to eat from the fruit from the tree.Imagine that one of your ancestors committed genocide.Does executing you bring justice to the people your ancestors murdered.Traditional Christianity in my opinion is full of complete and utter retards.

I believe, as EW said, we all would have sinned, sooner or later, in our lifetime. Most likely sooner. It is the nature of man to choose what he/she wants, over what God wants for us, at least some of the time. We are allowed to make choices....we are not perfect....we are subject to making errors. If we could not choose, we would be slaves or robots, but not God's children. But, that is the beautiful story of our Salvation. We fall short, Jesus lives and dies for us.....we are made pure by his blood.... as we journey through our existence, having different experiences, God's grace and love transform us. We learn and grow.....we see, over time, how God's way is best.....we surrender our lives to Him and He makes us worthy to be called His children.  God could have made the process different, but, He does it in a way so that we learn what love truly is. And, we discover God, when we discover Love, because He is Love. The journey back to Him, is the journey we need to take, so we are ready for Heaven....for our eternity with Him, and to spend an eternity in Heaven, Heaven needs to be in each of us.

D.

[darryl]

what I don't understand is why does god have to punish all of humanity just because one man and one woman decide to eat a fruit from a tree?
I mean did any of us choose to eat from the fruit from the tree.Imagine that one of your ancestors committed genocide.Does executing you bring justice to the people your ancestors murdered.Traditional Christianity in my opinion is full of complete and utter retards.

I prefer to think this is all planned by God, all part of His plan...the Fall, everything....in order to teach humans important lessons and experience things that will be invaluable in eternity.

[GodIsLove]

what I don't understand is why does god have to punish all of humanity just because one man and one woman decide to eat a fruit from a tree?
I mean did any of us choose to eat from the fruit from the tree.Imagine that one of your ancestors committed genocide.Does executing you bring justice to the people your ancestors murdered.Traditional Christianity in my opinion is full of complete and utter retards.

I believe, as EW said, we all would have sinned, sooner or later, in our lifetime. Most likely sooner. It is the nature of man to choose what he/she wants, over what God wants for us, at least some of the time. We are allowed to make choices....we are not perfect....we are subject to making errors. If we could not choose, we would be slaves or robots, but not God's children. But, that is the beautiful story of our Salvation. We fall short, Jesus lives and dies for us.....we are made pure by his blood.... as we journey through our existence, having different experiences, God's grace and love transform us. We learn and grow.....we see, over time, how God's way is best.....we surrender our lives to Him and He makes us worthy to be called His children.  God could have made the process different, but, He does it in a way so that we learn what love truly is. And, we discover God, when we discover Love, because He is Love. The journey back to Him, is the journey we need to take, so we are ready for Heaven....for our eternity with Him, and to spend an eternity in Heaven, Heaven needs to be in each of us.

D.

Such a beautiful post Dandelion. It brought tears to my eyes this morning.

[CHB]

what I don't understand is why does god have to punish all of humanity just because one man and one woman decide to eat a fruit from a tree?
I mean did any of us choose to eat from the fruit from the tree.Imagine that one of your ancestors committed genocide.Does executing you bring justice to the people your ancestors murdered.Traditional Christianity in my opinion is full of complete and utter retards.

I prefer to think this is all planned by God, all part of His plan...the Fall, everything....in order to teach humans important lessons and experience things that will be invaluable in eternity.

Me too.

CHB

[Dandelion]

what I don't understand is why does god have to punish all of humanity just because one man and one woman decide to eat a fruit from a tree?
I mean did any of us choose to eat from the fruit from the tree.Imagine that one of your ancestors committed genocide.Does executing you bring justice to the people your ancestors murdered.Traditional Christianity in my opinion is full of complete and utter retards.

I believe, as EW said, we all would have sinned, sooner or later, in our lifetime. Most likely sooner. It is the nature of man to choose what he/she wants, over what God wants for us, at least some of the time. We are allowed to make choices....we are not perfect....we are subject to making errors. If we could not choose, we would be slaves or robots, but not God's children. But, that is the beautiful story of our Salvation. We fall short, Jesus lives and dies for us.....we are made pure by his blood.... as we journey through our existence, having different experiences, God's grace and love transform us. We learn and grow.....we see, over time, how God's way is best.....we surrender our lives to Him and He makes us worthy to be called His children.  God could have made the process different, but, He does it in a way so that we learn what love truly is. And, we discover God, when we discover Love, because He is Love. The journey back to Him, is the journey we need to take, so we are ready for Heaven....for our eternity with Him, and to spend an eternity in Heaven, Heaven needs to be in each of us.

D.

Such a beautiful post Dandelion. It brought tears to my eyes this morning.

I don't know whether to be sad or happy that my passage brought tears to your eyes, but I am glad that it made a difference in your day, hopefully for the better.

D.

[darryl]

what I don't understand is why does god have to punish all of humanity just because one man and one woman decide to eat a fruit from a tree?
I mean did any of us choose to eat from the fruit from the tree.Imagine that one of your ancestors committed genocide.Does executing you bring justice to the people your ancestors murdered.Traditional Christianity in my opinion is full of complete and utter retards.

so called 'traditional' theology does fall short in some areas, IMO. I prefer Origen's thinking and the  Alexandrian school of Christian theology of the early Christian church...before people like Augustine, Tertullian  and Jerome came along and corrupted the Blessed Hope of UR, as taught in the NT.They, and others, turned something beautiful into 'fear based religion'...the kind of religion now prevalent in the Christian church.