Author Topic: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!  (Read 3694 times)

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Offline WhiteWings

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #25 on: September 18, 2009, 10:44:08 PM »
KJV1 Corinthians 15:23  But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
WW1 Corinthians 15:23 But every harvest in his own order: Christ and the first fruits harvest; afterward the fall harvest at Christ's (second) coming.

That's the way I see it Tim.
The verse speaks about:
- Order => There must be at least two things/groups to be able to order something.
- Afterward => That implies the order is (also) based on time.
:iagree:
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #26 on: September 18, 2009, 11:47:38 PM »
IIRC the groom stays behind a blows the shofar. The bride is carried in mid air to the groom.

 :cloud9: No matter whether it's one or both getting lifted up in the air, there's the "rapture". But I think it's both......Blessings...



That's brilliant!

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #27 on: September 18, 2009, 11:55:57 PM »


A young girl from Ireland is a bit to vague for me to Google



Google found it immediately!
"This girls name was Margaret McDonald and as far as records show she was around fifteen at the time."
« Last Edit: September 19, 2009, 12:06:24 AM by Beloved Servant »

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #28 on: September 19, 2009, 02:23:16 AM »
Carnal thinking can do nothing but think that the word up is speaking of a geographical direction.

Offline Cardinal

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #29 on: September 19, 2009, 02:24:35 AM »
:cloud9: Well, WW, I would, except for the fact for the fact there is no rapture the way the church is teaching it, and that word is not even in there to begin with.
That the exact word isn't there is of no importance to me. For starters every language has it's own words. What counts for me is that there is a word, verse, parable that supports the (concept of the) word.
It's a bit like hell. That word is really in the Bible. It's just old English that aligns perfectly with UR.
But it's burned beyond recognition by the ETs. Same for rapture. I'm very well aware of that when replying to your previous post.
Said that something similar to rapture is in the Bible. I have no idea what exactly it 'looks' like. But the concept is there. So in some shape or form it exists. Or not?

Basicly my point is if we have to stop using words that can be explained wrongly; well then the forum will become very quiet :laughing7: We should let ourselfs be muzzled by people full of negativism who have  daytime job on purpose ridiculing every word they find.


Quote
A man took the prophecy of a young girl in Ireland and completely and without understanding of the Spirit, carnalized what was said and took his "show" on the road with it, spreading the distortion, which was quickly adopted by equally carnally minded churchgoers. Look it up, it's true. Blessings....
A young girl from Ireland is a bit to vague for me to Google :winkgrin:

I just checked my calendar and a rapture is very near  :laughing7: :Peace:



 :cloud9: Didn't mean to offend you with that WW and I hope you're not referring to me as in "people full of negativism who have daytime job on purpose ridiculing every word they find".

I did say that the concept of it, ie. the prophecy the girl got was run with by someone who wanted to build a name for themselves, and distorted the meaning of it, spiritually speaking.

And I said the word "rapture" is not in there; that is why I put it in quotes like that, because 1) when a word is not in there, it's generally a red flag that something is wrong, and 2) when people use that word (thanks to the error out there), most people assume we're talking about flying away.

So what I was trying to clarify, however poorly, was that, I am not talking about flying away.

And thank you Molly, for posting that about harpazo.

If any would like to see the real "rapture", you can compare the concept with being born from ABOVE by being CAUGHT UP into our mother, New Jerusalem, that Jesus was speaking to Nicodemus about. Funny, He didn't tell him he was going to fly away.....  :winkgrin:  Blessings... 
« Last Edit: September 19, 2009, 04:19:31 AM by Cardinal »
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Taffy

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #30 on: September 19, 2009, 02:33:31 AM »
Quote
If any would like to see the real "rapture", you can compare the concept with being born from ABOVE by being CAUGHT UP into our mother, New Jerusalem, that Jesus was speaking to Nicodemus about. Funny, He didn't tell him he was going to fly away.....    Blessings...
Indeed ,Caught up In Spirit and United One to another, no longer Earthly But Heavenly. :icon_flower:



 :icon_flower:
« Last Edit: September 19, 2009, 02:42:16 AM by Taffy »
Isa 29:18 And in that day shall the deaf hear the words of the book, and the eyes of the blind shall see out of obscurity, and out of darkness.

aspiring son

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #31 on: September 19, 2009, 04:57:05 AM »
:cloud9: Well, WW, I would, except for the fact for the fact there is no rapture the way the church is teaching it, and that word is not even in there to begin with.
That the exact word isn't there is of no importance to me. For starters every language has it's own words. What counts for me is that there is a word, verse, parable that supports the (concept of the) word.
It's a bit like hell. That word is really in the Bible. It's just old English that aligns perfectly with UR.
But it's burned beyond recognition by the ETs. Same for rapture. I'm very well aware of that when replying to your previous post.
Said that something similar to rapture is in the Bible. I have no idea what exactly it 'looks' like. But the concept is there. So in some shape or form it exists. Or not?

Basicly my point is if we have to stop using words that can be explained wrongly; well then the forum will become very quiet :laughing7: We should let ourselfs be muzzled by people full of negativism who have  daytime job on purpose ridiculing every word they find.


Quote
A man took the prophecy of a young girl in Ireland and completely and without understanding of the Spirit, carnalized what was said and took his "show" on the road with it, spreading the distortion, which was quickly adopted by equally carnally minded churchgoers. Look it up, it's true. Blessings....
A young girl from Ireland is a bit to vague for me to Google :winkgrin:

I just checked my calendar and a rapture is very near  :laughing7: :Peace:



 :cloud9: Didn't mean to offend you with that WW and I hope you're not referring to me as in "people full of negativism who have daytime job on purpose ridiculing every word they find".

I did say that the concept of it, ie. the prophecy the girl got was run with by someone who wanted to build a name for themselves, and distorted the meaning of it, spiritually speaking.

And I said the word "rapture" is not in there; that is why I put it in quotes like that, because 1) when a word is not in there, it's generally a red flag that something is wrong, and 2) when people use that word (thanks to the error out there), most people assume we're talking about flying away.

So what I was trying to clarify, however poorly, was that, I am not talking about flying away.

And thank you Molly, for posting that about harpazo.

If any would like to see the real "rapture", you can compare the concept with being born from ABOVE by being CAUGHT UP into our mother, New Jerusalem, that Jesus was speaking to Nicodemus about. Funny, He didn't tell him he was going to fly away.....  :winkgrin:  Blessings... 

I don't think you guys are disagreeing, really.

An experiance of feeling God's presence in a strong way could be considered a rapture. Being caught up in the air, ( the heavenlies) with him; the coming of the Lord is mostly translated from the word parousia which is Greek for presence. Studying these verses puts a new and true perspective on what we are to be diligantly waiting for, and it's not planes trains and automobiles crashing into one another because the pilots have left the earth. And while there will be the ultimate consumation of all things into Christ, these verses can be daily exercised by waiting for the spirit in all things ( deliverance, healing, maturity, etc).

Grace and peace

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #32 on: September 19, 2009, 05:05:54 AM »
agreed, aspiring son, but, there will be a breakthrough.

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #33 on: September 19, 2009, 05:19:33 AM »
Light travels, both ways, through the window

Offline Molly

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #34 on: September 19, 2009, 05:29:40 AM »
Quote from: aspiring son
Studying these verses puts a new and true perspective on what we are to be diligantly waiting for, and it's not planes trains and automobiles crashing into one another because the pilots have left the earth. And while there will be the ultimate consumation of all things into Christ, these verses can be daily exercised by waiting for the spirit in all things ( deliverance, healing, maturity, etc).

Exactly!  :thumbsup:



Quote from: Cardinal
Funny, He didn't tell him he was going to fly away.....   

No, but he did tell Nathanael this--
 :bigGrin:


51And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Hereafter ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man.


--John 1

"angels" [of God]

H4397
מלאך
mal'âk
mal-awk'
From an unused root meaning to despatch as a deputy; a messenger; specifically of God, that is, an angel (also a prophet, priest or teacher): - ambassador, angel, king, messenger.

Offline Beloved Servant

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #35 on: September 19, 2009, 05:37:24 AM »
Jesus is the ladder.

Offline Cardinal

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #36 on: September 19, 2009, 06:55:30 AM »
 :cloud9: Yes, He is........and it's a spiral ladder like our DNA, which has revolutions or generations (Genesis) as does the whirlwind that caught up Elijah, and as we receive revelation from Christ we both ascend and descend, because the Word is a two edged sword cutting asunder spirit from soul because we must decrease (descend), so He can increase (ascend).

The good news He carries or "catches us up", each step/rung of the way, so we are caught up to meet Him in the air, ie. HIS BREATH/revelation of the Spirit. He has come, He is coming and He will come.

Which is why it says man shall not live (or have life) by bread/letter alone, but by every word/breath that proceeds from mouth of God. The letter killeth (we decrease/descend) but the Spirit giveth life (we increase with Him/ascend).

Beats flying away, if you ask me.  :winkgrin: Blessings.....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline WhiteWings

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #37 on: September 19, 2009, 08:38:09 AM »
:cloud9: Well, WW, I would, except for the fact for the fact there is no rapture the way the church is teaching it, and that word is not even in there to begin with.
That the exact word isn't there is of no importance to me. For starters every language has it's own words. What counts for me is that there is a word, verse, parable that supports the (concept of the) word.
It's a bit like hell. That word is really in the Bible. It's just old English that aligns perfectly with UR.
But it's burned beyond recognition by the ETs. Same for rapture. I'm very well aware of that when replying to your previous post.
Said that something similar to rapture is in the Bible. I have no idea what exactly it 'looks' like. But the concept is there. So in some shape or form it exists. Or not?

Basicly my point is if we have to stop using words that can be explained wrongly; well then the forum will become very quiet :laughing7: We should let ourselfs be muzzled by people full of negativism who have  daytime job on purpose ridiculing every word they find.


Quote
A man took the prophecy of a young girl in Ireland and completely and without understanding of the Spirit, carnalized what was said and took his "show" on the road with it, spreading the distortion, which was quickly adopted by equally carnally minded churchgoers. Look it up, it's true. Blessings....
A young girl from Ireland is a bit to vague for me to Google :winkgrin:

I just checked my calendar and a rapture is very near  :laughing7: :Peace:



 :cloud9: Didn't mean to offend you with that WW and I hope you're not referring to me as in "people full of negativism who have daytime job on purpose ridiculing every word they find".
Not you Cardinal. Not even someone on this forum. More general speaking and certainly not excluding religious people.
Short example. Martin recommended a book of Klassen in another thread. I looked up the reviews at Amazon. Someone found that the author didn't use the word Trinity. Enough to burn down the whole book.

Quote
And I said the word "rapture" is not in there; that is why I put it in quotes like that, because 1) when a word is not in there, it's generally a red flag that something is wrong, and 2) when people use that word (thanks to the error out there), most people assume we're talking about flying away.
I have no idea what it will be like. I don't even want to argue if it happens say at 2012 or as Willie likely say it's always now. (or similar wording). That said for me that rapture is the story of the bride and groom. It's not there without reason.
Several parts of the wedding already have taken place (example the drinking of wine). Literally. So why not the other parts? I can fully accept every word in the Bible has (several) spiritual meanings. But the way I see it every prophesy has been fulfilled literally too. Jonah and the fish for example.

Quote
So what I was trying to clarify, however poorly, was that, I am not talking about flying away.
Never thought that Cardinal.
 :Peace: :reachout:
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline Cardinal

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Re: Understanding 1 Cor. 15:1-28 Help!
« Reply #38 on: September 19, 2009, 09:37:56 AM »
 :cloud9:  :ty: :2thumbs: for clearing that up! Blessings.....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor