Author Topic: God's Plans for the Ages  (Read 2405 times)

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Offline Aleax

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Re: God's Plans for the Ages
« Reply #25 on: October 04, 2011, 01:37:53 PM »
I meant the original hard copy book has faded text, possibly too faded for using teh OCR method. The book is out of print and I was only able to find a used copy. For now one must d/l the ~60 Mb file if they want the book. There probably would've been a way to reduce the size greatly, but my computer skills are kind of outdated.
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The Plan of The Ages: God's Unfailing Love Revealed in the Cross

Offline WhiteWings

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Re: God's Plans for the Ages
« Reply #26 on: October 04, 2011, 03:09:15 PM »
Ok, understood.
I'll join the pages into one file and will try to reduce the size.
I'll PM you when done.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Offline Aleax

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Re: God's Plans for the Ages
« Reply #27 on: October 04, 2011, 11:31:05 PM »
Thanks to WW it's now available merged in one file, and in 10% of the original size.

https://rcpt.yousendit.com/1244495050/50d64ff74761faccf10f95b2e525c4c6

The link seems to expire on Oct 11, so grab the book before that if you want it.
Behold, I make a few things new.

The Plan of The Ages: God's Unfailing Love Revealed in the Cross

Offline jabcat

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Re: God's Plans for the Ages
« Reply #28 on: November 29, 2011, 08:24:57 AM »
Anyone have any new thoughts on this topic?  It's such an awesome, HUGE thing!
Neither should there be vulgar speech, foolish talk, or coarse jesting--all of which are out of character--but rather thanksgiving.  Eph. 5:4  **  Saved 1John 3.2, Eph. 2:8, John 1:12 - Being saved 2Cor. 4:16 2Peter 3:18 - Will be saved 1Peter 1:5 Romans 8:23

Doug

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Re: God's Plans for the Ages
« Reply #29 on: November 29, 2011, 05:21:29 PM »
Anyone have any new thoughts on this topic?  It's such an awesome, HUGE thing!


The chart from Concordant Publishing is a huge thing; below is a tiny segment from it:



Adolph Ernst Knoch was an ultradispensationalist, and so he was influenced by the views of John N. Darby, Wm. Kelly, E. W. Bullinger, Sir Robert Anderson, and others. He was associated with the "Plymouth Brethren" in Los Angeles, where he was baptized.  His view on the 70 weeks of Daniel 9 is similar to theirs. His position on the Church was such that in his mind, he separated believers of Jewish descent, from those who were Gentiles. This is evident in many of his articles and is represented although in a rather obscure manner, in the full chart from Concordant Publishing, under the section "The mysteries or secrets," where the apostles of the Lord are placed in a box separate from the "secret economy pertaining to God's purpose for the celestials." He puts this under the heading of Paul, while the other apostles are associated with ethnic Jews.
   
Wikipedia says of A. E. Knoch's theology, "Though in a revised forom, but still in principle, he retained the strong dispensationalism of the Brethren Movement (developed by Darby), and the two different gospels for the Jews and the Nations."

In the full chart, there is a box below the one representing the present church age in which it is stated, "When this section is folded under or covered the course God would have taken if Israel had not rejected their Messiah is exhibited."

I suspect this idea was derived from one of the nineteenth century German critics. It is incompatible with and IMO contradicts the statement of James, "Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world." [Acts 15:18]

A perceptive person will see that Knoch's approach was racist, and contradicts Paul's view of the Church, as in Galatians 3:28, or Colossians 3:10-11. The latter Scripture says, "And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him: Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all."

For Knoch, the "secret economy pertaining to God's purpose for the celestials," or the Gentile Church, began at the end of the book of Acts, or even later. There other types of dispensationalism such as "Acts 9 dispensationalism," "Acts 10 dispensationalism," "Acts 11 dispensationalism," "Acts 12 dispensationalism" ... or, simply, "Mid-Acts dispensationalism," but Knock's view is sometimes referred to as "Acts 28 dispensationalism," or more frequently, as "Ultradispensationalism" and "Bullingerism."

For Knoch, the earthly kingdom, the Millennium, is when Jews are exulted, and doted on by Gentiles, while his followers and other Gentile Christians have been "raptured" up to heaven, and so they are called the "celestials."
   
Knoch's thinking may possibly have been tainted by racist theories in Germany in his time. Knoch seems to have read the theological works of German scholars, and incorporated some of their views in his own work, without any acknowledgment. I remember once reading a book by Wm. Wrede that was translated into English and thinking how similar its views were to some of A. E. Knoch's writing. Wrede declared himself to be an unbeliever. According to Wikipedia, Knoch lived in Germany before the war and when he returned to America in 1939 he was put on an FBI watch list.

In the excerpt from the chart above, a Millennium is supposed to follow the present age, but there are several reasons why this ought to be seriously questioned, and I have presented some of these in another thread. Here, I will mention another one, from the book of Jude, especially vs. 14-15.

Jude 12-15
These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;
Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.
And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,
To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

"Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all." This tells us what Christ will do when he returns; not to exult Jews over the Gentiles as claimed in dispensationalism!

The thousand years or millennium of Rev. 20 is misplaced in the chart above, IMO. The saints who are beheaded reign with Christ, and they are "blessed and holy," and "on such the second death hath no power." If this was referring to a future millennium as shown in the above chart, would it not be redundant to say "on such the second death hath no power"? If they were already raised up, and had been made immortal, why mention that?

The chart also reveals a misunderstanding of the earthquake of Rev. 16:17-21; see this post.

And finally, 2 Peter 3 does not leave any room for a Millennium between this age and the time when the "fire" falls upon the ungodly: "But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."

In Knoch's view the "fire" is at the end of the Millennium; this contradicts what Peter wrote. But Knoch's attitude to the "Jewish" apostles was dismissive.

Doug




Offline micah7:9

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Re: God's Plans for the Ages
« Reply #30 on: November 30, 2011, 12:29:26 AM »
I read and heard somewhere that if Knoch would have kept his thoughts out of the CLV we would have had a much better translation. Just a notice. :dontknow:
« Last Edit: November 30, 2011, 12:34:15 AM by micah7:9 »
Mic 7:8  Thou dost not rejoice over me, O mine enemy, When I have fallen, I have risen, When I sit in darkness Jehovah is a light to me.

Offline eaglesway

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Re: God's Plans for the Ages
« Reply #31 on: November 30, 2011, 12:52:32 AM »
Since the New Jerusalem (us) is being built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus being the chief cornerstone....

And since the One New Man (us, again) is made up of Jews and Gentiles, Jesus being the "cap of the arch" or capstone.....

And since their is One Lord, One faith, One body, Jesus being head over all things to the church, his body, the fulness of him who fills all in all....


I don't have a whole lot of respect for the opinions of anyone who "dismisses" the apostles, especiallty the ultra-dispensationalists, who compartmentalize the Word of God in order to exclude their many and varied opinions from the weight of the "whole cloth" of the Word.
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Offline micah7:9

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Re: God's Plans for the Ages
« Reply #32 on: November 30, 2011, 02:15:24 AM »
Since the New Jerusalem (us) is being built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus being the chief cornerstone....

And since the One New Man (us, again) is made up of Jews and Gentiles, Jesus being the "cap of the arch" or capstone.....

And since their is One Lord, One faith, One body, Jesus being head over all things to the church, his body, the fulness of him who fills all in all....


I don't have a whole lot of respect for the opinions of anyone who "dismisses" the apostles, especiallty the ultra-dispensationalists, who compartmentalize the Word of God in order to exclude their many and varied opinions from the weight of the "whole cloth" of the Word.

 :dsunny:
Mic 7:8  Thou dost not rejoice over me, O mine enemy, When I have fallen, I have risen, When I sit in darkness Jehovah is a light to me.