The GIANTS

[Molly]

:cloud9: I guess I should have added a "disclaimer" to my post, that while I see it the way I said it, I also see it as ONE LEVEL of truth, because I also see it in relation to angels, too...... :2c:

Yes, the Bible is like an onion, isn't it?  There is layer after layer and connections from one end of it to the other that speak to us on multiple levels.  But, first, there is the natural, the literal word of God.

BTW, I don't believe Heiser says the sons of God in Gen 6:2 are angels.  I think they are higher celestial beings than what we normally think of as angels [although there might also be 'fallen angels' who follow them].  They are referenced in this passage:


12For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

--Eph 6

[Molly]

I have seen some reports where they say, they have found giant skeletons and a giant battle axe was reportedly found.

I often wonder what news the authorities don't let us see, but if these skeletons were true, why would goverments supress this truth, what would they have to gain?

:cloud9: I'm not so sure it's necessarily the government's motives, but the motives of the "scientific community", some of which would suppress anything to disprove the Bible in general and creationism in particular. See Molly's post this week under the thread "Welcome to 1984"......

Just my opinion, :2c: but it's that 'science' as we know it today belongs to the ancient mystery religions coming out of Babylon, and in the true tradition of gnosticism, they only let the initiates know what they know, and only those at the very top know everything they know.  Those on the outside are told something else and basically know nothing.

So, for instance,  when it comes to something like how did those primitive people ever build the pyramids?  The answer is dunno, it's a mystery. :dontknow:

[Molly]

Magic or Mainstream Science?
An interview on Newton's alchemy with historian Bill Newman   

   
Newton's Dark Secrets

A Legitimate Pursuit
NOVA: Why are people surprised when they hear that Isaac Newton—the grand patriarch of physics—was an alchemist?

NEWMAN: Well, I think it's because alchemy has been portrayed as the epitome of irrationality and a sort of avaricious folly.


NOVA: Sinister, dark-robed sorcerers trying to turn lead into gold. Is that an accurate picture of alchemists in Newton's time?

NEWMAN: It's accurate for some alchemists. But we now know that most of the great minds of the period were involved in alchemy, including Robert Boyle, John Locke, Leibniz, any number of others.

NOVA: Given that so many great minds were interested in it, why was alchemy illegal?

NEWMAN: Well, first of all, it became legal during Newton's time. But why was it illegal? There's a long association, for good reasons, between alchemy and counterfeiting. It's quite likely, actually, that medieval and early modern rulers were consciously employing alchemists to debase their own coinage.

NOVA: But they didn't want other people doing it?

NEWMAN: [laughter] Yeah, right; exactly, exactly.


"He really thought that alchemy provided a sort of limitless power over nature."



NOVA: So what were these "legitimate" alchemists in the 17th century trying to do?

NEWMAN: Alchemy really encompassed all chemical technology—everything ranging from the manufacture of pigments for paint to making artificial precious stones. It included the manufacture of so-called "chemical medicines." And, of course, it also included the attempt to make the "philosophers' stone."

NOVA: Tell me about the philosophers' stone. I think of it vaguely as some magical substance that could turn ordinary metals into gold.

NEWMAN: The philosophers' stone was thought to be an agent of universal transmutation. It also was viewed as a curative agent that could "cure" metals of their impurities and cure human beings of their illnesses. So it was a sort of universal panacea.

NOVA: Was Newton an alchemist because he wanted to make gold or find the key to immortality? Or was his alchemy just another part of his science—a way to gain knowledge about the material world?

NEWMAN: If you look at the experimental notebooks that he kept for about 30 years, it really is impossible to avoid the conclusion that he was trying to produce the philosophers' stone. But I don't think he was doing it to gain monetary wealth.

NOVA: Was it to gain an understanding of nature?

NEWMAN: And power over nature. Power over nature has always been a key element to alchemy.

Codes and Riddles

NOVA: Did alchemists think that they were going to discover powers they wanted to keep for themselves? Is that why alchemy is so veiled in secret codes?

NEWMAN: That's certainly part of the reason. You find alchemical treatises that claim that knowledge of the philosophers' stone has to be kept secret, because if it gets out to the world that a particular alchemist has it, he'll be strangled in his bed to extract the secret.

NOVA: It seems that Newton also wanted to hold tight to his secrets—he never published any of his alchemical work.

NEWMAN: I think that, like other alchemists, he thought that alchemy promised tremendous control over the natural world. It would allow you to transmute virtually anything into anything else, not just lead into gold. There are other things, too, that probably were in Newton's mind. For example, alchemists realized that if the philosophers' stone were real and it got out to the public, it would ruin the gold standard. [laughter]


"Alchemy was the ultimate riddle [which] provided a challenge to him that he just couldn't resist."



NOVA: I think what makes a lot of people think of alchemy as black magic is this bizarre language—phrases like "the Green Dragon" or the "menstrual blood of the sordid whore."

NEWMAN: Yes.

NOVA: It's mind-boggling to think of Newton writing those phrases.

NEWMAN: Well, this was the enigmatic language of alchemy. I mean "enigmatic" in a quite strict sense: it was a riddling language. The best way to look at these metaphors is in the light of riddles. So the "menstrual blood of the sordid whore" is decipherable. It means simply the metalline form of antimony. That is the "menstrual blood" that's extracted from the "sordid whore," which is the ore of antimony. [See more of Newton's alchemy decoded in our interactive manuscript.]

NOVA: It's a coded language.

NEWMAN: It is a code, and it's clear that the alchemists delighted in this code. It's almost a form of poetry. In fact, lots of alchemists wrote in the form of poetry, quite literally.

NOVA: Did all alchemists share the same code, use the same terminology?

NEWMAN: They shared lots of common elements, but it did vary from alchemist to alchemist. It's extremely tricky for Newton. He was reading alchemists over a period of time, ranging over perhaps a thousand years, and there was a lot of development in these treatises. But Newton generally thinks they're all saying the same thing, so that's a problem.

NOVA: Why did Newton spend so much time copying the writing of other alchemists?

NEWMAN: He wasn't for the most part just copying verbatim. What he was doing in many cases was weaving together extracts from different authors, trying to make sense out of them. I think alchemy was the ultimate riddle. Newton delighted in riddles, and this provided a challenge to him that he just couldn't resist.

Revealed Wisdom For a Chosen Few

NOVA: Why did Newton think that Greek myths somehow encoded alchemical recipes and a path to the philosophers' stone?

NEWMAN: That theory had been in existence for quite a long time. Newton's major source in alchemy, George Starkey, shared this theory. Michael Maier is a famous writer of the early 17th century who tried to decipher as much Greek mythology as he could get his hands on. So it was a common belief.

NOVA: Was it part of a broader belief in some sort of "revealed wisdom" about the natural world?

NEWMAN: Oh, yes. There's a tradition of scholarship that was very popular in the Renaissance called the prisca sapientia, the primal wisdom. It claimed that there was a secret wisdom that was first transmitted by an archetypical figure—say, for example, Moses—and then passed down through a line of successors, usually including Pythagoras, Plato, and so forth, and that this wisdom was really the ultimate tool for understanding the universe. Newton clearly believed that.

NOVA: Did Newton view himself as one of these chosen few, one of the people ordained to receive this wisdom?

NEWMAN: I suspect he did, yes. I don't think he would have admitted it publicly, but one of his pastimes was concocting alchemical pseudonyms for himself. And one of these pseudonyms was Jehovah Sanctus Unus—that is, Jehovah, the Holy One.

NOVA: That's how Newton described himself?!

NEWMAN: Yes!


http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/newton/alch-newman.html

[Cardinal]

 :cloud9: He also studied and found evidence of, the ELS bible codes in the text of the Torah, no small feat without benefit of computers, considering the distance of some of the skips.

[micah7:9]

Giants are big  and large.

[WhiteWings]

Giants are big  and large.

Can't giant refer to fame, skills or intelligence?
For example the giants of chess are the top five chess players.
???

Here is a small therad about giants: http://www.tentmaker.org/forum/members_lounge/giants_or_men_3678.msg39314.html#msg39314

[Molly]

Giants are big  and large.

(Only Og king of Bashan was left of the remnant of the Rephaites. His bed was made of iron and was more than thirteen feet long and six feet wide. It is still in Rabbah of the Ammonites.)

--Deut 3:11

[micah7:9]

Giants are big  and large.

Can't giant refer to fame, skills or intelligence?
For example the giants of chess are the top five chess players.
???

Here is a small therad about giants: http://www.tentmaker.org/forum/members_lounge/giants_or_men_3678.msg39314.html#msg39314

Yes. I believe so