Author Topic: When do we people go to the afterlife  (Read 8754 times)

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Offline Cardinal

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #50 on: April 09, 2009, 08:42:51 PM »
 :cloud9: You don't know how happy that makes me that someone "heard" that.  :girlheart: Blessings....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Zero7

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #51 on: April 09, 2009, 08:45:21 PM »
Cardinal, can you expand on this part?

 
Quote
...But I descended with Him into it, was aware of that person's thoughts of their heart thru His Spirit and also what had them bound as HE delivered them up out of it.

You experienced/became aware of his deliverance?


Offline sven

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #52 on: April 09, 2009, 08:57:04 PM »
@ Cardinal what you wrote reminds me very much on the Jewish view of Ge'Hinnom, punishment lasts up to 12 months, and every sin creates a demon that you meet in Ge'Hinnom, I think later Sheol and Ge'Hinnom became synonyms in Judaism

I think the Jews remember the dead for 11 months, cause only the most evil stay in Ge'Hinnom for the entire 12 months, but thats also an afterbiblical view.

Quote
Sheol is the O.T. place I earlier couldn't think of...this from Wikapedia;  "The phrase "Bosom of Abraham" refers to the place of comfort in sheol (Greek: hades) ... dead were gathered into a general tarrying-place, the sheol of the Old Testament .... the good, the wicked awaiting judgment at the resurrection..."

this is an afterbiblical view, there is no hint to such thing in the entire Old Testament
« Last Edit: April 09, 2009, 09:01:28 PM by sven »

Offline Cardinal

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #53 on: April 09, 2009, 09:04:40 PM »
Cardinal, can you expand on this part?

 
Quote
...But I descended with Him into it, was aware of that person's thoughts of their heart thru His Spirit and also what had them bound as HE delivered them up out of it.

You experienced/became aware of his deliverance?

 :cloud9: He took my spirit as one with His Spirit, because the thoughts of the heart (soul) are made manifest to HIM, so as one with His Spirit for that short time, so too did I "know" the thoughts of their heart. The things holding them were named, repentance came, and they were set free to ascend/resurrect up out of the old man of the flesh (He called the Pharisees sepulchers for a reason) .

Flesh to God does not just mean natural flesh like you can touch with your hands, but flesh is that which is "created" (pride of life/that which defines us apart from Christ/pride goeth before a FALL) out the union of the body (lust of the flesh) with the carnal beastly mind (lust of the eyes). Blessings...
« Last Edit: April 09, 2009, 09:13:48 PM by Cardinal »
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Cardinal

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #54 on: April 09, 2009, 09:07:38 PM »
@ Cardinal what you wrote reminds me very much on the Jewish view of Ge'Hinnom, punishment lasts up to 12 months, and every sin creates a demon that you meet in Ge'Hinnom, I think later Sheol and Ge'Hinnom became synonyms in Judaism

I think the Jews remember the dead for 11 months, cause only the most evil stay in Ge'Hinnom for the entire 12 months, but thats also an afterbiblical view.

Quote
Sheol is the O.T. place I earlier couldn't think of...this from Wikapedia;  "The phrase "Bosom of Abraham" refers to the place of comfort in sheol (Greek: hades) ... dead were gathered into a general tarrying-place, the sheol of the Old Testament .... the good, the wicked awaiting judgment at the resurrection..."

this is an afterbiblical view, there is no hint to such thing in the entire Old Testament

 :cloud9: Well, I didn't get it from the Jews, I was surprised to find out they even believed such a thing. I got from THE "Jew", our Jewish carpenter.  :bigGrin:

And yes, there are things about it in the OTand NT, they are just not understood and/or hidden in plain sight. Blessings....
« Last Edit: April 09, 2009, 09:31:23 PM by Cardinal »
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline jabcat

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #55 on: April 09, 2009, 09:28:52 PM »

Quote
Sheol is the O.T. place I earlier couldn't think of...this from Wikapedia;  "The phrase "Bosom of Abraham" refers to the place of comfort in sheol (Greek: hades) ... dead were gathered into a general tarrying-place, the sheol of the Old Testament .... the good, the wicked awaiting judgment at the resurrection..."

this is an afterbiblical view, there is no hint to such thing in the entire Old Testament

 And yes, there are things about it in the NT, they are just not understood and/or hidden in plain sight. Blessings....

Sven, I don't know, I don't have the complete knowledge and understanding of the whole OT...you may be right  :dontknow:
« Last Edit: April 09, 2009, 09:31:47 PM by jabcat »
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline Cardinal

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #56 on: April 09, 2009, 09:32:34 PM »
 :cloud9: Neither do I, but I'm learning.  :bigGrin:
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline WhiteWings

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #57 on: April 09, 2009, 09:35:56 PM »
:cloud9: Well, I don't agree that we "sleep" until the resurrection, so I guess I differ from the "official" version. I know there is a purgatory type of existence wherein the soul is separated at death from the spirit of man. The Spirit returns to the One that sent it, but the soul stays trapped temporarily in whatever it did not overcome thru the Spirit of Christ while still in the body. This is why David said, "Thou wilt not suffer my SOUL to be in Sheol (separated from God/Spirit)."


"The dead know nothing."
We don't sleep. -> know something
Spirit is in heaven. -> know something
Soul is in purgatory. -> know something

That just doesn't add up.
Please explain s-l-o-w-l-y :laughing7:
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline jabcat

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #58 on: April 09, 2009, 09:36:17 PM »
:cloud9: Neither do I, but I'm learning.  :bigGrin:

You are!  I'm saying there's a whole lot there, to know for sure something's NOT there  :happygrin:.

I like your New Testament statement...things hidden in plain sight..isn't that the truth?
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline Zero7

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #59 on: April 09, 2009, 09:47:02 PM »
:cloud9: Well, I don't agree that we "sleep" until the resurrection, so I guess I differ from the "official" version. I know there is a purgatory type of existence wherein the soul is separated at death from the spirit of man. The Spirit returns to the One that sent it, but the soul stays trapped temporarily in whatever it did not overcome thru the Spirit of Christ while still in the body. This is why David said, "Thou wilt not suffer my SOUL to be in Sheol (separated from God/Spirit)."


"The dead know nothing."
We don't sleep. -> know something
Spirit is in heaven. -> know something
Soul is in purgatory. -> know something

That just doesn't add up.
Please explain s-l-o-w-l-y :laughing7:


I don't believe in soul sleep. God puts us on ice for awile?
If it is true, well, what happens now when we sleep? We dream. So maybe that is a clue, I don't know.
But that doesnt explain "the dead know nothing"

Offline Cardinal

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #60 on: April 09, 2009, 09:53:43 PM »
:cloud9: Well, I don't agree that we "sleep" until the resurrection, so I guess I differ from the "official" version. I know there is a purgatory type of existence wherein the soul is separated at death from the spirit of man. The Spirit returns to the One that sent it, but the soul stays trapped temporarily in whatever it did not overcome thru the Spirit of Christ while still in the body. This is why David said, "Thou wilt not suffer my SOUL to be in Sheol (separated from God/Spirit)."


"The dead know nothing."
We don't sleep. -> know something
Spirit is in heaven. -> know something
Soul is in purgatory. -> know something

That just doesn't add up.
Please explain s-l-o-w-l-y :laughing7:

 :cloud9: There again, it's our understanding that needs adjusting, which is why we can't look at the surface of scriptures only. The dead know nothing, does not mean what it sounds like to our western mindset.

Death, is the separation of the soul from the spirit. We're so focused on what we can perceive with our senses, we think of it as only the spirit separating from the body, but we are a triune being.

Sheol, IS separation from God's Spirit; our spirit is what is NEVER separated from His Spirit, that's why it returns to the One who sent it, ie. nothing can separate us from His love. Our spirit is like a little flame that came off a huge fire, our God is like a consuming fire.

The soul is the mind, will, emotions and desires. The carnal mind is His enemy, it's enmity against God. Therefore, since the spirit of man is what is in communion with the Spirit of God, because the separation known as death has occurred, for this reason, the "dead" know "nothing", ie. except the things which are of them/their own minds, not the things which be of the Spirit. Our wisdom is sensual, from below, and in comparison to God's is as "nothing". Blessings....
« Last Edit: April 09, 2009, 10:08:18 PM by Cardinal »
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Doc

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #61 on: April 09, 2009, 11:31:47 PM »
:cloud9: Well, I don't agree that we "sleep" until the resurrection, so I guess I differ from the "official" version. I know there is a purgatory type of existence wherein the soul is separated at death from the spirit of man. The Spirit returns to the One that sent it, but the soul stays trapped temporarily in whatever it did not overcome thru the Spirit of Christ while still in the body. This is why David said, "Thou wilt not suffer my SOUL to be in Sheol (separated from God/Spirit)."


"The dead know nothing."
We don't sleep. -> know something
Spirit is in heaven. -> know something
Soul is in purgatory. -> know something

That just doesn't add up.
Please explain s-l-o-w-l-y :laughing7:

 :cloud9: There again, it's our understanding that needs adjusting, which is why we can't look at the surface of scriptures only. The dead know nothing, does not mean what it sounds like to our western mindset.

Death, is the separation of the soul from the spirit. We're so focused on what we can perceive with our senses, we think of it as only the spirit separating from the body, but we are a triune being.

Sheol, IS separation from God's Spirit; our spirit is what is NEVER separated from His Spirit, that's why it returns to the One who sent it, ie. nothing can separate us from His love. Our spirit is like a little flame that came off a huge fire, our God is like a consuming fire.

The soul is the mind, will, emotions and desires. The carnal mind is His enemy, it's enmity against God. Therefore, since the spirit of man is what is in communion with the Spirit of God, because the separation known as death has occurred, for this reason, the "dead" know "nothing", ie. except the things which are of them/their own minds, not the things which be of the Spirit. Our wisdom is sensual, from below, and in comparison to God's is as "nothing". Blessings....

So, I want to understand something... Is our spirit not conscious? In other words, is it only the soul of man that has conscousness?
God does not instruct us to pray to change His mind. He wants us to pray so that we'll know His mind.
 
"Prayer doesn't change God, it changes me." --C.S. Lewis

God never had or needed a Plan B. He's still on Plan A.

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Offline Molly

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #62 on: April 09, 2009, 11:34:52 PM »
:cloud9: Well, I don't agree that we "sleep" until the resurrection, so I guess I differ from the "official" version. I know there is a purgatory type of existence wherein the soul is separated at death from the spirit of man. The Spirit returns to the One that sent it, but the soul stays trapped temporarily in whatever it did not overcome thru the Spirit of Christ while still in the body. This is why David said, "Thou wilt not suffer my SOUL to be in Sheol (separated from God/Spirit)."


"The dead know nothing."
We don't sleep. -> know something
Spirit is in heaven. -> know something
Soul is in purgatory. -> know something

That just doesn't add up.
Please explain s-l-o-w-l-y :laughing7:

Don't forget there are also the living dead, as Jesus informed us when he said to let the dead bury their dead.

Offline Cardinal

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #63 on: April 10, 2009, 12:40:59 AM »
 :cloud9: Exactly, Molly, good point.  :thumbsup:

Doc; No, they both have a type of "consciousness". The spirit of God that is in us is inspiration, ie. breath that quickens. Quicken means to speed up or give life, but the life that God gives is not just the breath that enlivens the soul (even as the breath of animals/beastly carnal nature), but life that brings understanding, or "knowing".

Our soul is what makes us, us. He consumes it as we offer it on the altar; that's how we're changed from glory (terrestrial) to glory (celestial). As He quickens something to us (that "AHA!" moment) IF we accept whatever it was by changing how we now think (meaning of repentance = change the mind) about whatever it dealt with, it begins the process.

We then have to walk it out in shoe leather (works) for awhile, then after NOT seeing any change with natural eyes (because what is seen is not of faith but what is unseen) either within ourselves or our circumstances for a season, He will then move. The Spirit comes to perform the Word.

So if we stand in faith believing that the Word will not return void but will accomplish what it was sent to (you) to do, then that part of our soul will be translated out of the kingdom of darkness (carnal mind understanding) and into the kingdom of light (mind of Christ).

And because the oil (anointing) runs from the top of the head (mind) downwards (soul then body), this is the principle for healing and deliverance. Blessings...
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Doc

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #64 on: April 10, 2009, 01:05:53 AM »
:cloud9: Exactly, Molly, good point.  :thumbsup:

Doc; No, they both have a type of "consciousness". The spirit of God that is in us is inspiration, ie. breath that quickens. Quicken means to speed up or give life, but the life that God gives is not just the breath that enlivens the soul (even as the breath of animals/beastly carnal nature), but life that brings understanding, or "knowing".

Our soul is what makes us, us. He consumes it as we offer it on the altar; that's how we're changed from glory (terrestrial) to glory (celestial). As He quickens something to us (that "AHA!" moment) IF we accept whatever it was by changing how we now think (meaning of repentance = change the mind) about whatever it dealt with, it begins the process.

We then have to walk it out in shoe leather (works) for awhile, then after NOT seeing any change with natural eyes (because what is seen is not of faith but what is unseen) either within ourselves or our circumstances for a season, He will then move. The Spirit comes to perform the Word.

So if we stand in faith believing that the Word will not return void but will accomplish what it was sent to (you) to do, then that part of our soul will be translated out of the kingdom of darkness (carnal mind understanding) and into the kingdom of light (mind of Christ).

And because the oil (anointing) runs from the top of the head (mind) downwards (soul then body), this is the principle for healing and deliverance. Blessings...

Ok, I think that makes sense to me. So, what happens then is that a soul that has not been completely delivered at death then begins to go through the process of deliverance from the bondage it's still in once the spirit and soul leave the body and become separated from each other? So the "most conscious" part of us is what is stuck in Sheol/ Hades until it is completely delivered from that state.
God does not instruct us to pray to change His mind. He wants us to pray so that we'll know His mind.
 
"Prayer doesn't change God, it changes me." --C.S. Lewis

God never had or needed a Plan B. He's still on Plan A.

Res Veritas Loquitur

Offline Cardinal

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #65 on: April 10, 2009, 01:22:13 AM »
 :cloud9: Hey Doc, when I read that something new hit me. This is where SOME (the soul) will awaken to shame, others (the spirit) to righteousness (because it is already in Christ, in the Spirit). We've thought it was two different types of people's, but it's like all the other stuff in there, like the wheat and the tares, it's PARTS of the whole man. Cool! Thank You, Father....Blessings....

PS. I should add this is why Paul talked about a superior resurrection, one that takes place IN the body, that we don't have to literally die to obtain. This is the mark of the prize of high calling in Christ Jesus, the fullness of the mind of Christ that leads to the glorified and therefore incorruptible, body.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2009, 01:38:49 AM by Cardinal »
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Offline Molly

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #66 on: April 10, 2009, 01:37:58 AM »

Romans 9:33
As it is written: "See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes men to stumble and a rock that makes them fall, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame."

Offline Cardinal

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #67 on: April 10, 2009, 01:41:19 AM »
 :cloud9: That's true Molly, but the SOUL that sins, it shall be cut off from the Lord. The soul that has not overcome all while still in a body, IS "cut off" temporarily. Blessings....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Molly

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #68 on: April 10, 2009, 01:50:10 AM »
Maybe, Card, but even if I have to drag him down to hell with me, I never intend on being separated from him again. :icon_flower:

...if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.

--Psa 139


But this is what I hold onto:


6Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever.

--Psa 23

Offline Doc

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #69 on: April 10, 2009, 01:52:52 AM »
:cloud9: Hey Doc, when I read that something new hit me. This is where SOME (the soul) will awaken to shame, others (the spirit) to righteousness (because it is already in Christ, in the Spirit). We've thought it was two different types of people's, but it's like all the other stuff in there, like the wheat and the tares, it's PARTS of the whole man. Cool! Thank You, Father....Blessings....

PS. I should add this is why Paul talked about a superior resurrection, one that takes place IN the body, that we don't have to literally die to obtain. This is the mark of the prize of high calling in Christ Jesus, the fullness of the mind of Christ that leads to the glorified and therefore incorruptible, body.

Hmm. And that may answer the question I've had rolling around in my head about just what the heck Paul meant by "better resurrection".
God does not instruct us to pray to change His mind. He wants us to pray so that we'll know His mind.
 
"Prayer doesn't change God, it changes me." --C.S. Lewis

God never had or needed a Plan B. He's still on Plan A.

Res Veritas Loquitur

Offline Cardinal

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #70 on: April 10, 2009, 02:31:45 AM »
Maybe, Card, but even if I have to drag him down to hell with me, I never intend on being separated from him again. :icon_flower:

...if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.

--Psa 139


But this is what I hold onto:


6Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever.  --Psa 23

 :cloud9: Yes He is there, because He's busy making hell deliver up it's dead, for the last 2 days/2000 years of "doing cures/making whole".

Amen, what choice do we have, it's ALL His house, even the 'basement", LOL...

The soul is ALREADY separated from His Spirit; that IS what separates us in the first place, which is why it must be redeemed/restored. Blessings...
« Last Edit: April 10, 2009, 02:37:11 AM by Cardinal »
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline ChuckK3

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #71 on: April 11, 2009, 10:30:43 AM »
Here's a real kicker:

Do any of you miss your now departed loved ones?  "Yes", you say?  Why? 

Well, do you think your departed loved ones miss YOU?

I say NO!  Why?  Don't they love us?  Of course they do!  Do you miss any friend if that friend is in the same room with you at the moment?  Of course not!

Martin quotes that we have already entered everlasting life.  Therefore, are we not with our departed loved ones right now?  Our flesh mind of course cannot see this, but what about our spiritual mind?

Furthermore, our departed loved ones are no longer confined to a time/space continuum, so it's spiritually possible that we are already with our departed loved ones even though we are still confined to a perishable flesh body.

It is written "Now we are seated in the Heavenlies".  Funny, I thought we were still on Earth?  Yeah, right, our flesh bodies are.  I'm quite certain our spirit trancends our earthly body.   Not necessarily in an actual "our of body" experience, as if we "died" or something, although that could possibly happen.

Chuck :smile:

Offline sparrow

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #72 on: April 11, 2009, 09:14:44 PM »
Here's a real kicker:

Do any of you miss your now departed loved ones?  "Yes", you say?  Why? 

Well, do you think your departed loved ones miss YOU?

I say NO!  Why?  Don't they love us?  Of course they do!  Do you miss any friend if that friend is in the same room with you at the moment?  Of course not!

Martin quotes that we have already entered everlasting life.  Therefore, are we not with our departed loved ones right now?  Our flesh mind of course cannot see this, but what about our spiritual mind?

Furthermore, our departed loved ones are no longer confined to a time/space continuum, so it's spiritually possible that we are already with our departed loved ones even though we are still confined to a perishable flesh body.

It is written "Now we are seated in the Heavenlies".  Funny, I thought we were still on Earth?  Yeah, right, our flesh bodies are.  I'm quite certain our spirit trancends our earthly body.   Not necessarily in an actual "our of body" experience, as if we "died" or something, although that could possibly happen.

Chuck :smile:

Chuck...

 :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:

Best post on this entire thread.

I see the same thing, brother.

Do our loved ones sorrow for us...?? Well, if they see the bigger picture, there's not much need for sorrow and I believe they are cheering us on.

They are with us.

When my mother died, the split second before she died she said hello to my granny (who died 3 yrs before). I knew in my heart and in my soul that my granny WAS present and came to bring her home. My mother was dying of cancer, and had been thrashing a little back and forth and muttering and all of a sudden a great peace suddenly came over her from out of nowhere, she grew still and silent and said with all the wonder her voice could fathom... "Hi granny.....!"
A little bird who had flew on our windowsill and stood there looking in at us for several minutes and wouldn't leave, suddenly flew off the very SECOND that she died.

2 Weeks before my beloved dog died in January, my mother came to me in a dream and gave me a long, wonderful, comforting hug. (I've never had that happen to me in the 20 years that she has been dead. I woke up out of the dream in a "almost shocked" sort of state, because the dream was so intense and I just kept repeating to myself... oh my GOD! That was my mother. That was her essence, that wasn't just a dream... that was REALLY my mother! Her smell, her tight grip, the absolute comfort, everything about that hug was my mother.) After my dog died, I was a mess. I was so distressed my hair started to fall out and I developed hives. My dog also came back to me THREE times in very distinct dreams  the night that he died and the week after, that I, again, woke right up out of. He showed me how happy and healthy and surrounded by love he was. He was doing things he wasn't able to on earth. A few other encouraging messages I got from those dreams, but they're personal.

I was still distressed because I had so much guilt, wishing things had been different, etc. (as we all do I suppose). But, anyway I got so bad one day, I had to stay home from work because I cried all day long and just couldn't shake it. Slowly but surely, the dreams started to sink in.  God pointed me to many wonderful things in the bible. And a lot of other just truly beautiful things happened, especially some things that help snap me out of a year-long depression I had. Things have happened that have brought forth a need to put more love and kindness in this world. A need to rise above my earthly self and just do whatever I can do LOVE. To get past my earthly insecurities and limitations and LOVE. He worked some miracles in me and I have absolute, 100% faith that the moment we die, we go on and we are in the heavenlies. I will NEVER Forsake this belief. EVER.

My mother hugging me... I didn't realize it when it happened, but I was going to need that comfort. The year before I had been so distressed over things that had to do with events surrounding the death of HER mother, (my grandmother) and that was the first time my hair started falling out from stress. Then a year later, the stress enveloped me once more. She knew I needed that hug. (BEFORE I KNEW THAT I WOULD NEED THAT HUG. Do you see.... I had no idea the amount of distress I would be under when I had that dream. And I woke up perplexed at why, after TWENTY years would she NOW come to me?) And I believe things happened, and still more things happened in a way that would help me to really have faith in this belief of mine. I had already believed this. I never believed that when we die, we are just asleep. It was a hope deep inside of me and I had faith in it. Well God NURTURED it in a truly wonder-filled way. I think sometimes you just get to be shown stuff for a reason. We all have different little pieces of the puzzle. This puzzle piece is just... I can't tell you how sacred it is. I can't describe how valuable and beautiful it is to me. No matter the sorrow I went through to get it, the sorrow was just a stepping stone, in my eyes. and I wouldn't trade it for the world.

No mere human can ever say anything that will ever make me believe otherwise.
I see something that is so beautiful and wonder-filled....
God made me stumble across something that said "Native Americans believe that when a loved one died, they appear in a dream to a family member to let them know they are ok." I was not looking for this information, I just happened upon it.
Funny, how I have Native American blood and it was a Native American couple who helped me to understand Jesus.

Our God is VERY good.

VERY VERY VERY Good indeed.

But realizing having shared all of this, I do know that we are each on our own path.
I won't debate this view.
I just won't. If someone doesn't see it this way, that's fine.
No-one's beliefs intimidate my beliefs about this.

They are rock solid.
un-moving.

peace... :icon_flower:

« Last Edit: April 11, 2009, 09:39:26 PM by sparrow »
"I knelt to drink,
And knew that I was on the brink
Of endless joy. And everywhere
I turned I saw a wonder there."

If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give away all I have, and if I deliver up my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Offline jabcat

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #73 on: April 11, 2009, 09:45:43 PM »
Some of these things I'm not quite as settled on, but I enjoyed your post Sparrow, and it was inspiring.
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline sparrow

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Re: When do we people go to the afterlife
« Reply #74 on: April 11, 2009, 10:30:47 PM »
Some of these things I'm not quite as settled on, but I enjoyed your post Sparrow, and it was inspiring.

:HeartThrob:
Thank you Jabcat.
That gave me a smile...
 :icon_flower:
"I knelt to drink,
And knew that I was on the brink
Of endless joy. And everywhere
I turned I saw a wonder there."

If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give away all I have, and if I deliver up my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.