Universal Salvation is a Conscious awareness, that is not based on awareness.

[Mickiel]

Hi Mickiel:
All I know is, if I study too much, I start to feel dizzy. And no matter what anyone says about flat computer screens, my eyes aren't what they used to be either.

It's not that I "try" to keep things simple; it's just that long complicated things are started to weigh on me. I do better piece by piece.
(Gosh, and I'm only 37!)

Look, if the Kingdom of God is all about working hard and studying deep things, I don't think I'll make it. I just want to BE and BE with Him. Anything more, it might get rough for me..

Brian

Oh you'll make it, that much is garenteed. To some, the Kingdom of God is rest, they see no need to " Do" anything. See no need to worry about anything, and take no thought about sinning, because they know their sin is forgiven. And they make no efforts, no effort to overcome anything, no effort to grow, no effort to try themselves, because they are relaxerd in Christ, and feel that Jesus does all those things for them. Jesus will fill them, complette them, guide them, and feed them, in this mindset, hey, why should the pertson even think of doing things, Jesus has them covered. They don't study, they don't pray much, why should they, they are being served by heaven already, they are Kings already, why should a King make any effort in any area?

When the mindset is that all is laid before you, then it creates" I just want to BE and Be with him."

All the person needs then is a harp, and they will continue doing nothing in the Kingdom for all eternity.

Anyhow, I have enjoyed speaking with you and wish you well, I have nothing to offer you. The things I deal with , require than much more be given from the mind that observes it.

Peace.

[whyiloveitaly]

Mickiel:
Why do you say that you have nothing to offer me? I am learning much from you (moreso when your posts are short..)

I don't say that I don't try to learn. I do want to learn, what I am able to learn.
Some post things on this forum that you need a Ph.D. in philosopy to grasp. (And hours of free time to read!)

But that's not for me. And if it's not for me, it's probably not for many (common) people, because I think I'm pretty average.

And if it's not for many, how important is it?

Bri

[Mickiel]

Mickiel:
Why do you say that you have nothing to offer me? I am learning much from you (moreso when your posts are short..)

I don't say that I don't try to learn. I do want to learn, what I am able to learn.
Some post things on this forum that you need a Ph.D. in philosopy to grasp. (And hours of free time to read!)

But that's not for me. And if it's not for me, it's probably not for many (common) people, because I think I'm pretty average.

And if it's not for many, how important is it?

Bri

Well I think I am pretty average myself. I don't even have Gods Spirit yet, I hold no degrees, most of my work life has been spent either climbing trees or doing housekeeping, I am not part of any group. I think I am common also. But I am interested in God, and will take the time to consider him. Its nothing I can do with a mind that willnot take the time to consider. Most of the people will not take the time, so for the most, your right, its not important, so I am not involved with that group. So I kindly excused myself from you. In your mind, I am in that group which " Deals with Philosophy", and I understand that. I like to go deep into Gods word, I like to spend the time digging and searching. I like the things that you do not like doing, so we are not for each other. And there is no harm done in that, we all willnot walk together.

Some are content with just waking up in the mourning, and leave it at that. Just thankful for that. I am not like that. I want to know why I am alive, how long will I live. What is the sky, what lies beyond the sky. What is Life, why is Life, and every single thing I can learn about these and more. It is said that the Life of an Elephant is just one continous Feast, they live to eat. Well my time in the flesh is simular, I live to learn about  the things of God. It is one continous Feast. Can I then relate to people who are not like this? Well yes, I can, most of the people I deal with are not like this. I may not be very good at relating to them, espically when they require certain limitations from you, in order for you to deal with them, but I try.

Anyhow, I am too long with you. I am not for you, you are not for me, thats just how it is. There is no importance that can be passed between us, you have your ways, I have mine, and I have kindly reconized that, well perhaps not so kindly, and I apoligise for that,  but we must understand when we are not for someone. We can't push ourselves on others. I think that is one thing that tends to ruin relationships, when we think it just has to work. You have to know when to walk away, there will be someone for you, and someone for the other. I run into more who are not for me, than I do those who are. But the work goes on, life goes on. We just keep doing what we do, and for those who do nothing, they will continue also. So our importance does not lay inside of others evaluation, our Adaquacy comes from God.

Peace to you.

[whyiloveitaly]

What you say about relationships between people is kinda' what I say about our relationship with God. We don't need to try to force it. If He made us, why do we need to struggle to know about Him or strive in order to be accepted by Him?

No, we will not all walk together. Still, it's nice to hear other experiences. Some don't share at all, and that makes me sad.

Some people want to change how others think. That's an ugly, egotistical area that I hope to not wander into anymore; it's caused me enough problems in the past..

Today, I just like to compare experiences. And every now and then, I think we (all) grow from those exchanges as a result.

And I think that most of us here are here because we have something of God in our hearts to share.

Blessings!
Bri

P.S. I don't see you as part of the philosophy group. You just write a lot. Some write a lot, and are confusing, too!

[Mickiel]

Blessings!
Bri

P.S. I don't see you as part of the philosophy group. You just write a lot. Some write a lot, and are confusing, too!

A good journey to you.

Peace.

[whyiloveitaly]

Mickiel:
Please understand, I'm not telling you that you shouldn't write a lot. -It's just that I'm lazy and I skip over the long posts, even if they're interesting!

Still, I try to learn where I can!

If you prefer, I'll stop posting to you.

Blessings!
Bri

[Mickiel]

Mickiel:
Please understand, I'm not telling you that you shouldn't write a lot. -It's just that I'm lazy and I skip over the long posts, even if they're interesting!

Still, I try to learn where I can!

If you prefer, I'll stop posting to you.

Blessings!
Bri

I understand everything you have stated. I have not asked that you stop posting to me, I have only admitted that I am long winded, you are short in reading, thus we have no match with each other. This is what I have stated, its reality as it is. I am not going to stop writting, I just willnot respond to you in long terms, as you have requested. You have your limitations, you need things to be in a way that is pleasing to you, I understand that. You need to have things ordered in a way that fits into your comfort zone, I understand that.

I am only saying that I am not like you. I can read all day and all night, and can write just as much. It is not the length of things that turn me off, its the context. So I am nothing like you, you are turned off by length. So I only have gone by what you have expressed about yourself, by this I know I have nothing to offer you. By that I really meant nothing further, because when you are getting tired, I am not even hardly getting started. So we walk differing paths of intrest. I am not short winded, but I am inclinded to respect what people require of me. So out of respect for you, I say a little bit, and say no more.

If this is not what you want, then explain to me what you now require?

Peace.

[whyiloveitaly]

Hi again!
I'm glad you still want to write.
I don't require anything from anyone (I hope). I do like to converse with people about things that are close to the heart. I have seen people build walls of scriptures around themselves. (Not you.) And when they have to speak personally, they can't. So I think, where is the love?
Some may have a message of love, and so I get interested. But at times there is so much writing (again, not you) that I get tired. Example: www.goodnewsinc.net    I'd like to read some of the articles there, they talk about God's grace and they even bring out some scriptures that most people never even mention. But look at the length of those pages! Uffah! And I don't always have time, either.

Personally, I just like conversing. It can happen when you get a moment, it can be meaningful, even spiritual, and if there's a revelation or word or something to share, all the better!

Bri

[Mickiel]

Hi again!
I'm glad you still want to write.
I don't require anything from anyone (I hope). I do like to converse with people about things that are close to the heart. I have seen people build walls of scriptures around themselves. (Not you.) And when they have to speak personally, they can't. So I think, where is the love?
Some may have a message of love, and so I get interested. But at times there is so much writing (again, not you) that I get tired. Example: www.goodnewsinc.net    I'd like to read some of the articles there, they talk about God's grace and they even bring out some scriptures that most people never even mention. But look at the length of those pages! Uffah! And I don't always have time, either.

Personally, I just like conversing. It can happen when you get a moment, it can be meaningful, even spiritual, and if there's a revelation or word or something to share, all the better!

Bri

Well I have read the writings of John of Goodnews Inc., my goodness, I am nowhere near as long as he is. He writes volumes, I write paragraphs in installments. But I am always for real with it, I hold no intrest in style or volume, only substance. In fact I make concious efforts to be short. But I understand where you are comming from, I really do. And I really am different than you, the volumes don't bother me, If I am interested , I'll read it, if not, I won't.  One sentence can turn me off from something, just as if I am interested, then 10 books on the subject is not enough. But I too grow tired of reading useless material, but not of good material. I don't read a lot, but when I do, I enjoy it. I just finished a good book by Andrew Shaprio, " We are Number One". Its a book about everything America is number one in, Good and Bad areas. A very interesting  satistical read, and the book is perhaps over 10 years old. Its a stunning read, and I reconmend it, well not to you, but to those who like reading.

I also just finished " Biblical Archaeology", a pictorial guide to biblical archaeology by Robert T. Boyd, and it was written in 1969, so I kind of like the old stuff. But its an excellent read and shows how Archaeology literally proves that the Bible is historically valid. I reconmend it also, a stimulating read that solidifys your belief in the bible as the word of God. It shows many actual pictures of biblical evidence from the past. And I am in the middle of another exciting read by Julian Jaynes on the Consciousness of Man, oh how this man has opened much in me.

But I don't wish to bore you with such things. I am also about to read 11 Conan the Barbarian Comics I bought today. I think the Conan Mags are amoung the best done by Marvel. I enjoy with no end reading them. Then I give them away or trade them for more. But God first pricked my intrest in reading, with the Conan Comic Books when I was 12 years old. I am now 52, and still read them until this day. I can take a stack of them, begin reading at 7:00 pm, and go until 2:am in the mourning, and thourouhly enjoy myself, doing nothingelse but enjoying the writing, the characther, the drawings, my imagination and the Ice Cream.

Anyhow, peace.

[whyiloveitaly]

I think the ice cream sparks my interest the most. :) Ice cream here in Italy beats American ice cream hands down, IMHO. (That doesn't mean I'd reject an offer for a dish of cookie dough right now..)
I too like to read things if they touch something in me. I find myself skimming most long things just to see if it has "meat" in it- if it does, I read it with more attention. If it's really helpful (maybe like Julian Jaynes for you). then I might even re-read it a couple of times. It depends on the length.

Can you tell me about the Julian Jaynes book?

Bri

[Mickiel]

Now this is a challange to keep this short and simple. Julian Jaynes was a princeton university professor , who has recently died. His best work, in my view, was " The Orgin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind." Jaynes central Idea is that our modern type of consciousness is a recent development and began no more than 3,000 years ago. Before that human mentality was charactherized by auditory and visual images within the mind, and hardly no vocal skills comming out of the mouth. Their minds were split in two ( The Bicameral Mind). A result of a dissociation between the left and right hemispheres of the Brain. In laymans terms, they were alive but had no consciousness. Their decisions , plans and initatives were developed at the unconsciuous level, much like animals.

What fascinated me about his concepts, is that I think it explains the existance of humans before Adam, because Archaeology proves that humans existed long before Adam did. But I don't think God gave them consciousness, I think Adam and Eve were the first humans to have Conscious thought, or individual active consciousness which could communicate both inward and outward, holding accumulitive intelligence.

Peace.

[whyiloveitaly]

Wow! I think this is the first time someone talked of man existing 'before Adam,' at least in a physical realm! (Usually we talk about our existance with God before being placed on the Earth, which is something different.)

I have read a bit on human communication, and how we communicate with each other both analogically (body expression and emotion) and digitally (language). It's a subject that has always remained fascinating to me. Try saying "I love you" to someone without using words! (Sign language doesn't count..)

Maybe God expressed His love towards us in analogical form by dying for us! (I suppose the Bible would be the a digital form.)

I know that the left side of the brain is logical, and the right side is creative. Maybe before Adam, humans didn't have a developed left-brain??

Bri

[Mickiel]

Wow! I think this is the first time someone talked of man existing 'before Adam,' at least in a physical realm! (Usually we talk about our existance with God before being placed on the Earth, which is something different.)

I

Well man defintely did exist before Adam. Through history I think we can trace the timeframe from Adams creation to have been around 6,000 years ago. And the bible is an important historical archeological tool to help us do that. But Archaeology defintely proves beyond a shadow of doubt in my mind, that there were untold of numbers of humans who lived far before Adam did. That confused me for a long time, but after reading Julian Jaynes, that piece of the puzzle plugged a hole in my mind.

Again, I know many will not see this, but that is no concern of mine. The Neanderthall and Cromanon man, didnot hold consciousness as we do. They were not on our level of existence, they just were not. Now, why God did this, I have no ideal whatsoever, absolutely none. Its just a mystery to me, but I understand a little more of it now, than I did then, I pray that Pace continue in the comming years.

Adam and Eve were the first humans created " In Gods Image AND Likeness", but they were not the first humans created. " In the Beginning God created Man" just covers more ground than we are aware of.

Peace.

[arcticmonster2003]

quote Mickiel

Well man defintely did exist before Adam.

  Well Mickiel, there are some (me included) who do not think man defintely existed before Adam, and we refer to the science that says otherwise as:

1 Timothy 6:20  O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

If Paul, whom had revelation beyong any man I know, of the true reality we live in, didn't even say science was wrong, but rather that this craft we call science is falsely called science (pertaining to the definition of science), then I shall say the same as well.

Man defintely did not exist before Adam.
And the falsely called science of today has made itself into one of the biggest anti-God force in this world (even to a point of that being its whole point, that is disproving God), saying the universe came from an infinetely dense particle that had a big bang and created the universe, but neglecting to even comprehend the obsurdity that they haven't explained where that infinetely dense particle came from. In today's scientific community its ok to say nearly anything, just as long as you don't mention God....if you do, gasps of horror and spiritual insanity would fill whichever room you were talking about this with your fellow "scientists". Science (falsly called) and God are not friends. Nor can one serve two masters.

[reFORMer]

Well I think I am pretty average myself. I don't even have Gods Spirit yet, I hold no degrees, most of my work life has been spent either climbing trees or doing housekeeping, I am not part of any group. I think I am common also. But I am interested in God, and will take the time to consider him. Its nothing I can do with a mind that willnot take the time to consider. Most of the people will not take the time, so for the most, your right, its not important, so I am not involved with that group. So I kindly excused myself from you. In your mind, I am in that group which " Deals with Philosophy", and I understand that. I like to go deep into Gods word, I like to spend the time digging and searching. I like the things that you do not like doing, so we are not for each other. And there is no harm done in that, we all willnot walk together.

Some are content with just waking up in the mourning, and leave it at that. Just thankful for that. I am not like that. I want to know why I am alive, how long will I live. What is the sky, what lies beyond the sky. What is Life, why is Life, and every single thing I can learn about these and more. It is said that the Life of an Elephant is just one continous Feast, they live to eat. Well my time in the flesh is simular, I live to learn about  the things of God. It is one continous Feast. Can I then relate to people who are not like this? Well yes, I can, most of the people I deal with are not like this. I may not be very good at relating to them, espically when they require certain limitations from you, in order for you to deal with them, but I try.

Anyhow, I am too long with you. I am not for you, you are not for me, thats just how it is. There is no importance that can be passed between us, you have your ways, I have mine, and I have kindly reconized that, well perhaps not so kindly, and I apoligise for that,  but we must understand when we are not for someone. We can't push ourselves on others. I think that is one thing that tends to ruin relationships, when we think it just has to work. You have to know when to walk away, there will be someone for you, and someone for the other. I run into more who are not for me, than I do those who are. But the work goes on, life goes on. We just keep doing what we do, and for those who do nothing, they will continue also. So our importance does not lay inside of others evaluation, our Adaquacy comes from God.

Peace to you.

I'm trying to finish some other writing for here but had to get this bit out now.

I feel in great sympathy with what you are saying here and would explain more if I get time.  It's so late now!  But I must lament your saying:  "I don't even have Gods Spirit yet..."

For you, to think of God as Realm and Ruler is not right, in other words, The Kingdom of God is entirely future.  Also you seemingly think that there is at present no regenerating work of the Holy Spirit within us (what is often called "The New Birth" by many.)  This seems so contrary to Scripture and is such a plundering of our more important gifts and graces from God.  Now you seem to think one can't have the Holy Spirit?  On the day of Pentecost Peter said it was promised to even, "..all those afar, whosoever the Lord our God should be calling." (Act 2:39)

Without the Holy Spirit there would be no "Ecclesia" and Jesus would just be a historical footnote, only a philosopher of some value.  Having the Holy Spirit is the primary difference between the true Church and Mystery Babylon, the Mother of Whores.

[Mickiel]

I'm trying to finish some other writing for here but had to get this bit out now.

I feel in great sympathy with what you are saying here and would explain more if I get time.  It's so late now!  But I must lament your saying:  "I don't even have Gods Spirit yet..."

For you, to think of God as Realm and Ruler is not right, in other words, The Kingdom of God is entirely future.  Also you seemingly think that there is at present no regenerating work of the Holy Spirit within us (what is often called "The New Birth" by many.)  This seems so contrary to Scripture and is such a plundering of our more important gifts and graces from God.  Now you seem to think one can't have the Holy Spirit?  On the day of Pentecost Peter said it was promised to even, "..all those afar, whosoever the Lord our God should be calling." (Act 2:39)

Without the Holy Spirit there would be no "Ecclesia" and Jesus would just be a historical footnote, only a philosopher of some value.  Having the Holy Spirit is the primary difference between the true Church and Mystery Babylon, the Mother of Whores.

Well I must admit, I do personally doubt that the Holy Spirit has made its move yet, but thats just what I am being shown. Thats just me, so you can excuse it and write it off as whatever you wish, it should be no harm done, if the Spirit is there, its there.  I just am not totally convinced that it is.

Oh its going to make its move, and when it does, the people will know it. Because its too much power not to notice it.

But let me say this.  If I had to explain why there is no church of God now organized, why there is no solid unity amoung those who accept this way, why there is not a 100 percent clear vision on interpiting the Scriptures, I would say because the Holy Spirit has not rained down as of yet, and that would explain it all to me.

Hey, but thats just me.

But then what would that make all the prior claims from those who have spoken that they already have the Spirit? Well I think you know the answer to that.

Peace.

[Mickiel]

quote Mickiel

Well man defintely did exist before Adam.

  Well Mickiel, there are some (me included) who do not think man defintely existed before Adam, and we refer to the science that says otherwise as:

1 Timothy 6:20  O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:

If Paul, whom had revelation beyong any man I know, of the true reality we live in, didn't even say science was wrong, but rather that this craft we call science is falsely called science (pertaining to the definition of science), then I shall say the same as well.

Man defintely did not exist before Adam.

Well I respectfully disagree with you on this, and I agree with the Archeologist, and the scientist. The proof and the evidence is there, the finds are there, and the dates of the finds are documented. They have actually found frozen men who were over 10,000 years old. I am not frozen in my mind by the traditional view of the Bible, and I am not pushing my views on you or anyonelse. I simply shared what I believe. It matters not to me who accepts it.

The truth is, that God created humans long before he created Adam, but those humans did not have Consciousness.  They were closer to animals with instinct, thats all they had. Which really fits the discription of a cave man, in my mind. Adam was the first man created with Consciousness, therefore he really was the first true " Human in Gods Image and Likeness", but he was not the first human being.

This is what I believe.

Peace.

[Mickiel]

In 1959, Phil Orr, curator of anthropology at Santa Barbra museum, discovered the partial skeletal remains of an ancient woman in North America. Those remains were shown to be 10,000 years old. Using recent technology in radiocarbon dating, they reanalyzed those remains and found them to be over 13,000 years old, making them the oldest human remains found in North America.

You know, things like this need to challange the stubborn belief systems of many, and ignite within a desire to know the real truth, not to cover your mind in some kind of shell, as if what you  already know , is the end of that knowledge.

This woman lived during the end of the Pleistocene era. Do you know what that means? She was alive when the large herds of Bison and Woolly Mammoths roamed the earth. And Archceologist have unearth the actual bones and teeth of these Woolly Mammoths, so our ignorance does not cancel out these realitys. They exist, because God created them. And he created them long before he created Adam.

Peace.

[arcticmonster2003]

quote Mickiel

The truth is, that God created humans long before he created Adam, but those humans did not have Consciousness.  They were closer to animals with instinct, thats all they had. Which really fits the discription of a cave man, in my mind. Adam was the first man created with Consciousness, therefore he really was the first true " Human in Gods Image and Likeness", but he was not the first human being.
This is what I believe.

If this is what you believe then so be it, but I beg you not to cover your mind in some kind of science shell - - but the truth is that God did not create humans long before he created Adam

The science falsely called is flawed and therfore produces and announces flawed data to the public - the science falsely called is of this world and therefore lies to confuse and deceive people and keep them in bondage. New graduates are brainwashed and given faulty methods of determining the age of things, so its not that all are intentionally deceiving, but nonetheless their methods are flawed - its like the blind leading the blind.
How do you know that your not being fed lies? Have you understood that this woman lived during the end of the Pleistocene era? Or have you just been told so by others? Have you understood how, when or what the "Pleistocene" era is, or have you been told it exists by others? Have you considered that they could be lying to you?They are always talking about missing links (which aren't missing, they just aren't there) and yet miss out on the fact that it is their scientific assumptions which are wrong. Their dating methods are flawed. They can't even explain the spirit, nor the spiritual things that have dominated the earth since history and yet think they may say with assurance that there is no God. They admit that there are no records of civilization before Sumeria (southern Iraq), and yet they say humans have existed for 10's of thousands of years. And where do they get the idea for these humans from 10's of thoasands of years old? From flawed dating techniques. They can't even explain why there are such heavy metals on earth, and yet come up with an explanation anyways, that cannot be proven and therefore is not very scientific. I read an arcticle by a Petroleum Engineer whom went to a prominent university in the 1970's, whom said that his professor taught him in 25 years all oil reserves in the world would be depleted (that would mean there should be no oil left as we speak here in 2008) - - hey no problem, if it doesn't come to pass, they just change their story. They say that we have evolved from blue-green algae, and yet we see that blue-green algae is the most abundant organism on earth and even given millions of years would have had no reason to change into us to survive. I could list examples for days as to why it is science falsely called. Lets remember that these are entire fields and thousands and millions whom must justify everyday - the reason they should get a paycheck. But I'm not throwing out the Word of God for their lies, no thanks.




This is what I believe.

[arcticmonster2003]

quote Mickiel

But then what would that make all the prior claims from those who have spoken that they already have the Spirit? Well I think you know the answer to that.

Yes, I can see what your awnser is to that - you are calling us liars, insane, wicked, or decieved. Has to be one of the four right?

You are wrong.

You claim to not have the spirit, and yet judge others whom know they have the spirit, and in this you feel approved, and feel you have much knowledge to share with us so that we may be enlightened? Alot of your statements are firm and authoritative saying "This is the truth" or "The truth is" - but don't claim to have these truths from the spirit, but rather from science falsely called which changes its mind on  "truth", rather its theories every day.

Your trust is in science (falsely called). Not Gods Word. You feel you must bring these two together, when God has purposefully set aside the wisdom of this world (science falsely called) to be foolishness and has no intention of bringing it together in harmony with his Word, but rather, at the appropriate time shall reveal to all that the wisdom of this world is foolishness. It pleases God for now that his Word and the things of the Holy Spirit are thought of as foolish for now, as this is what he intended.

If your revelation is that no person alive today has the Holy Spirit, then I beg you to seek until you find, as many alive today have received the Holy Spirit. 

[Mickiel]

[quote author=

Yes, I can see what your awnser is to that - you are calling us liars, insane, wicked, or decieved. Has to be one of the four right?

You are wrong.
. 
[/quote]

I have called no one here anything of the sort. And I may well be wrong, but its still what I believe.  Its what I see, its what makes the most sense to me. I need not call any of you anything, because it matters not to me what you are, that only matters to yourselves.

You say you are annointed and called and chosen of God, I only say I seriously doubt that, but it may be. But I doubt it. It may come in the future, but speaking for myself, I just don't see it now.

As far as having knowledge to share, what could an outsider share with  the self professed people of God?

I am unworthy to wipe your Holy Feet.

Peace.

[arcticmonster2003]

quote arcticmonster2003

Yes, I can see what your awnser is to that - you are calling us liars, insane, wicked, or decieved. Has to be one of the four right?

quote Mickiel

I have called no one here anything of the sort. And I may well be wrong, but its still what I believe.  Its what I see, its what makes the most sense to me. I need not call any of you anything, because it matters not to me what you are, that only matters to yourselves.

No, you have not written those words directly, but instead leave room for only those 4 options, if your beliefs are correct, as you believe them to be, by telling us this:

quote Mickiel

But then what would that make all the prior claims from those who have spoken that they already have the Spirit? Well I think you know the answer to that.

Now I did not say that all apply to each person, but only perhaps one of those to each individual person whom claims to have the Holy Spirit - for example one may think he does, but does not, IE he is deceived, or one may know they do not but are embarressed to admit it IE a liar, or one may know he does not but seeks to spread his own agenda and by claiming his words are of the Spirit, IE wicked, or else one does not but is just insane - - there are many variations of these but I do believe those 4 words liar, insane, wicked, and deceived are about the only options available "if" you were correct and those whom claim they have the Holy Spirit do not.

quote Mickiel

You say you are annointed and called and chosen of God, I only say I seriously doubt that, but it may be. But I doubt it. It may come in the future, but speaking for myself, I just don't see it now.

As far as having knowledge to share, what could an outsider share with  the self professed people of God?

I am unworthy to wipe your Holy Feet.

I see some of that spirit that you are partaking of (the spirit of this world), is starting to make itself known, for all to see. This amount of sarcasm and spite, almost to the point of despising those whom are filled with the Holy Spirit in my opinion are what I would expect from the spirit of this world.

The spirit of the world seeks to destroy the faith of believers (and oh how it despises the faith of believers), and the spirit that coming from you Mickiel is seeking to destroy the very faith of Childred filled with the Holy Spirit, to make them doubt that they are even filled with the Holy Spirit - - and is seeking to deal them a harsh blow to their faith. I'm not saying this is your intention Mickiel, but it is the intention of the spirit that you are under currently.

[Mickiel]

[quote author=arcticmonster2003

I see some of that spirit that you are partaking of (the spirit of this world), is starting to make itself known, for all to see. This amount of sarcasm and spite, almost to the point of despising those whom are filled with the Holy Spirit in my opinion are what I would expect from the spirit of this world.

[/quote]

Make itself known, if you are trying to uncover my sins or weaknesses, you have but to ask, I hide nothing from any of you. For what? Why should I try to appear amoung you, what I am not, what would that benefit me? I am a sinner, and I have not progressed beyond that point. I already know I am of this world, and have made no claims otherwise.

You are the one who have made the Holy Spiritual claims, and you are the one who enjoys my weaknesses.

Peace.

[arcticmonster2003]

I do not enjoy your "weakness" as you put it. This would be twisted. I simply saw you posting supposed "truths", based on science falsly called and lest no rebuttal be make, many Children might have taken no rebuttal as agreement by everyone here.

[Mickiel]

despises [/b] the faith of believers), and the spirit that coming from you Mickiel is seeking to destroy the very faith of Childred filled with the Holy Spirit, to make them doubt that they are even filled with the Holy Spirit - - and is seeking to deal them a harsh blow to their faith. I'm not saying this is your intention Mickiel, but it is the intention of the spirit that you are under currently.

I do not seek to destroy, I simply post what I believe, like anyoneslse does. I believe what I post, they are not attacks, they are not efforts to deal harsh blows, they are what I see as the truth.

If that truth hurts you or anyonelse, then it is not me who supplies their weak faith, let God deal with their faith if it is destroyed. What kind of faith was it if one like me can destroy it anyway?  No, your just shaken by something, I wonder what it is?

Peace.