Author Topic: The word 'Carnal'  (Read 5937 times)

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Offline Cardinal

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Re: The word 'Carnal'
« Reply #50 on: April 24, 2010, 10:57:40 PM »
 :cloud9: Thanks for sharing, Syndicated. Yes, you described the "Holy laughter" perfectly. You can't bottle it up. And I agree with you, it shouldn't matter WHERE He touches someone, only that He does.

I was slain in my bedroom reading the Word when I first came to Him when He opened my eyes to the truth hidden in Matt. 13 and realized there was no rapture the way it was being taught.

And the weeping you describe, is called "travail", and it's when the Spirit cries thru you in a type of deep intercession. It's what Jesus was doing when it said He groaned within Himself.

It's to "birth" something in the Spirit to come to pass, usually for someone else, but not always. My guess is that He was having you all intercede for the ones doing the shooting and/or anyone being shot.

There's lot of spiritual things He does as we press in to to know Him. Blessings.....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline Dallas

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Re: The word 'Carnal'
« Reply #51 on: April 26, 2010, 01:32:08 AM »
I know people do get effected by the presence of the Lord in different ways, but I would say 95% of the experiences people have are self-induced.

All the time I spent in church I witnessed and participated in what we declared was God moving amongst us and the slaying and crying and such. I went along for the most part because that'ts what you did, and besides I really wanted it to be true. The truth is, if people are honest with themselves, the amount of "God" moments they have experienced are mostly self-induced desire.

Now the motive isn't an evil motive of wanting God's touch....but there is also motive of "look at me being touched by God."

So, like I said, I know God does touch people and they all react differently, I don't believe there are specific responses. I like Samuel's response...he didn't even know that the voice wasn't beyond anything outside of normal.

Offline eaglesway

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Re: The word 'Carnal'
« Reply #52 on: April 26, 2010, 05:09:31 AM »
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was 'without form' and 'void'. So are we, in the beginning. Chaos, mixture, darkness, confusion.

Darkness was on the face of the deep. The eyes of our heart are veiled, we cannot see Jesus "as He is", therefore we cannot be transformed.

The Spirit moves upon the face of the waters. So also the Spirit hovers over us, whispering and waiting until the appointed time.

And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. When we hear His voice, there is revelation of Jesus, the image of God- In these last days He has spoken to us in His Son. He is the radiance of the Father's glory and the exact representation of His nature. We are transformed from chaos to form, emptiness to fullness, confusion to wisdom, hate to love, the veil is removed and transformation into the image of Christ begins.

And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. (Heb 4:12)

 (Gen 1:3-5) God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day. This is the day that the Lord has made, Let us rejoice and be glad in it.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. The earth was formless and void(mixture), and darkness was over the surface of the deep(carnality), and the Spirit of God was moving over the surface of the waters(stirring up by way of reminder). Then God said, "Let there be light"(understanding); and there was light. God saw that the light was good; and God separated the light from the darkness(discernment).
(Gen 1:1-4)

IMO carnality is essentially chaos. Being "without form and void". Unrenewed men are carnal. Renewed men who walk out their natural resources- full of mixture, babes, as in immature-still under the influence of the flesh and natural mind.

1Co 2:14  the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

1Co 3:1  And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.

1Co 3:3  For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

Carnality is basically being born of the spirit, but living out of the resources of the natural man. Captive in Babylon, confusion by mixture.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2010, 05:17:45 AM by eaglesway »
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood.

Offline Molly

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Re: The word 'Carnal'
« Reply #53 on: April 26, 2010, 05:28:52 AM »
Quote from: eaglesway
And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
(Gen 1:3-5)

Romans 8:29
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

--Gen 1

10And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him:

 11And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
--Mark 1

3And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

--Gen 1

1Behold, I will send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the LORD, whom ye seek, shall suddenly come to his temple, even the messenger of the covenant, whom ye delight in: behold, he shall come, saith the LORD of hosts.

--Malachi 3

Psalm 118:24
This is the day the LORD has made; let us rejoice and be glad in it.

Offline reFORMer

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Re: The word 'Carnal'
« Reply #54 on: April 26, 2010, 07:39:36 AM »
Some of my experiences of being "slain in the spirit" were different than you described Cardinal.  The first time I had prayed earnestly for Katheryn Kuhlman (sp?) on a matter.  Right after that she came to me in a dream.  I was playing on the piano something that had the title, "A New Song" on the score.  She put her hands on me and power overcame me just at the edge of enough for me to fall to the floor three times, only I didn't fall. It felt something like electric rain and looked something like a shower of sparks descending.  Then, after she walked away from me a bit, she turned and said, "Don't follow me.  Follow Him."

Another time, alone, I just totally lost all strength in myself.  I crumpled to the floor, knowing it was God.  I was yet propped up on my elbow.  Then, as that went too and I was completely helpless, prostrate on the floor, I thought, "How long could this last?" and, "What will my mother say?"  Then, as Paul wrote, "Whether in the body or out of the body, I know not," so I also don't know for sure; but, I think The Word God spoke to me knocked my spirit out out of my body and I was in another higher realm.  It came from behind and was, "Call no man Father."  Notice, there was a displacement in the order of events.  Then I saw someone dressed in a robe with an empire waistline.  He had dark hair and beard.  He had a stern look on his face.  (I am not sure why.)  He traversed a perfect arc, upright and standing still, several feet above me.

I also want to weigh in on the so-called "prosperity gospel."  The bottom line is that you will always have enough to do the will of God.  It's about a lot more than money.  In meetings where certain of God's Words concerning His intentions to prosper us were taught I recognized a mixture of people present.  Some served Mammon and for them God was a means to gain.  This is like about any other true doctrine which the carnal mind can turn into destruction.

God's will is to enlighten, liberate, heal, empower, enrich us.  The opposite is darkness and ignorance, bondage, sickness, weakness, poverty.  If you don't know what is done by an enemy and what is brought to us through the good news of Christ, you will be in confusion and subject to many unnecessary debilitations you could otherwise conquer.  You are destined to be a victor and not a victim.  I know there is a sort of "fine print" to all this.  We can have seasons of testing and tempting.  But, you need to know what God is like and where you are going.

Much of the problem in this discussion about "carnal, carnality" is too many sources for knowledge that are not sorted out.  The dictionary is not the source for Biblical definitions.  Neither is the English translations of Scripture.  We should start in surveying words in the original languages.

There is nothing wrong with having a body. We are born with "carnal" bodies, which is bodies of "meat," of "flesh."  Jesus was inCARNate, which means, He came in the flesh.  That forever sanctifies to us our being born flesh creatures.  But, we are to follow Him, in obedience to God, subjecting our human flesh nature to death, departing that room to go into God, bringing our body with us.  Because of Jesus' "self emptying" (Gk: kenosis) God highly exalted Him.

Philippians 2:5-8 (CLT)...
5 For let this disposition be in you, which is in Christ Jesus also,
6 Who, being inherently in the form of God, deems it not pillaging to be equal with God,
7 nevertheless empties Himself, taking the form of a slave, coming to be in the likeness of humanity,
8 and, being found in fashion as a human, He humbles Himself, becoming obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2010, 05:14:17 AM by reFORMer »
I went to church; but, the Church wasn't on the program!  JESUS WANTS HIS BODY BACK!!  MEET WITHOUT HUMAN HEADSHIP!!!

Offline Cardinal

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Re: The word 'Carnal'
« Reply #55 on: April 26, 2010, 09:29:30 AM »
 :cloud9: Good post........ :thumbsup: I only shared one type. I too have been taken to the floor fully awake. He manifests many different ways; the only thing "limiting" Him is our level of fear. Blessings....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline sheila

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Re: The word 'Carnal'
« Reply #56 on: April 27, 2010, 07:29:10 PM »

   man without understanding is like a beast before Him

   anyone who takes the mark of the beast can not live.

    the theif comes only to kill,steal and destroy, I have come

    that they may have life,and have it to the full

   First the natural man[image of the corruptible/first Adam/sin

and error/as a beast before God/lacking understanding]

  man is as a sheep[lacking understanding] that Christ/Spirit is

the shepherd is as the colt of a donkey that the spirit

of Christ rides/leads directs

  Man/Adam   the first and the Last

   Lev 27;27

   If a beast so much as touches the mountain...Exodus 19,12,13

   Only when the Ram's horn sounds a long blast may they go up to the mountain...

     1 Cor 15;52 and Rev 11;15...listen,Itell you a mystery,


   in a flash at the twinkling of an eye,at THE LAST TRUMPET

      for the TRUMPET WILL SOUND, the dead will be raised

   imperishable, AND WE WILL BE CHANGED


   to the house of the God of Jacob..HE WILL TEACH US HIS


   But they do not know the thoughts of the Lord; they do not

understand His plan, he who gathers them like sheaves to the

 threshing floor.

   Isaaih 55;8  for my thoughts are not your thoughts,and

neither are your ways my ways,declares the Lord. As the

heavens are higher than the earth,so are my ways higher than

yours,and my thoughts than your thoughts




Offline Molly

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Re: The word 'Carnal'
« Reply #57 on: April 27, 2010, 08:07:55 PM »

 9That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

--John 1

Matthew 6:23
But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!