SNIPPETS FROM THE HARD COPY UR LIBRARY OF RODGER TUTT

[ded2daworld]

Doesn't the scripture say that God alone is eternal?
I think that he is and if he alone is eternal than nothing else that scripture labels eternal can actually BE eternal

[sheila]

AND THIS IS ETERNAL LIFE..TO KNOW[BE ONE WITH] THE ONE TRUE GOD.

  1 JOHN 5;19 WE KNOW THAT WE 'ORIGINATE' WITH GOD/WE KNOW THAT WE ARE

 CHILDREN OF GOD[THE LITTLE CHILDREN WERE PARTAKERS OF FLESH AND BLOOD]

    AND THAT THE WHOLE WORLD IS UNDER THE CONTROL OF THE EVIL ONE

[eaglesway]

Doesn't the scripture say that God alone is eternal?
I think that he is and if he alone is eternal than nothing else that scripture labels eternal can actually BE eternal

So many definition come into play here. For instance....

If eternal means always was and always will be then only God is eternal

If eternal means to live forever then a created being who is given or possesses unending life could be considered eternal.

Some people define eternal as forever, but without end doesnt necessarily mean eternal. Without beginning or end definitely does mean eternal- and that is God alone.

But the truth is, the words eternal and forever are a few steps of translation and interpretation out of "olam".

If we are using the first definition then I would say yes, only God is eternal, since He is the source of all things but He Himself has no source and therefore only He can be eternal, having always been, and enduring forever in the now, I AM THAT I AM.

Exo 15:18  The LORD(YHWH) shall reign for ever(olam olam H5769) and ever.H5703 ad)

Psa 10:16  The LORD(YHWH) is King for everH5769 and ever:H5703 (same)

This Psalm throws a monkey wrench in the gears

The king shall joy in thy strength, O LORD; and in thy salvation how greatly shall he rejoice! Thou hast given him his heart's desire, and hast not withholden the request of his lips. Selah. For thou preventest him with the blessings of goodness: thou settest a crown of pure gold on his head. He asked life of thee, and thou gavest it him, even length of days for ever and ever.
(Psa 21:1-4)

If olam olam means "age" or "world" and "ad" means either "eternity" or "terminus"(world without end, (age unending)

The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever.H5703 ad
(Psa 37:29)

Thy throne, O God, is for ever(H5769olam olam) and ever:(H5703  ad)the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.
(Psa 45:6)



It seems that "ad" means "unending ending" or "the end that never ends" or "the end that goes on forever" HAHA

Olam definitely means "indefinite period of time" or "other world" as in "unknowable", "mist", so

The scriptures are no help HAHAHA (just kidding)

Actually I think the scriptures are great help and prove out through usage that "context is everything" even in the Hebrew and Greek.

Some boldly proclaim that "ad" means eternal but the scriptures destroy us again in context in Job

Job 20:4  Knowest thou not this of old,(H5703 ad) since man was placed upon earth,......

Since it says clearly "ad", SINCE MAN WAS PLACED ON EARTH.....DOH! , our first definition of eternal(without beginning or end) only works when "ad" is conjoined with GOD.... proving my theory that words like "olam" and "ad" are defined by the subjects they are joined with, not by absolute independent definition.

Therefore, like the relentless pencil head I am I declare again that "aion" and "aionios" and "aidos" are only transliterations into Greek from "olam" and "ad"

YHWH means I AM THAT I AM or "SELF EXISTENT ONE". When olam olam ad are joined to YHWH....

 יהוה מלך עולם ועד אבדו גוים מארצו׃  Psa 10:16 reading left to right, "

YHWH MELEK OLAM OLAM AD ABAD GOY GOY ERETS

Jehovah reigns ages unending undone peoples earth

or to paraphrase

Yahweh reigns forever, world without end- the nations perish and are undone.

In context the psalmist is comparing the eternal omnipotence of the Self Existent One with the nations that are like grass before the wind in comparison, in order to encourage the Israelites to trust and obey Him and not fear emulate their enemies, the heathen.


The king's daughter is all glorious within: her clothing is of wrought gold. She shall be brought unto the king in raiment of needlework: the virgins her companions that follow her shall be brought unto thee. With gladness and rejoicing shall they be brought: they shall enter into the king's palace. Instead of thy fathers shall be thy children, whom thou mayest make princes in all the earth. I will make thy name to be remembered in all generations: therefore shall the people praise thee for ever and ever.(olam olam ad)
(Psa 45:13-17)

This seems to be a Messianic prophecy, for only the name of Jesus will be made a name worthy of unending praise(Phil 2:10, therefore He has given Him the name above every name that at the name of Jesus........)

Psa 48:14  For this God(H430 Elohiym) is our GodH430 for ever and ever(olam olam ad): he will be our guide even unto(H5921 al- through, beyond) death.

In this verse our friendly KJV translaters translated ad as everlasting once and perpetual once- also translating olam olam into everlasting.



Hab 3:6  He stood, and measured the earth: he beheld, and drove asunder the nations; and the everlasting(olam olam) mountains were scattered, the perpetual(H5769 ad)hills did bow: his ways are everlasting.(olam olam)





 

[rodgertutt]

Thank you for your exposition eaglesway.

MUST AION MEAN ETERNAL? – PHILIP SCRANTON

"There are many texts in which aion and aionios cannot bear the meaning of eternity. And there are no texts in which the meaning of a limited period of time does not make reasonable sense. Our great loss is that when we ascribe the meaning of eternity to these words, we obliterate from view God's purpose of the eons. Further, the character of God is slandered, making Him the inflictor of incomprehensible woe.

It does not say that "all in Christ shall be made alive." It says, "in Christ shall all be made alive." The word for made alive means to be made immortal. After the great white throne, the unbelieving will participate in the second death – the lake of fire. Finally, at the consummation, when death is abolished, all will be made alive in Christ."

God is working all things after the counsel of His will and according to His perfect schedule. But the improper translation of "for the ages of the ages" ignores the purpose and climax of history.

The holies of the holies (plural/plural) were the two inner confines of the tabernacle. They were more holy than the outer court and the camp and all the places outside the camp. In like manner, the ages of the ages (mistranslated forever and ever) are the two greatest ages of history because of what will transpire during their time.
It does not cast the smallest shadow on the brilliance of God's glory to say that glory be attributed to Him during the climatic eons when His purpose will be realized by all and His glory seen more clearly than ever before." 94

[rodgertutt]

TARDY OF HEART TO BELIEVE ALL – F. NEIL POHORLAK

Do you find your heart tardy to believe that God will have all mankind to be saved?" 1Tim. 2:4

"Those who would not yield an inch from the position that all have sinned means all, do not hesitate to rob God of His all in all shall be justified, all shall be reconciled, all shall be vivified, that God may be All in all.

This is God's grand goal: all saved, all justified, all reconciled, all vivified, that God may be All in all. This goal will see fruition when the eons have run their course. Do not confuse God's goal with His process." 95

[ded2daworld]

Great! and Amen!

[lomarah]

Do not confuse God's goal with His process.

Love this! So true! 

[rodgertutt]

MARTIN ZENDER GOES TO HELL – MARTIN ZENDER

"The world hates God because of the picture Christianity has painted of Him. The doctrine of eternal torment is a teaching of demons; a myth. It infects the world via a series of false expressions, printed onto tracts and forced into sermons. Those who espouse and teach it are in full heed of deceiving spirits, though they know it not.
 
There must be a remedy, and there is. 2Timothy 2:15, 'Be diligent to present yourself approved to God as a workman who does not need to be ashamed, handling accurately the word of truth.'

He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit of God is saying." 96

[ded2daworld]

I listened to Martin Zender a lot on my way to UR belief.

[rodgertutt]

I listened to Martin Zender a lot on my way to UR belief.

Pray for Martin.
He is going through a rough time.
Here is part of a lengthy email he sent out this November 8th.

"I could sit here for hours trying to think of an easy or soft way to tell you what I have to tell you, but maybe there is no better way than to just say it: My wife has divorced me. I am sorry to have to start this communication to you as bluntly as that, but it is that blunt, that tragic, that cold, and that heartbreaking. I am still in shock over it. After only 16 months of marriage, the woman I was married to has quit our life together. There was nothing I could do to stop it. If I could have, I would have."

Note by Rodger:
As many of us know, belief in UR doesn't exempt us from experiencing life's tragedies.

[ded2daworld]

I know from experience what Martin is going through. You feel like, "It seemed so obviously God's leading when we were together" and now it makes you doubt your relationship with God because if you were wrong about God's leading there...
My resolution was like Martins, it wasn't me that decided the marriage was over and we don't have control of anyone else's spiritual relationship.

[eaglesway]

The enemy of our souls is always seeking whom he may devour. That is why we are to be watchful. Lot could not save his wife, because to each one is given the stewardship of their own soul. In an age where love is growing cold because iniquity abounds, the ties that bind are weakened and the brokenness of the world and the fruits of death and chaos are all around us like Noah's flood, rising up to the gunwhales of the ark, our safety- Jesus. Unfortunately, not everyone wants into the ark because the door is opened by picking up a cross. For some, that is to high a price to pay for deliverance.

[lomarah]

Aw, that's horrible for Martin.    And ded and eaglesway that's true, just because someone decides to leave doesn't mean it wasn't God that brought you together.

[Diane]

Update: Martin Zender has remarried, several months ago and seems to be very happy with this.

[rodgertutt]

Unfortunately Diane, it is Martin's newest wife (the one that you are referring to) that has very recently divorced him.

That is what hurts him so much, the fact that two wives left him unexpectedly.

[Diane]

Unfortunately Diane, it is Martin's newest wife (the one that you are referring to) that has very recently divorced him.

That is what hurts him so much, the fact that two wives left him unexpectedly.

Oh My!!  I didn't know that!  Thanks for the correction.  Yes, that would be devastating for anyone.   

[rodgertutt]

THE DEPTHS OF GOD WILL RETRIEVE ALL - ANTHONY J. BORRELLO

"Without God's Spirit the 'depths of God' remain unknown. What an essential factor this is in the believer's quest!

When God's immense love evokes us to a higher plain, nothing will thwart our yielding to Him. Our past illusions must fade away with all of its faηade in order that a more accurate realization of God and the depths of God can be grasped in prelude to the ultimate retrieving of all to God through Christ so He truly will be All in everyone. He shall be 'All in all' in the total kaleidoscope envelope of LOVE. This is the Spirit-Reality Whom we should unabatedly proclaim to those who have ears to hear." 97

[rodgertutt]

NONE LOST, NONE DESTROYED – ANTHONY J. BORRELLO

"It is not a matter of if, only a matter of when each individual will respond to the irresistible call of God's love – a love filled with such peace and calmness that no one will be able to withstand its comfort indefinitely.

The power of God's love will attract like a magnet EVERYONE to their safe consolation within the confines of reconciliation. This, my dear friends is what 'God being All in all' is all about. The happy tidings are that none will be eternally lost or destroyed.

When the Holy Spirit's vision arrives within us, then and only then will we be able to grasp the fact that God's love does not contain the words 'eternally lost or destroyed' in its vocabulary." 98

[rodgertutt]

SOONER OR LATER GOD ALL IN ALL - ANTHONY J. BORRELLO

"As hostile and objectionable our dear brethren may be, there are answers and explanations for every argument and/or insinuation presented against the undeniable fact, That God indeed is a God 'Who will have all men to be saved, and come into a knowledge of the truth (1Tim. 2:4). As greatly as man and their religious attempt to fight this utterly dynamic evangel (good news), God shall eventually be All in all (1Cor. 15:28)."
EDITOR'S ADDITION:
BIBLE THREATENINGS EXPLAINED
http://www.tentmaker.org/books/BibleThreateningsExplained.html

"But God is in no hurry. He has specific eons, and administrations within the eons, to fulfill His universal purpose and intention of universal reconciliation. All came out of Christ, including Adam. Consequently all shall be restored by and through Christ, 'yet each in his own class' (1Cor. 15:23)."
EDITOR'S ADDITION:
GOD'S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
THE EONS OF THE BIBLE WITH CONCORDANCE
http://www.saviourofall.org/Tracts/Eons2.html

"Annihilation is only one step from its false associate 'eternal torment.' When clouds of confusion gather regarding God's plan for mankind, and despair comes showering down upon our studies, turn to God's word originally rendered, then, like a searchlight in the darkness of night, His love, and His light of understanding will surely beam forth. God will not allow any to be eternally lost. He is a loving Creator, working out His purpose for the universe, Who will get love from all in return, so that He can and will be 'ALL in all,' to all, 'later.'"
EDITOR'S ADDITION:
WILL UNBELIEVERS BE ANNIHILATED?  -  chapters three and four
 (If necessary copy and paste the following url into your browser address bar)
http://www.lighthouselibrary.com/read.php?sel=2586&searchfor=||KNOCH, ADOLPH E||&type=&what=author

and

Eternal Death (Conditional Immortality, Annihilation): One Step Out of Hell; One Step Short of Glory
http://www.tentmaker.org/books/EternalDeath.html
99

[rodgertutt]

A snippet from 125 NUTS FOR CALVINISTS TO CRACK – C.R. Bierbower

"Although a Calvinist myself for more than thirty years, the scriptures declaring God's infinite love, and the plain teachings of Jesus my Lord on the subject of love, mercy and truth, finally sank my theological ship. This left me searching for the truth as it is in Jesus. Finally I was convinced by the overwhelming number of Scriptures that our great God and Heavenly Father truly does, without partiality, love the whole world, and He will in His own time and in His own way finally reconcile all men unto Himself.

Arminianism and Calvinism both represent each other as the method for God's work in salvation, and both vigorously reject the final reconciliation of all men. It is my purpose in this book to point out to my Calvinistic brethren the inconsistency of their interpretation of Scripture." 100

[rodgertutt]

100 SCRIPTURAL  PROOFS THAT JESUS CHRIST IS THE SAVIOR OF ALL MANKIND – THOMAS WHITTEMORE

INTRODUCTION:  "The Scriptures analyzed in this book declare that much more was accomplished by Christ than traditionally taught. May your eyes be enlightened to see the joy that Jesus saw as He hung on the tree of crucifixion. May the traditions of the elders fall as scales from your eyes to see the full magnitude of the victory of Jesus Christ! When they do, your Bible will appear to be a brand new book, full of the power of God's love to be victorious over all things." 101

[rodgertutt]

A TRUE REVELATION AND A SECOND WITNESS – TRAVIS OGLETREE

" 'For we must needs die, and are as water spilt upon the ground which cannot be gathered up again, yet doth God devise means that His banished be not expelled from Him' (2Sam.14:14). The entire passage from 2Sam.14:1-21 shows that no matter how far one may stray from the Lord and undergo internal banishment from a sense of acceptance, nevertheless, our merciful Lord God Himself has devised means whereby His banished ones would not be expelled forever from Him. 'For out of Him, and through Him, and for Him are all. To Him be glory for the eons! Amen!' (Rom. 11:36). 'For God locks up all together in stubbornness, that He should be merciful to all.' (Rom. 11:32 CLNT)." 102

[ded2daworld]

Rodger quoted, "The entire passage from 2Sam.14:1-21 shows that no matter how far one may stray from the Lord and undergo internal banishment from a sense of acceptance, nevertheless, our merciful Lord God Himself has devised means whereby His banished ones would not be expelled forever from Him."

"You say you've walked 10,000 miles away? Dontcha know that it's only one step back?" - Petra

[rodgertutt]

Rodger quoted, "The entire passage from 2Sam.14:1-21 shows that no matter how far one may stray from the Lord and undergo internal banishment from a sense of acceptance, nevertheless, our merciful Lord God Himself has devised means whereby His banished ones would not be expelled forever from Him."

"You say you've walked 10,000 miles away? Dontcha know that it's only one step back?" - Petra

I believe that sooner or later, according to God's perfect timing for each individual, God will effectively influence everyone to take that step.

THE CHRIST OF GLORY – MARVIN W. RICE

"May we get a glimpse of Christ's wondrous Person as we peer into Sacred Writ. As we go back before the ages of time, through the eons of the Scriptures, forward to the grand finale, to the consummation of the ages, to that day when total reconciliation is completed and eternity continues.

'every knee bowing, celestial
and terrestrial and subterranean,
and every tongue acclaiming that
Jesus Christ is Lord, for the
glory of the Father'

God would receive no glory merely to see the unbelievers agree that Jesus is Lord, but too late, thus going off to destruction. Nay! The blood of the cross will prevail in every situation, eliminating all sins. What august glory this will bring to the Father as every last one of His creatures acclaim His beloved Son as their Lord!" 103

[rodgertutt]

JUSTIFICATION – DONALD G. HAYTER

"Although God introduced sin through the agency of His creatures, yet He did not sin in so doing. For it was no mistake, no failure of His. It was in accord with His intention, and it will be justified by the beneficial results obtained through its agency. In the brilliant glory of His ultimate the most somber and gloomy features of earth's history are transformed into a brilliant display of His power and wisdom and love.

During the final eons every creature in the heavens and on the earth and under the earth will have learned of the sufferings of the Christ, and of the depths of the Father's love revealed in them, and every knee will bow to Him Who died, acclaiming Him Lord, for the glory of God the Father. Thus will all ultimately be justified." 104