Author Topic: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings  (Read 9639 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline jabcat

  • Admin
  • *
  • Posts: 8820
  • SINNER SAVED BY GRACE
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #75 on: August 20, 2013, 04:41:42 AM »
Well, I've been watching this, and we're really bordering on discussing moderation issues publically, which probably needs to change direction real quickly.   :2c:

I don't know, but often we don't feel someone else's comments are out of line if they suit our own view.    Simply expressing a view, either way, is not out of line.  Telling someone, basically, to keep their mouth shut, is another issue.  What one person sees in a topic, may be just the opposite the other sees/understands, but then it goes right back the other direction too - while both are trying to get their understanding out of the same scriptures.   I believe since we're all human, we're veiled to varying degrees, have different understandings and abilities, etc.   That's why we encourage discussion rather than outright debate or arguing, i.e., "you're wrong and I'm right, so be quiet about it".  Because if that goes on ad infinitum, one person may think they've won - but in the process, what's happened is, the community/forum has lost.

I commend you micah on your PM, good job.  This thread isn't about Molly, but since there keep being comments, I'm going to say this.  I'm not saying that anyone in that most recent discussion said everything perfectly.  However, a particular participant involved had been a member for 6-8 years.  Also that member had come to the understanding of The Victorious Gospel of Jesus Christ during those years of participation on the forum (the focus of the forum) - and that not until having been on the forum for several years, in fact, only about 3 years ago.     However, following that thread, that member has pretty much left the forum.  Over-all, who won?
« Last Edit: August 20, 2013, 05:09:53 AM by jabcat »
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Offline micah7:9

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 5467
  • Gender: Male
  • Mic 7:8 Thou dost not rejoice over me, O mine ene
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #76 on: August 20, 2013, 05:03:24 AM »
ABSOLUTELY NO ONE! It is, in my opinion, it is, and should not be a matter of winning or losing. When we, all, I, discuss the Bible, the doctrines that we, all, I, pick up along the way, without the Bible as our solid foundation, are nothing more than the teachings(doctrines) we, I, all, pickup along the way. For me the Word of God is difficult enough attempting to discern with what small amount of wisdom and knowledge I, we, all, have been given by the Holy Spirit.
When we, I, all, build on a Truth, heated as the discussion maybe come, we, I, all, will learn. Building on a doctrine outside of that, is what is so often called for on the forum is opinion. :HeartThrob: :dsunny:

PS. thank you Jabcat
Mic 7:8  Thou dost not rejoice over me, O mine enemy, When I have fallen, I have risen, When I sit in darkness Jehovah is a light to me.

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 3557
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #77 on: August 22, 2013, 08:41:15 AM »
The battle is in my mind .
The flesh and the spirit at war.

When I pray in a manner, that the results of such prayer,
are evident to those around me.
Those around me will want to appeal to me and my flesh to
do it again .They want it bigger they me to hit the rock harder.

When I pray and the evidence, of the results of such prayers,
are only spiritually discerned .

I and my flesh can be easily dismissed .

I and my spirit will not be denied.
God will extract the Glory for Jesus as I give up
my Flesh's desire to bring Glory to the Christ.   

Beautiful and insightful post. :HeartThrob:
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #78 on: August 29, 2013, 08:45:40 PM »
Matt 10:27 What I tell you in darkness, that speak you in light: and what you hear in the ear, that preach you on the housetops.

In a synagogue the rabbi reads and speaks/whispers the word into the ear of the meturgan. The meturgan was highly skilled in both ancient and modern (of that day) Hebrew. He translated when needed. The meturgan then shouted the message to everyone present.

So what does Mat 10:27 mean.
Imo:
- I = rabbi ===> I = Jesus (via HS)
- You = meturgan ===> you = Bible student

 :2c:
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #79 on: August 29, 2013, 08:55:09 PM »
The reed and the oak

Matt 11:7 (AKJV)
7 And as they departed, Jesus began to say to the multitudes concerning John, What went you out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken with the wind?

The above is  a reference to the parable of the reed and the oak.

The mighty oak with it's strong roots (faith) never bent for the wind (false doctrines/enemies of his belief).
But a really strong storm (enemy) may blow over (death) the oak (believer).
---> The oak fights to the bitter end to defend his belief.

The reed has a totally opposite tactic. It bends by the slightest breeze of wind. A next to useless believer.

So John was a mighty oak that rather dies than bend for false doctrine.

 :2c:

1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline Colleen

  • Full
  • *
  • Posts: 90
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #80 on: August 30, 2013, 05:54:10 AM »
I'm intrigued White Wings.  What are the four angels holding? Is it the same kind of thing? A covering?

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #81 on: August 30, 2013, 08:42:54 AM »
Colleen below a quote from a "wedding article"I'm working on. I hope it at least answers part of your question. I want to point out if that the conclusion below can only be drawn from Hebrew. And therefore for me it's another bit of proof of Hebraic thought in the NT.

The angels in Rev 7:1 are restraining the wind. English and Greek give the impression it's just regular wind, but actually it's a Hebrew idiom meaning God holding back His blessing on the harvests as shown in Deut 28 and 29. The Holy Spirit is also called wind. So this verse tells us God is retracting His blessings. The land isn't harmed by actively destroying is with storm/wind but by letting evil run its cause by removing the blessing. So God punishes by doing nothing. The Holy Spirit that always worked for the benefit of man is restrained from benefitting man. One less opponent for satan. There is just one Holy Spirit but the verse is about four winds. The corners (seem to) refer to the 'tanaf'; the corners of a prayer shawl.  Those corners had special tassels on them that were symbolic of God/God's authority. God and the Holy Spirit are very closely linked so that's the reason one Holy Spirit is called four winds. To take this one step further; when the angles are holding the four tassels they are holding the prayer shawl as a covering over the earth. A covering refers to covenant. The shawl is also called wings.

Mal 4:2 But to you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and you shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.
Matt 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you that kill the prophets, and stone them which are sent to you, how often would I have gathered your children together, even as a hen gathers her chickens under her wings, and you would not!

Restraining the winds doesn't mean God also stops blessing the righteous people. It's a punishment for sinners. God no longer covers their sins with grace. Things are getting serious now. Many got the message and turned to God as the verse below shows. There is always time to repent. God's goal isn't to destroy but to chance upon chance to repent...

Rev 7:14 And I said to him, Sir, you know. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribula-tion, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

God often covers several people because of the righteousness of one. A good example of that is Sodom and Gomorrah. God was asked to spare the cities if a few righteous people lived in those cities. God agreed. God covered Egypt because Joseph people lived there too. But when God finally decided to stop covering, withhold blessing, restrain the four winds God provided personal instead of nationwide covering. And that's what's happening in this revelation verse. God is replacing the world-wide covering with a more personal version. So, once again, God doesn't cause all terrors found in Revelations, He merely stops shielding us from harm.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #82 on: August 30, 2013, 12:28:12 PM »
A Jewish couple stated their marriage vows/blessing under a Chuppah

The Chuppah comes in many forms and shapes. But the only thing about it that really matters is the covering cloth.
So sometimes 4 groomsmen held a prayer shawl over the heads of the couple.

So...imo...that means God is giving the people that still rebel a hard time by withholding His blessings but at the same time providing shelter for the bride.

Fact or fiction? It's a nice thought  :winkgrin:
« Last Edit: August 30, 2013, 12:35:17 PM by WhiteWings »
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline eaglesway

  • < Moderator >
  • *
  • Posts: 3557
  • Gender: Male
  • Grace & Peace be multiplied unto you, in Jesus
    • Hell is a Myth.com
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #83 on: September 03, 2013, 06:01:10 AM »
Defintely a nice thought, and I think- a true one.
The Logos is complete, but it is not completely understood. hellisamyth.com

Offline sheila

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 3413
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #84 on: September 03, 2013, 06:54:55 PM »
 :thumbsup:  finish that article up WW,I can't hardly wait to read it!!!! :dsunny:

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #85 on: September 20, 2013, 09:40:30 PM »
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline God Chaser

  • Full
  • *
  • Posts: 23
Re: Grab Bag - Various UR Points, Thoughts, Questions...
« Reply #86 on: October 10, 2013, 05:17:27 AM »
I didn't realize Augustine had made this specific argument 1500+ years ago;

"Is it not folly to assume that eternal punishment signifies a fire lasting a long time, while believing that eternal life is life without end? For Christ, in the very same passage, included both punishment and life in one and the same sentence when he said, "So those people will go into eternal punishment, while the righteous will go into eternal life" (Matt 25:46) If both are "eternal," it follows necessarily that either both are to be taken as long lasting but finite, or both as endless and perpetual. The phrases "eternal punishment" and "eternal life" are parallel and it would be absurd to use them in one and the same sentence to mean "Eternal life will be infinite, while eternal punishment will have an end " Hence, because the eternal life of the saints will be endless, the eternal punishment also, for those condemned to it, will assuredly have no end."

St. Augustine, City of God

Got the above from a quite interesting site.  The guy's not a universalist, but has some pretty interesting thoughts;

http://ekklesiahellweek.wordpress.com/

So it seems Augustine is not justifying "eternal punishment" based on its Greek translation, and in fact, he is actually challenging the Greeks on their translation which they held for the last several centuries before Augustine. Is that about right?

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #87 on: October 10, 2013, 09:13:49 AM »
I think he did justify ET with it.
Imo he simply states the words to describe the duration of punishment and life are the same. If one in everlasting the other one is everlasting too.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #88 on: October 31, 2013, 08:45:06 PM »
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline Lazarus Short

  • Bronze
  • *
  • Posts: 1504
  • Gender: Male
  • The truth points to itself. -Kosh Naranek
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #89 on: November 01, 2013, 05:02:30 AM »
"An Ancient Way of Cooking the Lamb" - it just gets more and more clear, once we set foot on the path!
Socrates taught Plato.  Plato taught Aristotle.  Aristotle tutored the son of Philip of Macedon.  This boy grew up to become Alexander the Great, largely by slaughtering a lot of people.  That's philosophy.

Jesus spoke the Truth.  He blessed the poor.  He healed the sick.  He even raised the dead.  He died on a cross for us, lived again, and came back long enough to tell us to love one another.  That's religion.

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #90 on: November 12, 2013, 08:47:46 AM »
Traditional translations of 1 Corinthians 7.1 suggest to the reader that the words "It is good for a man not to touch a woman" (KJV) are Paul's words of advice to the Corinthians. Many recent translations, however, correctly indicate that Paul is here quoting words from a letter written to him from the Corinthians. The Greek words peri de ("now concerning") here and in 8.1; 12.1; 16.1, and 16.12 introduce a new topic that has been raised in a letter from Corinth. The words translated "to touch" are a euphemism for "to have sexual relations." The following translation in REB is recommended as a model for other languages: "Now for the matters you wrote about. You say, 'It is a good thing for a man not to have intercourse with a woman.'"
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline Lazarus Short

  • Bronze
  • *
  • Posts: 1504
  • Gender: Male
  • The truth points to itself. -Kosh Naranek
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #91 on: November 12, 2013, 07:59:25 PM »
WW, do you see that unseen letter as an indication of Gnostic asceticism trying to creep in?
Socrates taught Plato.  Plato taught Aristotle.  Aristotle tutored the son of Philip of Macedon.  This boy grew up to become Alexander the Great, largely by slaughtering a lot of people.  That's philosophy.

Jesus spoke the Truth.  He blessed the poor.  He healed the sick.  He even raised the dead.  He died on a cross for us, lived again, and came back long enough to tell us to love one another.  That's religion.

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #92 on: November 12, 2013, 11:01:28 PM »
Maybe not purposely. When learning something new know things are often used a reference point. I've never seen the letter so I don't know if they politely asked Paul or tried to convince him of their views.

I think it's important to know when pagan stuff is used as a reference point. We have seen that in various places like Hades which is pure Greek mythology.
But also the reference to elements in Gal 4:3,9 and 2 Pet 3:10,12 is pagan.
To be clear mocking pagan stuff. For example many see the elements burning up as a nuclear war. But in Greek mythology it's "end of the age of the gods". Or more general the core of a 1000 and 1 Greek philosophies.

http://home.online.nl/spamfree/Lake/Elements.html
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #93 on: November 27, 2013, 09:20:40 AM »
"To him who overcomes, I will give some of the hidden manna."

The hidden manna is symbolic for Jesus Christ, which you'll see in a moment, and it refers to the 'Afikomen' tradition at the Passover Seder meal that is still practiced to this day. The tradition goes something like this;

1) The leader of the Seder, generally the father, would open a linen bag with three unleavened bread wafers in it called 'matzah'.
2) He would remove the middle matzah and break it in half. 
3) He would wrap the broken matzah in linen and hide it in the house during the course of the meal. This of course brings with it the imagery of the 'hidden manna', since this wafer (representing manna) would be hid-den.
4) After the meal, the children would be turned loose to find this hidden manna (the 'Afikomen').
5) The one that found the Afikomen would receive a reward.
6) The 'middle matzah' or 'hidden manna' would then be shared with every member of the family.

Naturally we can see the crucifixion of the Lord in this tradition, along with our promised salvation. The wafer represents the Lord who was broken, wrapped in linen, and hidden away in a tomb. And those who 'find' the Lord are rewarded with eternal life, a reality that will be shared by the entire Jewish family when "all Israel will be saved" in the last days.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #94 on: November 28, 2013, 08:23:10 PM »
EKKLESIA:
The word Greek ekklesia, often translated as church, and Hebrew synagogue both mean 'assembly'. The Hebrew B'rit Chadashah (NT), which uses the word haKeneset, which also refers to an assembly such as we would find in the synagogue. This word comes from the same roots that form 'haKnesset', the word used to describe the Congress (assembly) of Israel. This is where it gets quite interesting, because several other Hebrew words created from this same root have some very interesting implications for the Church;

HaKeneset = Synagogue or Assembly
Keneseeyah = Church
Keneeyah = Purchase Contract
Keneesah = Right of Entry

Notice how each of these words, formed from the same root, describe our salvation.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline dajomaco

  • 500
  • *
  • Posts: 845
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #95 on: December 02, 2013, 07:40:55 PM »
"To him who overcomes, I will give some of the hidden manna."

The hidden manna is symbolic for Jesus Christ, which you'll see in a moment, and it refers to the 'Afikomen' tradition at the Passover Seder meal that is still practiced to this day. The tradition goes something like this;

1) The leader of the Seder, generally the father, would open a linen bag with three unleavened bread wafers in it called 'matzah'.
2) He would remove the middle matzah and break it in half. 
3) He would wrap the broken matzah in linen and hide it in the house during the course of the meal. This of course brings with it the imagery of the 'hidden manna', since this wafer (representing manna) would be hid-den.
4) After the meal, the children would be turned loose to find this hidden manna (the 'Afikomen').
5) The one that found the Afikomen would receive a reward.
6) The 'middle matzah' or 'hidden manna' would then be shared with every member of the family.

Naturally we can see the crucifixion of the Lord in this tradition, along with our promised salvation. The wafer represents the Lord who was broken, wrapped in linen, and hidden away in a tomb. And those who 'find' the Lord are rewarded with eternal life, a reality that will be shared by the entire Jewish family when "all Israel will be saved" in the last days.

A wonderful post. Thanks ww

I would assume that the father would give hints or clues to the children.
If the hidden manna was not found in a timely manner.


Offline WhiteWings

  • Gold
  • *
  • Posts: 12654
  • Gender: Male
  • Yahshua heals
    • My sites
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #96 on: December 02, 2013, 08:21:18 PM »
I don't know but would assume so. Just like present day parents hiding easter eggs. They are always hidden in  ways they can be found. If the kids are young they are hidden in very visible places. The ancient Jewish house often had a single room.
Only the ET Jews would hide it in a vault in a hidden room  :laughing7:

What amazes me more if that the customs of the Jews fit so well with lots of things of God's Plan. Many, like this one, aren't found in the OT.
Would it be an example of: Proverbs 16:9 In their hearts humans plan their course, but the LORD establishes their steps.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline JulieTang84

  • 500
  • *
  • Posts: 679
  • Gender: Female
  • Loving to Live, Living to Love
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #97 on: December 02, 2013, 11:57:09 PM »
I don't know but would assume so. Just like present day parents hiding easter eggs. They are always hidden in  ways they can be found. If the kids are young they are hidden in very visible places. The ancient Jewish house often had a single room.
Only the ET Jews would hide it in a vault in a hidden room  :laughing7:

What amazes me more if that the customs of the Jews fit so well with lots of things of God's Plan. Many, like this one, aren't found in the OT.
Would it be an example of: Proverbs 16:9 In their hearts humans plan their course, but the LORD establishes their steps.


Well spoken WW.


I for one have so many fond memories of Christmas and Easter. As a child the anticipation was almost too much. My mom would make a big deal out of giving and made sure I always had presents to give. I would help pick them out and wrap them and even sign the cards as best I could. Christmas was a magical time, singing Christmas songs at the Lutheran school I attended. Oh sure it was great to open presents, but it was a lot of fun watching others open theirs too.


I know many deny their children Christmas, for many reasons. Secular, sure but what isn't these days. I would venture to guess, those that complain most could be the most secular of all.


As you quoted WW:  Proverbs 16:9 In their hearts humans plan their course, but the LORD establishes their steps.


No parent can lead a child where Father cannot find. There is much goodness, kindness; among other things that can benefit a child greatly through most of the secular holidays. Even Thanksgiving:  just because the true meaning is glossed over through commercialism, does not mean that any Spirit driven parent cannot bring the real meaning out and celebrate giving Thanks.


I would hate to think that any here are making an idol out of any of these holidays. Those that have yet blind hearts will have a better chance of seeing an alternate "spiritual" point of view, if one is given. Staying home, doing nothing is not a lot different than burying the silver.


Love Julie  :HeartThrob:

Don't Forget LOVE.

Offline Seth

  • Silver
  • *
  • Posts: 2207
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #98 on: December 03, 2013, 12:26:16 AM »
Quote from: JulieTang
I would hate to think that any here are making an idol out of any of these holidays. Those that have yet blind hearts will have a better chance of seeing an alternate "spiritual" point of view, if one is given. Staying home, doing nothing is not a lot different than burying the silver.

I totally agree. It's important to know what an idol really is. It's an earthly replacement for God, whether a gold calf, money itself, or the biggest idol of all: SELF, that is pride. Without those characteristics, there is no idol. That's why I believe it's fine to celebrate the holidays, as long as you put them in their own place. It goes to the intention. If you know you aren't placing the day above another, as if to downgrade God's importance on any other ordinary day, then celebrating holidays is not defiling you. It's always what proceeds from the heart that defiles a man.

Offline mplsfitter539

  • 300
  • *
  • Posts: 436
  • Gender: Male
Re: Grab Bag - Various Christian/UR Musings
« Reply #99 on: December 03, 2013, 03:53:16 PM »
Quote from: JulieTang
I would hate to think that any here are making an idol out of any of these holidays. Those that have yet blind hearts will have a better chance of seeing an alternate "spiritual" point of view, if one is given. Staying home, doing nothing is not a lot different than burying the silver.

I totally agree. It's important to know what an idol really is. It's an earthly replacement for God, whether a gold calf, money itself, or the biggest idol of all: SELF, that is pride. Without those characteristics, there is no idol. That's why I believe it's fine to celebrate the holidays, as long as you put them in their own place. It goes to the intention. If you know you aren't placing the day above another, as if to downgrade God's importance on any other ordinary day, then celebrating holidays is not defiling you. It's always what proceeds from the heart that defiles a man.
Seth I just read a few verses that disagree with your personal opinion.
Jer 10:1-5
1 Hear ye the word which the Lord speaketh unto you, O house of Israel:

2 Thus saith the Lord, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.

3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.

4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.

5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good.

So here Yahweh says Don't do it. Don't bring the tree inside the house and decorate it with gold and silver balls. Maybe what Yahweh means here is go ahead and enjoy the pagan holy days but just don't bring the tree inside and decorate it. Or maybe Yahweh is saying don't even acknowledge the pagan holy days because they are evil. I believe if something is evil we are required to not participate in it. The problem here is when Christians begin to think they know more than Yahweh does about the effects of participation in evil.
Shema O Israel, Yahweh our Elohim is Yahweh echad!!!