1 Pet 4 (AMP)
v 12 Beloved, do not be amazed and bewildered at the fiery ordeal which is taking place to TEST YOUR QUALITY, as though something strange to your position were befalling you.
v 13 But insofar as you are sharing Christ's sufferings, rejoice, so that when His glory [full of radiance and splendor] is revealed, you may also rejoice with triumph exultantly.
....
v 19 Therefore, those who are ill-treated and suffer in accordance with God's will must do right and commit themselves to the One Who created them and Who will never fail them.
Wonderful Post dear Anna :HeartThrob:
You said in part: "We never realize at the time what Father is putting us through"
I now understand fully without question that EVERYTHING is from Father and I have let go of the notion that there are limits to any given lesson and as such am open to anything Father has planned.
There is reason to rejoice in even the most difficult of circumstance. I will comment on the word "suffering" It is very similar to "sacrifice" in form. The common meaning of Sacrifice would suggest that it is something given (or taken) be-grudgingly. But this not the case at all. A true Sacrifice is done with joy and love, freely and willingly. It is giving something cherished to someone who is cherished greater. :HeartThrob:
Suffering is similar. One can easily turn and look at all hardships, sickness even death as suffering. Many will liken suffering, living in a house without A/C while others will equate it to having no running water.
Suffering comes to Joy when everything is seen through the eyes of gratitude. Many have taken the time during sickness to do wondrous works of art, poetry and writing. Death is an illusion and even the one who has to haul water many miles from a well can be very grateful for being able to do so. This is suffering in good spirit. It is not bemoaning anything but welcoming a new day to live in grace and gratitude.
:dsunny:
Love Julie :HeartThrob:
This just arrived in my in-box. I am thinking Father had a hand in it . :HeartThrob:
Suffering is a state of mind, the following story made me cry, it's precious.
Jesus said we must become as little children. I pray to be as Kevin. Free to LOVE and live in joy always.
I envy Kevin. My brother, Kevin, thinks God lives under his bed. At least that's what I heard him say one night.
He was praying out loud in his dark bedroom, and I stopped to listen, 'Are you there, God?' he said. 'Where are you? Oh, I see. Under the bed....'
I giggled softly and tiptoed off to my own room. Kevin's unique perspectives are often a source of amusement. But that night something else lingered long after the humor. I realized for the first time the very different world Kevin lives in.
He was born 30 years ago, mentally disabled as a result of difficulties during labor. Apart from his size (he's 6-foot-2), there are few ways in which he is an adult.
He reasons and communicates with the capabilities of a 7-year-old, and he always will. He will probably always believe that God lives under his bed, that Santa Claus is the one who fills the space under our tree every Christmas and that airplanes stay up in the sky because angels carry them.
I remember wondering if Kevin realizes he is different. Is he ever dissatisfied with his monotonous life?
Up before dawn each day, off to work at a workshop for the disabled, home to walk our cocker spaniel, return to eat his favorite macaroni-and-cheese for dinner, and later to bed.
The only variation in the entire scheme is laundry, when he hovers excitedly over the washing machine like a mother with her newborn child.
He does not seem dissatisfied.
He lopes out to the bus every morning at 7:05 (http://tentmaker.org/forum/x-apple-data-detectors://0), eager for a day of simple work.
He wrings his hands excitedly while the water boils on the stove before dinner, and he stays up late twice a week to gather our dirty laundry for his next day's laundry chores.
And Saturdays - oh, the bliss of Saturdays! That's the day my Dad takes Kevin to the airport to have a soft drink, watch the planes land, and speculate loudly on the destination of each passenger inside. 'That one's goin' to Chi-car-go! ' Kevin shouts as he claps his hands.
His anticipation is so great he can hardly sleep on Friday nights.
And so goes his world of daily rituals and weekend field trips.
He doesn't know what it means to be discontent.
His life is simple.
He will never know the entanglements of wealth or power, and he does not care what brand of clothing he wears or what kind of food he eats. His needs have always been met, and he never worries that one day they may not be.
His hands are diligent. Kevin is never so happy as when he is working. When he unloads the dishwasher or vacuums the carpet, his heart is completely in it.
He does not shrink from a job when it is begun, and he does not leave a job until it is finished.. But when his tasks are done, Kevin knows how to relax.
He is not obsessed with his work or the work of others. His heart is pure.
He still believes everyone tells the truth, promises must be kept, and when you are wrong, you apologize instead of argue.
Free from pride and unconcerned with appearances, Kevin is not afraid to cry when he is hurt, angry or sorry. He is always transparent, always sincere. And he trusts God.
Not confined by intellectual reasoning, when he comes to Christ, he comes as a child. Kevin seems to know God - to really be friends with Him in a way that is difficult for an 'educated' person to grasp. God seems like his closest companion.
In my moments of doubt and frustrations with my Christianity, I envy the security Kevin has in his simple faith.
It is then that I am most willing to admit that he has some divine knowledge that rises above my mortal questions.
It is then I realize that perhaps he is not the one with the handicap. I am. My obligations, my fear, my pride, my circumstances - they all become disabilities when I do not trust them to God's care
Who knows if Kevin comprehends things I can never learn? After all, he has spent his whole life in that kind of innocence, praying after dark and soaking up the goodness and love of God.
And one day, when the mysteries of heaven are opened, and we are all amazed at how close God really is to our hearts, I'll realize that God heard the simple prayers of a boy who believed that God lived under his bed.
Kevin won't be surprised at all ! :cloud9:
Love Julie :HeartThrob:
Such a heart warming story!!!! but what does it have to do with the topic of this thread??? Partakers in Christ's suffering??? Is Kevin not part of the ALL in Christ shall live???? Is he not saved through the shed blood of the cross???
Quote from: anna274 on November 06, 2013, 12:04:40 AM
Such a heart warming story!!!! but what does it have to do with the topic of this thread??? Partakers in Christ's suffering??? Is Kevin not part of the ALL in Christ shall live???? Is he not saved through the shed blood of the cross???
I am so disappointed that you chose to share this story as well as your other reply on a thread that very clearly features a Scriptural truth about Christ's sufferings and you boldly say "Suffering is a state of mind"
I'm asking the Mods to remove this thread, please. Thank you, anna274
Anna it is I whom am shocked and deeply saddened by your response to my heart felt posts to your thread.
1 Pet 4 (AMP)
v 12 Beloved, do not be amazed and bewildered at the fiery ordeal which is taking place to TEST YOUR QUALITY, as though something strange to your position were befalling you.
There it is stated for all to take heed of. Anything that takes place in ones life and dear sister I have had my share of horrible things is a test of character and the quality of ones faith, trust and Love for Father, His Son and all else. There is no reason to ever stand in wonder and ask: "God why me???"
Kevin in the heart warming story knows that God is under his bed and see's everything as magical through joyous eyes. Is he not being tested? Father, we are told will judge the condition of our hearts and I think Kevin is doing fine. His faith and Trust is insurmountable.
v 13 But insofar as you are sharing Christ's sufferings, rejoice, so that when His glory [full of radiance and splendor] is revealed, you may also rejoice with triumph exultantly.
As I implied in both of my responses. REJOICE :dsunny: Christ gave us reason to rejoice always, to look past the physical and see always the spiritual. To break free of the constraints of normality. Christ's radiance and Splendor is beyond compare and is reason enough to live in joyous Love always. Kevin lives this way, Father has given him eyes to see and I believe he see's better than most,
v 19 Therefore, those who are ill-treated and suffer in accordance with God's will must do right and commit themselves to the One Who created them and Who will never fail them.
So regardless of what befalls any of us. No matter how hard the hardship or how poorly treated we feel , we MUST always hold HARD and FAST to the Love that Father has so graciously given us. If Father is with us (If ....really) who can be against us. His rod and staff comfort us, if we choose to be comforted.
Yes Anna, suffering is a state of mind. Paul implied it. Rejoice, be happy be joyous because Jesus has suffered greater than an of us could ever. The suffering is only Temporal, Fathers Love is forever.
Is this not what should be on everyones mind. Is not every hardship full of lessons? Are we not to be grateful for everything for the highest good for all.
I hope the Mods do not delete this thread as I truly believe I have not crossed any line. I am not trying to mock you, I just am trying to say that the Spirit of Truth brings the Scriptures to Life. They are no longer just words on paper; rather they become part of one and each earthly lesson (hardship) is correlated with the Spirit. There is no disconnect, there simply cannot be.
I pray that my words are taken and received in the Spirit of Love in which they were given.
I had no intention of ever offending you, please know this :girlheart:
Love Julie :HeartThrob:
"12 Beloved, do not think strange the conflagration among you, which is becoming a trial to you, as of something strange befalling you,
13 but, according as you are participating in the sufferings of Christ, rejoice, that you may be rejoicing, exulting in the unveiling of His glory also.
14 If you are being reproached in the name of Christ, happy are you, for the spirit of glory and power, and that of God, has come to rest on you.
15 For let not any of you be suffering as a murderer, or a thief, or an evildoer, or as an interferer in other's affairs;
16 yet if as a Christian, let him not be ashamed, yet let him be glorifying God in this name,
17 seeing that it is the era for the judgment to begin from the house of God. Now if first from us, what is the consummation of those who are stubborn as to God's evangel?
18 And, "If the just one is hardly being saved, where will the irreverent and the sinner appear?"
19 So that, let those also who are suffering according to the will of God commit their souls to a faithful Creator in the doing of good." (1 Peter 4:12-19)
"12 Peter is the representative of the suffering saints of the Circumcision, and his ministry is especially intended for such. The persecutions of the first century were foretastes of the terrible time which precedes the coming of the kingdom. Hence these exhortations fit both occasions equally well. Then judgment will begin from the house of God, as detailed in the second and third chapters of the Unveiling.
15 Paradoxical as it may seem, only Jews are Christians in the Scriptures. The term is never applied to the nations, but only to Jews or proselytes. Paul never uses the name in his epistles. It occurs only in Acts, which is concerned with the past rejection of the kingdom, and in Peter, which looked forward to its future realization. It is a notable example of the manner in which Scriptural terms have been utterly perverted from their original use." (Concordant Commentary on the New Testament page 361)
"No trial has taken you except what is human. Now, faithful is God, Who will not be leaving you to be tried above what you are able, but, together with the trial, will be making the sequel also, to enable you to undergo it." (1 Corinthians 10:13)
"13 God does not try us to break us down but to build us up. Hence He sends nothing insupportable. He does not however, make "a way of escape", as many of His saints have found by experience. If He did, why or how could that enable them to undergo it? They would not need to endure it if He took them out of it. He makes a sequel. This word occurs again in Heb.13:7: "contemplating the sequel (A.V. end) of their behavior." All the great examples of trial were sustained by a contemplation of its sequel. Joseph held the sceptre in the prison. David wore the crown in Adullam. Even Job knew that he would see his Redeemer. We should not try to escape trial, but seek grace to endure it. We should not occupy ourselves with it, but contemplate the blessed outcome which it is designed to produce." (Concordant Commentary on the New Testament page 257)
QuoteGod does not try us to break us down but to build us up. Hence He sends nothing insupportable. He does not however, make "a way of escape", as many of His saints have found by experience. If He did, why or how could that enable them to undergo it? They would not need to endure it if He took them out of it.
Thanks for this Tom. I have found Father's Love :HeartThrob: to be very much like a coil spring or a large rubber band. We can try to resist the pull Of Fathers love as much and for as long as we like. He does not care because he knows our efforts a futile and will come to no avail. Our struggles in this life are to "Test" the quality of our character, but not in the way most assume.
Father knows who and what we are, it is "I" who does not. Oh, sure we assume to know everything we need and pull on the rubber band as hard as we can. We're strong; of course it is a struggle but heck, that's what Father want's right? :gimmefive:
No :HeartThrob:
Father wants us to TRUST in Him, to not lean on our own understanding. In short: to let go of the resistance, because it is not Father holding his love from us, but we who are holding ourselves from Him. I mean this in all sincerity; of what use is all these words if we are captured, beaten, abused and deny that Christ is LORD? :dontknow:
Of no use at all. This is the strength of character, of wisdom that SPIRIT builds through trust and peace and of course LOVE :HeartThrob: For until we cease the constant struggle and SEE ourselves as BEACONS of LIGHT :dsunny: for those who cannot see, we are just as lost as they and our struggle just as pointless.
This is why Paul told us to Rejoice and also why we are told to endure. We are to endure long enough to realize that the harder we struggle the dimmer our light. Rejoicing releases the Light of Spirit for the greater good of all, most of all oneself.
Father is simply awesome :HeartThrob:
Love Julie
......satan himself turns himself into an aangel of light....Holy spirit comforts
those who mourn...God wipes away tears from all eyes....Lot was tormented over the wickedness
of those who surrounded him. the man with the inkhorn marked on the forehead those
who mourned what was being done. No-one said shame on you 'you should be a pollyanna"
it is a failing on your part to be greived of evil and suffering...your greif is not legit.......
weeping endureth through the night..but joy cometh in the morning.............
...He says you will mourn..while the whole world rejoices....YET your greif shall be turned to joy..
.He was acquainted with sorrow
and affliction..........in great endurance..in trouble,hardships and distresses,in
beatings,imprisonments and riots,in hard work sleepless nights and hunger,in purity in
understanding,pateince in kindness,in the Holy spirit and sincere love. In truthful speech and in the
power of God.....and yet we live on......beaten and yet not killed,sorrowful yet always rejoicing
poor,yet making many rich
there is a time an purpose for everything under heaven.
Go ahead and cry ifyou feel like crying,He will wipe off the tears from your face...He wipes away
them all..there will be no more death or crying or mourning or pain..........
May the God of all comfort,comfort your hearts...in a little while the wicked will be no more.
...wait on Him,He will turn yours tears to joy
JESUS WEPT...Jesus sweat blood.......Jesus said...my soul is overwhelmed with sorrow
to the point of death.....................sometimes the 'state of mind of Christ' weeps,sorrows
suffers,is greived...and sometimes the Holy spirit is greived.
Luke 22;44...and being in anguish..He prayed more earnestly,and his sweat was like drops
of blood falling to the ground.
anguish- extreme pain either of body or mind.
QuoteJESUS WEPT...Jesus sweat blood.......Jesus said...my soul is overwhelmed with sorrow
to the point of death.....................sometimes the 'state of mind of Christ' weeps,sorrows
suffers,is greived...and sometimes the Holy spirit is grieved.
Beautifully said Sheila :HeartThrob:
Though there is an important point that we must never forget. Jesus the man, bore the sins of the entire world. Not only those sins that were but every sin that was ever to come.
How great was his sorrow? How could any mere mortal withstand what he did?
His LOVE for his Father was beyond comprehension, his Faith and Trust, likewise. Surely nothing on this Earth could ever overwhelm any of us to the point of crying tears of blood. :dunno2:
Puts everything into perspective; how easy it is for us to Love and Trust in Father and all that He has given us. Nothing more so than His SON Jesus Christ. :HeartThrob:
Love Julie :HeartThrob:
He laid his life down willingly..no man took it from him,like us..our life was taken from us by the man o
f sin/son of perdition[sin entered unto aall men]...the original liar and murderer........thus...
as Adam's nearest relative[son of God] Christ as our kinsmen redeemer come to raise up
seed unto His dead brother Adam..to inherit eternal life. For the commandment to Adam
to not eat from the tokogae was meant unto life for him..not death.......and God's motive
for speaking it was for the preservation of Adam's life..not his destruction.
But so that sin[evil spirit] would appear so utterly sinful...it slayed us by that which was spoken
to preserve us.[the Goodness of God that we not suffer death but live]
Thus,man had to be redeemed from sin and death and sin's law........and seed raaised up
in Christ[I am the resurrection] for Adam.to inherit the heavenly kingdom...
...if a husband died in Israel without an heir..then brother-in-law marriage was performed
to raise up seed to inherit in Israel...if a man refused to redeem..he was called the unsandaled
one....John the Baptist spoke of being unfit to remove[unlace] the sandals of His feet..and
proclaimed Him as the Bridegroom..sent to fulfill this in dead Adam's stead...........
.....the time comes when you will no longer call me Lord..but My husband.......
thus heavenly Jerusalem is God's wife..and the New Jerusalem the Lambs wife is man raised
up in Christ[the only daughter of her Mother[Jerusalme above].............the bride.