Author Topic: Jurgen Moltmann on the Final Judgement...  (Read 1194 times)

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cityonahill

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Jurgen Moltmann on the Final Judgement...
« on: April 06, 2009, 04:20:19 AM »
I am a huge fan of Jurgen Moltmann(a german theologian)...

Moltmann recently did a lecture at a conference called "The Final Judgement: Sunrise of Christ's Liberating Justice"...I think he presents a strong argument in favor of UR.
The lecture is in audio format...Here is a link to a blog providing a brief summary of the content. Enjoy!

http://www.rustyparts.com/wp/2007/03/05/moltmann-on-the-final-judgement/
« Last Edit: April 06, 2009, 04:24:54 AM by cityonahill »

Offline sven

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Re: Jurgen Moltmann on the Final Judgement...
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2009, 09:01:19 PM »
I've read it in German, I must admit I got some tears in my eyes 

Quote
The justice he will bring is not retributive justice that rewards the good and punishes the evil, but rather God's creative justice which brings the victims justice and puts the perpetrators right. The victims will be judged and given dignity and healing. The perpetrators of evil will experience the justice that puts things to right and transforms them. They will be saved by the crucified Christ who comes to them together with their victims.


 :thumbsup:
« Last Edit: April 06, 2009, 09:03:28 PM by sven »

Offline Tony N

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Re: Jurgen Moltmann on the Final Judgement...
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2009, 10:43:54 PM »
This quote comes from the web site link provided above:
Quote
Modern adaptations have put the personally responsible human being at the center instead of the wrathfully judging God. No one is sent to heaven or hell against his or her will—it is a person's will, their decision for or against God, that decides their destiny. If the responsible human being is at the center, then no one knows at what future he or she will arrive because decisions can vacillate. The last judgement becomes a symbol for the ultimate endorsement for our free will. According to both of the above ideas human beings are the masters of their own fate, or their own executioners, and the role of God is thereby reduced, an accomplice to human being's free will.

Since Moltmann opposes both of these views of the final judgement, I wonder, then, what is the point of human free will? Perhaps we are given the ability to choose right or wrong, help or harm so that we have the real possibility of participating in God's kingdom or the real possibility of love?

Man, I'm glad my justification rests upon Christ's faith and not my vascillating faith! It is rock solid.
Our participation in God's kingdom is due to Christ's faith. God then chooses us, fills us with His spirit and makes us worthy to take part in His kingdom and our love for God thus swells beyond former human constraints.

When Saul was on the Damascus road on his way to bind Christians and bring them back to Jerusalem, God overwhelmed Saul/Paul with faith and love. He did not ask Paul: "Would you pretty please believe in Me?" And the interesting fact is this: Paul said that the way God saved him is how God will save everyone.

1Ti 1:13-16  I, who formerly was a calumniator and a persecutor and an outrager: but I was shown mercy, seeing that I do it being ignorant, in unbelief."  (14)  Yet the grace of our Lord overwhelms, with faith and love in Christ Jesus."  (15)  Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all welcome, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, foremost of whom am I."  (16)  But therefore was I shown mercy, that in me, the foremost, Jesus Christ should be displaying all His patience, for a pattern of those who are about to be believing on Him for life eonian."
Just because God says He will save all mankind
does not necessarily mean He won't.

Offline legoman

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Re: Jurgen Moltmann on the Final Judgement...
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2009, 03:35:23 PM »
1Ti 1:13-16  I, who formerly was a calumniator and a persecutor and an outrager: but I was shown mercy, seeing that I do it being ignorant, in unbelief."  (14)  Yet the grace of our Lord overwhelms, with faith and love in Christ Jesus."  (15)  Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all welcome, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, foremost of whom am I."  (16)  But therefore was I shown mercy, that in me, the foremost, Jesus Christ should be displaying all His patience, for a pattern of those who are about to be believing on Him for life eonian."


 :thumbsup: Thanks for pointing that verse out Tony!  Awesome.

Offline Tony N

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Re: Jurgen Moltmann on the Final Judgement...
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2009, 04:59:06 PM »
1Ti 1:13-16  I, who formerly was a calumniator and a persecutor and an outrager: but I was shown mercy, seeing that I do it being ignorant, in unbelief."  (14)  Yet the grace of our Lord overwhelms, with faith and love in Christ Jesus."  (15)  Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all welcome, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, foremost of whom am I."  (16)  But therefore was I shown mercy, that in me, the foremost, Jesus Christ should be displaying all His patience, for a pattern of those who are about to be believing on Him for life eonian."


 :thumbsup: Thanks for pointing that verse out Tony!  Awesome.


Thanks legoman. I can see in my own life being saved according to the pattern Paul was saved. The pattern is not that we have to be persecuting Christians but that  the grace of our Lord will overwhelm us with faith and love in Christ Jesus.
Just because God says He will save all mankind
does not necessarily mean He won't.