Jesus' Body

[Cardinal]

So if He doesn't come back to earth in HIS glorified body, do you think we at some point go to Him?  Because IF (and I believe He does) exist in HIS OWN glorified body - and since you SAW Him Card - I believe at some point(s) we will see Him.  His glorified flesh with our (immortal) glorified eyes.  Because we (are and) will be His co-workers, His co-heirs, ruling and reigning WITH Him.  If our mortal is raised immortal (I Cor. 15) in a glorified body, why wouldn't we be able to see our elder Brother?  We will have new bodies;  will our elder Brother and Savior hide from us?   :OhNo:

:cloud9: Interesting point. Shortly before I had this experience of seeing Him literally full body in someone, I felt like a fireball of the HG hit me in the chest, and I felt it rolling around in me. The glory was heavy on me, and I asked Him what He was doing. He spoke, "My love is now being shed abroad in your heart." Then when that subsided and I looked at this man sitting next to me, there He was, to my shock.

So obviously, I saw Him, but I can't explain why in that way.  :dontknow: Blessings....

[jabcat]

So obviously, I saw Him, but I can't explain why in that way.  :dontknow: Blessings....

:thumbsup:

[jabcat]

I think I have to disagree at this point that He won't return and be present in bodily form.  I agree He is and will be present in us His spiritual body, but ALSO;

"For you have died, and your Life [in the Last Age] has been hidden together with the Anointed One in God.  When the Anointed One, who is our Life, appears [at the beginning of the Last Age], then you too will appear together with Him in glory."   Cololssians 3:3,4  The Christian Bible

I say, "Glory"!  

[Molly]

I think I have to disagree at this point that He won't return and be present in bodily form.  I agree He is and will be present in us His spiritual body, but ALSO;

"For you have died, and your Life [in the Last Age] has been hidden together with the Anointed One in God.  When the Anointed One, who is our Life, appears [at the beginning of the Last Age], then you too will appear together with Him in glory."   Cololssians 3:3,4  The Christian Bible

I say, "Glory"!  

Col 3--Isn't that the same as this?


1 Thessalonians 3:13
To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.


And, this?

Jude 1:14
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

[Nathan]

I think I have to disagree at this point that He won't return and be present in bodily form.  I agree He is and will be present in us His spiritual body, but ALSO;

"For you have died, and your Life [in the Last Age] has been hidden together with the Anointed One in God.  When the Anointed One, who is our Life, appears [at the beginning of the Last Age], then you too will appear together with Him in glory."   Cololssians 3:3,4  The Christian Bible

I say, "Glory"!  

I'm not questioning whether or not he appears, I'm questioning the form in which he appears.  That's why we hear the term frequentlyl on the form He "is" coming, he "has" come and he "will continue" to come.  

When he resurrected and went back to his loved ones, they didn't recognize him either because they were still looking for the old form that he left in.  He returned to them in a resurrected state and then ascended . . only to return again in power to live "in" us and even now, we still expect the old form to manifest again?  

To some, he comes as a ray of light.  But to others who have been in a drought, he comes as a thunderhead.  he comes to all of us, but the form is never the same because our experiences, needs and situations are never the same.

Paul talks about these bodies of ours dying as well and putting on immortality, but until we experience that, our minds can only come up with images (imaginations) which don't even come close to the reallity of what's on the other side.  He came in the flesh so we, in the flesh could "see" him and be changed.  But once we pass over into the spirit, that doesn't mean that he's still going to manifest in the same form that he did when we were in the flesh.  It will appear, make no mistake about that, but what form that entails is a whole other matter.

[Molly]

Yikes.  That preposition could be 'in'. :mshock:


Jude 1:14
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

"with"

G1722
εν
en
en
A primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state), and (by implication) instrumentality (medially or constructively), that is, a relation of rest (intermediate between G1519 and G1537); "in", at, (up-) on, by, etc.: - about, after, against, + almost, X altogether, among, X as, at, before, between, (here-) by (+ all means), for (. . . sake of), + give self wholly to, (here-) in (-to, -wardly), X mightily, (because) of, (up-) on, [open-] ly, X outwardly, one, X quickly, X shortly, [speedi-] ly, X that, X there (-in, -on), through (-out), (un-) to(-ward), under, when, where (-with), while, with (-in). Often used in compounds, with substantially the same import; rarely with verbs of motion, and then not to indicate direction, except (elliptically) by a separate (and different) prep.

[thinktank]

So if He doesn't come back to earth in HIS glorified body, do you think we at some point go to Him?  Because IF (and I believe He does) exist in HIS OWN glorified body - and since you SAW Him Card - I believe at some point(s) we will see Him.  His glorified flesh with our (immortal) glorified eyes.  Because we (are and) will be His co-workers, His co-heirs, ruling and reigning WITH Him.  If our mortal is raised immortal (I Cor. 15) in a glorified body, why wouldn't we be able to see our elder Brother?  We will have new bodies;  will our elder Brother and Savior hide from us?   :OhNo:

:cloud9: Interesting point. Shortly before I had this experience of seeing Him literally full body in someone, I felt like a fireball of the HG hit me in the chest, and I felt it rolling around in me. The glory was heavy on me, and I asked Him what He was doing. He spoke, "My love is now being shed abroad in your heart." Then when that subsided and I looked at this man sitting next to me, there He was, to my shock.

So obviously, I saw Him, but I can't explain why in that way.  :dontknow: Blessings....

Allow me to explain if I may through the scriptures.

He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

So it seems your keeping Gods commandments card, a rare christian, well done   :grin:

John
18 I will not leave you comfortless: [1] I will come to you. 19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. 20 At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you. 21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

The world cannot see him currently, but we see him through the holy ghost. But the scriptures declare that one day even the world will see him.

Revelation 1:7   

Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen

The saints will also return to earth with him

1 Thessalonians 3:13 

To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.

Jude 1:14   

And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints


Even the old testament propecies this return
Deutoronomy
33And this is the blessing, wherewith Moses the man of God blessed the children of Israel before his death. 2 And he said, The Lord came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery [1] law for them.

So to me not only is God manifesting to us now through his spirit, but also will return to earth in his resurected body in whatever form he chooses, with his saints also in their resurected bodies.

God bless Jesus

[jabcat]

I think I have to disagree at this point that He won't return and be present in bodily form.  I agree He is and will be present in us His spiritual body, but ALSO;

"For you have died, and your Life [in the Last Age] has been hidden together with the Anointed One in God.  When the Anointed One, who is our Life, appears [at the beginning of the Last Age], then you too will appear together with Him in glory."   Cololssians 3:3,4  The Christian Bible

I say, "Glory"!  

I'm not questioning whether or not he appears, I'm questioning the form in which he appears.  That's why we hear the term frequentlyl on the form He "is" coming, he "has" come and he "will continue" to come.  

When he resurrected and went back to his loved ones, they didn't recognize him either because they were still looking for the old form that he left in.  He returned to them in a resurrected state and then ascended . . only to return again in power to live "in" us and even now, we still expect the old form to manifest again?  

To some, he comes as a ray of light.  But to others who have been in a drought, he comes as a thunderhead.  he comes to all of us, but the form is never the same because our experiences, needs and situations are never the same.

Paul talks about these bodies of ours dying as well and putting on immortality, but until we experience that, our minds can only come up with images (imaginations) which don't even come close to the reallity of what's on the other side.  He came in the flesh so we, in the flesh could "see" him and be changed.  But once we pass over into the spirit, that doesn't mean that he's still going to manifest in the same form that he did when we were in the flesh.  It will appear, make no mistake about that, but what form that entails is a whole other matter.

I agree with most if not all of this.  I understand the beliefs some have about Him only appearing as He went away to mean, "in the clouds", as in, "apparent in PEOPLE".  I've heard that one.  True enough the disciples didn't recognize Him, but I personally don't get any indication that it was because His form appeared to be non-human, or ET'ish, or like some sort of wispy octopuss, etc.   :bigGrin:  It was apparently different somehow, glorified (whatever that means exactly), but still (I believe) a "human-type" form.  As WW pointed out earlier, he ate, drank, and invited to be physically touched.  However, at the same time, He was able to pass through walls, appear and re-appear.  So my personal belief is, although He does and will appear in the clouds of saints, that's not all it was talking about when the angels said this same Jesus YOU ARE GAZING AT will come again in like manner. 

Molly, looks like along with the Colossians scriptures I mentioned, you've come up with another couple re: seeing Him.   I'll look at some other translations on those verses. :thumbsup:

[jabcat]

Good post TT.

[jabcat]

Yikes.  That preposition could be 'in'. :mshock:


Jude 1:14
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

"with"

G1722
εν
en
en
A primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state), and (by implication) instrumentality (medially or constructively), that is, a relation of rest (intermediate between G1519 and G1537); "in", at, (up-) on, by, etc.: - about, after, against, + almost, X altogether, among, X as, at, before, between, (here-) by (+ all means), for (. . . sake of), + give self wholly to, (here-) in (-to, -wardly), X mightily, (because) of, (up-) on, [open-] ly, X outwardly, one, X quickly, X shortly, [speedi-] ly, X that, X there (-in, -on), through (-out), (un-) to(-ward), under, when, where (-with), while, with (-in). Often used in compounds, with substantially the same import; rarely with verbs of motion, and then not to indicate direction, except (elliptically) by a separate (and different) prep.

Most literal translation from the Koine Greek I'm aware of;

1 Thessalonians 3:13
so that He might solidly establish your hearts unblamable in purity in front of our God and Father at our Master Yesu's Presence with all of His Pure Ones [at the beginning of the Last Age]!


Jude 1:14
Now about these people Enoch (the seventh from Adam) also prophesied, saying, "Notice, the Master came with many thousands of His Pure Ones..."   The Christian Bible (1991)

[Nathan]

Of course his form was humanly after the resurrection, he was still submitting himself to the laws of nature and all that.  For me, I'm not worried so much on the form, I see him more as light.  He's the ultimate illuminator and I think wherever there is life, there is light.  Fire is it's own light . .we all have light in us, but our minds are what makes it dark because with light and illumination is limitless vision and understanding . . .but with these limited minds we have now, all they can come up with are shadows, shades of light.  And Jesus even went so far as to say the greatest darkness is with those who think light is in them when it's acutally darkness.

Friggin mind anyway.  Works wonderfully in this realm . . .screws up everything in the spiritual realm though.

[jabcat]

 We only use a little bit of it, and sometimes in my case it's painfully obvious.   :laugh2:

[Cardinal]

We only use a little bit of it, and sometimes in my case it's painfully obvious.   :laugh2:

:cloud9: Have you ever thought about how carnal men talk about wanting to access more than the 10% of it? Look what a mess it's made of things already and they want MORE???  :help:

[Cardinal]

Yikes.  That preposition could be 'in'. :mshock:


Jude 1:14
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,

"with"

G1722
εν
en
en
A primary preposition denoting (fixed) position (in place, time or state), and (by implication) instrumentality (medially or constructively), that is, a relation of rest (intermediate between G1519 and G1537); "in", at, (up-) on, by, etc.: - about, after, against, + almost, X altogether, among, X as, at, before, between, (here-) by (+ all means), for (. . . sake of), + give self wholly to, (here-) in (-to, -wardly), X mightily, (because) of, (up-) on, [open-] ly, X outwardly, one, X quickly, X shortly, [speedi-] ly, X that, X there (-in, -on), through (-out), (un-) to(-ward), under, when, where (-with), while, with (-in). Often used in compounds, with substantially the same import; rarely with verbs of motion, and then not to indicate direction, except (elliptically) by a separate (and different) prep.

:cloud9: Yes, what a difference one word can make, eh? Sort of the like the thousands of saints, as in, the 144,000?

[jabcat]

There sure are a lot of interpretation on the 144,000.  Some claim they're only from the Jewish nation.   :dontknow:

That Greek word 'en' apparently has tranlsation options of in, amongst/among, or with;  from what I find the most literal translation appears to be with.  

Of course we can proclaim He's in, among, and with us now;  however, I believe even more so at His "glorious appearing".  :2c:

Exactly what that looks like, it will be glorious!   :gimmefive:

[jabcat]

We only use a little bit of it, and sometimes in my case it's painfully obvious.   :laugh2:

:cloud9: Have you ever thought about how carnal men talk about wanting to access more than the 10% of it? Look what a mess it's made of things already and they want MORE???  :help:

Hmmm...interesting point.  Maybe dim's not so bad after all.   :NewB1:

[Cardinal]

There sure are a lot of interpretation on the 144,000.  Some claim they're only from the Jewish nation.   :dontknow:

:cloud9: I like the one I heard.....men/spirit not defiled with women/soul = Jews. Blessings.....

[Nathan]

The beauty of all of this is that the blood of the Lamb is the only power-source that can reverse our whoring nature back into a virgin state.  We become the pure and spotless bride simply because he declares it over us.  That's just too awesome!

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: AMEN

[micah7:9]

So if He doesn't come back to earth in HIS glorified body, do you think we at some point go to Him?  Because IF (and I believe He does) exist in HIS OWN glorified body - and since you SAW Him Card - I believe at some point(s) we will see Him.  His glorified flesh with our (immortal) glorified eyes.  Because we (are and) will be His co-workers, His co-heirs, ruling and reigning WITH Him.  If our mortal is raised immortal (I Cor. 15) in a glorified body, why wouldn't we be able to see our elder Brother?  We will have new bodies;  will our elder Brother and Savior hide from us?   :OhNo:

I looked in Strongs and found no "glorified body" nor "glorified flesh(body)" I did not think there was. From my understanding God is Spirit (Jo. 4:24) and Joh 6:63  the spirit it is that is giving life; the flesh doth not profit anything; the sayings that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life;
I will say this, there is a great difference in Spirit, spiritual, and [spiritualizing] the first two are real and have substance, the later is the weakness and hunger of mans mind to see something, a proof of mans ignorance.

Job 19:26  And after my skin hath compassed this body , Then from my flesh I see God:
Job 19:27  Whom I--I see on my side, And mine eyes have beheld, and not a stranger, Consumed have been my reins in my bosom.
1Jn 3:2  beloved, now, children of God are we, and it was not yet manifested what we shall be, and we have known that if he may be manifested, like him we shall be, because we shall see him as he is;
Peace and Love Through Jesus

[jabcat]

I certainly could be missing something, but I personally wouldn't take Strong's as the definitive resource.  I think the term is more descriptive, than an actual phrase.  Sort of like Strong's wouldn't have Judas and the word suicide linked together, yet it appears that's likely what's described in the scriptures.

like him we shall be, because we shall see him as he is;

Amen.

"See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have," (Luke 24:39).

"But someone will say, "How are the dead raised?  And with what kind of body do they come?... 40 There are also heavenly bodies and earthly bodies, but the glory of the heavenly is one, and the glory of the earthly is another.   42 So also is the resurrection of the dead.  It is sown a perishable body, it is raised an imperishable body; 43 it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; 44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body.  If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.  45 So also it is written, "The first man, Adam, became a living soul."  The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

It is spirit because it is no longer earthly, not corruptible, not of dust.  "It [the body] is raised in glory".  Like I said, I may be missing something, but to my understanding that equals what's described as a "glorified body".  

Blessings, James.  

[jabcat]

I found an interesting site - perhaps a bit orthodox, not sure, but they talk about the resurrection, Jesus' resurrected body the disciples saw;  they also suggest Saul saw Jesus' (OK, I'll put it in quotes  :laughing7:) "glorified body" prior to his conversion;  i.e., the Light.  They also note his referring to Jesus by name differently prior to and after his conversion.  Some interesting thoughts.

It's here, and I thought the most interesting was about half-way down (if you want to scan real quick);  the headings were "The Form Is Different", "The Fashion Is That of Light", and The Figure of the New Body is the Lord's Glorified Body".  Might be worth a look.    

http://www.heavenpastpresentfuture.com/Chapter17.html

[Molly]

I found an interesting site - perhaps a bit orthodox, not sure, but they talk about the resurrection, Jesus' resurrected body the disciples saw;  they also suggest Saul saw Jesus' (OK, I'll put it in quotes  :laughing7:) "glorified body" prior to his conversion;  i.e., the Light.  They also note his referring to Jesus by name differently prior to and after his conversion.  Some interesting thoughts.

It's here, and I thought the most interesting was about half-way down (if you want to scan real quick);  the headings were "The Form Is Different", "The Fashion Is That of Light", and The Figure of the New Body is the Lord's Glorified Body".  Might be worth a look.    

http://www.heavenpastpresentfuture.com/Chapter17.html

Yes, Paul saw the resurrected Christ.  That's what blinded him.  It's the same resurrected body that was shown to the disciples at the transfiguration, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets--

His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light.
--Mat 17

It is the same body that Thomas and the disciples saw in the upper room which Jesus called, 'flesh and bone,' [as opposed to 'flesh and blood'].

It is the body vivified by the life giving Spirit, which the believers know and share among the body as the blood of Christ.

... the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

--1 Cor 15


Revelation 1:5
And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

6And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

[jabcat]

Love it!  Molly's mining gold.

[Lefein]

This thought came to me when I was praying about the issue of glorified bodies, existence, and what not:

Light does not abandon its colour, hue, and shade after striving to become a more excellent, and glorified form of electromagnetic wave.  Its colour, hue, and shade in fact shine more brightly, and vibrant, and more beautifully real than before because it has become a more excellent, and glorified form of electromagnetic wave.  

We don't abandon our being, and individual design because of glorification - we become beautified perfected forms of who we are - Deity indwelt, and divine indwelling; Human!

The physical manifestation of the concept of light, whose being is electromagnetism, is visible colour, and energy.  

The physical manifestation of a man whose being is a Spirit, is a visible body.

The physical manifesation of God, whose being is Spirit-Love-Truth-Life-Perfect, is his glory, and excellence both invisible, and visible.

The physical manifestation of a man whose being is a God-indwelt Spirit must therefore be a visible body filled with God's Love, Truth, Life, Perfection, Glory, and Excellence both invisible, and visible.