Author Topic: What about Satan and his minions?  (Read 3235 times)

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Offline sheila

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Re: What about Satan and his minions?
« Reply #25 on: April 03, 2009, 11:29:32 PM »


   God's purpose for EVIL

   the serpent is a rod of discipline in the Lords hands

    when the children take the hand of the serpent through

   disobediance and accepts the spirit of rebellion..the

  consequences of evil and all the suffering of it..

  can make the child repent and return unto the Father.

  All mankind down here  on earth are children..and the heart

  of a child is full of folly. Do not forsake the rod of discipline.

  The law of sowing and reaping applies as long as we remain in

 the flesh on this earth. And when we do repent from sin..and

  suffer evilfor doing good ...the rod tests us..For he who has

   suffered[for doing right] has desisted from sin.

   Obediance is perfected through suffering.

   good and evil will be sown as long as the earth exists...

   and harvest time will also continue as long as the earth exists

  He that loves His child does look for him with discipline


   The adversary is needed until the children mature and learn

  obediance.Repent,turn to doing right then suffer for doing right


   Now our big brothers and sister's in heaven...holy angels

  have already been perfected and cast satan out of the heavens

  They suffered evil while obeying God [ex; Michael not daring to

  rebuke satan in the dispute over Moses body]

   During that spiritual warfare in heaven satan and his

  messengers were not strong enough to overcome God's

  obediant angels..they suffered satan in heaven.


   Now satan is confined to the earth, and the angels of heaven

are in union with their little brothers down here still dwelling on

  the earth. Now we are at a disadvantage due to the weakness

 of our flesh and our power is small..but they are powerful and

 will come with Jesus to help us win the spiritual war.They are

the true saviours of Mt Zion. Michael will stand up refers to this

 very thing.

  They will ride the more mature children down here as horses in

 the spiritual battle.. And as they are united with us in heart

 as the weaker vessel..so too, we are united in heart with those

 here on earth that are weaker vessels, and serve as saviours

 on Mt Zion to them.

   It is all spiritual warfare and conducted righteously and not

 against flesh a nd blood..because flesh and blood is not the

enemy but the enemy is spiritual.

   God Himself finishes our training..and those that are glorified

 in heaven[angelic brothers and sisters]suffer for doing God's will

 in this way.Putting up in love with the evil that is present in

 our flesh, loving us and ministering to us. you all know that

 the Holy spirit[and all holy spiritual children] are distressed

 with evil and malice and it greives them. Just as we with

 token are greived in the presence of evil in ourselves and

  others. So, you can see why enduring evil and suffering

 for doing righteousness does lead to perfection in the spirits of

  mankind.

  This serving of one another will even apply to the animal

 Kingdom. As angelic sons of God have battled for and with us

in our interest when we were as beasts..so too, the taming of

wild animals and the learning of dwelling togather in unity will

 occur. This is part of the dominion of the Kingdom also.

  Adam was given dominion over the earth..and the subjecting

 of the animal kingdom is referred to in several places in the

  scriptures. The lion will lie down with the Lamb,kid and leopard

 etc, child and the poisoned asp etc on His Holy Mountain.

   Yes even the animals will have the spirit of love for one

   another and quit devouring one another.

   All things must be subjected..

  Older brothers and sisters assist with younger etc...

  a little child will be the leader of them all speaks of the

 youngest in our heavenly numbers assisting in taming the

 the animals.

   The Kingdom of Heaven is as when a woman hid  leaven in a

 jar and then all the flour was leaven..this is what that is

  speaking of.

   All of this sowing and reaping is transpiring now

  simultaneously. Litle children are making freinds of their pets

 cats and dogs,birds and cats..we have all seen these things in

 the news. This goes all the way up to the top of heaven. The

  more mature serve the less advanced.

   By the same token the kingdom of darkness continues in it's

  sowing and reaping and will continue as long as the earth

  exists. And we,too, see the evidence of this in the news and

   in our daily lives.

   As long as the earth exists refers to as long as we dwell in

 the earth,or as long as the earth literally exists.

   When someone dies and is resurrected in heaven,He is taught

  how and in what way He will serve the Father, He has been

delivered from the sin in his flesh,but must suffer the sin in

 other's flesh that he serves on earth. Therefore he is perfected

 by suffering evil  in obediance.

   Now when everyone is clothed on High..the rod will no longer

 be of use/needed and becomes obsolete..just like the law is

  faded away so too the rod. For the law was written against

 the lawless and the rod against the disobediant and for the

testing/perfecting of the obediant through the suffering for

 obediance.

  All the children will be placed in the BODY/FAMILY where

 Father places them,and they will find contentment and

fulfillment where they are placed by Him..for He forms us for

 this very purpose.

   There is a real difference between a free gift and a talent.

   The free gift requires no effort on our part..but a talent

  requires our effort for it's increase. We want to increase our

  Father interests/business. If Father has 'sanctified' us for His

use on earth now..our talents will require some effort on our part

But,He does not sanctify all of mankind for His use on earth at

present..that does not mean the free gift will not be given them

 for they will bear fruit in heaven after they die,just as we

bear fruit now,to the extent we put to death the wicked works

of disobediance in our life to the benefit of our Father's interest.

   Does everyone get a 'talent' in this life ? Everyone gets at

  least one , but if he be overtaken by the wicked spirit

  completely he will not have increase. That human will receive

  the free gift through no effort of his own, but that rebellious

 spirit will be cast out.For every knee will bow and every tongue

  will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord.

      Sheila

 

 not increase

Offline Pierac

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Re: What about Satan and his minions?
« Reply #26 on: April 04, 2009, 03:46:42 AM »

One of the only things that I have trouble with regarding universalism is the problem of evil  :BangHead:

Ok, what about the demons who "believe and tremble?"(James 2:19) will they be reconciled back to God? And will Satan be one of those who will confess that "Jesus Christ is Lord"?

A huge problem I have is that if Satan was created purely for the purpose of tormenting and deceiving humans then isn't the God who created Satan really the source of all evil? If Satan has no will and is basically a puppet of evil deeds, then how does that fit with a universal reconciliation of God's creation?

As it relates to the human race, I like universalism and it reconciles many questions I have...but I can't seem to reconcile the problem of evil.



The purpose of Evil... Indeed?

CLV Ecc 1:13 I applied my heart to inquiring and exploring by wisdom concerning all that is done under the heavens: it is an experience of evil Elohim (God) has given to the sons of humanity to humble them by it.

KJV Ecc 9:12  For man also knoweth not his time: as the fishes that are taken in an evil net, and as the birds that are caught in the snare; so are the sons of men snared in an evil time, when it falleth suddenly upon them.

Ecc 3:11  God has made everything fit beautifully in its appropriate time, but he has also placed ignorance in the human heart so that people cannot discover what God has ordained, from the beginning to the end of their lives.

Evil seems to have a purpose in God's plan....perhaps we are just ignorant of this?   :2c:

Paul


[mistake, no changes made...jabcat]
« Last Edit: April 04, 2009, 04:07:10 AM by jabcat »

IceDash

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Re: What about Satan and his minions?
« Reply #27 on: April 04, 2009, 03:51:01 AM »
ID

   YOU HAVE A WONDERFUL SURPRISE AWAITING YOU!!

   Father does this so often, anything that comes up out of

  heart for Him.[spontaneous].he does for us.

   ex; David wanted to build the temple for the Lord..the Lord

  built David a house. He is very tender in affection,our Father.

    Bless you,ID

                                Sheila

Thank for a loving post, of course I always love God, sometime I feel I didn't do enough for him, all I can do is love him

Offline jabcat

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Re: What about Satan and his minions?
« Reply #28 on: April 04, 2009, 04:11:14 AM »

The purpose of Evil... Indeed?

CLV Ecc 1:13 I applied my heart to inquiring and exploring by wisdom concerning all that is done under the heavens: it is an experience of evil Elohim (God) has given to the sons of humanity to humble them by it.

KJV Ecc 9:12  For man also knoweth not his time: as the fishes that are taken in an evil net, and as the birds that are caught in the snare; so are the sons of men snared in an evil time, when it falleth suddenly upon them.

Ecc 3:11  God has made everything fit beautifully in its appropriate time, but he has also placed ignorance in the human heart so that people cannot discover what God has ordained, from the beginning to the end of their lives.

Evil seems to have a purpose in God's plan....perhaps we are just ignorant of this?   :2c:

Paul


I think this goes against our grain Paul.  It goes against my natural reasoning, but I need God to go against my grain, for as the scriptures you quote say, it is for a purpose..HIS purpose...

For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it,in hope

that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. Romans 8:20,21

Taken from True Grace Fellowship site;  "When man arises after the present experience is over, the world of mankind will be able to testify to the wisdom of God in allowing the experience of suffering and death. When they are awakened from death, their faulty vision or understanding of God will be corrected."
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline sparrow

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Re: What about Satan and his minions?
« Reply #29 on: April 04, 2009, 05:49:32 AM »


   
   When someone dies and is resurrected in heaven,He is taught

  how and in what way He will serve the Father, He has been

delivered from the sin in his flesh,but must suffer the sin in

 other's flesh that he serves on earth.
Therefore he is perfected

 by suffering evil  in obediance.

  

Hey Sheila... can you expand a little on this?
Thanks my friend,
Sparrow
"I knelt to drink,
And knew that I was on the brink
Of endless joy. And everywhere
I turned I saw a wonder there."

If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give away all I have, and if I deliver up my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Offline sheila

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Re: What about Satan and his minions?
« Reply #30 on: April 04, 2009, 06:49:38 AM »
  Hi Sparrow

When anyone is raised to heaven,he islike the angels..

 all God's angels minister to those who are going to inherit

 salvation [mankind] we really do have angels appointed to us

 as guardians and teachers. These are truly Holy spirits...

 that guard us and keep us.The lead Holy spirit is Pravuil

  If we don't listen to the Holy spirit and resist it..and keep

rejecting it and following a rebellious spirit. Our angels may

become so greived with the situation that they may petition

Father for respite . When this happens we are in fact at an

 evil spirits mercy[which is not a good place to be] they will

bring a lot of evil fruit in our lives..and cause much sorrow.

   It is like one of us striving to get truth to some-one else and

they resist it, finally in exasperation we leave them with the

lie their holding onto,instead of revealing a wonderful spiritual

 truth to them. Sometimes people resist the Holy spirit instead

of satan

   David prayed after he sinned and asked God to please not

  take away His  Holy spirit. And Father didn't, but David had to

  deal with a lot of suffering over it through-out his life..

   There is a scripture that says, turn such a one over to satan

   for the destruction of the flesh, so that the spirit may be

  saved.

    I have had to apoligize to the Holy spirit before...and

  don't want to greive him. I try an co-operate the best I can

with them so as not to make their duties more  or greivous

 to them when they have to deal with me in my sinful condition.

  But I have failed at times,and often wondered that they didn't

  leave me.


    They are our Big brothers and sisters in the family of God..

   they put much effort in getting communication to us.

  In Daniel,he had fasted for 21 days waiting for communication

 from heaven on a matter. Gabriel explained about the delay

and how reinforcement from Michael was needed to get through.


    The Holy angels as ministering spirits do many things for us

 that we are not aware of. When we are like the angels in

 heaven..we will serve this way,too.


   The rider on the white horse,Jesus and all the army of heaven

 are riding on white horses and waging spiritual warfare with

justice and truth. That is how this revelation of the salvation of

all and the great spiritual banquet has been served to us.


    They too, fight against prince a palities etc in our behalf.

  Those people they ride in turn proclaim what has been

 declared to them, for other people to hear.

   I have noticed some I understand better than others...just as

  on this forum we may understand ones post clearer than

someone else saying the same thing in a different manner.


   Truth is truth no matter what manner,but we tend to hone in

on that we can relate to easier and grasp the understanding

 quicker. Sometimes one will use a word that I never even heard

 of,or a terminology I am not familiar with, I have to research it

 to understand what they told me [archaic words,terminology]


   We all do the same with the disciples too..some we

 understand clearer as to what is being expressed. I especially

 prefer John and Paul's wittness for some reason.


  I appreciate all of their efforts on all of our behalf.


   It is both a wonderful and frightful and exciting time we

  we are living in. Many of the saints would have loved to live in

 our day and to expierence on this earth what we have been

 expierencing.

  Ours is a really big family and the older children always help

 with the younger ones.

Offline sparrow

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Re: What about Satan and his minions?
« Reply #31 on: April 04, 2009, 10:00:22 AM »
Thank you for sharing all of that, Sheila.
Definitely ponder-material for me.

 :HeartThrob:,
sparrow
"I knelt to drink,
And knew that I was on the brink
Of endless joy. And everywhere
I turned I saw a wonder there."

If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give away all I have, and if I deliver up my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing.

Offline Akira Takahashi

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Re: What about Satan and his minions?
« Reply #32 on: April 05, 2009, 05:10:14 AM »
Gah, I once remember a certain philosopher once brought up a similar notion, but I can't remember the details at all.  I'll go on a hunt for the book and come back after I've had time to study the details of his position and my thoughts on it.