1 Thessalonians 5:1 - 11

[Dandelion]

1 Thessalonians 5Young's Literal Translation (YLT)

5 And concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need of my writing to you,
2 for yourselves have known thoroughly that the day of the Lord as a thief in the night doth so come,
3 for when they may say, Peace and surety, then sudden destruction doth stand by them, as the travail [doth] her who is with child, and they shall not escape;
4 and ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day may catch you as a thief;
5 all ye are sons of light, and sons of day; we are not of night, nor of darkness,
6 so, then, we may not sleep as also the others, but watch and be sober,
7 for those sleeping, by night do sleep, and those making themselves drunk, by night are drunken,
8 and we, being of the day -- let us be sober, putting on a breastplate of faith and love, and an helmet -- a hope of salvation,
9 because God did not appoint us to anger, but to the acquiring of salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ,
10 who did die for us, that whether we wake -- whether we sleep -- together with him we may live;
11 wherefore, comfort ye one another, and build ye up, one the one, as also ye do.

Just came upon this yesterday. I never remember seeing this verse as a confirmation of UR, but it seems like that is what it is, to me.

Your thoughts, my friends?

[anti_nietzsche]

I often struggle with the two-fold plan of scripture that speaks about salvation sometimes as a matter concerning all of mankind, and sometimes only concerning only the church. What helps is to see the context of the first century where most of the threatenings already came to pass when Jerusalem was sieged and then conquered by Rome. That's sometimes forgotten by people. But the cross and its results are universal. God thought of all of us and his love is victorious! On Earth it can be frustrated but death is the end of the frustration at the latest.

[Dandelion]

I see the 'sleep' and 'drunkeness' as symbolic for people who are not aware of the Lord......living in the materialistic world, rather than the spiritual one. I think this is saying that all will be saved....together in Him we will live.

That's how I see it.

D.

[bushy]

I hadn't read this carefully enough to get it before but now I agree. Because whether we are of the night (asleep and drunk), or of the day (awake and sober), we will all live together with Him. The "we" includes everyone.

[Dandelion]

Yes, thank you!

D.

[marie glen]

I see the 'sleep' and 'drunkeness' as symbolic for people who are not aware of the Lord......living in the materialistic world, rather than the spiritual one. I think this is saying that all will be saved....together in Him we will live.

That's how I see it.

D.

:O wow! how true!! by experience, we can see that neither sleep, nor drunkeness lasts forever.. one always sobers up, and wakes up ...unless we die in our sleep of course! but it's obvious this is not the "sleep" that's being referred to!