Christ's death

[Lefein]

Perhaps it does not speak concerning what happens to us in Death, because Death isn't the goal in the first place, it is just a temporary consequence of things.

The Bible is always pointing towards Life, Death is just an enemy along the way.

[Beloved Servant]

I know He saved me from myself.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: It actually does......it's just that it has to be received line upon line, then precept upon precept, so that fear is not strengthened before unconditional love is. My  :2c: Blessings....

[Beloved Servant]

Behold the Lord.

We are in your presence.

Today is the day.

[thinktank]

Perhaps it does not speak concerning what happens to us in Death, because Death isn't the goal in the first place, it is just a temporary consequence of things.

The Bible is always pointing towards Life, Death is just an enemy along the way.

I meant the book deals with death, because it points towards life. But man in his fallen state is confused about what death means, for we have many interpretations that can be taken from the bible, some say death is physical, others spiritual, we have all kinds of testimonies that do not compliment each other. I guess the easiest thing to say is let's focus on Christ, but it would be great if we could say to unbelievers and to ourselves, this is what happens when you die, there is no need to fear.

and lately it has been on my mind that death means the death of the soul, that christ came to save our soul and only few that save it. But All spirits [men] are saved eventually.  :2c:

[micah7:9]

Lazurus died later on after that day dont you think?

His body, yes, because he was not yet given an incorruptible body.

But a body that is dead four days has already gone through a lot of decomposition, yet Jesus told us the man Lazarus was 'sleeping.'

Was Lazurus dead or not? If he was not dead, then Jesus did not do what he said right?

[Lefein]

In that line of thought Thinktank, I think we might have a break through.   :thumbsup:

The soul of men, can be easily defined as his heart - mind, will, emotions, etc.  The Psyche, the Greek word for soul is Psyche afterall, and Psychology is the study of the soul, the mind-will-emotions of a person.

Upon reading your statement; Death of the soul, a whole flood of ideas came up.  Things like...

The Spirit is saved (as you said) but if the soul of a person is rotten, selfish, and wicked, it'll be burned away leaving barely anything left to take with him to the afterlife.  But if a soul has been cleaned, and purified, and made good by a walk with Christ in the land of the living (IE: being saved, and walking the straight and narrow walk) there is much more that is able to be taken with him to Heaven.

Perhaps this is one of the things that Christ was talking about when the Bible says that a man's works will go through the fire, and what isn't built on the foundation of righteousness (Christ) will burn away as stubble.

It'd also be quite a merciful thing too, as the old things will not be remembered - who in Heaven would want to remember (or carry the weight of) all of their wicked deeds?  Or keep all the junk in their souls?  I'd rather go to Heaven stark naked, and innocent...and be unashamed, than to go Heaven with wet fur coats riddled with guilt.

Perhaps they'll keep but fuzzy ashes, like fuzzy memories of evil that is just enough to know they don't want it ever again compared to Love.

"I recall...sort of, like a nightmare, or a dream that I was once a murderer...But that is just a dream now, and I have better things to attend to here."

And then at long last...even the ashes blow away...and one becomes so thoroughly content, their wills aligned in perfect harmony with God, that there is no thought of rebellion.

I think Thinktank, that you're on to something very special.  :boyheart:

[micah7:9]

If one has Chirst in them, then there is no fear of death.
The Bible is very plain on what happens when a living soul dies
Thats the only kind of soul there is (a living creature,) it returns to dust from which it came, and the spirit returns to the one who gave it.

[Lefein]

It would seem to me that the soul is an important, and lasting factor to man's being.  Not something that merely returns to dust like waste.

[Beloved Servant]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMszhdPbB1o

[micah7:9]

I have no desire to have anything but the truth in my quiver, so I ask, if the first time a word is used in the Bible and its diffention given at that point, is that not the foundation to bulid the foundation on?  Now as time and mankind grow things change, but I have not found that what the Bible gives as the diffention has changed.
Gen 2:7  So then Yahweh God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed in his nostrils the breath of life—and man became a living soul.

That as far as I know is the meaning of a soul. A body(dust of the ground, flesh) + breath of life(spirit)= a living soul. Without  body and spirit, there is no soul, living or otherwise. Or an this incorrect meaning?

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Man is a 3 part being, spirit, soul and body. If one of those goes back to the One who sent it, then that only leaves 2 that can die. He saves our soul to the uttermost (not a one time event, a progressional outworking of His Spirit within us), that we are not ashamed in the resurrection, because we are "unclothed".

The soul is the garment of the spirit that gets spotted by the flesh, ie. fleshly desires not in line with the Spirit. "She" is the lesser glory, meant to magnify the greater glory. God said that it is not good for man (spirit) to be alone, so He created him a helpmeet (soul). The soul is what gives the spirit visible expression. Jesus was the soul or heart of the Father, who is a Spirit, expressed.

The soul is made up of 4 parts: mind, will, emotions and desires. The desire of all nations (mankind) shall come, whether it be Christ or something else, He gives us over to our desires until we've had our fill of them and turn to Him in that area, which is when every knee bows the knee IN US. My  :2c: Blessings.....

[micah7:9]

Where in the Bible are these explainations and diffintions what a soul is?
And where in the Bible does it show man is a 3 part being?
Where in the Bible does it read that the soul is made up of 4 parts?

[Lefein]

I have no desire to have anything but the truth in my quiver, so I ask, if the first time a word is used in the Bible and its diffention given at that point, is that not the foundation to bulid the foundation on?  Now as time and mankind grow things change, but I have not found that what the Bible gives as the diffention has changed.
Gen 2:7  So then Yahweh God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed in his nostrils the breath of life—and man became a living soul.

That as far as I know is the meaning of a soul. A body(dust of the ground, flesh) + breath of life(spirit)= a living soul. Without  body and spirit, there is no soul, living or otherwise. Or an this incorrect meaning?

A garment (dust-flesh-body) that has been animated by a sentient living being force (spirit-breath of God) will inevitably have a mind-will-emotions-psyche (soul).

But that doesn't mean the garment is the soul, because dust is dust, whether it is the elements that make up our body, or the elements that make up the rocks, or stars, or comets.  The Spirit is what makes that garment of elements "useful".  The Soul is connected more or less...to the Spirit, because it is sentience that produces the facets of the psyche, not elemental material.

A self-aware, living force, or being will have a soul by default, it doesn't matter if he dwells in a body made of dust, fire, or water.

A rock...doesn't have soul, and neither does my glass of koolaid.  Even if the rock is made of dust, or my koolaid is made of water.

Where in the Bible are these explainations and diffintions what a soul is?

While I search...Do you have any better explanation for what it is?

As far as I can tell, it very possibly implies "Being", and as such a human being has emotions, will, desires, a mind, etc...These can only come out of sentience, Life - I cite logical reasoning, and common sense.

___

Lets look closer at the text you provided.

Gen 2:7  So then Yahweh God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed in his nostrils the breath of life—and man became a living soul. 

I'll include this verse;

Gen 1:26  And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

The facts are laid out like this;

God formed man of the dust of the ground.

God breathed his breath, his pneuma, his ruach into the man.  God is Spirit - God is Life, God is Sentient, God has a soul, God is a living being.

The man after the breath of life, God being breathed into him then became a living soul - a living being - a sentient being.

The man is made in God's image, and having become a living-being is now completed.

So from this I conclude that the "being" of a person is directly correlated, and derived from the Breath of Life - Spirit, rather than the dust.

Speculatively speaking; Therefore the dust will return to dust - but the spirit will go back to God, and the soul, or being that depends on the spirit will if it goes anywhere, go to back to God, not the dust.  Yet there is more for me to think about I am sure.

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: Shared them when we discussed this before......they're in the words of the Word, and the scriptures like this one......

1 Thessalonians 5:23 KJVA
And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.


Strong's Number:   05315   
Original Word Word Origin
Xpn from (05314)
Transliterated Word TDNT Entry
Nephesh TWOT - 1395a
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
neh'-fesh    Noun Feminine 

Definition
soul, self, life, creature, person, appetite, mind, living being, desire, emotion, passion
that which breathes, the breathing substance or being, soul, the inner being of man
living being
living being (with life in the blood)
the man himself, self, person or individual
seat of the appetites
seat of emotions and passions
activity of mind
dubious
activity of the will
dubious
activity of the character
dubious 

God breathes "out", the spirit enters into the flesh and you are born of the flesh. God breathes "in", the spirit returns to the One who sent it, ie. you die.

[Beloved Servant]

When Adam was created
His "womb" was in his side,
But one day Father took it
And from it built his bride.

When man was first created
There were two sides to his nature;
One side: female – one side male...
Nothing lacking in his stature.

Then man was as an eunuch...
Satisfied to be alone,
For he felt no LACK WITHIN himself,
He was contented with his own.

Not once was Adam heard to say,
"I wish I had a mate,"
For he then was "as the angels"
As our Lord was heard to state.

It was God Who said, "I never planned
That man should live alone,
I'll build for him a help that's meet
Of his flesh and of his bone."

For in the beginning of creation
The Lord God said to man:
"I bless you; now be fruitful,
Multiply, and fill the land."

How can a man be fruitful
And reproduce his life?
Why, in this earth, he cannot
If he doesn't have a wife!

Male and female, two in one,
United through and through,
But by His Will He altered man
And out of one made two.

And this He did by causing man
To fall into a sleep
And while man slept, He took form him
A chamber from the deep.

The Word of God is powerful
As a sharp, two-edged sword
And by His Word divided He
The Spirit from the soul.

Then builded He the woman
According to His plan
And when the maid was finished
He brought her to the man.

Eve came forth from Adam
Knowing not from whence she came
But Adam knew she came from him
And so he gave her name.

And Adam called her Wo-man
Because she was taken out of man
And soon "his side" would be his bride
And mother of his clan.

The woman came forth as a babe
She had to learn from man
She did not hear from God "direct"
But she heard "second-hand."

So Adam tried to teach her
The things that God had said,
But without HIS revelation
It won't stay in your head...

The woman represents THE SOUL
That was taken out of man
The man the SPIRIT BEING Son
Who came forth by God's own Hand.

For the FIRST a Spirit
THEN he became "a soul"
And if you'll hearken to these words
The Truth will soon unfold.

The soul, outside the Spirit,
It easy to deceive
But the soul that's IN the Spirit
A lie will soon perceive.

So let our souls be subject
To the Spirit of the Lord
For if we do, we'll rule our flesh
And not lose our reward.

— Lora Huston

[micah7:9]

Lefein, I believe you almost have it.        Body(dust) + breath(spirit)= living soul(creature)                                                   
                                                         Body(dust) - spirit(breath) = death

Where in the Bible are these explainations and diffintions what a soul is? ??
And where in the Bible does it show man is a 3 part being? ??
Where in the Bible does it read that the soul is made up of 4 parts???

Nice poem.

I Thes. 5:23 I would have to use "being" "life" "breath" and may your spirit and being and body be preserved entire,
                                                               and may your spirit and breath and body be preserved entire,
                                                               and may your spirit and life and body be preserved entire,

SOUL is a living creature........ a living creature, does not HAVE a soul.

[Lefein]

Perhaps there is a clue as to what a Nephesh (Soul) is in the word itself.

According to strongs; Nephesh comes from the root word Naphash

http://www.studylight.org/lex/heb/view.cgi?number=05314

Psyche, the Greek word means;

http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=5590

And comes from;

http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=5594

[Lefein]

Another key note; while the soul/spirit/breath is the "Being" of an individual, however the correlation between the breath and being of a person may be in light of the dust of his body.

Mankind was never meant to be bodiless, being disembodied he may be alive (or dead), but he is not yet "complete as a being, though still a being" until he is embodied, whether in dust, or in glory.

[micah7:9]

Another key note; while the soul/spirit/breath is the "Being" of an individual, however the correlation between the breath and being of a person may be in light of the dust of his body.

Mankind was never meant to be bodiless, being disembodied he may be alive (or dead), but he is not yet "complete as a being, though still a being" until he is embodied, whether in dust, or in glory.

All I know for sure is that the Bible defines the dust of the ground given the breath of life becomes a living soul. I know that (a) soul is a breathing creature H5315 nephesh.
Practiclally from the oncet of my Bible studies and reading I had been told that we/ man is made up of three parts..
body- soul- spirit. I taught it, I understood it, I believed it. Until about a month or two ago, I read Gen. 2:7 and there it was.
It did not read that dust of the ground when The Lord God breathed into it,  recieved a soul. I read that it became a living soul. I can answer no questions about the defintiion of a dead soul or what a soul was before Gen. 2:7
And then  there is  1Co 15:45  Thus, also, it is written—The first man, Adam, became, a living soul, the last Adam, a life-giving spirit.
Man did not recieve a soul.

[Lefein]

I'd say that he could still be considered three parts.  Becoming, is still a form of receiving in a way.  If I become bruised, I have received a bruise.  If I become alive, I have received life.  If that makes sense.

Though of course, I do agree that the base idea of being "three separate parts" is a bit off. 

We have nerves, and a brain made up of nerves, and a nervous system, all contained in a body.  Now, the nerves in our spinal cord and tongue are different and categorisable as different from the nerves in the brain - but they are all one nervous system interlinked and connected, running the same electrical currents.  And the body of muscle, and skin is certainly not our nerves - but our nerves are integrated into the body, as it is into us.

A disembodied person is maimed, but alive (or dead), in the same way that a person whose nervous system is malfunctioning is maimed.  An embodied person is healthy and whole, as well as alive.

It is of my conclusion therefore, that we are indeed "three part", but the key point being that we are a multi-part integrated unit; The Individual.  Each part is important to that unit.  Including a body - whether it is dust, or glory.  Especially a soul, which comes from the root of it all - The Breath of Life, which animates the dust, and activates the soul in a similar way that a computer is made of metals and silicon (Dust), being connected to a power source (Breath) activates the programs, and applications (Soul) that makes it a functioning machine (Being); A living soul.

Then there is even the phrase itself;

"A Living Soul" - A soul (being) - that is alive (enbreathed with Life, and given sentience) - embodied in dust, disembodied in physical death and later to be embodied in glory.

[Molly]

We are spirit, soul, and body.

The body does not equal the soul.

Jesus gave his soul for us.

[micah7:9]

We are spirit, soul, and body.

The body does not equal the soul.

Jesus gave his soul for us.

Where can that be found In the Bible?

[Beloved Servant]

The Greek word for SOUL is psuche, which means MIND. It is the root word from which we get all our English words dealing with the psychic, i.e. the human soul, the mind, the mental life. Psychoanalysis, psychology, psychiatry – all these words come from the same root – psuche. Proverbs 2:10 suggests that the soul needs knowledge. "Knowledge is pleasant unto thy soul." Note also Prov. 19:2 and 24:14. Since knowledge is a function of the mind, this shows that the mind is a part of the soul. All three of these verses from Proverbs tell us that we need to have knowledge in the soul. Then Ps. 139:14 says that the soul knows. "I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvelous are Thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well." To know is something of the mind, which again shows that the mind is a part of the soul. Ps. 13:2 says the soul considers, or counsels, which refers to the mind. Lamentations 3:20 indicates that remembrance is of the soul. That is, the soul can remember things. From these verses we can see that there is a part in the soul that knows, considers, and remembers. This part is called the mind.

The second part of the soul is the will. Job 7:15 says the soul chooses. "So that my soul chooseth death rather than life." To choose something is a decision made by act of the will. This shows that the will is a part of the soul. Job 6:7 says the soul refuses. To choose and refuse are both functions of the will. I Chron. 22:19 says, "set your soul to seek." Just as we set our minds to think, so we set our souls to seek. This is, of course, the soul making a decision, which shows that the will is a part of the soul. Then in Numbers 30, "bind his soul" is mentioned ten times. When we read this chapter, we understand that to bind the soul is to make a decision. It deals with a vow that is made to the Lord. To make a decision to bind the soul is to make a vow to the Lord. Thus, it is demonstrated that the will is a part of the soul. In Ps. 27:12, 41:2, and Ezekiel 16:27 the Hebrew word for "soul" is translated "will." This again reveals that the will is a part of the soul.

The emotion is the third part of the soul. With the emotion there are many aspects: for example, love, hatred, grief, joy, peace, fear, etc. All of these are expressions of the emotion. References to the fact that the soul loves are found in I Sam. 18:1, S. of S. 1:7, and Ps. 42:1. These verses show that love is something of the soul, proving, therefore, that within the soul there is such an organ or function as the emotion. II Sam. 5:8 says, "Whosoever getteth up and smiteth the Jebusites that are hated of David's soul, he shall be chief." This passage shows that hatred is something of the soul. See also Ps. 107:18 and Eze. 36:5. Since hatred is an expression of the emotion, these verses also prove that the emotion is a part of the soul. Joy, an element of the emotion, is also a part of the soul, as seen in Isa. 61:10 and Ps. 86:4. Then there is the matter of grief, mentioned in I Sam. 30:6 and Judges 10:16. Grief is another expression of the soul.

The fourth part of the soul is the desire. We read in I Sam. 20:4, "Then said Jonathan unto David, Whatsoever thy soul desireth, I will even do it for thee." This verse shows that desire is found in the soul, making it a part of the soul. See also Deut. 14:26. This verse and many others show desire to be in the realm of the soul.

The affection is the fifth part of the soul. We read of Abraham's nephew, Lot, who, though he lived in Sodom, his heart affection was toward the Lord, and the record states, "For that righteous man dwelling among them, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds" (II Pet. 2:8). Lot vexed his righteous soul because his affection was not upon the things they were doing. From his prison cell in Rome the apostle Paul penned these immortal words, "Set your AFFECTION ON THINGS ABOVE, and not on things on the earth" (Col. 3:2). Hear now the inspired words of Jesus as He teaches His disciples, "And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy SOUL... this is the first commandment" (Mk. 12:30). This quality of love – agape – means in the Greek "to have affection" (see Strong's Concordance). Thou shalt HAVE AFFECTION for the Lord thy God! What magnificent words these are, describing as they do the affection that we should have for the Lord with all our SOUL. This proves that affection is a function of the soul. 

On a day in the long ago an apostle by the name of Paul penned these telling words: "For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent BEGUILED EVE through his subtilty, so YOUR MINDS should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ" (II Cor. 11:2-3). In this significant passage Eve in the garden of Eden is contrasted with two things: the bride of Christ and the mind. The mind is a function of the soul. The vision of the bride of Christ pervades the whole of scripture, from Eden onward, with ever-increasing clearness. Eve, the mother of the human race, is the first type of this great mystery. Let us not underestimate this remarkable woman from whom the whole human race has sprung!
— Eby

[Beloved Servant]

continuing:

Jesus said, "I lay down my life (Gr: soul) that I may take it again... I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again..." (Jn. 10:17-18). The word POWER used here literally means "the right, the privilege," while the word LIFE is psuche on the Greek, meaning the SOUL, the soul realm with its mind, will, emotion, desire, and affection.
Thus, to use Jesus' words, "I HAVE THE RIGHT TO LAY DOWN MY OWN SOUL-LIFE, die out to all the flesh appeal which would bring me into bondage to the world's system; and I HAVE THE RIGHT TO TAKE UP MY SOUL-LIFE IN A HIGHER SPHERE OF THE SPIRIT." The end of this is, "Not my will, but THINE be done" (Lk. 22:42).

www.kingdombiblestudies.org/Echoes/echoes30.htm