Author Topic: Confession/Forgiveness  (Read 2032 times)

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Jerm

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Confession/Forgiveness
« on: September 11, 2009, 03:20:19 AM »
Something I've kind of been confused by lately.  If our sins have already been forgiven, why are we then told to confess our sins for forgiveness in 1 John 1:9?

Offline Cardinal

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2009, 03:28:35 AM »
 :cloud9: IMO, there is a difference between what was provided, and our knowledge, appropriation, and application of it. Blesssings.....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline gregoryfl

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2009, 04:21:22 AM »
Something to consider is that it is not a conditional statement, but a statement of reality. One thing that will help you to see this is to consider the other "if" statements:

1Jn 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him and walk in the darkness, we lie, and don't tell the truth.
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ, his Son, cleanses us from all sin.
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us the sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we haven't sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

These are all speaking in the same vein. Ask yourself, does one have to say they have fellowship with him and yet walk in darkness in order for them to then lie, or is the fact that they say they have fellowship and yet walk in darkness prove that that are in reality liars, without the truth in them?

Do you have to walk in the light, and then after that have fellowship with one another, or is the fact that you are walking in the light proof that you are already having fellowship with one another?

If someone says they have no sin, are they then deceived after that as a result, or is the fact that they say they have no sin proof of the reality that they are in fact already deceived?

See the pattern? It is the same with the confession of sin. Those who are forgiven and cleansed are those who confess (agree with God) about their sins. Notice it is not asking God to forgive you, but confessing them. It is the same as confessing Jesus as Lord. It is agreeing and acknowledging him as such. Same thing with confession of sins here. Not a condition, but a reality of those who are forgiven and cleansed.

Just my 2 cents,

Ron :)

Offline Tony N

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2009, 04:01:05 PM »
Our sins have not just been forgiven, we've been justified.

So why tell God we are sorry when we do wrong?

It is interesting to note that under Peter and the twelve, repentance comes before salvation. The Jew must repent to be saved.
With us of the nations under Paul, repentance comes after we are saved and is not a requisite to salvation.

We, of the nations don't repent to be saved, but repentance is a way to tell God we've had a change of heart concerning our conduct.

Them thar is just my dos centavos.
Just because God says He will save all mankind
does not necessarily mean He won't.

Offline WhiteWings

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2009, 09:02:55 PM »
The Jew must repent to be saved.
With us of the nations under Paul, repentance comes after we are saved and is not a requisite to salvation.

Not saying you are wrong but for me it contradicts: God is no respector of persons.
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Zeek

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2009, 09:08:40 PM »
The Jew must repent to be saved.
With us of the nations under Paul, repentance comes after we are saved and is not a requisite to salvation.

Not saying you are wrong but for me it contradicts: God is no respector of persons.

if he is no respector of persons in that sense, then there could never be a chosen, and a non chosen; and there could not be an "especially" group, as in "especially believers".

Offline Seth

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2009, 09:13:23 PM »
Acts 10

 34Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

 35But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

 36The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all:)

 37That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

 38How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

 39And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

 40Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

 41Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

 42And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and dead.

 43To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.

44While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

 45And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.


 46For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God.





« Last Edit: September 11, 2009, 09:17:48 PM by Seth »

Offline Tony N

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2009, 10:03:19 PM »
Seth, the below quote was prior to Israel being set aside and the secret that the nations would be blessed apart from Israel (a secret unknown in the O.T. and N.T. apart from Paul).

Act 10:34 Now Peter, opening his mouth, said, "Of a truth I am grasping that God is not partial,

In other words, during that time God was not partial as long as one DID righteous acts and FEARED God etc. Under Paul, it is not what we do that makes us acceptable to God but it is all based on pure grace apart from works of law.

Tony

Acts 10

 34Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

 35But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

 36The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all:)

 37That word, I say, ye know, which was published throughout all Judaea, and began from Galilee, after the baptism which John preached;

 38How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.

 39And we are witnesses of all things which he did both in the land of the Jews, and in Jerusalem; whom they slew and hanged on a tree:

 40Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly;

 41Not to all the people, but unto witnesses chosen before God, even to us, who did eat and drink with him after he rose from the dead.

 42And he commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is he which was ordained of God to be the Judge of quick and dead.

 43To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.

44While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

 45And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.


 46For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God.






Just because God says He will save all mankind
does not necessarily mean He won't.

Offline Seth

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2009, 10:29:53 PM »
Seth, the below quote was prior to Israel being set aside and the secret that the nations would be blessed apart from Israel (a secret unknown in the O.T. and N.T. apart from Paul).

Act 10:34 Now Peter, opening his mouth, said, "Of a truth I am grasping that God is not partial,

In other words, during that time God was not partial as long as one DID righteous acts and FEARED God etc. Under Paul, it is not what we do that makes us acceptable to God but it is all based on pure grace apart from works of law.

What I believe the scripture shows is the method by which man is able to do righteousness: supernatural work of the Holy Spirit. That is why there is no partiality. Any nation that feareth God and worketh righteousness is accepted, whether Jew or Gentile. The reason is because the works ARE apart from the Law, yet are done according to the Spirit by obedience as a result of faith.

The Law is not of faith which is why works of the Law are "our own righteousness" which is dirty rags.

But works done according to the Spirit as a result of obedience through faith are acceptable to God and the Bible shows that it is GRACE that teaches us to do those works.

Offline WhiteWings

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2009, 10:33:07 PM »
The Jew must repent to be saved.
With us of the nations under Paul, repentance comes after we are saved and is not a requisite to salvation.

Not saying you are wrong but for me it contradicts: God is no respector of persons.

if he is no respector of persons in that sense, then there could never be a chosen, and a non chosen; and there could not be an "especially" group, as in "especially believers".
What can I say more than: Good point Zeek!
1 Timothy 2:3-4  ...God our Savior;  Who will have all men to be saved...
John 12:47  And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
Romans 4:5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous ...

Tim B

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2009, 10:36:56 PM »
Something to consider is that it is not a conditional statement, but a statement of reality. One thing that will help you to see this is to consider the other "if" statements:

1Jn 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him and walk in the darkness, we lie, and don't tell the truth.
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ, his Son, cleanses us from all sin.
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us the sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we haven't sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

These are all speaking in the same vein. Ask yourself, does one have to say they have fellowship with him and yet walk in darkness in order for them to then lie, or is the fact that they say they have fellowship and yet walk in darkness prove that that are in reality liars, without the truth in them?

Do you have to walk in the light, and then after that have fellowship with one another, or is the fact that you are walking in the light proof that you are already having fellowship with one another?

If someone says they have no sin, are they then deceived after that as a result, or is the fact that they say they have no sin proof of the reality that they are in fact already deceived?

See the pattern? It is the same with the confession of sin. Those who are forgiven and cleansed are those who confess (agree with God) about their sins. Notice it is not asking God to forgive you, but confessing them. It is the same as confessing Jesus as Lord. It is agreeing and acknowledging him as such. Same thing with confession of sins here. Not a condition, but a reality of those who are forgiven and cleansed.

Just my 2 cents,

Ron :)

Do you think this has anything to do with what Jesus said about forgiveness: "forgive your neighbor or your Father will not forgive you"?


Offline Seth

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2009, 10:45:04 PM »
1 Corinthians 15:10
But by the grace of God I am what I am, and his grace to me was not without effect. No, I WORKED harder than all of them--yet not I, but the grace of God that was with me.


Titus 2
 11For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,

 12Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

 13Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;

 14Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

 15These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee.




Do you see how the grace of God CAUSES works of righteousness to be done and why those that fear him and worketh righteousness are acceptable to him? It's because GOD is doing the works.

Meaning:

Acts 10
 34Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

 35But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.



That IS a statement of grace. Not a statement of works apart from grace. But the question is, and probably always has been this: do we properly understand "grace?"






« Last Edit: September 11, 2009, 11:54:41 PM by Seth »

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #12 on: September 12, 2009, 03:02:33 AM »
why? because he is talking to the non gentiles, or Israel's people in 1 John.
In all of the gospels of the Circumcision (All new testaments books other than Paul's Books) are for us to use as a learning tool to understand how God works for his chosen people, people under the law and the curse of the law.  Lee Damboise          sinfreeforever@gmx.ru

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #13 on: September 12, 2009, 03:17:48 AM »
Why IN 1 John = Answer
Therefore, if a "gospel" which was divinely ordained for one people, is perverted to another, its promises simply cannot be fulfilled.
 
 Consequently, it is "not another" gospel or "good news" for them.  And those to whom it is being preached, becomes both disturbed and deceived.  Now when this "different gospel" while true for the people for whom it was divinely ordained, was perversely forced upon the Galatians, the Uncircumcision, the "gentiles," its promises could not be fulfilled, therefore, their faith was misplaced and nullified! And on this account Paul doubly emphasized the "curse" or anathema upon the preachers, saying, "though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you        ( Galatians, the Uncircumcision or "gentiles"), than that ye have received, let him be accursed" (Gal   1:8-9;2:2,7).    Now the reason for all this defense is as follows.  Paul had gone into Galatia in accord with his divinely ordained commission, bringing the gospel which came to him through a revelation of Jesus Christ" (Gal. 1:11-12 ), for which he had been separated (Rom 1:1-5),and which he specifically designated "that gospel which I preach  :bgdance:among the gentiles" (Gal 2:2), and "the gospel of the Uncircumcision" ( Gal 2:7) .  Later, Christianized Jewish preachers visited the churches of Galatia and "removed" or transferred the believers from the grace of Christ in which they had been called to "a different Gospel" of faith and works , which was none other than "the gospel of the Circumcision" that was committed unto Peter for the Circumcision ( Gal 2:7-9 ) Consequently, they were urged to be "circumcised"        ( Gal 5: 2-3; 6: 12-13 ), to "observe days, months, seasons and years" ( Gal 4:8-11 ), and to be "zealous for the law" and "live according to the customs of Moses" like as the Jewish believers were demanded by " the gospel of the Circumcision"         Gal 3:1-9; 4:19-21; 6:12-15; Acts 21:19-21.  Therefore, Paul was moved by "a revelation" to go up to Jerusalem and "communicate, " submit or make known to them—James, Peter and John, who are supposed to be pillars—"that gospel which he preached among the gentiles" ( Gal 2:1-10).  At this meeting, those of repute—James, Peter and John—submitted nothing to Paul ! On the contrary, Titus, being a Greek believer through Paul's ministry, was not permitted to be circumcised, and Paul did not simulate or give place by subjection, not even for an hour, that the truth of the gospel might continue with us  (Gal 2:1-5 ).  Furthermore, at that meeting, it was clearly revealed that Paul had been entrusted with "the gospel of the Uncircumcision, according as Peter of the Circumcision."  And also, "when James, Cephas ( Peter ) and John, who seemed to be pillars, learned of the grace that was given to Paul, they gave to him and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that they should go unto the "heathen" or nations, and they unto the  circumcision" ( Gal 2:7-9 ).  After this meeting, Paul was moved by the Spirit to write this epistle to the Galatians, that they might be delivered from this disturbance and bondage of the law to which they had been "removed" or transferred from the truth of the gospel of the grace of God, which he had brought them, with its freedom of Sonship through the hearing of faith apart from works of the law 
 
Gal 3: 1-14.  He also was quite vehement in his protest against the preacher, invoking the "curse" or anathema ( which was the ancient custom of devoting a person to an expiatory or atoning sacrifice to the gods in order to avert public calamity), upon any man, even himself or a messenger from heaven, who would bring "ANY OTHER GOSPEL  TO THEM      ( The Galatians, the Uncircumcision or "gentiles")THAN THAT WHICH HE, PAUL HAD PREACHED TO THEM !" What would Paul say to apostate Christendom if he were here today, when, conservatively speaking, seventy-five % of its teachings, beliefs, customs and practices are drawn from the Circumcision gospel and writings, thus "removing" or transferring believers from the grace of Christ, in which they are called, and consequently distorting the gospel of Christ.
   God has clearly and definitely declared that Paul was His chosen vessel to bear His name to the "gentiles" or nations.  He entrusted to him the specific gospel for the nations by a revelation of Jesus Christ  ( Gal 1:12), namely, "the gospel of the Uncircumcision" (Gal 2:7 ).  He was separated and commissioned the apostle, herald and teacher of the nations in knowledge and truth ( Rom 1: 1-5;11:13;15:15-18 ).

Lee Damboise II        sinfreeforever@gmx.ru

Offline gregoryfl

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #14 on: September 12, 2009, 03:53:07 AM »
Something to consider is that it is not a conditional statement, but a statement of reality. One thing that will help you to see this is to consider the other "if" statements:

1Jn 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him and walk in the darkness, we lie, and don't tell the truth.
1Jn 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ, his Son, cleanses us from all sin.
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us the sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we haven't sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

These are all speaking in the same vein. Ask yourself, does one have to say they have fellowship with him and yet walk in darkness in order for them to then lie, or is the fact that they say they have fellowship and yet walk in darkness prove that that are in reality liars, without the truth in them?

Do you have to walk in the light, and then after that have fellowship with one another, or is the fact that you are walking in the light proof that you are already having fellowship with one another?

If someone says they have no sin, are they then deceived after that as a result, or is the fact that they say they have no sin proof of the reality that they are in fact already deceived?

See the pattern? It is the same with the confession of sin. Those who are forgiven and cleansed are those who confess (agree with God) about their sins. Notice it is not asking God to forgive you, but confessing them. It is the same as confessing Jesus as Lord. It is agreeing and acknowledging him as such. Same thing with confession of sins here. Not a condition, but a reality of those who are forgiven and cleansed.

Just my 2 cents,

Ron :)

Do you think this has anything to do with what Jesus said about forgiveness: "forgive your neighbor or your Father will not forgive you"?



Hey Tim :)

I believe that what Jesus said is a beautiful illustration showing the difference of living under the law as opposed to living under grace.

When Jesus said what he said there, as well as what he is recorded to have said in the "Lord's prayer," where he says "and forgive us our debts, AS we have forgiven our debtors," as I understand it, he was speaking to a people as under the law. That is what the law demanded, and his bringing it out as fully as he did was meant to drive them to despair, for who honestly wants God to only forgive them according to how well they forgive others?

Once he did die, compare what you showed Jesus as saying with how Paul worded the subject:

Col 3:13  bearing with one another and, if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other; AS the Lord has forgiven you, so you also must forgive.

We have now been empowered to actually forgive, and it springs out of his total forgiveness of us. So I see it relating at least in that sense, that forgiveness from God's standpoint is a done deal.

Offline reFORMer

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2009, 06:29:58 AM »
The idea that there is one gospel of grace and works to the Circumcision and another of grace alone to the Uncircumcision is froth of carnal minds.  It is of recent invention.  The earliest mention of two Israels, natural and spiritual, seems to be in the end of the 1700's.  It began to be popularized in the end of the 1800's, specially so with the publication of the Scofield reference Bible in 1911.  The Truth is there is but one gospel for all mankind.  That Peter had an assignment to Israel and Paul to the nations did not mean they preached different gospels.  It is same message for all.  It is by grace through faith for all.  The flesh profits nothing.  Here Paul is stating it to his brethren:

1 Corinthians 15:1-5 (CLT)...
1 Now I am making known to you, brethren, the evangel which I bring to you, which also you accepted, in which also you stand,
2 through which also you are saved, if you are retaining what I said in bringing the evangel to you, outside and except you believe feignedly.
3 For I give over to you among the first what also I accepted, that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures,
4 and that He was entombed, and that He has been roused the third day according to the scriptures
,
5 and that He was seen

This is what Paul told Peter in the presence of many witnesses:
Galatians 2:15-16 (CLT)...
15 We, who by nature are Jews, and not sinners of the nations,
16 having perceived that a man is not being justified by works of law, except alone through the faith of Christ Jesus, we also believe in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by the faith of Christ and not by works of law, seeing that by works of law shall no flesh at all be justified.

I HATE racial dispensationalism!!!  It has been used to claim that the gifts of the Holy Spirit are not for present day believers; but, are for Jews according to the flesh.  It claims the kingdom of God is not now; but, is for a carnally defined Israel in the future, while in reality the Eclessia is the kingdom arrived.  Racial dispensationalism is used to teach that the center of God's plan is a carnal Israel when The Eclessia is what is at the center of God's purposes.  The Eclessia is the flesh and bone of God in the earth.  The Eclessia will reign with Christ in all the earth, indeed, over all the works of God.  The truth that The Church (Eclessia) is Israel now is not "replacement," but is the elevated revelation of God's original intent.  God's proves who His chosen people are by giving them the Holy Spirit!

Read what Jesus says in John 8 to those who are racially descendants of Abraham.  It always has been to those who believe God's word, never a matter of flesh.  God is never a racist.  The flesh profits nothing!!

Additionally, the people in Israel today are Israelis , not Israelites.  The Zionists are racially Jephathites, not Shemites.  In the 700's Kenazia, where Germany is now, took up Judaism as a religion.  They were Turks, Huns, Syrians...not of Shem, but of Jephath.  Those who can trace their ancestry to Abraham, The Shephardim (meaning, "from Spain") are about 5% or 100,000 persons and they do not accept the present state of Israel.  It is important to note some contemporary Bible translations change the word "seed" to "descendants" to sell.

Galatians 3:16, 25-29 (CLT)...
16 Now to Abraham the promises were declared, and to his Seed. He is not saying "And to seeds," as of many, but as of One: And to "your Seed," which is Christ.
25 Now, at the coming of faith, we are no longer under an escort,
26 for you are all sons of God, through faith in Christ Jesus.
27 For whoever are baptized into Christ, put on Christ,
28 in Whom there is no Jew nor yet Greek, there is no slave nor yet free, there is no male and female, for you all are one in Christ Jesus.
29 Now if you are Christ's, consequently you are of Abraham's seed, enjoyers of the allotment according to the promise.

You've got to be kidding!! A gospel of grace and works for Jews?!  A different one for those racially gentiles?  I wonder how many gospels some believe there are!  Do you realize what it does to people who would be followers of Jesus that have been deceived by dispensationalism to believe the opposite of what is in the plan of God, that they are going to disappear at any moment and the world is going to be taken over by the devil?  What actually is to happen is Christ in His people is going to appear.  The appearance of the head is not the disappearance of the body.  It's called "the manifestation of the sons of God." (Romans 8)  And they will reign in all the earth, not Satan.  Instead of expecting to be brought into victory over all things destroying man, dispensationalism has people looking for an escape from here to make way for Satanic rule.  That is largely why, until about 1980, the evangelicals of the 20th century weren't involved in American politics.  Why polish the brass on a sinking ship was their rationale.  Abominable!

And their teachers, the ones I know about, have learned from one another to advocate what they call a "literal" interpretation, which is nothing more than an "outer court" or natural and carnal understanding.  They have no depth in the word.  Much of my family is like that.  Many people to whom I am personally endeared are dispensationalists, so it isn't easily ignored or taken on lightly as a topic of conversation.  I'm supposed to be deceived, a rebel and a heretic.  That's lots of fun!  Many of the dispensationalist do know the Lord, somewhat; but, they are robbed and blocked from advancing.  Jesus says, "I can guarantee this truth: Many prophets and many of God's people longed to see what you see but didn't see it, to hear what you hear but didn't hear it. " (Matthew 13:17, GW)  You can be Godly or even a prophet and not understand the Lord or His word.  Take heed.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2009, 08:43:04 AM by reFORMer »
I went to church; but, the Church wasn't on the program!  JESUS WANTS HIS BODY BACK!!  MEET WITHOUT HUMAN HEADSHIP!!!

Offline Seth

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #16 on: September 12, 2009, 08:48:45 AM »
AMEN!

There is ONE Gospel: Believe on the name of Christ, RECIEVE THE HOLY SPIRIT, be saved from sin unto good works. ALL apostles preached that message.

More here: http://www.tentmaker.org/forum/index.php?topic=6805.0



Offline Cardinal

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #17 on: September 12, 2009, 07:47:38 PM »
 :cloud9: Amen reFORMer........it's nothing more than of trying to put the wall of partition back up that He tore down. And I HATE the "rapture" doctrine that robs the Truth from His people, as well. Blessings....
"I would rather train twenty men to pray, than a thousand to preach; A minister's highest mission ought to be to teach his people to pray." -H. MacGregor

Offline rosered

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #18 on: September 12, 2009, 09:09:48 PM »
Something I've kind of been confused by lately.  If our sins have already been forgiven, why are we then told to confess our sins for forgiveness in 1 John 1:9?


  HI  ALL ,,,,
 
  you all gave some good answers   and I have also thought about this before Jerm
 
 To be   sure it is a process  , that salvation comes
  we  being  compared to trees  have to bear some type of fruit
 
  why would Jesus tell us to make the tree good and  fruit good 
 
if it did not matter at all ?
 
   to me  we have to acknowledge   sin /  error /wrong in our hearts first
  and know  we have no real power over it  :dontknow:
 
 that this power  over it will be from God , giving Him the glory 
 that to  me is why we must   even though  forgiven  of sin /error  , must confess its in us
first   than the process  of God dealing with us and changing our hearts will continue  to perfection /maturity   good fruit to Gods glory and  praise
 
  here is the TNIV  on what  motivates  because we fear punishment for  sin /error ?
 or because we are really sorry  that our behavior that  hurts  folks and God as well ?
  those Pharrisses/ readers  not doers of the Word ,  had a  false sense of power to me telling others   their  worthless  in Gods eyes and yet they  never pleased God in their superior /god type  attitudes either
  see what I mean here ?
 
MATT 3 
 7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: "You brood of vipers!
 
  Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath?
 
 
8 Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. 9 And do not think you can say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham.
 
 10 The ax is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.

   to me the fire is a very humbling experience  , we have NO POWER at all if not given and than taken of the Lord to do what we all do ..
 
 
   thanks for the post its a good  thing to consider  :thumbsup:
 
  God bless  :HeartThrob:   rose

Offline Seth

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #19 on: September 12, 2009, 10:30:57 PM »
Good works Rosered: whatever we DO, we do to the glory of God out of a desire to obey, which is genuine faith. Not out of fear of getting beat up like the Law did.

Offline rosered

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #20 on: September 12, 2009, 11:20:31 PM »
Good works Rosered: whatever we DO, we do to the glory of God out of a desire to obey, which is genuine faith. Not out of fear of getting beat up like the Law did.
   Yes Seth your right , I do believe even our  desire comes from the Lord Jesus Christ as well  :thumbsup:
 
  :HeartThrob:  God is good ! God  bless ya bro!   rose

 

HartleyDamboiseII

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Re: Confession/Forgiveness
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2009, 03:22:32 AM »
How many Gospels are there Really???
          Now these two Greek words --- EU and ANGGELIA--- combined, form the compound word, EUNAGGELIA of EUANGGELION, which means in literal English, WELL-MESSAGE or GOOD MESSAGE. in our most common bibles it means, a message of good news.

1. The Gospel which God Brought before to Abraham

2.  The Gospel which Gabriel brought to Zachariah

3.  The Gospel which Timothy brought from the Thessalonians to Paul

4.  The Gospel of the Circumcision

5.  The Gospel of the UNcirumcision
              a. The Secret ( 'Mystery') of the Gospel

6.  The Gospel of the Unsearchable Riches of Christ
               "Another Gospel: Which is not Another"

7.  The Eonian ('Everlasting') Gospel

               There is many more subdivisions of the above

Lee Damboise II