Author Topic: Women speaking in church  (Read 3244 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Cardinal

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 8437
  • Gender: Female
Re: Women speaking in church
« Reply #25 on: November 12, 2009, 04:31:34 AM »
 :cloud9: I know the feeling.......
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

coldwar

  • Guest
Re: Women speaking in church
« Reply #26 on: April 21, 2010, 10:22:46 PM »


Spiritually speaking, the woman is as the soul of man, and "she" should never speak in place of the Spirit-man speaking. Blessings....

I'm glad I found this again- I happened upon it last week when I first joined here and "poking about". So, Cardinal, I see you're a woman... and you put forth this statement that "the woman is as the soul of man". Someone else said "the soul should not lead the spirit".

I just feel this is correct, but it's a very "hard sell". We are so confused in modern times about gender roles and gender differences- perhaps there has never really been a time when there hasn't been confusion about this to one extreme or the other.

So, if I were to make a statement that "men and women operate from different perspectives and are fundamentally concerned about different things", Cardinal, would you be OK with that? Because I cannot find a woman anywhere who would agree. Instead, women generally believe "we are all born with clean slates and any perceived differences, besides the obvious physical ones, are purely from societal conditioning".

Is this fundamental "soul vs spirit" difference between the sexes truly what was behind God's prescribed order of things in the Old Testament, and was Paul carrying this over to the Church dispensation out of ignorance, as a Jew, or out of inspiration? Is it possible for women to "operate as men" in the Church? I remember reading one of the Psuedo-Gospels (Gospel of Thomas perhaps?) where Jesus was dealing with his disciples over his allowance of Mary Magdalene joining them, seemingly as an equal, and Jesus saying something like "she has become like a man". I'll try and find that again and re-post. The whole thing is rather interesting for discussion, but like I said before, it's difficult to find anybody willing to discuss it.

Dave

coldwar

  • Guest
Re: Women speaking in church
« Reply #27 on: April 21, 2010, 10:39:56 PM »
Yes- here it is:

Gospel of Thomas Collection-

114. Simon Peter said to them, "Make Mary leave us, for females don't deserve life."

Jesus said, "Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of Heaven."

SQ

  • Guest
Re: Women speaking in church
« Reply #28 on: April 21, 2010, 10:49:32 PM »
I haven't saw Cardinal here in a long while, I sure miss her.

Offline Cardinal

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 8437
  • Gender: Female
Re: Women speaking in church
« Reply #29 on: April 23, 2010, 03:12:18 AM »
 :cloud9: Thanks SQ.....I've missed all of you on here, too! Finally got computer fixed, PTL!

Anyway; Dave, the only "woman" that is supposed to be expressing herself is the soul of HIM, which is the attributes of His nature or character, as it is moved by the works of the Holy Ghost, His Spirit, thru the gifts of the Spirit. One is the nature, one is the works.

The two together are to function as ONE, IN the believer, and it doesn't matter whether it's a male or female after the flesh for this to happen, which is why it says there is now neither male nor female IN, Christ (Spirit) Jesus (soul).

Jesus was one who possessed His female (soul under subjection to the Spirit), and thus could display the nature of Father and Mother;
which is why it says a man must leave Father and Mother and cleave unto his wife. He left Father and Mother and did cleave unto His wife (they are one BODY). Blessings....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Beloved Servant

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 4290
  • David's sling
Re: Women speaking in church
« Reply #30 on: April 23, 2010, 04:56:57 AM »
"herself is the soul (female) of HIM, which is the attributes of His nature or character, as it is moved by the works of the (male) Holy Ghost"

That's what I meant Card.
In another thread I expounded it further.
No male, female.
Just unity in Christ.

No more duality He never had a rib removed.

The complete and perfect man.

Offline Molly

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 11315
Re: Women speaking in church
« Reply #31 on: April 23, 2010, 04:46:21 PM »
Quote from: Cardinal
Jesus was one who possessed His female (soul under subjection to the Spirit), and thus could display the nature of Father and Mother

which is why it says there is now neither male nor female IN, Christ (Spirit) Jesus (soul).


Cardinal!  WB!   :bgdance:


Thanks for that.  It explains to me why the Hebrew name for our Lord is the feminine form of the word for salvation.



"salvation"
H3444
ישׁוּעה
y'shû‛âh
yesh-oo'-aw
Feminine passive participle
of H3467; something saved, that is, (abstractly) deliverance; hence aid, victory, prosperity: - deliverance, health, help (-ing), salvation, save, saving (health), welfare.




H3467
ישׁע
yâsha‛
yaw-shah'
A primitive root; properly to be open, wide or free, that is, (by implication) to be safe; causatively to free or succor: -  X at all, avenging, defend, deliver (-er), help, preserve, rescue, be safe, bring (having) salvation, save (-iour), get victory.

Offline Cardinal

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 8437
  • Gender: Female
Re: Women speaking in church
« Reply #32 on: April 23, 2010, 05:10:11 PM »
 :cloud9: Thanks Molly! It has been a rough walk lately.....

And yes it does; and when He sat weeping over Jerusalem, it was as El Shaddai, the "many breasted" One, ie. the "hen" with her chicks. He manifested different aspects of the Godhead because He had the Spirit without measure. Blessings....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Online WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 13182
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Women speaking in church
« Reply #33 on: August 11, 2011, 12:20:55 PM »
Better a late reply than no reply at all  :winkgrin:

http://www.messengers-of-messiah.org/NewPDF/CMWomen2010WebsiteEd.pdf
Leadership: Page 47-60  ==> Many female leaders
Submission: Page 35-39 ==> A husband rules over his wife in a sense of providing food and protection. Also that leadership has to be earned by "Biblically correct behaviour". Being a man on itself is not a basis for rulership. And all of that is based on equallity. The man doesn't submit. The wife submits herself after she aproved his ways.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...