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Christian Life / Re: Path of Truth
« Last post by Tom on Today at 05:52:40 PM »
It's an interesting site by Paul Cohen and Victor Hafichuk , who denounce ET and ED as well as many other doctrines while stating that God will save everyone, but the site also says that Christian Universalism, more specifically the articles we find here at tentmaker or at bible-truths, is also wrong because it claims that Christ has done all the work and we do not have to do anything, so to then the "false" Universalism is not Salvation.

They also complain that they were "kicked out of the Tent"

Thoughts?  :dontknow:

I don't know anything about these folks, but I think they're wrong if they say Christ's sacrifice wasn't enough.

"For in grace, through faith, are you saved, and this is not out of you; it is God's approach present, not of works, lest anyone should be boasting." (Ephesians 2:8,9)
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Welcome Central - **FIRST POST MUST BE MADE HERE / Re: Hi There :-)
« Last post by Tom on Today at 05:48:07 PM »
Right, "ecclesia" is literally "out-called," and it usually refers to those of us called out of the world to be the "body of Christ." Acts 19:32 just shows how the word was used for a secular purpose.

Ronny to Tom:
Another interesting part of this to me,is not only are we the ecclesia/church,the called out ones;but in the scripture,we are also described as the body of Jesus Christ,the temple of God. And if and when I choose to listen to them on TV,I can hear a number of preachers, preaching about what they believe will be a future,rebuilt Jewish temple.  But at this moment,I can't remember hearing these same preachers,talk about the temple that is in the here and now. That is,the temple in this age,that is made up of all,who have been born of God. I wonder,why I so seldom hear any preacher,preach on and talk about that?


Tom to Ronny:
I don't watch TV at all because it's boring to me. So I don't watch TV preachers. I prefer to read scripture and communicate on this forum. I think the ecclesia, the body of Christ, is distinct from the church those preachers are leading, and that's why you don't hear the same thing you'll get from an accurate translation of scripture.

Tom to Ronny:
I think you're right that the ecclesia/church/body of Jesus Christ is a different thing from the denominational type preachers and churches I was speaking about. Though of course, there are people in those who are also members of the ecclesia/church/body/temple of Jesus Christ.  Put there by God and not by themself or by any denominational type preacher.

And in the past,all that I had was the scripture as translated by various people and some deniminational type  preachers on TV. And some of those God has used to bless me, even though I knew they were wrong on somethings. Well,even when both they and I didn't rightly understand somethings,God still used one denominational type TV preacher,to free me from "worship" of preachers and denominational teaching.

The one thing that really bothers me about any denominational preacher,that I might see and sometimes watch on TV,is that all of them believe and teach that a lost person must in some way save themself. That,by their supposed "free will." Too,though some will seldom if ever mention such,in the background of their teaching,there is always the denominational type teaching if threatening the lost person with a Jesus Christ created hell of eternal punishment. I know that's wrong now and I hate to see that false threat used in any way. But,I think I need to keep in mind,that at least some who believe this and are wrong about it,at least some of them sincerely believe what they are saying. And at least that's better than the ones who simply teach/preach such to try and control some people and get money out of them.

That's the problem with church doctrine. You have to save yourself from eternal punishment in an pagan hell of torture in fire forever. Scripture says we're chosen before the disruption of the world, and it's in grace through faith that we're saved, not of works.

"He chooses us in Him before the disruption of the world" (Ephesians 1:4)

"For in grace, through faith, are you saved, and this is not out of you; it is God's approach present, not of works, lest anyone should be boasting." (Ephesians 2:8,9)
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Welcome Central - **FIRST POST MUST BE MADE HERE / Re: Hi There :-)
« Last post by RonnyTX on Today at 05:08:56 PM »
Right, "ecclesia" is literally "out-called," and it usually refers to those of us called out of the world to be the "body of Christ." Acts 19:32 just shows how the word was used for a secular purpose.

Ronny to Tom:
Another interesting part of this to me,is not only are we the ecclesia/church,the called out ones;but in the scripture,we are also described as the body of Jesus Christ,the temple of God. And if and when I choose to listen to them on TV,I can hear a number of preachers, preaching about what they believe will be a future,rebuilt Jewish temple.  But at this moment,I can't remember hearing these same preachers,talk about the temple that is in the here and now. That is,the temple in this age,that is made up of all,who have been born of God. I wonder,why I so seldom hear any preacher,preach on and talk about that?


Tom to Ronny:
I don't watch TV at all because it's boring to me. So I don't watch TV preachers. I prefer to read scripture and communicate on this forum. I think the ecclesia, the body of Christ, is distinct from the church those preachers are leading, and that's why you don't hear the same thing you'll get from an accurate translation of scripture.

Tom to Ronny:
I think you're right that the ecclesia/church/body of Jesus Christ is a different thing from the denominational type preachers and churches I was speaking about. Though of course, there are people in those who are also members of the ecclesia/church/body/temple of Jesus Christ.  Put there by God and not by themself or by any denominational type preacher.

And in the past,all that I had was the scripture as translated by various people and some deniminational type  preachers on TV. And some of those God has used to bless me, even though I knew they were wrong on somethings. Well,even when both they and I didn't rightly understand somethings,God still used one denominational type TV preacher,to free me from "worship" of preachers and denominational teaching.

The one thing that really bothers me about any denominational preacher,that I might see and sometimes watch on TV,is that all of them believe and teach that a lost person must in some way save themself. That,by their supposed "free will." Too,though some will seldom if ever mention such,in the background of their teaching,there is always the denominational type teaching if threatening the lost person with a Jesus Christ created hell of eternal punishment. I know that's wrong now and I hate to see that false threat used in any way. But,I think I need to keep in mind,that at least some who believe this and are wrong about it,at least some of them sincerely believe what they are saying. And at least that's better than the ones who simply teach/preach such to try and control some people and get money out of them.
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Christian Life / Re: Path of Truth
« Last post by rosered on Today at 05:00:08 PM »
It's an interesting site by Paul Cohen and Victor Hafichuk , who denounce ET and ED as well as many other doctrines while stating that God will save everyone, but the site also says that Christian Universalism, more specifically the articles we find here at tentmaker or at bible-truths, is also wrong because it claims that Christ has done all the work and we do not have to do anything, so to then the "false" Universalism is not Salvation.

They also complain that they were "kicked out of the Tent"

Thoughts?  :dontknow:
Hi  bro ed ...
   we be willing to have the Lord do His works  though us  as Jesus proved it   by living it ...being the son of man    and the son of God
 
   What   about  without me you can do nothing ? John 15

 and every  good gift and perfect gift comes down from the Father of Lights   ?    James 1

 anything anyone has is in Gods hand /power   and His good pleasure
 
 I  do not know  about them being removed from the Tent   not my call
 
  :Peace2: 
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Christian Life / Path of Truth
« Last post by Eduard on Today at 04:41:09 PM »
It's an interesting site by Paul Cohen and Victor Hafichuk , who denounce ET and ED as well as many other doctrines while stating that God will save everyone, but the site also says that Christian Universalism, more specifically the articles we find here at tentmaker or at bible-truths, is also wrong because it claims that Christ has done all the work and we do not have to do anything, so to then the "false" Universalism is not Salvation.

They also complain that they were "kicked out of the Tent"

Thoughts?  :dontknow:
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FAQs Regarding UR / Re: I am not UR
« Last post by Seth on Today at 03:41:56 AM »
Brother, I think you are assuming that it is the universal salvation believers as the ones who do not want fellowship or are the ones judging. You don't have to do much more than affirm the teaching of universal salvation and it will be YOU being judged, not them.  You can do it in the nicest most respectful way possible, but it's not the attitude that offends them. The doctrine is what offends them. Anyone who has any doubt about that, try it.

With all due respect, Seth

You're preaching to the choir

I have fessed up that I was long gone from the church, so in that I must insert that part of that was for the same reasons you state; thus, I have tried it.
Having said that, I must say that part of the blame -per say- falls on me, for not having the desired love and faith, and simply wishing to convert others to my understanding.

That's good that you have that level of self awareness to understand what you could have changed. But even if you had the love and faith, i don't think it matters as to the end result. Personal opinion of course.

The only universal salvation believers who can attend church in peaceful fellowship are the silent ones, at least silent on that matter.
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FAQs Regarding UR / Re: I am not UR
« Last post by Tom on Today at 03:37:21 AM »
Quote
...and I feel like I'm fellowshiping with folks here when I'm on the forum. I think anybody who has witnessed the various disagreements among folks here would realize there aren't any "set guidelines" here other than what scripture says.

"For the entire law is fulfilled in one word, in this: "You shall love your associate as yourself."" (Galatians 5:14)

When an occasion happens spontaneously with other people in the flesh that presents an opportunity for fellowship or evangelizing, I go for it, but it's not something I actively seek anymore. I think the Lord provides the time and place when it's necessary, and we just have to know the truth to be ready to offer a rational defense of the faith. I'm definitely not into any "denomination" or "guidelines"...

Tom, I hear you, and I'm right there with you., A myriad times I can relate after the fact as to how the Lord used me to witness to others, but that does not absolve me from witnessing before the congregation

It is those that know one best, who can testify about one's faith, whether we are truly or not., and if our faith is to be a testimony for Christ, then surely we are to be present, not only when opportunity presents itself, but so too at every moment standing shoulder with every member of the body

I am but a slave in faith of the Lord Christ my God, and as such, I must never neglect the sheep, for I am one of them, and to think otherwise I would set myself apart from the congregation of Saints

thus i implore all of us to continue in being witness to Christ, both on-line as well as in true presence

I'm glad to speak the truth "in true presence" as you say, but it's not necessary to do that in a church. In fact, I think communication, especially of a spiritual nature, is most effective on a personal level. Even the hierarchal set up of the church with one man dictating doctrine to the congregation discourages good communication like you can have one on one or in a small circle of acquaintances.
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FAQs Regarding UR / Re: I am not UR
« Last post by RaiderGonzo on Today at 03:30:58 AM »
Brother, I think you are assuming that it is the universal salvation believers as the ones who do not want fellowship or are the ones judging. You don't have to do much more than affirm the teaching of universal salvation and it will be YOU being judged, not them.  You can do it in the nicest most respectful way possible, but it's not the attitude that offends them. The doctrine is what offends them. Anyone who has any doubt about that, try it.

With all due respect, Seth

You're preaching to the choir

I have fessed up that I was long gone from the church, so in that I must insert that part of that was for the same reasons you state; thus, I have tried it.
Having said that, I must say that part of the blame -per say- falls on me, for not having the desired love and faith, and simply wishing to convert others to my understanding.
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FAQs Regarding UR / Re: I am not UR
« Last post by Seth on Today at 03:11:59 AM »
Brother, I think you are assuming that it is the universal salvation believers as the ones who do not want fellowship or are the ones judging. You don't have to do much more than affirm the teaching of universal salvation and it will be YOU being judged, not them.  You can do it in the nicest most respectful way possible, but it's not the attitude that offends them. The doctrine is what offends them. Anyone who has any doubt about that, try it.
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FAQs Regarding UR / Re: I am not UR
« Last post by RaiderGonzo on Today at 03:07:53 AM »
My brother Seth, I believe you., I know that such conflict happens in the congregation, but I'm here to tell you that it is not all as it seems to be. When you're a part of the congregation and they know you, who you are, where you come from, and what you are like, then it is not as if you're a walk-in and they know nothing about you and you command no respect., I say this because I love my brethren, and keep them tight to my heart, and while they may not see or understand as I do, neither do I judge them nor I cast them aside in my understanding of things., to love our brothers and sisters is a commandment., it is not optional as to whether they agree with us or not, but it is a trial that one must endure, and it is a duty for one to witness., you don't have to compromise; you just have to have Christ in your intent, and with Him in you, you will be whole; thus others will see that in you, and they too will believe the truth
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